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daveg5 said:
basically all people are asking for is, 4 Ram slots (a most if G5 and in pairs) upgradable graphics, at least at the time of ordering, preferable removable AGP, and 1PCI slot or pccard slot for future firewire1600-usb3-wireless 802-firewire-sata300 technologies.
some notebooks already have this feature set.

Ok, I think the only way this could happen is for someone to sell this to Steve the way that someone sold open-source to him. I agree that upgradability is a good thing: it would probably take out one more leg from the anti-Mac crowd who take great pleasure in pointing out "Oh, look, you can't upgrade it!"

Here's the deal: the people I hang around with who would say this are computer techs who wouldn't want an AIO because they're power users who want slots and bays, so they wouldn't ever be a part of the demographic for this; and the people I deal with on the phone doing TS would, for the most part, buy this kind of system because they have a solutions-based (aka appliance) point of view, and they are the very folks at whom these systems are aimed.

Me, personally, I have an 800 MHz 15" iMac, and until the day that it is no longer useful or it dies, I wouldn't trade it for the world. I love the design. I think whomever created it deserves a pat on his/her/their back for it and an attaboy. I was once what I could call a power user, but my needs and uses have long since quit being at the high-end and requiring the forefront of technology to satisfy.

I am not the kind of person who is interested in having a 5-, 6-, or 7.1 sound system connected. I don't play any high-end games. I am not a 3D rendering or animation artist. I am a graphic designer and desktop publisher, and my needs are fully met with InDesign, Photoshop, Quark, and occassionally Illustrator (used as a screwdriver or hammer, not as a paintbrush).

I love the screen. The only "deficiency" is the size: I would love to have the 17" screen. Otherwise, it does everything I want and more. If I had to go and get a screen for it, I wouldn't have bought it. Period. If it was sold as a dome or a box, I would have probably bought a tower and found a home for it.

I have used the G4 cube at another place I used to work for, and while it's nice, it's a real pain in the patookas because now I have yet another box taking up space on the worksurface. I can't stick it behind the monitor because there's no phyiscal space. I can't put it on the floor because the cord length isn't long enough, and even if it were, then I'd have to get under the desk everytime I wanted to insert a CD or DVD. Besides, it's made to be a piece of art, so it should be in a place where it can be seen. So, it sits to the rear right of the monitor, and it competes with a USB ZIP drive and USB floppy drive for space, to say nothing of the fact that it cramps where I can have my mouse and pad. If it were a FP iMac, none of this would be the case.

I think the point that a lot lot of people on this board are missing is the fact that there is a difference between having a choice and Apple obeying a marketing edict wherein they are trying to provide an appliance.
 
MikeTheC said:
Ok, I think the only way this could happen is for someone to sell this to Steve the way that someone sold open-source to him. I agree that upgradability is a good thing: it would probably take out one more leg from the anti-Mac crowd who take great pleasure in pointing out "Oh, look, you can't upgrade it!"

Here's the deal: the people I hang around with who would say this are computer techs who wouldn't want an AIO because they're power users who want slots and bays, so they wouldn't ever be a part of the demographic for this; and the people I deal with on the phone doing TS would, for the most part, buy this kind of system because they have a solutions-based (aka appliance) point of view, and they are the very folks at whom these systems are aimed.

Me, personally, I have an 800 MHz 15" iMac, and until the day that it is no longer useful or it dies, I wouldn't trade it for the world. I love the design. I think whomever created it deserves a pat on his/her/their back for it and an attaboy. I was once what I could call a power user, but my needs and uses have long since quit being at the high-end and requiring the forefront of technology to satisfy.

I am not the kind of person who is interested in having a 5-, 6-, or 7.1 sound system connected. I don't play any high-end games. I am not a 3D rendering or animation artist. I am a graphic designer and desktop publisher, and my needs are fully met with InDesign, Photoshop, Quark, and occassionally Illustrator (used as a screwdriver or hammer, not as a paintbrush).

I love the screen. The only "deficiency" is the size: I would love to have the 17" screen. Otherwise, it does everything I want and more. If I had to go and get a screen for it, I wouldn't have bought it. Period. If it was sold as a dome or a box, I would have probably bought a tower and found a home for it.

I have used the G4 cube at another place I used to work for, and while it's nice, it's a real pain in the patookas because now I have yet another box taking up space on the worksurface. I can't stick it behind the monitor because there's no phyiscal space. I can't put it on the floor because the cord length isn't long enough, and even if it were, then I'd have to get under the desk everytime I wanted to insert a CD or DVD. Besides, it's made to be a piece of art, so it should be in a place where it can be seen. So, it sits to the rear right of the monitor, and it competes with a USB ZIP drive and USB floppy drive for space, to say nothing of the fact that it cramps where I can have my mouse and pad. If it were a FP iMac, none of this would be the case.

