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The reality is… with a notch screen, the top part of the screen that comes down to the bottom of the notch is only really available for application menus, so there is an erosion of screen size in practice.
That is complete bollocks. There is no "erosion" of screen space. The space below the notch is the regular 16:10 size. Without the notch there'd be a larger top bezel. With the notch we get additional screen to the left and right of the notch.
 
That is complete bollocks. There is no "erosion" of screen space. The space below the notch is the regular 16:10 size. Without the notch there'd be a larger top bezel. With the notch we get additional screen to the left and right of the notch.
And without the notch visible there's a huge top bezel that's larger than any other modern laptop. It was a poor design on Apple's part, and probably the worst part of the MBA/MBP design. It also has the detrimental issue of cropping the menubar text and menu items for more technical programs.
 
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It also has the detrimental issue of cropping the menubar text and menu items for more technical programs.
Every program that I have used that has menus that cross over the notch area, have never had anything "behind" the notch. Photoshop and Lightroom menus are all there and avoid the notch.

The notch is in the menu bar and does not really take any screen real estate for application work. Videos I have are not affected by the notch. I would much rather have the thin bezels. The camera does take space and that space has to come from somewhere.
 
That is complete bollocks. There is no "erosion" of screen space. The space below the notch is the regular 16:10 size. Without the notch there'd be a larger top bezel. With the notch we get additional screen to the left and right of the notch.

Try that with an app in full screen
 
And without the notch visible there's a huge top bezel that's larger than any other modern laptop.
The menu bar is in the space left and right of the notch, it's not just bezel.
It was a poor design on Apple's part, and probably the worst part of the MBA/MBP design. It also has the detrimental issue of cropping the menubar text and menu items for more technical programs.
Yes, if you have a program with more menu items than fit beside the notch that's a problem. The only real problem with the notch.
 
Yeah, you get a full 16:10 screen area application under the notch with a persistent menu bar. On the no notch MacBooks the menu bar "pulls down" into your full screen app and shifts the content down. The aspect ratio of the MacBooks with notches are physically taller. You GAIN screen space with the notch.

Except on the default behaviour the menu bar isn't displayed, I mean that's kind of the point of the full screen mode and has been since it was introduced with Lion. I'm looking now on my Neo using Safari which is filling the screen as intended with no notch and it's great.
 
I really hope this is the start of a trend.

Cameras are small enough to fit in the bezel. I don't hate the notch due to MacOS GUI but I prefer if it wasn't there.

This is actually a reason to buy the Neo for me.
What Apple did with the notch was leave the camera in the bezel, but they pushed the screen up into the bezel and put the menu there. That freed up space below that area for app content. The area below the notch on the MBPs is the same size as the previous full screen. We just gained some extra space where the bezel was.

Menus intelligently avoid the notch and pop over to the right, if needed. This is mostly just the Window and Help menus, which are much less used.

The only problem with the notch is a little less space for menu bar icons. The space they can exist in is less when they have to share the space with the notch. This was not a new problem with the notch, it just made is a little more common. Lots of us were using third-party apps to divert extra menu bar icons to sub panels even before the notch came on the scene. I do wish that Apple would bring out a first party solution to manage those icons and give us a place to see them when there are too many to show.

Overall the notch and moving the menu into the bezel was a clever bit of design that allow the screen to get bigger without requiring the case to get bigger. It was a twofer.

It probably would have gone down better if Apple had included a setting to make the menu bar black so people bugged by having a visual element there could ignore it. There are third-party tools that do that but some people don’t want to use them. I’ve tried them but in the end don’t bother and turn them off.
 
What Apple did with the notch was leave the camera in the bezel, but they pushed the screen up into the bezel and put the menu there. That freed up space below that area for app content. The area below the notch on the MBPs is the same size as the previous full screen. We just gained some extra space where the bezel was.

Menus intelligently avoid the notch and pop over to the right, if needed. This is mostly just the Window and Help menus, which are much less used.

The only problem with the notch is a little less space for menu bar icons. The space they can exist in is less when they have to share the space with the notch. This was not a new problem with the notch, it just made is a little more common. Lots of us were using third-party apps to divert extra menu bar icons to sub panels even before the notch came on the scene. I do wish that Apple would bring out a first party solution to manage those icons and give us a place to see them when there are too many to show.

Overall the notch and moving the menu into the bezel was a clever bit of design that allow the screen to get bigger without requiring the case to get bigger. It was a twofer.

It probably would have gone down better if Apple had included a setting to make the menu bar black so people bugged by having a visual element there could ignore it. There are third-party tools that do that but some people don’t want to use them. I’ve tried them but in the end don’t bother and turn them off.
The thing is, since there is no faceid in the notch camera it is completely unnecessary to have a notch. I have a Windows laptop with a regular qhd camera in an extremely thin bezel from 2022. So the technology is there. I could maybe understand if faceid was involved.

I don't really care as I have adjusted to the notch but if they could get rid of it(and they can) I would prefer it for a number of reasons, even if they just put a hole punch in the screen like on the iPhone. It is just better esthetics.

It feels to.me like a solution in search of a problem instead of the other way around. I thought if they were keeping the notch in successive gens it would eventually get faceid which I would love on a Mac.
 
The thing is, since there is no faceid in the notch camera it is completely unnecessary to have a notch. I have a Windows laptop with a regular qhd camera in an extremely thin bezel from 2022. So the technology is there. I could maybe understand if faceid was involved.

I don't really care as I have adjusted to the notch but if they could get rid of it(and they can) I would prefer it for a number of reasons, even if they just put a hole punch in the screen like on the iPhone. It is just better esthetics.

It feels to.me like a solution in search of a problem instead of the other way around. I thought if they were keeping the notch in successive gens it would eventually get faceid which I would love on a Mac.
This is the camera module under the notch. There is the camera, true-tone sensor, light-sensor and a couple of mounting brackets. It’s not just a camera that can go in a punch.

The rumors are that the next case designs will get a redesigned module that is more compact and some elements might be under the screen but we don’t know details.


1773505473022.png
 
Try that with an app in full screen
I run Adobe Photoshop in full screen. The menu occupies the top of the screen where the notch is located. The menu items are not missing because of the notch and sit properly on the left and right of the notch. When I move Photoshop to my second monitor, the menus change.
if you have a program with more menu items than fit beside the notch that's a problem. The only real problem with the notch.
That has never been a problem for the apps I use. The menu is split and no part is behind the notch.
 
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And without the notch visible there's a huge top bezel that's larger than any other modern laptop. It was a poor design on Apple's part, and probably the worst part of the MBA/MBP design. It also has the detrimental issue of cropping the menubar text and menu items for more technical programs.

I like thick black bezels, especially at the top. I dislike some Windows laptops where the bezels is almost gone.
 
Except on the default behaviour the menu bar isn't displayed, I mean that's kind of the point of the full screen mode and has been since it was introduced with Lion. I'm looking now on my Neo using Safari which is filling the screen as intended with no notch and it's great.

You solve this easily by having a black background. The top area just looks like black bezels in full screen mode.
 
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