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New Ti2 G4???
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OK, *way* too many leaps in logic here...
1) It's really funny for you to talk about a dual 800 smoking machine X -- especially given that you have never used nor tested a dual 800. Talk to me next week, buddy.
2) As for bus speeds and processor speeds: OK, look, I don't know how many games you've played, but the bus and processor speeds are both second-tier in importance compared to the graphics card. I don't care if you have a quad-2 Ghz machine sitting on your desk -- if you have some crappy video card, you aren't going to be able to run games such as Q3 and Unreal very happily.
3) EAX and Sound Blaster: not here on the Mac, so doesn't make much sense in a comparison of PowerBooks to G4 desktops.
Look, very simply, it breaks down to the fact that, right now, your desktop G4s have a pretty nice Nvidia card in them and your PowerBooks and iBooks have the ATI 128 Mobility chipsets in them. That single fact is the #1 reason why, if you are a serious gamer, you'd prefer a desktop over a laptop. If, however, Apple chooses to upgrade its graphics coprocessors in the September revision to the PowerBook G4 (and I sincerely believe that they will), then much of the gap will have disappeared. Do you pay a price in your gaming for a slower processor and bus speed, and a slightly scaled down Nvidia board? Of course. Would that price be astronomical? Absolutely not.
Pass the popcorn
Ouch what a left hook.
Yeah, the thing to remember about Duals is that they deepen processing not double it's rate: you can do more things at once NOT the same things twice as fast.
Video Acceleration, however only adds significantly to games (admittedly most games) that exploit hardware 3D acceleration. The performance IS more affected by bus speed and Video card than any other combined factors though. Mostly the CPU just calculates location, kinda like a dispatcher: they still need to be speedy but other things are more critical to overall performance.
.....And a spectator is in the ring with a chair!!!........
Ouch what a left hook.
Yeah, the thing to remember about Duals is that they deepen processing not double it's rate: you can do more things at once NOT the same things twice as fast.
Video Acceleration, however only adds significantly to games (admittedly most games) that exploit hardware 3D acceleration. The performance IS more affected by bus speed and Video card than any other combined factors though. Mostly the CPU just calculates location, kinda like a dispatcher: they still need to be speedy but other things are more critical to overall performance.
.....And a spectator is in the ring with a chair!!!........
Hey Hey "buddy"
Alright, I may be making assumptions about the performance of the dual 800, but I don't see a new Powerbook taking on a new desktop G4 anytime soon.
I agree with you on the dependency on graphics chips, but that also brings up again the advantage of a desktop, when you want to upgrade that graphics card, how do you plan on doing that on your "gaming machine" Portable? Expandability is my #1 one reason for using a desktop over a Portable for a gaming machine. Knowing that the card I have doesn't have to be the one I always use, you have no luxary like that with a Portable. Umm...Sound Blaster is here for the Macintosh, check out creative's website. And as for EAX, westlake and others have spoken many times of future implementation of it in their games. Personally, I use my computers for many years before I buy a new one, so looking to the future is a good thing for me. I'm sorry, but I am still not seeing how you can compare a Portable with a desktop when in terms of gaming. I just don't see even an updated PBG4 pumping out the framerates a dual 800 should. I'll be sure to get back to you on those performance tests "next week, buddy".
Heh...I'm enjoying this way too much
http://www.americas.creative.com/products/category.asp?Category=8&MainCategory=8
Alright, I may be making assumptions about the performance of the dual 800, but I don't see a new Powerbook taking on a new desktop G4 anytime soon.
I agree with you on the dependency on graphics chips, but that also brings up again the advantage of a desktop, when you want to upgrade that graphics card, how do you plan on doing that on your "gaming machine" Portable? Expandability is my #1 one reason for using a desktop over a Portable for a gaming machine. Knowing that the card I have doesn't have to be the one I always use, you have no luxary like that with a Portable. Umm...Sound Blaster is here for the Macintosh, check out creative's website. And as for EAX, westlake and others have spoken many times of future implementation of it in their games. Personally, I use my computers for many years before I buy a new one, so looking to the future is a good thing for me. I'm sorry, but I am still not seeing how you can compare a Portable with a desktop when in terms of gaming. I just don't see even an updated PBG4 pumping out the framerates a dual 800 should. I'll be sure to get back to you on those performance tests "next week, buddy".
