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Do the new iMacs have 2 user accessible RAM slots?

What exactly is the difference here?

256MB of PC2700 (333MHz) DDR SDRAM expandable to 1GB; one 184-pin DIMM and one open user-accessible SO-DIMM slot.

Also, I think the update is very nice. The 15" iMac is at a very nice price point right now. It certainly adds the needed distinction between the eMac and iMac lines which have been blurred since the introduction of the 1Ghz/Combo/AE eMac.
 
Price Comparison

I just took a visit to Dells site and configured a PC with pretty much the same specs as the 15" iMac. Though the Dell started out at $400, after I configured it it was less than $100 within the price of the iMac.
 
i agree big time, the g5 so turned me off looks wise, the imac is art. g5 powermac is not art sorry. imac screen ergonomics are first in class.
 
cool. new iMacs! 😀

now i'm not happy about this because i'm going to get a iMac, but because of what it means for PowerBook updates...😉

you see, Apple won't let a 'consumer' model have better specs than any of their 'Pro' models, or at least they won't let it last long. so the current iMac specs just about guarantees that there will be new PowerBooks soon. 😀

oh, and for people who want to see the old iMac specs and compare then to the new specs... just open another browser window and head to Apple Australia.😛 if we don't even have new iPods and iMacs yet... i hate to think what this means when the PowerBooks are released! 😱
 
Originally posted by 3.1416
Not compared to either the dual G4 or 1.6 G5 towers.

Add in the cost of 17" widescreen display to the G5 or G4 tower. The cost difference does begin to show (although so does the performance. 😉) The 17" has very decent specs, even at $1799. With the educational discount it drops down to ~$1600. Not too bad. Again, not everyone needs a G5.
 
For a student on a budget, these iMacs are looking like great performers for their price points. I'm definitely digging the new graphics card in the 17".
 
makes me almost wish i had waited upgrading my powermac. the screen is about perfect floating in front of you (17") 1.25 on 167 bus& 333 ram is so nice. almost perfect, just a lil better video card and lots of ram and you have a gamers imac.( come on steve how about a special edition imac) for gamers.
 
Originally posted by raschild
For a student on a budget, these iMacs are looking like great performers for their price points. I'm definitely digging the new graphics card in the 17".

Me too. The FX5200 and the widescreen 17" may push me over the edge to upgrade from my old (5 years)CRT iMac.
 
Originally posted by job
Me too. The FX5200 and the widescreen 17" may push me over the edge to upgrade from my old (5 years)CRT iMac.
this machine is so far ahead of that. you got a 233 or 333? i still have a 333 that my son uses. almost 5 years old.
 
Originally posted by joeyjojoe
So the new iMacs and iPods are available for purchase today? I checked out the Apple website and that says 3-5 days, but I think it says that for any item.

So can people go to an Apple store and buy one today?

We received the iMacs over the weekend here at Zones. The iPods are due in tomorrow. E-mail me if you are interested or have any questions, I'm here to work with Apple people and businesses alike.
 
Re: Re: ? No true DDR with G4 ?

Originally posted by isgoed
Yes, you're right, the 7455 has no true DDR support, but the 7457 has. I just read an article on macbidouille which was written by someone who better understands it than i do. They state that the processor being used is the 7455B. This could possibly mean that it isn't even overclocked at all ??? They do say that it is good news for overclockers, so it could be overclocked. http://www.macbidouille.com/niouzcontenu.php?date=2003-09-08#6557

edit:
Oh but wait... Since it is not the 7455A, it could have true DDR support. i dunno.
Just remember Motorola does not call the rev 2.x and rev 3.x 7455s the A & B chips, they're using A/B/C right after the 7455 to denote modified processes -- so you won't see 7455B (what Mac B is calling a rev 3.x) reflected in the part number, it'll be either a 7455 rev 3.3 or 3.4 chip which carries a last letter F or G.

So yes it is most likely a 7455 revision 3.x chip, most likely the rev 3.4 they just announced.

Confused yet?