I think the point that a lot lot of people on this board are missing is the fact that there is a difference between having a choice and Apple obeying a marketing edict wherein they are trying to provide an appliance.
Word! If you want removable drives and blah blah blah get a Powermac. It seems that just about everyone on these boards just want a Powermac with a built in screen.
 
MikeTheC said:
I have used the G4 cube at another place I used to work for, and while it's nice, it's a real pain in the patookas because now I have yet another box taking up space on the worksurface. I can't stick it behind the monitor because there's no phyiscal space. I can't put it on the floor because the cord length isn't long enough, and even if it were, then I'd have to get under the desk everytime I wanted to insert a CD or DVD. Besides, it's made to be a piece of art, so it should be in a place where it can be seen. So, it sits to the rear right of the monitor, and it competes with a USB ZIP drive and USB floppy drive for space, to say nothing of the fact that it cramps where I can have my mouse and pad.

this has to be the first post EVER that complains of how the G4 Cube is such a desk space hog!!!
 
Dr. Dastardly said:
Word! If you want removable drives and blah blah blah get a Powermac. It seems that just about everyone on these boards just want a Powermac with a built in screen.

Not necessarily.

Just today one of my sales reps emailed me that he was ready for a new computer but couldn't justify paying three times the price for a Mac. A little backdrop, we sell a product that consumers see as a commodity but our product is better than the competitors and more expensive. I often use Apple and/or Macs as comparisons in sales meetings. And often try to sell the benfits of switching to my staff.

I called him into my office and asked him what he wanted to do. (BTW, replacing a just under 3 year old Sony) Lots of multi media stuff he replied; pictures, movies, move my music collection to computer (he loves my iPod) and Office. We went to the Apple Store and he said no way can he afford a PM. He asked me what I was buying and I showed him the iMac (waiting for G5) and he said he already has a kick ass 19" display so that would be a waste. Don't they offer something affordable without a monitor?

Not giving up, we went to Dell's web site to look at the $600 PC he originally compared a Mac to. Built it up to iMac like specs and software and the huge price difference disappeared although still a difference.

Back to Apple and the eMac. Showed him iLife (all the software he needs except Office. Another rep had joined us and said his wife was a teacher. Office for $139, solved). Popped over to show him what I could of .Mac (few sites of pictures and one movie, my bookmarks accessible on a PC at work). OK, he's close now.

Told him a Mac should last him 5 or so years, maybe more or 2-3 Sony's. Ease of use, security, it just works, tons of freeware and shareware, cool OS X stuff. (Damn, was never this hard selling Macs as a reseller for 8 years).

OK, ready to close him. Why is the product you sell more expensive than your competitors? It's better and we have verifiable proof and references. Oh, I said, like a Mac.

Told him to eBay his 19" monitor and buy an eMac or wait for the new iMacs or I'd fire his ass. I love switching people.
 
rdowns said:
Not necessarily.

Just today one of my sales reps emailed me that he was ready for a new computer but couldn't justify paying three times the price for a Mac. A little backdrop, we sell a product that consumers see as a commodity but our product is better than the competitors and more expensive. I often use Apple and/or Macs as comparisons in sales meetings. And often try to sell the benfits of switching to my staff.

I called him into my office and asked him what he wanted to do. (BTW, replacing a just under 3 year old Sony) Lots of multi media stuff he replied; pictures, movies, move my music collection to computer (he loves my iPod) and Office. We went to the Apple Store and he said no way can he afford a PM. He asked me what I was buying and I showed him the iMac (waiting for G5) and he said he already has a kick ass 19" display so that would be a waste. Don't they offer something affordable without a monitor?

Not giving up, we went to Dell's web site to look at the $600 PC he originally compared a Mac to. Built it up to iMac like specs and software and the huge price difference disappeared although still a difference.

Back to Apple and the eMac. Showed him iLife (all the software he needs except Office. Another rep had joined us and said his wife was a teacher. Office for $139, solved). Popped over to show him what I could of .Mac (few sites of pictures and one movie, my bookmarks accessible on a PC at work). OK, he's close now.

Told him a Mac should last him 5 or so years, maybe more or 2-3 Sony's. Ease of use, security, it just works, tons of freeware and shareware, cool OS X stuff. (Damn, was never this hard selling Macs as a reseller for 8 years).