Heh...I'm enjoying this way too much
http://www.americas.creative.com/products/category.asp?Category=8&MainCategory=8
Re: Hey Hey
When I said that the Sound Blaster is "not here," I meant that it is quite literally "not here," as in not built-in to the original Macs that you spoke of. Sure, you can add sound cards to desktop Macs, and upgrade your video cards, etc. etc. etc. Of course desktops offer upgradability while portables do not; no one contests that point. But, out of the box, a revised PowerBook will compete pretty well with your dual 800.
That you only upgrade after "many years" seems like your bigger problem. A PowerBook in 2 years will smoke your dual-800 of today, and of course it would offer a superior gaming experience to that dual-800 as well. If you're really this hard-core of a computer user, save your money that you seem intent on spending on SoundBlaster cards and video cards and God knows what else, and invest it so that you can upgrade a little quicker....
When I said that the Sound Blaster is "not here," I meant that it is quite literally "not here," as in not built-in to the original Macs that you spoke of. Sure, you can add sound cards to desktop Macs, and upgrade your video cards, etc. etc. etc. Of course desktops offer upgradability while portables do not; no one contests that point. But, out of the box, a revised PowerBook will compete pretty well with your dual 800.
That you only upgrade after "many years" seems like your bigger problem. A PowerBook in 2 years will smoke your dual-800 of today, and of course it would offer a superior gaming experience to that dual-800 as well. If you're really this hard-core of a computer user, save your money that you seem intent on spending on SoundBlaster cards and video cards and God knows what else, and invest it so that you can upgrade a little quicker....
Haha. I never claimed to be a hardcore computer user, I just like to play games. And a desktop in 2 years will beat a Powerbook of today and in 2 years...Don't really get the point of that one. Any computer in 2 years will smoke any computer of today...that's just technology.
This is going absolutely no where, you're not gonna give in obviously and I am not either. I disagree with you, we'll just wait and see for the revised Powerbook that doesn't actually exist to us yet...then either of us can make claims of gaming power.
heh, and don't give advice to me. you don't know a single thing about me.
This is going absolutely no where, you're not gonna give in obviously and I am not either. I disagree with you, we'll just wait and see for the revised Powerbook that doesn't actually exist to us yet...then either of us can make claims of gaming power.
heh, and don't give advice to me. you don't know a single thing about me.
Wow
Wow, that was a defensive post if I've ever seen one!
Anyway, I think that this actually went somewhere important: what to buy today and what to buy tomorrow. By your own concession, computers tomorrow will beat computers today. My argument is that that means PowerBooks of tomorrow (2 years) will beat desktops of today(including your flashy dual-800) -- and that's at gaming or whatever else you want to talk about. So, unless you are completely loaded, or are looking to buy your computer for the long haul, you should get something that IS NOT top of the line (so you aren't paying premium prices) and upgrade frequently. You'll have a machine that is always state-of-the-art while losing a minimum in depreciation. You can always prey on the less computer-savvy by selling your used Mac right before Expos and therefore getting top dollar for your machine while maximizing the time that you have to use it.
I guess, JoyBoy, where I'm left befuddled is why you want to invest *SO* much in a computer today, and to make it complete with every gizmo and gadget out there, when you don't have the resources to upgrade frequently or don't choose to. I just am not getting why you don't save some of that cash and trade-up your Mac in a year and get your NVIDIA GeForce 4 card with 64 MB of VRAM or whatever is "in" at that point in time...and if you "just like to play games"...well... $3500+monitor+peripherals is an awful lot to pay for games. I hear there is this new thing called the Sony Playstation out..................
[Edited by john123 on 08-14-2001 at 10:44 PM]
Originally posted by JoyBoy
Haha. I never claimed to be a hardcore computer user, I just like to play games. And a desktop in 2 years will beat a Powerbook of today and in 2 years...Don't really get the point of that one. Any computer in 2 years will smoke any computer of today...that's just technology.
