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Okay, the "Crazy Sawtooth Project" has now become my "Crazy Gigabit Ethernet" project-Rage 128 and all.

You're welcome for the suggestion ;) The Gigabit is still one of the models I'm missing, unfortunately.

It seems as thought it has a GEForce 2MX Twin-View.

Do tell how the Public Beta copes with it.

If it weren't for the fact that I'm against piracy on principle, I'd download the slimmed-down PPC-only Leopard version that's circulating the web and will fit on a single layer DVD just to avoid fighting this.

What principle? I don't think they even still sell Leopard anymore...

That being said it's the only version of OS X (besides Snow Leopard) that I actually have a retail install disk for. Two, actually.
 
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Do tell how the Public Beta copes with it.

Will report, but I suspect that Public Beta(if not DP) will be fine with it.

Here's an Apple page from Feb. 2001(when Public Beta was still in distribution) advertising the 2MX-although admittedly not the twin view version-as a BTO option.

http://web.archive.org/web/20010214000541/http://www.apple.com/powermac/graphics.html

(BTW, without researching the dates, since it's late and I'm feeling too lazy to do that, I'm guessing that this page is advertising the Digital Audio model since it mentions 4x AGP)
 
LightBulbFun asked me in another thread if Public Beta recognizes both processors. I can confirm that it does.

Sorry for taking a photo of the screen-it seems as though the :apple:+shift+3 screenshot short cut that has worked since the beginning of time(I think at least System 6, if not earlier) was omitted from Public Beta and 10.0.
 

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oh Cool heh! how does it perform?

I've been too busy installing OSs to pay attention :)

I've also put the RAM back up to 2gb and put the 2MX twin-view in-I want to see how the early OS X versions play with those. I dug out a 4MX, so I may even try that.

I'll do some crunching on it tonight in Photoshop and see what I think.

BTW, Public Beta-10.5 is now installed. I just need to run the updates on everything, which is quite a project in and of itself :rolleyes:

I'm also going to put another 40gb HDD in on the secondary ATA bus. I just need to decide if I'm going to ditch the ZIP drive completely, or if I'm going to try and make a SCSI ZIP drive working...
 
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Now you Have OS X DP 1 2 3 4 to install along with rhapsody and OS X sever 1.0 good luck :p

Yes indeed. I think that 40gb should be enough, since these were all meant to run on systems with 4gb HDDs.

I hope that Rhapsody will run on this computer. If not, that's what I have Beige G3s for :)
 
Sorry for taking a photo of the screen-it seems as though the :apple:+shift+3 screenshot short cut that has worked since the beginning of time(I think at least System 6, if not earlier) was omitted from Public Beta and 10.0.

Grab.app is present even in the Public Beta you know...

BTW, Public Beta-10.5 is now installed. I just need to run the updates on everything, which is quite a project in and of itself :rolleyes:

I would like to know how Leopard performs on a Rage 128.
 
Grab.app is present even in the Public Beta you know...
Something was wrong, then, as it wasn't working for me.

I would like to know how Leopard performs on a Rage 128.

I've actually done it several times, although primarily with the PCI version of the card. I think it would be doable if you enabled the flat dock and a lot of the other eye candy, but it's pretty miserable with a stock Leopard set-up. I've only ever really done it seriously for maintenance and trouble-shooting(I always have a couple of PCI Rage 128s lying around), so can't speak extensively as to the performance. Things like the dock animations are very slow.

Erik said that he ran one at work in a Sawtooth for several years with two of them(one PCI, one AGP), though, so he's probably a better person to answer that.
 
Something was wrong, then, as it wasn't working for me.

Worked for me in OS X 10.0 on my iMac G3 before the hard drive died, although I would imagine the Public Beta has a lot more issues with things like that.

I've actually done it several times, although primarily with the PCI version of the card. I think it would be doable if you enabled the flat dock and a lot of the other eye candy, but it's pretty miserable with a stock Leopard set-up. I've only ever really done it seriously for maintenance and trouble-shooting(I always have a couple of PCI Rage 128s lying around), so can't speak extensively as to the performance. Things like the dock animations are very slow.