But since it has no L3 cache it'll really be a MC7445(A/BorC)xx ... xxF or ...xxxG

---

So the old (what Mac B calls a 7455B) might have been rev3.3 (XC7445ARX867WF) and a newer rev3.4 (MC7445ARX1000WG).

NOTE -- They also changed the first letter, with the switch to rev G.
 
Originally posted by job
Do the new iMacs have 2 user accessible RAM slots?

What exactly is the difference here?

The iMac does indeed have 2 RAM slots, but only one is user-accessible. The user-accessible one is the SO-DIMM slot (laptop RAM), which you can install by taking the bottom plate off the iMac.

The second RAM slot takes standard desktop RAM (184-pin DIMM), but it's shoved way up into the iMac's innards, and even if you do open it up to get there to install it yourself, you break a thermal grease contact, which isn't trivial to put back. So by all accounts, this second RAM slot is not user-accessible by any means.

Originally posted by SiliconAddict
If Apple could put out a system for $999, or even lower, they would snag some of these users.

What is your obsession with ignoring the eMac? The eMac is exactly what you are talking about... if you're REALLY strapped for cash, it's stupid to consider an iMac. It even gives you a 17" CRT built-in. Hey, look, there's even a $799 eMac. Granted, it has only a CD-ROM drive, but if you only want to do e-mail, web browsing, and word processing, there's no need to get anything better than that (get a 64 MB USB flash drive for $30 to backup your files, and you're set).
 
Fan noise, RAM upgrades, and assorted stuff

Originally posted by airmac
So, how loud is iMac?

Fan Noise
I can't comment on this model, but iMacs use a chimney design with intake on the rounded bottom (very hard to block these), hot air out of the top, and a single large fan situated at the top of the dome to pull the air. The parts are stacked one on top of each other so the air visits each part before coming out the top. One part (the hard drive?) is wrapped in a malleable metal perhpas to act as a heat sink (but I can't be sure, perhaps its for interference reasons). I think the design is pretty similar to the old G4 Cube but with the addition of the fan (on the + side this means it can take a faster hard drive, be cheaper, etc.).

In general, I think it is the more efficient than anything in the PC world. For instance, the favorite SFF PC is the Shuttle which uses a heat pipe to get around the horrible geometry issues so it can cut down the number of fans to one (two if you have a machine whose northbridge neads a fan, three if you add an AGP card). The intakes are on the lower side and are very easy to block (I've seen one SFF PC design that actually blocks the intakes with a set of speakers). Airflow seems very haphazard, especially with the addition of an AGP card. There are some serious heat issues reported with such things. (In their defense, I own a number of them and have not personally had any of them fail due to heat--then again I don't install any high end AGP cards in them nor do I overclock them).

The subjective noise level of the iMac is low. My test is that the hard drive disk whirr bothers me in the case of the iMac (I have replaced the hard drive with an IBM/Hitachi so YMMV), but is not especially noticeable above the fan noise in any Shuttle I've owned. G4 processors much less power than a Pentium 4 (even these overclocked MPC 7455s in the new iMac)--the MPC7455 uses 15 watts @ 1Ghz, while the P4 uses over 100 if you're crazy enough to use a 3.2Ghz P4.

BTW. Noise level is related to fan noise which is related to airflow design, quality and number of fans, and the amount of heat that needs to be dissipated. Heat dissipation is directly proportional to power usage.

If I had to guess as to why the iMac (and the G4 PowerMac) isn't available at 1.4Ghz, I'd say that there are probably yield issues at turning out enough quantities, not a heat issue.

It's a real good design, IMO, but I think the iMac might have to be redesigned when consumer graphics chipsets will start requiring fans.

RAM Upgrades
As mentioned the iMac has two slots. One is a user-serviceable SO-DIMM slot (this means notebook RAM so it will cost you more). It is very easy to upgrade and instructions are available on Apple's website as well as the included manual (I think). Basically you unscrew the bottom plate and you can add the Airport Extreme (and I guess Bluetooth also) and the SO-DIMM.

The other DIMM is on the motherboard which is not an easy thing at all to upgrade. While I was upgrading the hard drive, I changed out the DIMM on my old iMac, but everyone who saw my disassembly and thought it was nuts--I'm sure it must void the warrantee. I don't recommend doing so, though it will give you a healthy respect for Apple design and build quality.