OK, ready to close him. Why is the product you sell more expensive than your competitors? It's better and we have verifiable proof and references. Oh, I said, like a Mac.

Told him to eBay his 19" monitor and buy an eMac or wait for the new iMacs or I'd fire his ass. I love switching people.

I always think the 12" PB is the best option for these people, it allows them to keep their old monitor, it has plenty of power to be a desktop for non pro stuff and you get the added advantage of having a super sleek laptop aswell. I guess the hard drive isn't that large however.
 
yeah, myself included both the iBook, and the PowerBook, seem to be the best 'tools' for persuading people to switch, it worked for me, and now i'm really happy with my iBook! :cool:
 
The proof is in the keynote!

Sorry I'm late to the party or if I'm reposting a point already made. I got tired around page 20-something of this thread and didn't feel like reading all the way to page 33.
The proof is in Steve's WWDC keynote. I got this from the anandtech.com forum of all places! (Yeah, I know they're a bunch of Mac-bashin' PC-lovin'... I'll stop there) Anyway this is what 1 member of that forum had to say about the keynote:

"Well, check out the stream at the 45 and a half minute mark, where he's demo-ing the Spotlight search capabilities of Tiger.

His primary searches are "imac" "Paris" "birthday"

I think that's a pretty damn big hint that new 20th Anniversary iMacs are going to be released at Apple expo in Paris on August 31st."
 
DISCOMUNICATION said:
Sorry I'm late to the party or if I'm reposting a point already made. I got tired around page 20-something of this thread and didn't feel like reading all the way to page 33.
The proof is in Steve's WWDC keynote. I got this from the anandtech.com forum of all places! (Yeah, I know they're a bunch of Mac-bashin' PC-lovin'... I'll stop there) Anyway this is what 1 member of that forum had to say about the keynote:

"Well, check out the stream at the 45 and a half minute mark, where he's demo-ing the Spotlight search capabilities of Tiger.

His primary searches are "imac" "Paris" "birthday"

I think that's a pretty damn big hint that new 20th Anniversary iMacs are going to be released at Apple expo in Paris on August 31st."
Yeah all the conspiracy experts are saying that. But its pretty much a given now seeing that Apple said that the Imacs were due in September. Aug. 31st is pretty close to September.

What got me was the half-dome search he did. But I read into things to much as well. ;)
 
September iMacs.

I read somewhere, that there are continuing supply problems with a primary and single sourced component, and this has to be resolved - guess they don't want a repeat of a recent quality control panic. Sensible, really.
 
blasto333 said:
Very Good point. Why not announce it then and say shipping in September?!?!?
They don't want to get stuck with a glut of inventory on what the public would deem unsellable iMac G4's.
 
imac is all wrong!!!!!!!!

first of all, maybe this has been said (33 pages! :eek: ) and i couldnt read it all and anyway im sure some of yall 'll get PO'ed at this.

THE EMAC IS ALREADY WHAT THE IMAC G4 SHOULD HAVE BEEN
if i were apple, and there are many reasons im not, the imac g5 would be in 3 configurations.

base model:
19" CRT at 1600x1200
PPC 970 (not fx) at 1.6 ghz
512mb ram (up to 2096) w/ 2 slots
Radeon 9600 pro w/ 64mb vram (no upgrade)
80gb sata hdd (up to 250)
combo drive (with option to downgrade to cd-rom or up to superdrive)
notebook-style ram slots (just unscrew and pop-in)
tilt/swivel stand a la emac
in aluminum :cool::cool: with iPod mini colors
$999

dv model: same except
22" CRT at 2048x1536
1024mb ram (up to 4096)
Radeon 9800 pro w/ 128 vram
160gb sata hdd (up to 250)
8x superdrive (w/ combo option)
aluminum a la g5 tower
$1599

dv special edition: same as dv except
1.8ghz PPC 970
9800 pro w/ 256 vram
250gb hdd
aluminum in iPod mini colors
$1799

i'd definitely buy the pink dv special edition and im sure the most popular would be the base model because it's what the original imac was. that's why it sold well. because it was just enough power, but not enough to be expensive. plus a huge monitor that would actually scale down for people who want bigger text but dont know about "dpi" and changing it that way (remember consumer). also people who want to do more things like gaming and photoshop and dvds could buy the dv and people who just want the best (or need it and cant afford the extra 200+monitor for a pm) would get the dv se
 
homerjward said:
if i were apple, and there are many reasons im not, the imac g5 would be in 3 configurations.

