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puma1552

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Some of you probably already saw that I bought a mid-2015 15" refurb from Apple earlier this week. Came from Apple somewhat beat up/clear signs of being used. Returned it same day.

Found that Microcenter was selling the same model brand new today.

Reserved one for in store pickup, drove 30+ minutes across town, ran in, grabbed it, out in 10 minutes. When I entered the store, there was no line to get in the store. When I exited, there was a line of 50 people waiting to get in.

Went back to my car, opened it to give it a once over before driving home. Large chip in lid immediately obvious. Box it up, get in line to get in the store which is now 100 people long. 25 minutes go by, get in there, do an exchange. Get out, go back to car, open and inspect, looks good. Has a tiny chip on the lid, smaller than the first one, but livable. Decide to keep it, assuming the screen checks out when I get home.

Get home, start setting up new one, check backlight bleeding. This is the worst backlight bleeding I've ever seen in my life. Upper right and lower left are terrible:

31079617147_98fd0bcb12_b.jpg


*sigh*

Currently reformatting it and boxing it up and now I have to go back across town and I don't want to be that guy doing exchange #2. Sort of just want to do a return and tell the return counter just give me a refund and then just go across the store and rebuy another one but they also have a one per customer limit and I'm sure I'll end up with the same guy helping me to get the new one and he will be like wtf. Maybe this is why I buy new products so infrequently, it can be such a hassle playing the QC lottery.
 

Trebuin

macrumors 65816
Jun 3, 2008
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The third party resellers don't really check out these things. I bought a refurb Microsoft surface from Best Buy that didn't even have a working operating system. They just check for general appearance, make it down, then hope for the best.
 
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puma1552

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The third party resellers don't really check out these things. I bought a refurb Microsoft surface from Best Buy that didn't even have a working operating system. They just check for general appearance, make it down, then hope for the best.

?

This was a factory sealed new unit from Apple, just being sold at Microcenter. Nobody at Microcenter opened it (not a refurb).

Good news to report though - the next one I got is cosmetically perfect (no chips/scratches and a nice tight lid/body gap too, sometimes that gap is so hit or miss) and while this one does have a little bit of backlight bleed, not nearly what is in that picture above and much more within the realm of acceptable.

Time to do a clean install of Mojave and get it set up!
 

SDColorado

macrumors 601
Nov 6, 2011
4,360
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Highlands Ranch, CO
I got one like that. Shipped straight from Shanghai, but upon opening the lid and inspecting it, I found a series of sharp nicks along the left hand edge near the speaker. Definitely not shipping damage, nothing about the outter brown box, the inner white box, etc. showed any sign of damage. You just have to give them a good going over these days.

Hope this one works out well for you!
 

Trebuin

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Jun 3, 2008
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Also I should say, Microcenter was super cool about everything.
They typically are. Sorry, I thought you bought a referb from Microcenter...not new. It's a bit concerning about their assembly line if these are coming out broken & burred already. I can imagine there may have been an accident with some of the machines.
 

puma1552

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They typically are. Sorry, I thought you bought a referb from Microcenter...not new. It's a bit concerning about their assembly line if these are coming out broken & burred already. I can imagine there may have been an accident with some of the machines.

Just seems like as the years go by you have to inspect more and more and it seems like more and more often, you have to swap out. I used to never, ever have to swap Apple products out a decade ago.
 

Tommy c

macrumors 6502
Sep 9, 2012
404
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Pocono PA
That's interesting. Ive bought from Simply Mac and macs4u used without any problem. Hope you get this sorted out.
 

Trebuin

macrumors 65816
Jun 3, 2008
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Central Cali
I think it was actually an Apple line that caused that, otherwise you would have had a crushed box. Accidents happen, but seriously...Apple needs to stop nicking & diming their workers while hoarding all the profits. If you max perform the workers, then they'll try to hide accidents & hope its blamed on the shipment. I guess machine packing could be at fault too. Apple used to be a lot better, especially when we could swap out our pats. I'm about this far away from building a hackintosh laptop.
 
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puma1552

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So, wanted to give a little review of the new machine but didn't want to start another thread.

I did a clean install of Mojave and everything is now set up and I am just waiting for the initial large backup to my Time Capsule.

Coming from a mid-2010 MBP...wow. Even though my Mid-2010 was a high end BTO and this is a base model, the differences are outstanding and it genuinely feels like an upgrade. Sure for my use cases, speedwise it feels the same, because I don't do anything intensive. Then again that's not fair because I've been spending all night setting up the computer so it's been constantly doing stuff/indexing, etc. - hasn't really had a chance to finish setting up and just be ready to fly. I can tell the SSD is fast though.

But the tangibles are so much better.

The size and design is excellent.

The retina screen is amazing to finally have. Yeah, all of you have had it for the past six years and my wife's had it for five years, but I've never had it. So much clearer to look at.

On that note, scaling to 1920 x 1200 after staring at 1440 x 900 for so long is amazing. Everything is so small and crisp and clean, and so much content on my screen. My 24" ACD is 1920 x 1200 and now I'm wondering if I need that anymore because everything looks comically large on it now and it doesn't yield any more content than what I have in my built-in retina display.

And rounding out the aesthetic, I love dark mode. Overall, the screen alone sells the computer - much higher res, retina clarity, and dark mode; so different from my 2010.

I do find now that I actually prefer to turn font smoothing off, whereas I've always had it on before. I like the thinner fonts, and to me they look crisper/sharper. Yes, fonts on the Cinema Display look a little bit different/worse in Mojave, and it's a toss up whether or not font smoothing or no font smoothing looks better on that, but neither look amazing. It looks fine though at normal viewing distance, it's by no means unusable and I will continue to use my external display for the time being.

