My new MacBook Air m2 - 8gb is great

[raythompsontn]

Discussing with people about 8 GB vs 16 GB is like mud wrestling with a pig. You both get dirty but the pig likes it.

And with that I am done.

 

[6749974]

Shhhh. Don't introduce logic. People are busy whining.

It's only logical that people with opposing opinions would debate and argue when the topic is brought up. To think otherwise is illogical. To complain about it, is whining.

Have you considered not whining about people freely discussing a topic?

 

[Mainsail]

It caught the attention of a bunch of us because the title. 8GB RAM base with stupidly pricey upgrades is known by anyone that posts on Mac forums or follows tech industry news to be an increasingly controversial topic. OP was undoubtedly aware of the hornets nest he was poking. If he had said "8GB is great for my needs" in the title, it wouldn't have drawn an ounce of attention...

As it is, it reads like an embarrassing advert for Apple, when as a premium company that sell premium products a lot of us feel they shouldn't be nickel and diming us over components that have little monetary value in 2024. It's exactly the same as someone creating another thread titled "256GB storage is more than enough."

But, the title of the thread is:

My new MacBook Air m2 - 8gb is great​

The title and the content of the post relate to the Ops' base MBA and how it meets his needs. The Op describes how he uses the computer and even that it might not work for everyone. I would get your point if the title said something like:

The new MacBook Air m2 - 8gb more than enough for anyone

But, that was not the case. The Ops post is objective and accurate. There aren't false claims. Compare it to those posts that say stuff like the base MBA isn't good for anything but surfing the web, which is demonstrably false.

I get that people believe that Apple's upgrade pricing is unreasonably high. As mentioned, this is also the case with MS Surface computers and some other manufactures. I am not defending those prices. But, I suspect Apple has sales data that shows this is the best pricing strategy for profit maximization.....which is what businesses do. I would also suspect that the pricing is not just based on the unit cost of RAM. The base model is Apple's most popular configuration, and oftentimes there are additional production costs for manufacturing a nonstandard model that exceed the component costs. Again, from a consumers perspective, I would prefer lower upgrade pricing ......but, I don' pretend to know Apple's manufacturing cost structure. I also don't pretend to know what other people need for their day to day computer use. I just know that my base M2 MBA is great and meets all of my needs.

 

[6749974]

I would assert that "common buyers" don't need and don't care about the upgrades. They want a system that will do web browsing, email, the occasional Pages document or Numbers spreadsheet. Maybe edit a few photographs. Common buyers are not heavy users. The existence, or need, for more than 8 GB or extended storage is just not relevant for "common buyers".

I still see Windows systems selling with 4 GB of ram and they work just fine for the intended use. The fantasies about increased memory are not relevant. Real world is what matters.

I ran Photoshop and Lightroom on a minimum spec M1 Air for about a year. It worked just fine. Only reason I upgraded to the M2 Air was for the additional USB-C ports when charging as the M1 used a USB-C port to charge. I opted for increased storage and memory as my 20% discount, plus the trade that was offered, made it a no-brainer.

Thats the heart of the issue.

• Is 16 GB an appropriate config for the price Apple charges? YES
• Is 16 GB better from a computer system's perspective? YES
• Do common people benefit from 16 GB over 8 GB? YES

The system relies less on compression and swap. The system will last longer into the future, and be more flexible to any further use cases and app changes (eg. going from Logic to Pro Tools; going from Final Cut Pro to Adobe Premier). The system will have more software cache to make the macOS feel snappier. The system will have less writes to storage, due to swap. The CPU/GPU will less likely be bottlenecked by swap. People can multitask better in a time where they work from home and have to zoom, and worry less about having to many tabs open and so on. Common users benefit from 16 GB over 8 GB.

Should able go backward and start outfitting all base models with 4 GB simple because some Windows systems come with 4 GB (which don't cost $1000 MSRP by the way!)? Thats a ludicrous "whataboutism."

 

[6749974]

Discussing with people about 8 GB vs 16 GB is like mud wrestling with a pig. You both get dirty but the pig likes it.

And with that I am done.

I resent that you have a poor argument so you call your opposers “pigs.”

The argument isn’t, “does 8 GB RAM work” because obviously the answer is “Yes, it works.” The argument is, “are we long in the tooth for a 16 GB standard,” which the answer is “yes, for the price and functionality 16 GB is more appropriate.”

Why is it that people whom have that opinion are “pigs”?

Everyone benefits from our advocacy. Only Apple benefits from yours.

