New Intel Mac mini

[SaddY]

first post

Ok guys, don't be fooled by my first post. I've been reading macrumors for a LONG time. Read the whole topic and just really feeled the urge to post something.

This release SUX ! Let me tell you why.
An integrated graphics card ? are you kidding me ?

Ok I can understand some of you guys saying people don't need a dedicated graphics card. That the mini is not aimed at gaming people. But you guys are forgetting one thing.

These people also don't need a core duo.. they don't even need a core solo.. so explain me if this pc is aimed at web browsing reading an e-mail listening and streaming of iTunes and this basic stuff.. Why would these people have to pay MORE then they had to at first for something they don't need ?
You guys claim that it shouldn't be in a pc of this formfactor and price range.. I can agree.. but either give me a better graphics card or don't increase the price.

Name me 1 thing you can't do with an PPC mini that you can now you have this AMAZING core solo ?.

I couldn't care less about this core duo.. I wish they had just either put some core solo's in and lowered the price/keep it at the same level or put a duo in it WITH dedicated graphics card and increase the price.. don't increase the price and leave out the candy... I have saved money to buy a mini but I'm not buying one now. Hell I can do the same on my Palm Lifedrive.. it has bluetooth, wifi, I have an external keyboard.. it has a screen.. I can listen to music.. stream music.. play games (graphics are rubish also) e-mail.. watch video.. hook it up to my tv after buying a converter (same as mini). I'm just disapointed

 

[zap2]

i think the new Mac Mini looks nice, a lot like a Rev A iMac g5, minus the Graphics Card, plus the speed of the Core Duo, and plus the Built in BT and AirPort,

 

[stcanard]

You guys shouldn't nag too much about the Intel Integrated graphics. I mean, what did you expect?!?

Sorry, Mac/Technical site tradition. All Apple product announcements must be followed by at least 3 types of complaints:

1) OMG they missed the target market, nobody will buy this!
2) OMG I can't believe they didn't include <X> nobody will buy this!
3) OMG it's too expensive, everyone will buy the Dell version instead!

And, if it's a computer launch like this one, the obligatory fourth complaint:

4) OMG this will never play video games! What will all those people that bought their old systems because they were such great gaming machines do?

 

[Tastannin]

http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=937

hmm.

Nah, I don't think so. SO-DIMM's for memory? More expensive. The design is more modular, but not as classy as the Mini is. The Mini-PCI slot is nice, but Apple already builds in the WiFi and Bluetooth functionality, and what else could you use the slot for? Nothing else, really. The bottom line is that this AOpen MiniPC is gonna be sold mostly as a barebones system.

Apple goes all the way, gives you the whole package. 🙂 You get a much better deal that way. Apple has a target market, and they know who they're aiming for. Not those who want to game on their Macs for cheap. Not those enthusiasts who want to build their own Mac. Hell, many of you were screaming at Apple for an headless Mac. Now you're screaming bloody murder for the Mac Mini having integrated graphics! If you told us two years ago that we'd be getting a headless Mac running a dual core Intel cpu for less than a grand, we'd have called you insane. 😛

 

[whooleytoo]

[*]Apple made a very big deal out of the fact that the mini DIDN'T have integrated graphics when it came out. Odd that they'd go to it now.

This bugs me about Apple. It doesn't surprise me, but it bugs me.

"Woo look, we made a laptop with a handle!"... and then drop it quietly in the next iteration.

"Woo look, we make quiet Macs without fans!"... and then went on to launch to 'wind tunnel' PM G4s.

It's a bit of an Apple trait.

 

[reyesmac]

So much for a "TiVo killer" DVR Mac mini.🙄

Yeah, where the heck do people get these rumors from and why can't Apple deliver products that their customers have been wanting for years. Are Apples media center plans (if they have one) so high that the technology simply is not available for it yet?

Or maybe they wont ever come out with a DVR on a Mac. That would cut into their iTunes business. Who cares, I only need the thing watch movies with, it doesn't have to be a Mac. I would just prefer to give them my money first.

 

[MacMusicMan69]

Wow That WAS FAST

A new Mini, i am jumping up and down for joy. But 100 bucks more, damn I hope the price goes down soon.