base model:
19" CRT at 1600x1200
PPC 970 (not fx) at 1.6 ghz
512mb ram (up to 2096) w/ 2 slots
Radeon 9600 pro w/ 64mb vram (no upgrade)
80gb sata hdd (up to 250)
combo drive (with option to downgrade to cd-rom or up to superdrive)
notebook-style ram slots (just unscrew and pop-in)
tilt/swivel stand a la emac
in aluminum :cool::cool: with iPod mini colors
$999

dv model: same except
22" CRT at 2048x1536
1024mb ram (up to 4096)
Radeon 9800 pro w/ 128 vram
160gb sata hdd (up to 250)
8x superdrive (w/ combo option)
aluminum a la g5 tower
$1599

ummm, if you were apple my first question for you would be Why the hell are you using CRTs ??
a 15" LCD costs as much as a decent 19" CRT. and 19" LCDs cost as much as 22" CRTs. i think 99 out of 100 apple customers would rather pay the same price for 2 inches less viewable area. not to mention a lighter, flicker free, more energy effecient LCD.

not to mention the 17" eMac is 50lb's... a 22" CRT iMac would fall through the top of my desk.

i'm not saying this because i don't like CRTs, i am looking at 2 of them right now.
 
DISCOMUNICATION said:
Sorry I'm late to the party or if I'm reposting a point already made. I got tired around page 20-something of this thread and didn't feel like reading all the way to page 33.
The proof is in Steve's WWDC keynote. I got this from the anandtech.com forum of all places! (Yeah, I know they're a bunch of Mac-bashin' PC-lovin'... I'll stop there) Anyway this is what 1 member of that forum had to say about the keynote:

"Well, check out the stream at the 45 and a half minute mark, where he's demo-ing the Spotlight search capabilities of Tiger.

His primary searches are "imac" "Paris" "birthday"

I think that's a pretty damn big hint that new 20th Anniversary iMacs are going to be released at Apple expo in Paris on August 31st."

do you also beleive that Nostradamus predicted WWII and 9-11 as well?
 
Dr. Dastardly said:
Yeah all the conspiracy experts are saying that. But its pretty much a given now seeing that Apple said that the Imacs were due in September. Aug. 31st is pretty close to September.

What got me was the half-dome search he did. But I read into things to much as well. ;)

I was thinking aloong the same lines. I saw the Stevenote again :D today, and i think the halfdome search was just to get our noses off the scent. Or perhaps the formfactor won't be any different :confused:
 
MikeTheC said:
You know, regarding this entire ornamental case thing, I wonder where it stands relative to those weather- and stock market-color changing globes that Brookstone sells.
Those are made by Ambient Devices. They are in the same situation as Apple, pantent-wise; both have unapproved pending applications.

Ambient recently entered a license agreement with Color Kinetics, who do have patents in this area. The only real difference between what Apple and others are doing is that Apple would claim the idea for use within a computer enclosure, while the other are more general. Depending on timing, Apple would likely have to get licenses from one of the others; with applications still pending all around, that might well explain why the idea has gone unused.
Maybe Apple will have Macs that glow white when their stock goes up, and red when their stock goes down. :eek:
All I want is a way to permanently disable those stupid throbbing iMac sleep lights that doesn't involve a hacksaw.
 
base model:
19" CRT at 1600x1200
PPC 970 (not fx) at 1.6 ghz
512mb ram (up to 2096) w/ 2 slots
Radeon 9600 pro w/ 64mb vram (no upgrade)
80gb sata hdd (up to 250)
combo drive (with option to downgrade to cd-rom or up to superdrive)
notebook-style ram slots (just unscrew and pop-in)
tilt/swivel stand a la emac
in aluminum :cool::cool: with iPod mini colors
$999

You think that an iMac will have more RAM, a better GPU, the same HD as the low end PowerMac? Then they'll add an anodized metal cover - which will raise the price - and build the monitor in, but sell at the same price as the SuperDrive eMac?

I have to admit it's less crazy than some things I've seen, but still pretty far out into its own ballpark.

dv model: same except
22" CRT at 2048x1536
1024mb ram (up to 4096)
Radeon 9800 pro w/ 128 vram
160gb sata hdd (up to 250)
8x superdrive (w/ combo option)
aluminum a la g5 tower
$1599

I just did a search for 22" CRTS and the prices are all around $500-650 for name brand parts. That leaves no room at all for the extra RAM, graphics card, bigger HD, SuperDrive, and everything else that you're talking about adding in. For one thing, I find it ludicrous that Apple would offer more RAM in their consumer models than the professional ones, and especially that the mid-level consumer machine would have a better stock graphics card than anything but the top pro tower.

dv special edition: same as dv except
1.8ghz PPC 970
9800 pro w/ 256 vram
250gb hdd
aluminum in iPod mini colors
$1799

See above.

