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Neverending quest for 10G usb-c hub?

T

toke lahti

macrumors 68040
Original poster
Hi,
just wondering, how many years will it still get, before usb-c gets so mainstream, that you can buy a usb-c hub with >3 usb-c ports, all working 10 Gbps (3.1 gen 2)?

Anybody found any yet?
People just don't need these?
Is there a certain technical limitation why these are not in the market?

#1
www.startech.com

4-Port USB C Hub - USB-C to 4x USB-A Ports - SuperSpeed 10Gbps USB 3.2 Gen 2 Type-C Hub - USB Bus Powered - Portable/Compact USB-C to USB Adapter Hub for Laptop - Aluminum

4-Port USB C Hub - USB-C to 4x USB-A Ports - SuperSpeed 10Gbps USB 3.2 Gen 2 Type-C Hub - USB Bus Powered - Portable/Compact USB-C to USB Adapter Hub for Laptop - Aluminum
www.startech.com www.startech.com
-only usb-a ports (4)
-no aux power

#2
www.startech.com

4 Port USB C Hub w/ 2x USB A & 2x USB C - SuperSpeed 10Gbps USB Type-C 3.2 Gen 2 Hub - USB Bus Powered - Portable USB-C to USB Adapter Hub - Aluminum - 9.8" (25cm) Cable - TAA

4 Port USB C Hub w/ 2x USB A & 2x USB C - SuperSpeed 10Gbps USB Type-C 3.2 Gen 2 Hub - USB Bus Powered - Portable USB-C to USB Adapter Hub - Aluminum - 9.8" (25cm) Cable - TAA
www.startech.com www.startech.com
-2 usb-c ports
-no aux power

#3

Delock Produkte 64054 Delock Externer USB 3.1 2 Port Typ-A und 2 Port USB Type-C™ Hub mit 10 Gbps

www.delock.de www.delock.de
-2- usb-c ports
+aux power
 
I just don't understand why anyone isn't making a Thunderbolt/USB-C ONLY dock. I want 4 to 6 powered USB-C ports that I can plug in the MBPro and have it charge, my LG Ultrafine monitor, USB-C SSD storage drives... and all of them get powered through the dock.

I don't need USB-A ports, card readers, security locks, HDMI, DisplayPort, or anything else - though a reliable Ethernet port would be nice.

I can't believe there aren't a ton of professionals who would love that device... even if it was $300-$400.
 
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I'm in the same boat, so am looking at the two offerings from OWC. They both have 10G on board, but a single Displayport, and I need two, so its going to be a mix of the dock plus the USB-C to Dual Displayport adapter.

OWC were the only ones who I found actually had something that existed. I also looked at the Aikitio (spelling?) eGPU that could add an extra card in it for the 10G ethernet but it doesn't exist anymore as far as I can see.
 
ivnj said:

IOGEAR 4 Port USB 3.0 Hub Gray GUH3C22P - Best Buy

Shop IOGEAR 4 Port USB 3.0 Hub Gray products at Best Buy. Find low everyday prices and buy online for delivery or in-store pick-up. Price Match Guarantee.
www.bestbuy.com
Click to expand...
Okay, no mention about 3.1gen2, but it is that.
No aux power though...
[automerge]1590234791[/automerge]
satcomer said:
I just found this OWC Thunderbolt 3 Pro Dock that has a 10g port on it!
Click to expand...
Nope, I'm not looking for ethernet.
I want to run my mac mini with 3 different os'es, 3 ssd's connected to usb-c hub, each having 10Gbps when in use.
 
satcomer said:
However curb your 10G Ethernet port USB C port doesn’t have the bandwidth for it, only Thunderbolt 3!
Click to expand...
1590532614803.png
 
My understanding of why we have not seen such a device come to market is because apparently USB-C has to do some negotiating with the downstream devices on what it will be doing, and that can actually force physical hardware path decisions. For example, if the downstream will be a 4k/5k monitor needing the full 10 Gbps, that requires dual lane support, which means a monopoly on both pairs of USB 3.x data path wires in the physical connector; easy if there's only one USB-C port, not so much otherwise. The connector supports simultaneous 3.0/3.1 and 2.0 by way of physically separate wires, so that's why it remains possible to have a single USB-C downstream plus one or more 2.0-based ports, such as a few type A ports and an SD card reader, all operating at 2.0 speed. The connector even supports power delivery plus the four wires for 3.x plus the extra pair for 2.0, which is why you see some "hubs" that have a usb-c data and a separate usb-c for power (but no data), and then the 2.0 stuff.