That mini pc deal look so much like a mini, I wonder how many idots, will buy it.

Today shows how much apple rock, so what if the graphics aren't the best I sure they are ways to tweak it.

 

[matticus008]

Are you sure about this? I don't think there's any sure way to know yet.

Positive. In addition to all of Apple's product pages correctly distinguishing between DIMM and SODIMM modules, Crucial's memory selector includes a full-size DIMM for the new mini. Additionally, much of the mini's internal volume is predetermined by components. SODIMMs are taller and wouldn't easily clear the drive stack...but that last bit is just a thought exercise.

You're right about whoever made that graphics comment. The use of a "real" graphics chip doesn't help multitasking and doesn't really lift a burden off the CPU. RAM is what helps multitasking, and integrated video means less RAM. The whole CPU burden thing is just Apple FUD (or marketing trying to explain things to consumers--blind leading the blind).

 

[joeboy_45101]

If the public is dissatisfied with a product then I see no reason for them not to complain. I, and apparently many others, don't give a **** how powerful this Intel Integrated Graphics is supposed to be. It's not what we, the public, wanted. Apple is not entitled to our business or our money.

I am disappointed with this product. It feels like they baked a great cake but then frosted it with dog ****. I'm not totally unreasonable, this is the first attempt at the new Mac mini. I was all ready to buy one today, but this integrated graphics crap turned me off.

I encourage everbody on this forum to let Apple know how you feel about this product and design.

http://www.apple.com/feedback/

The Mac mini is listed under the PowerMac category for some reason.

 

[adamcz]

It's been well established now that this machine sucks for video games. Is there anything else that it sucks for?

I'm ok with never playing a video game on my computer, if this mini is nice for everything else.

 

[SaddY]

Sorry, Mac/Technical site tradition. All Apple product announcements must be followed by at least 3 types of complaints:

1) OMG they missed the target market, nobody will buy this!
2) OMG I can't believe they didn't include <X> nobody will buy this!
3) OMG it's too expensive, everyone will buy the Dell version instead!

And, if it's a computer launch like this one, the obligatory fourth complaint:

4) OMG this will never play video games! What will all those people that bought their old systems because they were such great gaming machines do?

Well, I can agree that this is the case. However it is very understandable.
We are on a rumor site where the rumors are almost more glamorous thant the actually turn-out. What do you expect ?. It's also quite understandable that people are not statisfied with a price increase.

 

[JtheLemur]

Your primary Mac hosts your music & videos, and streams it to the Mini as a set-top box.

Set-top box? I'd have picked up one of these new Minis right off the bat if it had decent video output, but it doesn't. Very few HDTVs still have DVI, they're all HDMI, as they should be. With a DVI to HDMI converter I'd need a separate sound system for sound output as HDMI is considered one input, as it was deigned to carry both digital video and audio - scratch that.

There's no component output, and on average the price for a converter is $300 (there's one for $120 but I say the quality is suspect) - cable-only solutions exist but I'd rather not be a guinea pig as I can't find any reviews or notes on them.

It can do S-Video, but S-Video is for shlubs. =) Like I said earlier, with Apple going HD-Everything, where the heck is the digital output on this thing? Anyone who knows anything about the direction TV, movies and media are taking in the next few years is going to buy an HDTV-capable set (even a cheap one).

Huge bummer - I'd have paid for an Apple breakout box that would allow this thing to hook up to an HDTV as long as it was less than $150...

 

[asencif]

Similar Point on previous page

Ok I can understand some of you guys saying people don't need a dedicated graphics card. That the mini is not aimed at gaming people. But you guys are forgetting one thing.

These people also don't need a core duo.. they don't even need a core solo.. so explain me if this pc is aimed at web browsing reading an e-mail listening and streaming of iTunes and this basic stuff.. Why would these people have to pay MORE then they had to at first for something they don't need ?
You guys claim that it shouldn't be in a pc of this formfactor and price range.. I can agree.. but either give me a better graphics card or don't increase the price.

Name me 1 thing you can't do with an PPC mini that you can now you have this AMAZING core solo ?.