--

As a footnote, the average 22" CRT weighs 67 pounds and costs over $500, while a 17" appears to weigh around 34 pounds and costs between $90 and $160.
 
if apple make the new imac a crt.... i will buy the biggest one and eat it..... and i will have spicy sauce ( which i hate) on it, it would "represent" a step back in technology....

just my 2 tupence
 
paxtonandrew said:
The LCD Panel at the top of the computer is called the 'head'. We are all imagining a computer with-out a screen, and dub it the 'headless' iMac.

Hope this helps
I have always heard it called the screen, Lcd, or monitor, I think only the rumor sites call it the head, surely apple does not.
Pc's now have cube like shuttles, I even saw one with an Apple display, AGP 2 PCI and still small and quiet.
 
CRT iMac

AL-FAMOUS said:
if apple make the new imac a crt.... i will buy the biggest one and eat it..... and i will have spicy sauce ( which i hate) on it, it would "represent" a step back in technology....

just my 2 tupence

Apple already have a CRT iMac. It is called the eMac and is relally just an extension of the previous CRT iMacs of old. These computers are also cheaper than a standard iMac, so when you eat the computer, you won't have to feel guilty about eating the 'flagship' comsumer Mac! :rolleyes: :cool: :eek:
 
thatwendigo said:
This thread has grown enormously while I've been swamped with work, but I keep seeing the allegation that a shift to AMD would make Apple so much cheaper.

Once more, I present the rebuttal to the claim that moving to x86 would at all reduce Apple's overhead on their systems:

Tyan Thunder K8W AMD-8000 Chipset
Dual Socket 940
8x PC3200 DIMM (with ECC)
2x ATA-133
1x AGP 8x, 2x PCI-Xa, 2x PCI-Xb, 1x PCI
2x PS2, 1x COM, 1x LPT, 1x LAN, 5X USB 1.1, 2x FireWire, SPDIF out
Gigabit Ethernet
4x SATA​
Cost: $436

2x AMD Opteron 248
Socket 940
2.2ghz core clock​
Cost: $1378

ATI Radeon 9600XT 128MB
AGP 8x​
Cost: $219

Enermax Noisetaker 600w PSU
Cost: $168

Pioneer DVR-A07XLA
8x DVD+/-R, 4x DVD+/-RW, 24x CD-R, 24x CD-RW​
Cost: $119

Seagate 160GB 7200RPM SATA
Cost: $117

2x Crucial 256MB PC3200 OEM RAM
Cost: $104

Total cost: $2,541

And another $200 for the Lian Li case that looks like a G5. However that is a PROFESSIONAL system. Very few Mac or PC people have them. That vast majority of PCs sold are under $1500. You can get a 2.2ghz Ahlon 64 system for $1000 or what is still a very fast Athlon XP system for $500. That's where x86 has its advantage, in the consumer systems.
 
ChrisH3677 said:
Well replied, Mike, Nick and Kriz. I'll just add, if Apple went x86, then they would be dead coz they'd have had to compete in the same cut-throat market as PC manufacturers.

They already do.

ChrisH3677 said:
aldo, yeah maybe i'm wrong. Afterall, linux running on x86 is probably the number reason for its success. How many people with an x86 gave Linux a look because they could?

But that said, Apple would then be reduced to an OS manufacturer - and MS would have pulled out all stops then. While Apple sticks to PPC, MS is happy. Look at the dirtypool MS has played over the years to consolidate its PC market. I don't think Apple would last 5 minutes against MS in the PC market. First they'd pull all MS products for OSX - and probably invalidate all existing licences. Some people say having no MS products is why Linux hasn't cracked the desktop.
And, just coz the chips are the same, doesn't mean the 3rd party software will be ported. If it was that easy, Linux would be king. MS still controls the personal computer market, and as long as Apple stick to their bit of the ocean, MS will leave them alone.

Microsoft needs Apple around for two reasons.

1. To avoid Anti-trust laws, Microsoft needs a high profile competitor. Without Apple around, Microsoft would be sliced up into little companies like AT&T was dismantled into the baby bells. Apple going under would not be in their best interests. Why do you think they bailed Apple out a few years back?

2. The MBU makes money. That money would probably be lost to linux office suites if Apple wasn't around.
 
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