Erik said that he ran one at work in a Sawtooth for several years with two of them(one PCI, one AGP), though, so he's probably a better person to answer that.

Can the Yikes! run Leopard with LeopardAssist? I saw how much trouble you had getting Leopard on that G4 upgraded G3 (did you even succeed with that yet?) and the logic board for the Yikes! is almost identical.
 
Can the Yikes! run Leopard with LeopardAssist?
Without having done it, I would say the chances are decent.

Here's the thing. Most of the upgrades I've done to the two G4s here at work have been done either via Firewire (Sawtooth) connected to my 17" PowerBook or G5 or via external Firewire case (Yikes) connected to the same.

The Yikes, of course cannot connect via TDM, so pulling the drive and putting it in a case was the only way to do this. Since the Leopard installer was seeing either a G4 PowerBook or a G5 I never had a problem with the installs. After that it was simply a matter of updating.

The Sawtooth had 1.75GB of ram at one point (400mhz) and I optimized the system. No icon previews, disabled QuickLook, Beamsync, Secrets prefpane, etc. My coworker who was using the Mac only had two displays, one Rage card dedicated to each display. We're a newspaper so our quality is not magazine quality so that also helps. Yes, the Mac was a bit slow, but it was never frozen or unresponsive. You could still do the work.

That said, I brought the G5 back because the complaints about how 'slow' it was were frequent. Now, it's going to BE slow if you have Illustrator, InDesign, QuarkXpress, Suitcase, Photoshop, Acrobat, Entourage, Word and TenFourFox all open at the same damn time. I specifically gave instructions that if my coworker was done with an app she was not going to use for awhile to quit the app. Those instructions were never usually followed and so the Mac became 'slow'. Well. Yeah. It's hard not to tax the processors when you've got ten million apps open at the same time!

So, my point in that little rant is, just be judicious in what apps you have open. Even at home on my QS, TenFourFox is almost always the only app left running. I close everything else when done with them.
 
Can the Yikes! run Leopard with LeopardAssist? I saw how much trouble you had getting Leopard on that G4 upgraded G3 (did you even succeed with that yet?) and the logic board for the Yikes! is almost identical.

Without actually doing it, I strongly suspect that the Yikes! will have the same problems I ran into with the B&W G3. I can certainly try, but as you said the logic boards are virtually identical.

I don't think that Leopard Assist alone will work.
 
what "paper with pen" icon is that in the picture? (maybe some sort of TextEdit or Apple Works?)
That mac radeon 8500 is very very rare. As far as I know, it only ever came on the xserve g4 if you ordered it as a workstation with agp card.
It also came as a BTO with Quicksilver G4s as far as I know. I would have to check everymac.com
Sawtooth=100mhz FSB
DA and QS=133mhz FSB
I thought one can't swap a DA/QS CPU into a AGP/GE G4?

The Digital Audio G4 with 733MHz was at some point starting to ship with 10.0.3 so that might be candidate for such a project as well. Also the first Quicksilvers came with 10.0.4 preinstalled (733MHz, 867MHz, Dual 800MHz).

Doesn't your Mac got slow with multiple partitions on one drive?
 
I thought one can't swap a DA/QS CPU into a AGP/GE G4?

The Digital Audio G4 with 733MHz was at some point starting to ship with 10.0.3 so that might be candidate for such a project as well. Also the first Quicksilvers came with 10.0.4 preinstalled (733MHz, 867MHz, Dual 800MHz).

Doesn't your Mac got slow with multiple partitions on one drive?

As far as I know(but without doing it) DA cards can be put in Sawtooth/GigE computers without issues. QS card require running an extra +12V line to where the 4th mounting post would connect if the card were in a QS.

As for the partitions-these older versions of OS X aren't very "heavy" and I'm not doing much serious work in them, so it's not that noticeable. Leopard is on its own drive(with a small partition for OS 9) so it's so much an issue there.
 