I couldn't care less about this core duo.. I wish they had just either put some core solo's in and lowered the price/keep it at the same level or put a duo in it WITH dedicated graphics card and increase the price.. don't increase the price and leave out the candy... I have saved money to buy a mini but I'm not buying one now. Hell I can do the same on my Palm Lifedrive.. it has bluetooth, wifi, I have an external keyboard.. it has a screen.. I can listen to music.. stream music.. play games (graphics are rubish also) e-mail.. watch video.. hook it up to my tv after buying a converter (same as mini). I'm just disapointed

This is a point I made on the previous page on the mac mini's disntictability...If it's aimed at the entry-level basic web surfing and e-mail person then why a core duo, front row, and remote control. This bumps up the price unecessarily which is the point of the mac mini...$499...If you plan to offer a high-end model then at least give it a dedicated GPU to do some video and not just music. This can be done in so many other ways that there's no need to buy a whole computer to do it. Maybe this is the ultimate guinea pig for a real HD HT system.

 

[millypede]

Positive. In addition to all of Apple's product pages correctly distinguishing between DIMM and SODIMM modules, Crucial's memory selector includes a full-size DIMM for the new mini. Additionally, much of the mini's internal volume is predetermined by components. SODIMMs are taller and wouldn't easily clear the drive stack...but that last bit is just a thought exercise.

You're right about whoever made that graphics comment. The use of a "real" graphics chip doesn't help multitasking and doesn't really lift a burden off the CPU. RAM is what helps multitasking, and integrated video means less RAM. The whole CPU burden thing is just Apple FUD (or marketing trying to explain things to consumers--blind leading the blind).

AHHHHHHHH

Learn before typing, the old Mac mini did indeed use full size mem modules, but the new one does not, hold Ill get this new Apple training document they have just sent out...

 

[AlmostThere]

GMA 950 and Core Duo. The Core Solo is basically the same as a Pentium-M Banias 1.5Ghz. There's very *very* little difference.

What you should be saying is:

X1300 and a Celeron-M
or
GMA 950 and Core Solo

Celeron-M to Core Solo price difference (~$80) covers a X1600 at $64

A Celeron-M with X1600 is even more yes. X1600 decodes 720p H264 decoding on chip compared to 576p for the X1300, assuming ATI / Apple write the drivers.

 

[matticus008]

These people also don't need a core duo.. they don't even need a core solo.. so explain me if this pc is aimed at web browsing reading an e-mail listening and streaming of iTunes and this basic stuff.. Why would these people have to pay MORE then they had to at first for something they don't need ?
You guys claim that it shouldn't be in a pc of this formfactor and price range.. I can agree.. but either give me a better graphics card or don't increase the price.

Name me 1 thing you can't do with an PPC mini that you can now you have this AMAZING core solo ?.

First things first. Welcome to registered userdom!

Now, a new CPU was necessary. There are dozens of threads in the forums about users talking about sluggishness of the mini or running into brick walls doing increasingly common tasks. iMovie performance and iTunes encoding left quite a bit to be desired. The old mini couldn't really be described as a zippy little computer.

So there's nothing you can't do with the old mini, but a lot of the criticism of the G4 model has been addressed by increased capacity. Also remember that the G4 had all the RAM bandwidth and sophistication that 1998 had to offer. It chokes on large videos (for example, HD clips) and while trying to do tasks in iMovie and even Photoshop. These have all been addressed (except Photoshop which is now impaired by Rosetta for the time being...but then again pros won't be running PS in Rosetta).

 

[ScubaDuc]

That little piece of "turd" has a dual-core now, more expansion capabilities and multimedia streaming built-in, isn't that what you were ALL asking for? So?

What expansion capabilities are you all talking about? Have I missed something?
You can choose between 3 5400 rpm drives and RAM: Expansion to me is a free PCI for a card: Replacing some components can hardly be defined as "expansion capabilities" in my book

 

[whooleytoo]

Also to others, I'm pretty sure the GMA 950 doesn't use the CPU for any of its work, its still a seperate chip just not with its own memory.

True, but the concern is because OSX uses the graphics card for a lot of its work. IF the GMA 950 doesn't have great performance, it could greatly affect the overall system performance, not just gaming.

 

[SaddY]

This is a point I made on the previous page on the mac ...... a real HD HT system.

