Netgear Launches New Orbi Dual Band Mesh Wi-Fi System for $230

[avtella]

The final spec has been released (please correct me if I'm wrong) and features can be added through firmware updates. I imagine the big names will do significant firmware updates as we move forward. The point is right now, it simply does not make sense to invest hundreds of dollars into last generation's technology when the the new is already available. People don't refresh their routers more than every few years or so and thus it's not a very prudent decision (IMO) to buy last-gen products at this price point.

I mean the current AX routers are extremely expensive compared to similarly performing AC routers (comparing in AC performance), with little gain in AX. The AX Orbi is like $700 vs $400 or so for the AC version. The R7800 is like $150-180 while the AX88U is like $300 and even though certain stuff can be enabled in updates some other stuff won’t till next gen chipsets, I mean the IPQ8078 from Qualcomm was supposed to support everything when announced in 2017 but now they are releasing similar chipsets with all features enabled for 2nd gen products. Also if anyone recalls when Broadcom first announced MU support for their first wave 2 AC chips, it was enabled after like a year and so bad it actually caused a performance loss with MU clients which wasn’t fixed till their 2nd gen Wave 2 AC chips. Also don’t forget that current AX chipsets from both Broadcom and Qualcomm still have various issues that need fixing, and maybe a few months before they are truly mature so stability is also a factor. I speak from experience as Beta tester of multiple high end routers since 2014, I have the RAX80 (Broadcom based) and RAX120 (Qualcomm based) in my possession at the moment. I will say though that Qualcomm usually implements advertised ancillary features in a more functional manner.

 

[aajeevlin]

Yeah, there's a point where it's worth paying someone a few hundred bucks to run cat6 network cable to the most optimal spots in your home to set up wired access points there. If you have something like 4500sqft you're already well past that point.

Once the wiring is in place it's forever. You can power the access points using Power over Ethernet, so no need for electrical outlets near them. You have dedicated bandwidth to each access point. You can keep upgrading the access points as tech improves.

Not to mention, while the guy is installing cable, might as well have him run network drops to your entertainment center and home office, so you can put that stuff on the wired network. The more stuff on your wired network, the better wireless will perform too.

this is the way to go. I have long ago switched to using pfsense + access point. When WiFi6 becomes a thing. I’ll simply pop my previous APs out and out in the new ones. No need to buy an entire system again.

 

[fmcshan]

Dear Apple, we miss the sleek design of AirPort!

 

[aneftp]

Im happy with my 2 Linksys triband velop (used for $130) plus my 4 linksys velop dualband ($50 plus $100 for all 4). So my total cost is $280

I got the dual band hard Ethernet Wired.

So the one triband sits in living room (not Ethernet Wired).

I get speeds 400-500mpbs throughout my 4000 square foot home.

The key is if u have Ethernet. U don’t need triband.

I really am just using 3 of the 4 dualband. I don’t even plug in the 4th dual band. It’s sitting in box.

 

[jcshas]

I don’t think any of the new/cheaper mesh routers are. I know the new Eero isn’t. I think it’s worth the extra money to future-proof with tri-band. Ethernet wiring for backhaul isn’t an option for me.

the Eero pro is indeed tri-band. check their website.

 

[CanyonLizard]

man, why did apple have to go and stop making routers?

I keep wondering the same thing, while hoping that my devices will hold out long enough for Apple to change their mind and reopen that division.

 

[Doctor Q]

I just switched (FINALLY!) from Comcast 250MB down (super rare to see anything CLOSE to those numbers - much closer to 25MB and not uncommon for it to drop as low as unusable) to CenturyLink gigabit fiber. It is stupid fast. It lands at the house in the living room modem/router (where TV and Apple TV are hardwired). Form there, I'll run one CAT-6 to the center of the house (where a loft/office resides). There, I'll connect to an old AEBS (I too fall in the camp that wished Apple were still in the router game). Form there, it's another CAT6 to another Base Station in the back of the house/master bedroom. This will afford TV and Apple TV Hardwire access as well as strong wifi (theoretically) to the studio that is a free-standing structure off the master bedroom.

Do you end up with separate Wi-Fi networks in different parts of the house?

 

[MacFanatick]

I'm waiting to see what Google announces tomorrow. An updated Google WiFi would probably be the replacement system for my AirPorts...

 

[jezbd1997]

As far as I can tell no Wifi6 right?

No this seems to be a new budget model... they have a wifi 6 model in the original shape coming soon I believe
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I'm waiting to see what Google announces tomorrow. An updated Google WiFi would probably be the replacement system for my AirPorts...

Interested in this as well, the current google wifi system specs were not high enough to replace my airports

 

[jezbd1997]

This is insane to me. What kind of company puts out a "brand new" wi-fi system that isn't even up to date?