For what we want, i.e. more than one downstream USB-C, I think you'd have to add a chip in the middle that intentionally breaks the protocol and does not allow a device to negotiate the use of 10/20 Gbps speeds, only allowing 5, and only allowing the use of one lane per port, as this would be a two port device. It could of course have additional USB 2.0 non-C ports. Such a device would likely cause more trouble than it's worth because you know people would be trying to plug in devices that expect to be able to negotiate 10 gbps / dual lane usage, then calling in for support when they fail.

I think we're stuck with Thunderbolt 3 hubs, as they have 40 Gbps to the Mac, and can then have several Type C 3.1 ports, via dedicated chips per port. Obviously not ideal as you don't want a big honking Thunderbolt hub sitting next to your keyboard for simple things like Yubikeys and flash drives.
 
Bear in mind any 10GBe adapter or hub creates HEAT.
I use the CalDigit adapter, and during use, especialy with heavy file transfers, the unit gets quite warm! Fortunately its a complete heatsink design so no moving parts or fans, hence stays nice and quiet, and performs wonderfully.


The OWC dock mentioned above also performs well, but has an inbuilt fan to keep it cool, so adds some noise. The fan can be switched off, but its not recommended to run it like this for anything more then 30 mins - so good for a quick audio recording when you need silence, but not for anything more.


I personally now use the above CalDigit 10GBe adapter, connected to the TB3 port on the back of my CalDigit TS3+ Dock - that way whenever my laptop is connected to the dock I have full 10GBe to the network as well. Works perfectly well.

 
Ifti said:
Bear in mind any 10GBe adapter or hub creates HEAT.
I use the CalDigit adapter, and during use, especialy with heavy file transfers, the unit gets quite warm! Fortunately its a complete heatsink design so no moving parts or fans, hence stays nice and quiet, and performs wonderfully.


The OWC dock mentioned above also performs well, but has an inbuilt fan to keep it cool, so adds some noise. The fan can be switched off, but its not recommended to run it like this for anything more then 30 mins - so good for a quick audio recording when you need silence, but not for anything more.


I personally now use the above CalDigit 10GBe adapter, connected to the TB3 port on the back of my CalDigit TS3+ Dock - that way whenever my laptop is connected to the dock I have full 10GBe to the network as well. Works perfectly well.

Click to expand...
Well, that doesn't help me to connect 3 ssd's affordably with fast connection to my mini.
(Btw, my mini has "internal" 10GbaseT ...)

But, this will, expensive Delock has got an inexpensive contestant:
www.amazon.de

Goobay 66456 USB-C™ Gen2 hub - adds four USB-A connections to a USB-C™ device

Goobay 66456 USB-C Hub Gen2, Four USB-A Ports with 10 Gbps per port, Black Cable
www.amazon.de

Looks like the same than delock, only without aux power and those I already have.
If this works, it has amazing price performance ratio.
And it still weird that there aren't more like this: usb3.1gen2, 10Gbps in & out + aux power.

Even with 20x money, you can't buy a tb hub with 3 tb enclosures for ssds, can you?
Or does tb storage enclosure with daisy chining even exist?
 