 

[Mainsail]

Good work completely missing the point of everything I wrote. 👏🏼

Good work completely missing the point of everything I wrote......see how I did that.

 

[raythompsontn]

I resent that you have a poor argument so you call your opposers “pigs.”

And I resent that you think I called anyone a “pig”.

What I stated is nothing but a phrase showing the futility of discussing something against someone else that is fixed on their opinion.

I cannot help it if you feel that way. Goodbye.

 

[Zdigital2015]

(I’m glad you got the model you wanted so quickly).

It's an open secret with us Mac nerdsl that Apple tends to have low stock of an “ultimate model” for every product line; which they do not advertise on the website, and often if you go into the store and ask, employees will deny it because they don't even know about it themselves.

In the case of the MacBook Air, the ultimate model they carry is a 10c GPU, 16 GB RAM, 1 TB model that costs $1800. But that is not the official models they provide retail partners, meaning if you go to Costco, Amazon, Best Buy, and other retail centers around the world—where a majority of Macs are sold—you're always going to find these two models:

• 8 GB RAM, 256 GB storage
• 8 GB RAM, 512 GB storage

And it's those two models that get discounted $200 off during sales, which are quite frequent.

(Sometimes Best Buy will have a 16 GB model and it will be on sale, but its rare and very specific, like only a 15-inch M2 Air with 16/1TB and it has to be Midnight Blue colored)

My point stands—you can get a base model M2 Air for $200 off but if you want to spec it up to 16 GB, you're usually going to have to visit Apple.com and pay an additional $200 which means you're paying $400 more than anyone else for a simple addition of 8 GB RAM that costs Apple only $3 or whatever; and that feels foolish to do.

Just ordered a Space Grey 16GB/1TB 15” Air for $1499 from Best Buy

I'm simply explaining a core reason why some people are strongly annoyed with this 8 GB RAM issue. Ignore reason if you wish. Whataboutisms don't win debates or change minds.

The "if you don't like it, buy Windows" argument needs to be banned here. It’s so tired and false. People are allowed to love Macs while criticizing an unfavorable aspect of the buying process; just as people are allowed to love their country while advocating for improvements.

Well, Windows or Linux are the only alternatives for those dissatisfied with Apple and its pricing. Personally, I’d be pleased as punch not to have had this thread hijacked by the “Apple is greedy and should be giving me more for free because I demand it” contingent that seemingly take over every one of the “8GB is fine” threads on their crusade to demand we all think their way and how we are naive, gullible, ignorant shills when we don’t agree. I’ve have both 8GB and 16GB Macs, I currently own an 8GB/512GB M1 13” MacBook Pro and it only slows down when loading DaVinci Resolve or the Affinity Suite, which is somewhat to be expected. Otherwise, the machine punches above its weight class for everything else. Take time to learn your workflow before accepting 8GB or blindly laying down extra cash for more DRAM you may not need.

 

[MilaM]

It’s very rare retailers having BTO options for sale on their shelf.

BTO Macs get very small discounts in my region. I was considering buying a Mac mini recently. But most shops only carry the 8GB/256GB or the 8GB/512GB models. Amazon does not carry BTO models at all.

 

[6749974]

And I resent that you think I called anyone a “pig”.

What I stated is nothing but a phrase showing the futility of discussing something against someone else that is fixed on their opinion.

I cannot help it if you feel that way. Goodbye.

You literally called us pigs, and said we're pulling you into the mud. You're implying we're beneath you.

But if you want to walk that back and apologize, go ahead.

 

[6749974]

Just ordered a Space Grey 16GB/1TB 15” Air for $1499 from Best Buy

• Did you walk into any Best Buy and walk out with a 16 GB model?
• Did you get to choose your storage?
• Did you get to choose your color?
• Does Best Buy sell 16 GB models in the 13" form factor?

The answer to all those questions is "No!" Best Buy only inventories 8/256 and 8/512.

Best Buy sells this one specific 15-inch configuration in low inventory that will soon say "Out of Stock"—so only online and for a limited time, where as anyone can walk into a Best Buy and walk out same-day with an 8 GB model and $150-200 off. You've failed to disprove my core point; your use of a small niche exception just proves the rule that 16 GB models are not equal from a retail logistics perspective.

Well, Windows or Linux are the only alternatives for those dissatisfied with Apple and its pricing. Personally, I’d be pleased as punch not to have had this thread hijacked by the “Apple is greedy and should be giving me more for free because I demand it” contingent that seemingly take over every one of the “8GB is fine” threads on their crusade to demand we all think their way and how we are naive, gullible, ignorant shills when we don’t agree.