It’s a cheaper model... they have a wifi 6 model coming very soon

 

[sirozha]

Ubiquiti routers seem interesting. Especially since they’re targeted towards enterprise. But idk how good they are compared to these Netgear and Linksys.

I’ve been thinking about getting their consumer-targeted Amplifi but it just seems too constrained in features compared to the business-line Unifi.

Ubiquiti has a UniFi Dream Machine, but it really is not targeted at the enterprise. It’s targeted at a prosumer or very small business. It’s not even targeted at a small branch of a larger business because the controller it talks to must run on the Dream Machine itself. So, the AP and the Security Gateway (router) cannot be homed to a centralized controller like the standalone APs and Security Gateway can. Additionally, the feature set on the security gateway built in to the Dream Machine is extremely narrow - it’s still in development. However, even the standalone Security Gateways have a very stripped down feature set, and have such weak CPUs with no VPN offloading that the encrypted throughput is dismal.

I would only recommend 3rd generation UniFied APs and only the UAP-AC-HD or more expensive ones. The UAP-nanoHD and UAP-IW-HD are buggy and have very limited range even though they are 3rd generation. I would not recommend the Dream Machine for many reasons. One reason is a very narrow feature set of the built-in Security Gateway and the other one is the fact that its AP is based on the UAP-nanoHD.

There’s also a Dream Machine Pro, but it doesn’t have a built-in AP, it’s rack-mountable, and the Security gateway runs the same firmware as the non-Pro Dream Machine, which means that the feature set is very narrow. Can’t even match a regular home router.

 

[jettredmont]

Low price and most likely equally low performance. If you can afford a 4500 sqf home, you can probably also afford good wifi. This seems useless.

Yeah, it is quite a step down from the closer-to-$400 RBK53 equivalent, more in feature set and reliability than in price.

"Dual band" is like the Google WiFi, and will cause the same difficulties as there. Without a dedicated uplink band, and without any wired backhaul option (no ethernet jacks on the satellites), this is a really lightweight offering.

I can't help but see it as a (year+ late) marketing response to Google's kit. Although, the Google version is $20 cheaper for 3 units, and the satellites support wired backhaul if you happen to have ethernet cabling to suitable install points in your home.

Overall, it seems a bit like floundering on Netgear's part. I really like my AC3200 system (RBK52 I believe, plus a lower-power dual-band wall satellite to fill in the end of an 'L' in the house). I can't even tell if these dual-band satellites will be able to interoperate with the tri-band solution Netgear has had out for a while. They don't seem to have much direction in what they are unveiling these days (a satellite with voice assistant built in is a bad idea on so many levels, then this foray into the low-end implementations for very large spaces).

 

[picaman]

the Eero pro is indeed tri-band. check their website.

Not talking about the Eero Pro. Talking about the new Eero that’s $249 at Amazon. Same setup as this new Orbi: three dual band units. Everyone is coming out with a comparable low end mesh package. I wouldn’t buy any of them, but that’s me.

 

[Phonzoxd]

Hows this so expensive, when the tp-link m4 set which is 3 routers, is like $80 cheaper.

 

[MareLuce]

No Wifi 6?

Why buy a new router with old technology?

*** Exactly ***

As of today:
- my phone ( iPhone 11 Pro Max ) supports WiFi-6
- my work laptop (Thinkpad X1 Extreme) supports WiFi-6

I can't wait to get a router that supports WiFi-6!

But I've had so many problems with my current NetGear Orbi (dropping connections even with a base station and 2 satellites) that I am waiting for Eero to come out with their WiFi-6 / 802.11ax router anyway.

 

[tennisproha]

I left NetGear for Ubiquiti. They do have some issues of their own but I'm very happy with the switch. I do wish they had better management tool integration for Edge Router/Switch and UniFi products (if you go 100% UniFi their tools are nicely integrated but there are use cases I prefer Edge Router and Edge Switch for) but even without it's a great prosumer solution. Lots of capabilities you'd normally have to go to Cisco for but more accessible for the higher end of home users and for small businesses.

Thanks. Any other issues that standout?

I’m looking for something that can be remotely managed away from home but also offers really good security. Ability to add IoT devices later a plus.

 

[alexandr]

I keep wondering the same thing, while hoping that my devices will hold out long enough for Apple to change their mind and reopen that division.

my sentiments exactly! i know the odds are against us, but they could use the fast-growing smart-home industry as an excuse to jump back into it without looking stupid.

 

[sirozha]

Avoid AmpliFi. No wired backhaul, no dedicated wireless vackhaul. Its a shared client/backhaul.

Orbi and Velop have dedicated mesh backhauls. If you cant do a wired backhaul do Orbi or Velop. (i think they also both support wired backhaul)

I run UniFi at some places. It works for some installations, not others. Most people I recommend Orbi to.