This is going absolutely no where, you're not gonna give in obviously and I am not either. I disagree with you, we'll just wait and see for the revised Powerbook that doesn't actually exist to us yet...then either of us can make claims of gaming power.
heh, and don't give advice to me. you don't know a single thing about me.
Wow, that was a defensive post if I've ever seen one!
Anyway, I think that this actually went somewhere important: what to buy today and what to buy tomorrow. By your own concession, computers tomorrow will beat computers today. My argument is that that means PowerBooks of tomorrow (2 years) will beat desktops of today(including your flashy dual-800) -- and that's at gaming or whatever else you want to talk about. So, unless you are completely loaded, or are looking to buy your computer for the long haul, you should get something that IS NOT top of the line (so you aren't paying premium prices) and upgrade frequently. You'll have a machine that is always state-of-the-art while losing a minimum in depreciation. You can always prey on the less computer-savvy by selling your used Mac right before Expos and therefore getting top dollar for your machine while maximizing the time that you have to use it.
I guess, JoyBoy, where I'm left befuddled is why you want to invest *SO* much in a computer today, and to make it complete with every gizmo and gadget out there, when you don't have the resources to upgrade frequently or don't choose to. I just am not getting why you don't save some of that cash and trade-up your Mac in a year and get your NVIDIA GeForce 4 card with 64 MB of VRAM or whatever is "in" at that point in time...and if you "just like to play games"...well... $3500+monitor+peripherals is an awful lot to pay for games. I hear there is this new thing called the Sony Playstation out..................
[Edited by john123 on 08-14-2001 at 10:44 PM]
clintons cock custard
yes u r right, calm down and relax.... enjoy a pernot with a mate or even just settle for casual sex.
I think the big issue is clock speed improvements in tibooks.
and elvis aint dead hes just having a break.....heeeheeee, sorry that woz immature of me.
yes u r right, calm down and relax.... enjoy a pernot with a mate or even just settle for casual sex.
I think the big issue is clock speed improvements in tibooks.
and elvis aint dead hes just having a break.....heeeheeee, sorry that woz immature of me.
the frame rate in the Duals is due to the Nvidia, not the dual G4's. Given enough RAM the game should run almost exactly as fast on all 3 G4's if they're using the same card. If there's any difference in the Tibook it's the lack of 3D acceleration in the ATI chipset.
Back to the subject: can anyone see a keyboardless, touchscreen Tibook2? That might resolve a lot of rumors and lose that Evil little keyboard. It'd even lose that thickness in exra framing around the keyboard/hinge/monitor.
Kela: the bulk of the chassis is actually an assortment of composite and exotic materials, the Titanium just comprises the frame. The processor CARD takes up +/- 1cm but the chip itself is,(dare I say it ?) wafer thin. Open an Imac A-D to see a similar board.
Back to the subject: can anyone see a keyboardless, touchscreen Tibook2? That might resolve a lot of rumors and lose that Evil little keyboard. It'd even lose that thickness in exra framing around the keyboard/hinge/monitor.
Kela: the bulk of the chassis is actually an assortment of composite and exotic materials, the Titanium just comprises the frame. The processor CARD takes up +/- 1cm but the chip itself is,(dare I say it ?) wafer thin. Open an Imac A-D to see a similar board.
I just want to be your friend.
You can trade up a with a dual 800 the same as with any other computer. I do just like to play games, you are assuming that is the only thing I use my computer for. If that were true, I'd be buying a PC
Of course a Powerbook in 2 years will beat a desktop of today, I'm not disputing that at all. I just don't see what that prooves whatsoever. A desktop in 2 years will beat a desktop of today as well. That's the way computers are. My 2 year old G3 doesn't compete real well with a G4. But I don't expect it to.