OP knew what they were doing when the started a post sub-titled "8 GB is great!" OBVIOUSLY people will push back against that because as an objective topic, that is arguable. You expect a forum known for 'arguing about Mac topics' to just take this one topic in the chin?

And again, the "If you don't like it, buy Windows" is tired and false and bad faith. If there is any intelligence in that brain of yours—and of course there is, you're not dumb—then you can comprehend how a person can like a thing (on balance) but take issue with a smaller aspect of it.

I love my country but I have every right to take issue with a few aspects of my country I do not like, and vocalize them. Telling someone, "If you don't like it, move" is incredibly dimwitted and serves no one but lazy minded people who are looking for the easy way to dismiss the argument. Don't do that!

 

[6749974]

I’ve have both 8GB and 16GB Macs, I currently own an 8GB/512GB M1 13” MacBook Pro and it only slows down when loading DaVinci Resolve or the Affinity Suite, which is somewhat to be expected. Otherwise, the machine punches above its weight class for everything else. Take time to learn your workflow before accepting 8GB or blindly laying down extra cash for more DRAM you may not need.

Would your own M1 13” MacBook Pro have been a better computer, for the price you paid, had it come with 16 GB RAM? By your own admission, the CPU slowed down because it didn't have sufficient RAM.

You paid $1299 for something that slows down in Affinity Suite because it has the same low amount of RAM used in $399-$499 laptops. Why are you ok with that?

What we're arguing benefits you. What you're arguing only benefits Apple. Why? Why are you taking a conservative position that progress is bad?

 

[ignatius345]

Personally, I’d be pleased as punch not to have had this thread hijacked by the “Apple is greedy and should be giving me more for free because I demand it” contingent that seemingly take over every one of the “8GB is fine” threads on their crusade to demand we all think their way and how we are naive, gullible, ignorant shills when we don’t agree.

Why not extend this logic to other areas, I wonder? I mean, why doesn't the base model Toyota Camry come with a nicer interior, when Toyota could put leather on the seats at minimal expense instead of RIPPING OFF their customers? 🤣

 

[ignatius345]

It's only logical that people with opposing opinions would debate and argue when the topic is brought up. To think otherwise is illogical. To complain about it, is whining.

Have you considered not whining about people freely discussing a topic?

"Freely discussing" as in beating the same tired-ass drum endlessly. Move on. Apple sells computers in whatever configurations they choose to to make money, so just deal with that (or don't). They're also hardly the only company who prices things strategically. Just sort of sick of hearing all the bitching, honestly.

 

[6749974]

"Freely discussing" as in beating the same tired-ass drum endlessly. Move on. Apple sells computers in whatever configurations they choose to to make money, so just deal with that (or don't). They're also hardly the only company who prices things strategically. Just sort of sick of hearing all the bitching, honestly.

Your response is lazy. It's an easy way to dismiss any subject.

"You don't like it? Well that's the way that it is, accept it or move on. You don't like this aspect of corruption or injustice or greed or hardship? Move to another country. Don't like corruption in Wall Street or Government or corporate regulation or consumer rights? Well thats just the way it is. Stop talking about it."​

You think I enter forum posts, regarding topics that fatigue me, and demand people there cease discussing the topic? No I don't. That would be arrogant and self-centered of me to do.

 

[ric22]

Look at this laptop, one of the best selling on Amazon, with the same RAM as a MacBook Pro 14"... but at 10% of the cost!

SGIN 15.6 Inch Laptop 8GB RAM 256GB SSD Celeron Quad-Core Up to 2.8GHz, PC Notebook with Dual Band WiFi, 2xUSB 3.0, Keyboard Film in Eight Languages

The SGIN Laptop 8GB RAM 256GB SSD, equipped with a powerful Celeron Quad-Core processor.

www.amazon.co.uk

Sure, it's got a crap processor, but for people that genuinely just open the occasional document and browse the internet, this should be sufficient...

 

[StoneJack]

Look at this laptop, one of the best selling on Amazon, with the same RAM as a MacBook Pro 14"... but at 10% of the cost!

SGIN 15.6 Inch Laptop 8GB RAM 256GB SSD Celeron Quad-Core Up to 2.8GHz, PC Notebook with Dual Band WiFi, 2xUSB 3.0, Keyboard Film in Eight Languages

The SGIN Laptop 8GB RAM 256GB SSD, equipped with a powerful Celeron Quad-Core processor.

www.amazon.co.uk

Sure, it's got a crap processor, but for people that genuinely just open the occasional document and browse the internet, this should be sufficient...