If you are able to go all in POE wiring. With UniFi can centralize UPS. Run POE to AP’s, small switches, cameras, and more.

Firewall, vlan’ing, and site-site vpn is very nice and easy for multiple locations.

AmpliFi has wired backhaul. There’s even a YouTube video on how to enable it.

 

[tennisproha]

Avoid AmpliFi. No wired backhaul, no dedicated wireless vackhaul. Its a shared client/backhaul.

Orbi and Velop have dedicated mesh backhauls. If you cant do a wired backhaul do Orbi or Velop. (i think they also both support wired backhaul)

I run UniFi at some places. It works for some installations, not others. Most people I recommend Orbi to.

If you are able to go all in POE wiring. With UniFi can centralize UPS. Run POE to AP’s, small switches, cameras, and more.

Firewall, vlan’ing, and site-site vpn is very nice and easy for multiple locations.

Hmm, Is this not the wired backhaul you mention?

Regarding Unifi, my intention was actually to do a router to POE setup at home. I want something that can really be remotely managed away from home but also offers really good security. Haven’t heard good things about Netgear and Linksys security, which is why I’m hesitant towards them. Ability to add IoT devices later would be a plus.

We have good coverage so I don’t think mesh would be necessary. Just want a solid, feature-rich, secure setup with great configurability options.

Sorry I’m fairly networking naive. I understand all the lingo you wrote but don’t really know how to go about finding the right setup.

 

[TheIntruder]

my sentiments exactly! i know the odds are against us, but they could use the fast-growing smart-home industry as an excuse to jump back into it without looking stupid.

Apple built a foundation for IoT with HomeKit, and then let someone else finish the house and move in.

Now, it's on the outside looking in.

It could have brought Apple standards to things like cameras, doorbells, thermostats, timers, etc., with a privacy-oriented bent as an extra to set it apart. Could have incorporated iCloud services into the mix to form a whole other, complementary ecosystem to iOS.

Instead, we've got a speaker that had Siri (another lead squandered) shoved into it, and HomeKit relegated to a niche.

Might be Apple's biggest strategic blunder in recent history.

 

[alexandr]

Apple built a foundation for IoT with HomeKit, and then let someone else finish the house and move in.

Now, it's on the outside looking in.

It could have brought Apple standards to things like cameras, doorbells, thermostats, timers, etc., with a privacy-oriented bent as an extra to set it apart. Could have incorporated iCloud services into the mix to form a whole other, complementary ecosystem to iOS.

Instead, we've got a speaker that had Siri (another lead squandered) shoved into it, and HomeKit relegated to a niche.

Might be Apple's biggest strategic blunder in recent history.

i couldn't agree more. apple's ability to integrate would've been the most amazing part of it all. instead we have... what you said...

 

[CraigB1960]

Apple built a foundation for IoT with HomeKit, and then let someone else finish the house and move in.

Now, it's on the outside looking in.

It could have brought Apple standards to things like cameras, doorbells, thermostats, timers, etc., with a privacy-oriented bent as an extra to set it apart. Could have incorporated iCloud services into the mix to form a whole other, complementary ecosystem to iOS.

Instead, we've got a speaker that had Siri (another lead squandered) shoved into it, and HomeKit relegated to a niche.

Might be Apple's biggest strategic blunder in recent history.

I keep trying to love my HomeKit, but can't. I am a retired EE that specialized in transmission automation. It is not hard to design a well thought out home integration system....Homekit misses on many key targets.

I hope they will put more effort into this, they have capable engineers that can implement it.

 

[lazyrighteye]

Do you end up with separate Wi-Fi networks in different parts of the house?

Not quite there yet - still sourcing cables.
But that’s an interesting thought I hadn’t yet considered. And now that I think about it, that does seem highly likely. Hmmm...

 

[John.B]

Is Netgear still charging $50 (upfront) for tier-1 support calls ?

 

[Aston441]

I purchased the Google mesh wifi about six months ago, with three satellites for our 5000 sf home. It was a big improvement over the Airport Extreme with Airport Expresses throughout the house.

The Airport Expresses have been re-tasked with streaming music to the built-in speakers throughout the house.

This.


I've struggled with junk wifi routers since 1999 (not a typo). I've used every brand. I've used every alternative software (Tomato, etc)

At best I occasionally had acceptable performance... until the hardware eventually, always, fried itself.

I went Google mesh a year ago.

They are perfect.

They use essentially zero overhead. I have no idea how this is possible, but it is a fact. The performance is astonishing.

Probabaly Google sends everything I do online to the NSA.

I don't care.

At all.

Because for the first time in TWENTY YEARS my stupid wifi just works, perfectly, everywhere, all the time. And setup took one minute.

I'll never get the weeks maybe months of my life back trying to make wifi performance acceptable, before Google mesh changed everything.