Alright, I decided to ditch the ZIP drive and put another hard drive in the bay. I tried to put in a SCSI ZIP drive, but the big 50 pin SCSI cable just gets in the way and makes cable congestion in that area a real problem. I may tackle it one of these days, but having a ZIP drive really isn't an incredibly high priority. This computer will have a SCSI card of some sort or another in it, so I can always jerry-rig in the ZIP if I find a temporary need for it in the future.

In any case, I prepped the 40gb drive for OS installations, even though I haven't actually started yet. Here's a screen shot with all the mounted volumes-14 total. Now I just need to start installing DPs and the other early stuff.

I'm also including the Geekbench score for the dual 500, for anyone interested.
 

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Well, it looks like I won't be able to install the DPs on this system. I may need to go to a B&W to install DP, or even a Beige G3.

Perhaps they will install on my G4-converted B&W, or possibly my Yikes!. If I could get Leopard running on either of those systems, I'd truly have one "do it all" system, although the B&W at least has so far eluded me as far as getting Leopard working.
 
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I ran DP2 and 3 on my sawtooth and it ran fine (apart from DP2 Freaking out with my mouse but thats my mouses fault) so maybe you can try using the sawtooth again?
 

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I ran DP2 and 3 on my sawtooth and it ran fine (apart from DP2 Freaking out with my mouse but thats my mouses fault) so maybe you can try using the sawtooth again?

Did you ever try running DP1 and DP2 on the same drive? Curious to know whether it works with the funky partitioning Apple used for those.
 
Did you ever try running DP1 and DP2 on the same drive? Curious to know whether it works with the funky partitioning Apple used for those.

No. Sadly i'm all out of ATA HDDs to test it on since my last spare ATA HDD went up in smoke literally. (the drive in question was the original 4GB quantum fireball from my G3 beige :( ). while I do have one 40GB PATA HDD in my MDD I don't want to format that since it has a Linux install I put waaay too much time into LOL! I really need to get some more PATA drives i'm down to 1 now :( BTW DP2 and DP3 were not running on the same drive together after I was done messing with DP3 I formatted the drive and installed DP2
 
I ran DP2 and 3 on my sawtooth and it ran fine (apart from DP2 Freaking out with my mouse but thats my mouses fault) so maybe you can try using the sawtooth again?

I wonder if the would work if I used my Pismo to do a TDM install. As it is now, the installer won't even run and just tells me that the hardware isn't supported.

I'm at my parents' house for the weekend and brought the GigE with me, but am working with somewhat limited resources until Monday. I do have my Pismo with.
 
I wonder if the would work if I used my Pismo to do a TDM install. As it is now, the installer won't even run and just tells me that the hardware isn't supported.

I doubt it. I think the early DPs are just reworkings of OSX Server 1.x and as such have a VERY limited set of hardware drivers. Even if you swap out the default optical drive with something compatible, the OS will not install. Even DVD drives are not supported, which leaves the Lombard 333MHz as the last machine capable (but not supported) of running Rhapsody albeit with only 256 colours.
 
Just going to say with my Sawtooth, Like nothing in it was stock the ODD was a PC DVD DL burner from my MDD and the Ram was a hoge podge of sticks (since i stole 3 sticks of ram for the G3 beige) the GPU was a PCI Rage 128... DP2 installed with out a hitch on the 4GB fire Ball from my G3 beige LOL
 
Just going to say with my Sawtooth, Like nothing in it was stock the ODD was a PC DVD DL burner from my MDD and the Ram was a hoge podge of sticks (since i stole 3 sticks of ram for the G3 beige) the GPU was a PCI Rage 128... DP2 installed with out a hitch on the 4GB fire Ball from my G3 beige LOL

Great. Looks to be a better bet than DP1. That didn't look any different or behave any differently from Server 1.x.
 
with all this Old OS talk going around I decided to Play with Rhapsody and I decided at getting the intel version of Rhapsody (DP2) going in vmware and as you can see its very interesting to see the granddaddy of the OS X we know today.
 

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