As an Amazon Associate, MacRumors earns a commission from qualifying purchases made through links in this post.
The G-Technology (now owned by Western Digital) gear typically supports Thunderbolt daisy chaining. Their G-Drive, G-Raid, G-Speed enclosures unfortunately come with drives pre-installed, so you can't just buy the raid enclosure and throw your own SSD's in, but you could always buy the cheapest model with spinning disks and swap them for SSD's.
 
ispcolohost said:
The G-Technology (now owned by Western Digital) gear typically supports Thunderbolt daisy chaining. Their G-Drive, G-Raid, G-Speed enclosures unfortunately come with drives pre-installed, so you can't just buy the raid enclosure and throw your own SSD's in, but you could always buy the cheapest model with spinning disks and swap them for SSD's.
Click to expand...
Yep, funny that they still sell daisy-tb-enclosure for $330 and you get a 4tb spinning disk in that.
What is the reason to buy a tb enclosure with spinning disk?
It was a nice idea in 2010, but in 2020...

Aaand, their external ssd drives do not, of course, support daisy chaining...
(Because too complicated to use: you should put a powerplug in that enclosure and write user guide: "If you are daisy chaining, you need to use aux power.)
 
Hello,

It is disappointing to see how few true Thunderport docs/hubs exist. At one extreme are USB-C options for around $20 but they compromise 4k @30HZ or USB speed 5GB/s.

I'm throwing this out there but this option from Anker is very tempting to me since it appears to be the cheapest name brand USB-C option with both USB 10 GB/s and 4K @ 60HZ for $59.

https://www.amazon.com/Anker-PowerExpand-Adapter-Delivery-Ethernet/dp/B0874M3KW4/ref=pd_cart_vw_crc_... [amazon.com]

Thoughts on this item? Alternatives? My primary need is an SD card slot, USB A, and ethernet is a bonus.
 
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yatesd said:
Hello,

It is disappointing to see how few true Thunderport docs/hubs exist. At one extreme are USB-C options for around $20 but they compromise 4k @30HZ or USB speed 5GB/s.

I'm throwing this out there but this option from Anker is very tempting to me since it appears to be the cheapest name brand USB-C option with both USB 10 GB/s and 4K @ 60HZ for $59.

https://www.amazon.com/Anker-PowerExpand-Adapter-Delivery-Ethernet/dp/B0874M3KW4/ref=pd_cart_vw_crc_... [amazon.com]

Thoughts on this item? Alternatives? My primary need is an SD card slot, USB A, and ethernet is a bonus.
Click to expand...
Well, it has ONE usb-c port, no aux power for that and I'll bet it's only 5Gbps, because they don't say it's 10Gbps.
 
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Is it even physically possible to have a dock with 4 x 10 Gbps USB-C 3.1g2 ports connected via a single USB-C 3.1g2 x 10Gbps cable?

Wouldn't it have to be a TB3 dock (with those ports) to provide the bandwidth you want?

Or I misunderstanding, and you're conflating USB-C (the connector) with USB3.1g2 (the protocol) and TB3 (the protocol) - and you are just bemoaning the fact that there's no cheap TB3 dock with 4 USB3.1g2 ports (plus lots of other ports) 😵
 
Yeah I suspect those specs from StarTech are disingenuous, or they're just confused. My earlier post about USB 3.1 explains why. However, if the device actually is USB 3.2 gen 2, then it could potentially have 20 gbps to the computer and do 10 gbps to the downstream ports. I can't tell because their own specs make no sense; is it 3.1 or 3.2?

Bus TypeUSB 3.1 Gen 2
Industry StandardsUSB 3.2 Gen 2 - Backwards compatible with USB 3.0, 2.0, and 1.1
InterfaceUSB 3.1 Gen 2
 
tyc0746 said:
Is it even physically possible to have a dock with 4 x 10 Gbps USB-C 3.1g2 ports connected via a single USB-C 3.1g2 x 10Gbps cable?

Wouldn't it have to be a TB3 dock (with those ports) to provide the bandwidth you want?