Hehe typing the damn message ( & registerign) took me long enough for you guys to post an entire page of comments which I ofcourse didn't read yet hehe 🙂.

Entry machine should have an entry price ! even for a mac !

 

[nataku]

Sorry, Mac/Technical site tradition. All Apple product announcements must be followed by at least 3 types of complaints:

1) OMG they missed the target market, nobody will buy this!
2) OMG I can't believe they didn't include <X> nobody will buy this!
3) OMG it's too expensive, everyone will buy the Dell version instead!

And, if it's a computer launch like this one, the obligatory fourth complaint:

4) OMG this will never play video games! What will all those people that bought their old systems because they were such great gaming machines do?

lolz. ok. looks like i still have a lot to learn. 😀

 

[matticus008]

Learn before typing, the old Mac mini did indeed use full size mem modules, but the new one does not, hold Ill get this new Apple training document they have just sent out...

Please do. I look forward to you proving Apple wrong.

 

[millypede]

Even PC's are doing it better
http://www.pcworld.co.uk:80/martprd/product/ADVENT/DHE+1000/984209

 

[jayb2000]

umm, infrared???

Why have built in bluetooth and then rely on crappy line of sight infrared for the remote?

(ok, to go along with the theme, I think the integrated graphics are not the best choice)

But the remote thing is just annoying. How great would it be to be anywhere within 30 feet of your mini/TV/Stereo setup and be able to change volume, skip songs, etc.


Oh well, I hope the iBooks or MacBooks or whatever they are called are better. I really am sick of my G3 iMac 🙁

 

[stcanard]

Well, I can agree that this is the case. However it is very understandable.

As I state, it is expected!

We are on a rumor site where the rumors are almost more glamorous thant the actually turn-out. What do you expect ?.

Honestly? I wish more people would be able to stand back and look at it from a business / marketing point of view. I see the same people complaining the same things again, and again, and again, and never learning when the product sells.

I can understand saying "this won't suit _my_ needs" but the kneejerk reaction of "what I want is what everybody wants, if it doesn't meet my needs it's a failure" quite honestly bothers me -- it speaks to a self-centeredness that really shouldn't exist beyond 10 years old.

It's also why I generally don't hang out on these product releases anymore, it just got on my nerves too much. just today I had a bit too much time on my hands, and when I get the bit between my teeth...

It's also quite understandable that people are not statisfied with a price increase.

Understandable, but let's look glass 1/2 full here -- the airport and bluetooth used to cost more than $100 so you're actually getting a better deal. After all one of the biggest complaints I heard about the Mac Mini is that it didn't include these, and now that it does nobody wants it?

Plus, glass 3/4 full -- if the older mini's were so much better a deal, there will be some great deals to be had as stores dump stock.

 

[DTphonehome]

Set-top box? I'd have picked up one of these new Minis right off the bat if it had decent video output, but it doesn't. Very few HDTVs still have DVI, they're all HDMI, as they should be. With a DVI to HDMI converter I'd need a separate sound system for sound output as HDMI is considered one input, as it was deigned to carry both digital video and audio - scratch that.

There's no component output, and on average the price for a converter is $300 (there's one for $120 but I say the quality is suspect) - cable-only solutions exist but I'd rather not be a guinea pig as I can't find any reviews or notes on them.

It can do S-Video, but S-Video is for shlubs. =) Like I said earlier, with Apple going HD-Everything, where the heck is the digital output on this thing? Anyone who knows anything about the direction TV, movies and media are taking in the next few years is going to buy an HDTV-capable set (even a cheap one).

Huge bummer - I'd have paid for an Apple breakout box that would allow this thing to hook up to an HDTV as long as it was less than $150...

Too lazy to clip your quote.

Dude, DVI and HDMI are EXACTLY the same thing, pin for pin. The only diff is that HDMI carries audio as well, and is a bit smaller. DVI is video only. So you don't need a converter at all. The cable solution is the same thing as buying a regular DVI-DVI cable. It just passes the DVI pins into a smaller HDMI connector. For sound, you can use optical out to your reciever, and you have an all-digital hookup.

The DVI/HDMI thing is a nonissue.