Headless Macs
Yeah, count me in as someone who wishes they came out with a headless Mac for cheaper than an eMac. Not that that changes anything, I have different needs than most (I wouldn't mind some cheap web servers running Mac OS X client) and probably represent a minority that would be outweighed by the number of lost sales of eMacs and PowerMacs (as well as the tech support headache of external monitors, resolutions, antialiasing settings, and DVI vs. VGA).

Just goes to show that you can't please everyone.

G5 iMac
As has already been mentioned, I'm with the crowd who think that there won't be a G5 iMac anytime soon: the line has just been refreshed; they can always refresh again with an L3 cache or an MPC 7547 (which will probably go in the new Powerbooks); there are probably more G4 speed bumps from Motorola ahead as the 7455 isn't even at 130nm (of course this means a lot of frustrating Motorola delays 😉; and the G5 represents a singular distinction between pro/consumer desktop lines. Heck, Apple is still plugging the 2x1.25Ghz G4 PowerMac.

I hope this helps,

terry
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: New iMacs Released

Originally posted by pgwalsh
Even if you only want to surf the web, I think you should bother with a Mac. If you're looking for simplicity you should bother with a Mac. Just don't get the latest and greatest and you'll be happy. Plus if you explore further in the future you'll be really happy with the iApps.... iPhoto is so simple to use.

don't forget iChat (video)--unique to Macs.
 
I wonder now how long until we get an eMac at 1.25Ghz? A month or two? That is the magic number I am waiting for to upgrade my old iMac DV 400 and I can't afford a new iMac, but I want something faster then my old iMac.
 
? No true DDR with 7457 G4 ?

Originally posted by isgoed
the 7455 has no true DDR support, but the 7457 has

Are you positive about this? The Moto sheets at http://e-www.motorola.com/webapp/sps/site/prod_summary.jsp?code=MPC7457&nodeId=03C1TR046708718653 (particularly the "MPC7457 RISC Microprocessor Hardware Specifications" pdf in the table) make no mention of any differences between the 7455 and 7457 memory bus subsystems. They do stress that it's a socket-compatible upgrade.

I find it hard to believe that they wouldn't mention something as significant as finally implementing DDR support....

If you search the web for "7457 DDR", you'll find lots of articles like http://www.macnn.com/news/17098&startNumber=30, which claims that a follow-on chip, the 7457-RM, will have DDR support, but that this year's 7457 will be SDR...
 
Originally posted by job
Add in the cost of 17" widescreen display to the G5 or G4 tower. The cost difference does begin to show

Sort of. A stripped down dual G4 (256/80/Superdrive/Radeon 9000) is $1800, same as the iMac. Add a decent display and you're only a few hundred $ more than the iMac for a much better performing (and more expandable, if that matters) Mac.

It's similar to the 1.8 vs dual 2.0 G5; if you can afford $2400 for the 1.8, you can probably afford $600 more for a far better machine.
 
Originally posted by Thanatoast
Aargh! ::despair:: Oh well. Heroes III is still a good game.

I don't see why so many people have dismissed these updates. Come on people, clock speed has jumped by 25%, and bus speed by 33%(?) Standard ram is upped (in the 17'er anyway) and the videocards have been updated (sorely needed imho). All for no increase in price. Give apple a break, yo. I, for one, am happy with these updates.

edit:formatting

The increase in and of itself is not a bad one. I think the issue that most people have with this update is that it's about 6 months behind in relative computing terms (I guess compared to wintel machines). I can't speak for everyone, but I think most would-be mac users wouldn't mind paying a premium for better design, OS, and integration, so long as hardware specs remain comparable.

The new iMac is a nice machine, but spec-wise, it just doesn't seem up to snuff. The value equation is further diminished by the imminent release of a G5 iMac (less than 6 months?). We're going to see a much more significant boost in performance then. This update is a step up, but when Apple move to the G5, it's going to be a whole flight of stairs.
 