Or I misunderstanding, and you're conflating USB-C (the connector) with USB3.1g2 (the protocol) and TB3 (the protocol) - and you are just bemoaning the fact that there's no cheap TB3 dock with 4 USB3.1g2 ports (plus lots of other ports) 😵
Click to expand...
My need is to run separate OSses from external ssd's. So, only one of those downward ports are in "full" use at one time.
But having 10G upstream and (4x) 5G downstream means, that I get no benefit of that upstream speed. Might as well use plain old usb-a-3.0 hub.

Problem with tb-docks is, that they are utterly expensive, have ports that I don't need and don't have ports that I do need. And, of course, there are no tb3-hubs on the market. If there would be a tb-dock, that would have one fw, one esata and 4 10G-usb ports, I'd consider it.
 
Last edited:
toke lahti said:
Problem with tb-docks is, that they are utterly expensive, have ports that I don't need and don't have ports that I do need. And, of course, there are no tb3-hubs on the market. If there would be a tb-dock, that would have one fw, one esata and 4 10G-usb ports, I'd consider it.
Click to expand...

You could technically achieve 4 3.2 gen 2 USB-c ports with:

www.sonnetstore.com

Echo Express SEL (1 PCIe slot for low-profile card + compact design)

Desktop Thunderbolt 3 adapter box with one PCIe expansion slot for low-profile PCIe cards.
www.sonnetstore.com www.sonnetstore.com

+

www.sonnetstore.com

Allegro USB-C 4-Port PCIe Card (4-ports • USB-C 10Gbps/USB 3.2 Gen 2 • Dual controllers • USB-C charging)

Mac, Windows and Linux PCIe adapter card with four USB-C ports and 7.5W of power dedicated to each port for bus-powered USB 3.1 Gen 2 (10Gbps) devices. Backwards compatible with USB 3.1 and 3.0 peripherals.
www.sonnetstore.com www.sonnetstore.com

But it is still utterly expensive.
 
toke lahti said:
My need is to run separate OSses from external ssd's. So, only one of those downward ports are in "full" use at one time.
But having 10G upstream and (4x) 5G downstream means, that I get no benefit of that upstream speed. Might as well use plain old usb-a-3.0 hub.

Problem with tb-docks is, that they are utterly expensive, have ports that I don't need and don't have ports that I do need. And, of course, there are no tb3-hubs on the market. If there would be a tb-dock, that would have one fw, one esata and 4 10G-usb ports, I'd consider it.
Click to expand...

I found it!

USB 3.1 Gen 2 (10Gbps) ports.

www.charjenpro.com

PreLaunch Ultimate Dock

www.charjenpro.com www.charjenpro.com
 
"I want to run my mac mini with 3 different os'es, 3 ssd's connected to usb-c hub, each having 10Gbps when in use."

Maybe I'm misunderstanding the need, but if you put the SSD's in a Thunderbolt drive enclosure, something like this:

eshop.macsales.com

OWC ThunderBay 4: Thunderbolt 4-Bay External RAID Storage

The ultimate Thunderbolt RAID Storage Drive for creative workflows. Perfect for handling 4K video, audio, and photography with confidence and speed.
eshop.macsales.com eshop.macsales.com

Would that work?
 
MevetS said:
"I want to run my mac mini with 3 different os'es, 3 ssd's connected to usb-c hub, each having 10Gbps when in use."

Maybe I'm misunderstanding the need, but if you put the SSD's in a Thunderbolt drive enclosure, something like this:

eshop.macsales.com

OWC ThunderBay 4: Thunderbolt 4-Bay External RAID Storage

The ultimate Thunderbolt RAID Storage Drive for creative workflows. Perfect for handling 4K video, audio, and photography with confidence and speed.
eshop.macsales.com eshop.macsales.com

Would that work?
Click to expand...
It would work. It's just absurd level of overprice.
Same thing can be done in 5Gbit/s with any regular usb-hub and slowly the new 10Gbit/s ones are becoming mainstream.

TB will soon die from mainstream.
Usb4 will replace it in all consumer level needs.
Then Apple doesn't offer it in other macs than the high end -> more profits.
 
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