Yes. There are also car brands (Yugo, Trabant) which are/were fraction of the cost of Toyota. Yet, Toyota is a number car seller in the world. Price is not the only factor, especially for computing.

 

[ric22]

Yes. There are also car brands (Yugo, Trabant) which are/were fraction of the cost of Toyota. Yet, Toyota is a number car seller in the world. Price is not the only factor, especially for computing.

I was talking about RAM. The £179 laptop on Amazon contains 8GB. Apple charges £21 more for 8GB of RAM than that complete laptop costs! I don't need to use a car analogy to help get that point across clearly, do I?

 

[StoneJack]

I was talking about RAM. The £179 laptop on Amazon contains 8GB. Apple charges £21 more for 8GB of RAM than that complete laptop costs! I don't need to use a car analogy to help get that point across clearly, do I?

I already told you, cost is not everything. If that was a case, the world will be driving only Yugos and Trabants. But both those brands died long ago and Toyota, which is 10 times more costly, is a number one seller. Do I need to repeat the example for you to understand?

 

[ric22]

I already told you, cost is not everything. If that was a case, the world will be driving only Yugos and Trabants. But both those brands died long ago and Toyota, which is 10 times more costly, is a number one seller. Do I need to repeat the example for you to understand?

Is Apple RAM magic or special compared to Windows RAM? Clearly no need to ever talk to you or read your posts again. Thanks for your contribution.

 

[StoneJack]

Is Apple RAM magic or special compared to Windows RAM? Clearly no need to ever talk to you or read your posts again. Thanks for your contribution.

You still dont get it. Why dont u reread my post and think for a while?

 

[6749974]

You still dont get it. Why dont u reread my post and think for a while?

It's hard to think our way around a bad analogy. Did Toyota use Yugo parts?

I always thought Toyota captured the market because they offered more spec at lower prices than the competition? Isn't that the opposite of Apple?

Can you maybe find a better analogy?

 

[StoneJack]

It's hard to think our way around a bad analogy. Did Toyota use Yugo parts?

I always thought Toyota captured the market because they offered more spec at lower prices than the competition? Isn't that the opposite of Apple?

Can you maybe find a better analogy?

well you are wrong. Check how much latest 4runner or RAV4 costs vs competition and you will be surprised to find that Toyota is not cheapest by far. If you comprehend that fact, you may understand the analogy.

 

[6749974]

well you are wrong. Check how much latest 4runner or RAV4 costs vs competition and you will be surprised to find that Toyota is not cheapest by far. If you comprehend that fact, you may understand the analogy.

Maybe consider that your analogy was about Toyota vs Yugo in the 1980's—when asian car companies where boxing out American car companies with value-per-dollar—so I'm playing by your timeline then.

Now you're talking about a completely different car market in today's economy now that Toyota has grown and dominated the market to the point of being the top 3rd brand. It's a different market.

Your strategy here is to use a bad analogy and then insult everyone for not understanding it. Just quit it. Go back to speaking about the thing, rather than making up vague analogies where everyone has to translate branding, technology, and car markets to what Apple is doing with RAM.

 

[colonelbutt]

Look at this laptop, one of the best selling on Amazon, with the same RAM as a MacBook Pro 14"... but at 10% of the cost!

Many folk buy the macbook for its look, feeling, build quality, screen quality and/or apple service.
These are qualities over and above its mere specs.
People buy the apple hermes watch, a rolex (when a 5.99 watch from amazon has more accurate time), Leica, etc.

You pays your money and takes your choice

IMHO, for my uses, I either buy the cheapest Macbook air, or the 18gb macbook pro. One is double the price of the other. As you add to the base, you approach the pro, which has the m3 pro cpu, and it hardly seems worth it when you are at 50% of the difference.

I opted for the base air (the M2), as it was the lightest and it met all the needs that I wanted for a portable and "holidayable" laptop. I have a desktop PC I built myself which has a sick specification for my heavy duty work, and of course games.

In the months I have been using the air, it has performed snappily and faultlessly. I am glad of my choice not to get the pro or get 16gb.

Everyone does what works for them. The only thing I object to, is people telling someone, whose workflow they don't know, is that 8gb is not enough. When it is plenty for many many tasks.

Saying that apple "should" provide 16gb in the base model or should provide the upgrade for less money is a totally separate argument. It has its merits and detractors