Re: Fan noise, RAM upgrades, and assorted stuff

Originally posted by tychay
G5 iMac
As has already been mentioned, I'm with the crowd who think that there won't be a G5 iMac anytime soon: the line has just been refreshed; they can always refresh again with an L3 cache or an MPC 7547 (which will probably go in the new Powerbooks); there are probably more G4 speed bumps from Motorola ahead as the 7455 isn't even at 130nm (of course this means a lot of frustrating Motorola delays 😉; and the G5 represents a singular distinction between pro/consumer desktop lines. Heck, Apple is still plugging the 2x1.25Ghz G4 PowerMac.

Anyone wanna make a bet that IBM will be producing G5s at greater cost-effectiveness than Motorola will be producing G4s in six months time?

And if you were Apple, why in the world would you NOT put a more powerful more profitable chip in the iMac?

Staying with Motorola past this revision makes absolutely no sense. What - are we supposed to be excited about a 1.5 GHz G4 and 200MHz bus speeds in Q2 2004?
 
Re: Fan noise, RAM upgrades, and assorted stuff

You have described a very intereting upgrade to your iMAC. Do you 'or anybody for that matter' know what the maximum memory capacity of these machines are if the main DIMM is upgraded. Does maxing out the DIMM slot allow expansion beyond the published memory capacities?

This current rev the the iMAC is interesting but it did come up short on installed memory. In some ways it is close to meeting my needs, but I was really hoping that Apple would have went just a bit further.

Thanks
DAve



Originally posted by tychay
snipped <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<,
RAM Upgrades
As mentioned the iMac has two slots. One is a user-serviceable SO-DIMM slot (this means notebook RAM so it will cost you more). It is very easy to upgrade and instructions are available on Apple's website as well as the included manual (I think). Basically you unscrew the bottom plate and you can add the Airport Extreme (and I guess Bluetooth also) and the SO-DIMM.

The other DIMM is on the motherboard which is not an easy thing at all to upgrade. While I was upgrading the hard drive, I changed out the DIMM on my old iMac, but everyone who saw my disassembly and thought it was nuts--I'm sure it must void the warrantee. I don't recommend doing so, though it will give you a healthy respect for Apple design and build quality.
 
I find iMac updates, unexciting, uninspiring, underpowered, uncool and understandable.

Understandable, due to the fact that Apple still isn’t out of Moronrola dark shadow. Such a shame considering that it was once Apple’s most popular product line (maybe saved the company)
God damn you Moronrola.

😡
 
Anyone else notice the new iMacs ship with the old full size keyboards? I wonder why, especially since the G5s come with the eMac keyboards.

Optical mouse and full-size keyboard
The Apple Mouse uses a high-precision optical sensor for unparalleled accuracy. The 108-key Apple Keyboard features 15 full-size programmable function keys, with special keys to adjust audio and eject CDs or DVDs and a built-in two-port USB hub.

indexkeyboardmouse01072002.jpg
 
Originally posted by Gyroscope
I find iMac updates, unexciting, uninspiring, underpowered, uncool and understandable.

Understandable, due to the fact that Apple still isn’t out of Moronrola dark shadow. Such a shame considering that it was once Apple’s most popular product line (maybe saved the company)
God damn you Moronrola.

😡

Yup, it is gonna take a while to move away from the shadow.

But *finally* the iMac has *decent* graphics!

🙂
 
As iMac user I'm happy to see them upgraded, but unfortunately, none of the items of my "iMac wishlist" has been included:

* bluetooth mouse and keyboard (OK, they are apparently in the works)
* 90 degrees turnable display: This would enable me to read PDF files in a convenient manner without having to print them
* Internal speakers: the external speakers just take up space and mess up the desk with their cables
* Stereo microphone (instead of the mono one)
* Built-in camera: same was with speakers, I expect everything to be built-in with an iMac. If I want flexibility then I'll buy a PowerMac
* and finally a headless iMac! Just take off the display and put a VGA/DVI/ADC output at the back, and there you are! They could also put a CRT display instead of the flat panel onto the iMac's base and replace the eMac with it. This could save them lot of production costs, as all three models (flat panel iMac, CRT iMac, headless iMac) share all parts except the display.
 
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