I am excited because it will run games blazing fast, how does the become "wanting to compete with every gizmo and gadget out there". I didn't buy a new monitor or 1.5gigs of RAM from Apple or any peripherals, and it didn't cost me $3,500 dollars. You're making quite a few assumptions. Which is fine by me, just know most are way off. But hey, you want to judge me because whether you can't afford one yourself or whatever reason you have, go ahead. Maybe you think I'm putting down the Powerbook, which I am not trying to do. Of course if I needed a portable I'd go for one, they're great machines, I just want the power of a desktop top for gaming and work. If that seems like a poor reason to spend all this money on a dual 800, that's fine with me, I just don't care.
I'd never buy a PS2 btw.
If anyone wants to get ripped a new one go post on maccentral or something, many of the people that frequent there know more than all of us combined. It is quite intimidating.
Heh. Defensive? Maybe, only because you're way too offensive. I don't take this to heart, I might be being defensive only because I don't have any desire to turn a debate into a personal attack. You seem to want to do that and that's grand. Note how I'm the one using the happy smiley faces. And you're the one on the attack,. It's just forum posting. It appears to make more of an influence on you than me. Which is rather amusing.Originally posted by john123
Originally posted by JoyBoy
Haha. I never claimed to be a hardcore computer user, I just like to play games. And a desktop in 2 years will beat a Powerbook of today and in 2 years...Don't really get the point of that one. Any computer in 2 years will smoke any computer of today...that's just technology.
This is going absolutely no where, you're not gonna give in obviously and I am not either. I disagree with you, we'll just wait and see for the revised Powerbook that doesn't actually exist to us yet...then either of us can make claims of gaming power.
heh, and don't give advice to me. you don't know a single thing about me.
Wow, that was a defensive post if I've ever seen one!
Anyway, I think that this actually went somewhere important: what to buy today and what to buy tomorrow. By your own concession, computers tomorrow will beat computers today. My argument is that that means PowerBooks of tomorrow (2 years) will beat desktops of today(including your flashy dual-800) -- and that's at gaming or whatever else you want to talk about. So, unless you are completely loaded, or are looking to buy your computer for the long haul, you should get something that IS NOT top of the line (so you aren't paying premium prices) and upgrade frequently. You'll have a machine that is always state-of-the-art while losing a minimum in depreciation. You can always prey on the less computer-savvy by selling your used Mac right before Expos and therefore getting top dollar for your machine while maximizing the time that you have to use it.
I guess, JoyBoy, where I'm left befuddled is why you want to invest *SO* much in a computer today, and to make it complete with every gizmo and gadget out there, when you don't have the resources to upgrade frequently or don't choose to. I just am not getting why you don't save some of that cash and trade-up your Mac in a year and get your NVIDIA GeForce 4 card with 64 MB of VRAM or whatever is "in" at that point in time...and if you "just like to play games"...well... $3500+monitor+peripherals is an awful lot to pay for games. I hear there is this new thing called the Sony Playstation out..................
[Edited by john123 on 08-14-2001 at 10:44 PM]
You can trade up a with a dual 800 the same as with any other computer. I do just like to play games, you are assuming that is the only thing I use my computer for. If that were true, I'd be buying a PC
Of course a Powerbook in 2 years will beat a desktop of today, I'm not disputing that at all. I just don't see what that prooves whatsoever. A desktop in 2 years will beat a desktop of today as well. That's the way computers are. My 2 year old G3 doesn't compete real well with a G4. But I don't expect it to.
I am excited because it will run games blazing fast, how does the become "wanting to compete with every gizmo and gadget out there". I didn't buy a new monitor or 1.5gigs of RAM from Apple or any peripherals, and it didn't cost me $3,500 dollars. You're making quite a few assumptions. Which is fine by me, just know most are way off. But hey, you want to judge me because whether you can't afford one yourself or whatever reason you have, go ahead. Maybe you think I'm putting down the Powerbook, which I am not trying to do. Of course if I needed a portable I'd go for one, they're great machines, I just want the power of a desktop top for gaming and work. If that seems like a poor reason to spend all this money on a dual 800, that's fine with me, I just don't care.
I'd never buy a PS2 btw.
If anyone wants to get ripped a new one go post on maccentral or something, many of the people that frequent there know more than all of us combined. It is quite intimidating.
Or you could change venues here....
John123 could use a new playmate to pick on in the Grammar thread.......I'm bored with his ass.
John123 could use a new playmate to pick on in the Grammar thread.......I'm bored with his ass.
Bottom line: Desktop has the edge.
Hey guys, What was that topic again? We were talking about Tibooks not Desktop systems anyway.
Hey guys, What was that topic again? We were talking about Tibooks not Desktop systems anyway.
Will you two be quiet? This is one of those "arguments" where both people yell "at" each other instead of arguing or discussing.Of course a desktop is a better gaming mac, but you can't take it on the plane, and if you bought a powerbook and kept it on your desk all the time you should be guillotined or something. Plus, by the time you guys are finished disemboweling each other it will be September already and we'll have our new Ti. I propose that we all shut up until September.
which two?
Okay, sure. Perhaps Battlenet Starcraft at twenty paces?
Go check out the thread on Hardware/software ready for Paris.
Okay, sure. Perhaps Battlenet Starcraft at twenty paces?
Go check out the thread on Hardware/software ready for Paris.
Popcorn, Peanuts!!!
Damn, I could make some cash selling consessions. Any bets? Odds on favorite on the language Geek, he's more likely to Hack the Arena. Then again JoyBoy has that certain special, Ear-biting-off quality.
Ice Cream, Cotton Candy, Condoms, Lube.......wait wrong bag..........
Damn, I could make some cash selling consessions. Any bets? Odds on favorite on the language Geek, he's more likely to Hack the Arena. Then again JoyBoy has that certain special, Ear-biting-off quality.
Ice Cream, Cotton Candy, Condoms, Lube.......wait wrong bag..........
Popcorn, Peanuts!!!
Damn, I could make some cash selling consessions. Any bets? Odds on favorite on the language Geek, he's more likely to Hack the Arena. Then again JoyBoy has that certain special, Ear-biting-off quality.
Ice Cream, Cotton Candy, Condoms, Lube!!.......wait wrong bag..........
Damn, I could make some cash selling consessions. Any bets? Odds on favorite on the language Geek, he's more likely to Hack the Arena. Then again JoyBoy has that certain special, Ear-biting-off quality.
Ice Cream, Cotton Candy, Condoms, Lube!!.......wait wrong bag..........
errr... what teh f_ _k?
Name teh hotel room number or bar and buy each other a drink all ready. kiss and make up and get a grip. You guys act like this is the key element of the world as we know it.
We're talking about the upgrade to the Tibook no the ability to sqeeze each other's cocks harder, or frag each other... does that include foreplay???
Back to the issue...
How much improvement will the GeFore2 or similar give the Final Cut Pro app over the current ATI 128 Rage?
LOL!!!
Name teh hotel room number or bar and buy each other a drink all ready. kiss and make up and get a grip. You guys act like this is the key element of the world as we know it.
We're talking about the upgrade to the Tibook no the ability to sqeeze each other's cocks harder, or frag each other... does that include foreplay???
Back to the issue...
How much improvement will the GeFore2 or similar give the Final Cut Pro app over the current ATI 128 Rage?
LOL!!!
Re: Re: Re: which two?
I'm game, but I can't host, slow connection. Might be able to set up something at work though. Plus we'd be able to have witnesses. Unless you can host. I also want my Dual G4 first
Btw, what is it with some of you and sex? Get outside...hit the gym...get a g/f. This is just replusive.
[Edited by JoyBoy on 08-16-2001 at 08:13 PM]
Originally posted by john123
Originally posted by JoyBoy
Starcraft? Bah. Quake 3 is where deathmatch related "I OWN YOU FOREVER" type competitions should go down
I smile too much.
You're on. Name a day and time and an IP, and I'll frag your butt.
I'm game, but I can't host, slow connection. Might be able to set up something at work though. Plus we'd be able to have witnesses. Unless you can host. I also want my Dual G4 first
Btw, what is it with some of you and sex? Get outside...hit the gym...get a g/f. This is just replusive.
[Edited by JoyBoy on 08-16-2001 at 08:13 PM]