Speakers are so much better than I expected them to be, I was impressed.

Force Touch Trackpad, don't really care, don't know where I can even make use of it yet.

Would've preferred a 512 GB machine but it doesn't really matter. I have everything I own on it and I have 163 GB free still.

Only real dislikes are the lack of a sleep indicator, and for the hell of it, those little green battery indicator lights, those were always kind of neat on the older ones, if frivolous. If I really want to nitpick I think it's dumb it doesn't say Macbook Pro on the glass under the screen, there's plenty of room for it even with the different hinge design. Glad they put this back in 2016. Pretty minor gripes overall.

I also bought MS Office 2019...it's uhhh, quite the upgrade from the Office 2008 I was using that has long had support dropped. Wasn't going to put that old crap on this new machine so it was time for an upgrade there too.

Might just be me but the keyboard on this one seems to sit a tad further down in the chassis than my mid-2010. Feels about the same, but I swear the keys are a fraction of a millimeter lower than my 2010.

I like my keyboard and ports, and I like my reliability. I paid $1750 for this brand new today, I know B&H Photo has a black Friday deal for $1700 for a much more powerful, high spec mid-2017. But I just don't care. I wanted to drive my display and I wanted reliability. The keyboard and ports were really just a bonus since I could get over both on the new machines pretty easily I think.

All in all I am really happy with this purchase. When I got my mid-2010, I never thought that the next one I'd get would be a 3.5 year old base model, but I'm really happy with it. And despite the age, which I know some people would never pay $1750 for this today, it feels like such a sensible buy coming in well under the $2k mark as Apple prices become more and more asinine - this is a huge upgrade over what I had, and it didn't take a lot of money to get it. Any 15" MBP under $2k is a steal IMO.

Super happy with it.
 
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puma1552

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which model did you end up getting?

Just the base model 2.2/16/256, which is all that's available new at any resellers.

I did have one question - I am running my built in display to look like 1920 x 1200. I downloaded a 2880 x 1800 wallpaper, set it to "Center", and it did not fill the screen at all? I think this has something to do with the scaling, etc., but I was surprised to see that a 2880 x 1800 wallpaper did not fill the screen on a 2880 x 1800 machine, especially when running it at a lower resolution than the native resolution?

It did fill the screen correctly on my external display, as expected, which is natively 1920 x 1200 so it naturally resized it to be small enough to fit just right on that screen - was sort of expecting the same on the built in retina display.
 

BeatCrazy

macrumors 601
Jul 20, 2011
4,829
3,956
So, wanted to give a little review of the new machine but didn't want to start another thread.

I did a clean install of Mojave and everything is now set up and I am just waiting for the initial large backup to my Time Capsule.

Coming from a mid-2010 MBP...wow. Even though my Mid-2010 was a high end BTO and this is a base model, the differences are outstanding and it genuinely feels like an upgrade. Sure for my use cases, speedwise it feels the same, because I don't do anything intensive. Then again that's not fair because I've been spending all night setting up the computer so it's been constantly doing stuff/indexing, etc. - hasn't really had a chance to finish setting up and just be ready to fly. I can tell the SSD is fast though.

But the tangibles are so much better.

The size and design is excellent.

The retina screen is amazing to finally have. Yeah, all of you have had it for the past six years and my wife's had it for five years, but I've never had it. So much clearer to look at.

On that note, scaling to 1920 x 1200 after staring at 1440 x 900 for so long is amazing. Everything is so small and crisp and clean, and so much content on my screen. My 24" ACD is 1920 x 1200 and now I'm wondering if I need that anymore because everything looks comically large on it now and it doesn't yield any more content than what I have in my built-in retina display.

And rounding out the aesthetic, I love dark mode. Overall, the screen alone sells the computer - much higher res, retina clarity, and dark mode; so different from my 2010.

I do find now that I actually prefer to turn font smoothing off, whereas I've always had it on before. I like the thinner fonts, and to me they look crisper/sharper. Yes, fonts on the Cinema Display look a little bit different/worse in Mojave, and it's a toss up whether or not font smoothing or no font smoothing looks better on that, but neither look amazing. It looks fine though at normal viewing distance, it's by no means unusable and I will continue to use my external display for the time being.

Speakers are so much better than I expected them to be, I was impressed.

Force Touch Trackpad, don't really care, don't know where I can even make use of it yet.

Would've preferred a 512 GB machine but it doesn't really matter. I have everything I own on it and I have 163 GB free still.

Only real dislikes are the lack of a sleep indicator, and for the hell of it, those little green battery indicator lights, those were always kind of neat on the older ones, if frivolous. If I really want to nitpick I think it's dumb it doesn't say Macbook Pro on the glass under the screen, there's plenty of room for it even with the different hinge design. Glad they put this back in 2016. Pretty minor gripes overall.

I also bought MS Office 2019...it's uhhh, quite the upgrade from the Office 2008 I was using that has long had support dropped. Wasn't going to put that old crap on this new machine so it was time for an upgrade there too.

Might just be me but the keyboard on this one seems to sit a tad further down in the chassis than my mid-2010. Feels about the same, but I swear the keys are a fraction of a millimeter lower than my 2010.

I like my keyboard and ports, and I like my reliability. I paid $1750 for this brand new today, I know B&H Photo has a black Friday deal for $1700 for a much more powerful, high spec mid-2017. But I just don't care. I wanted to drive my display and I wanted reliability. The keyboard and ports were really just a bonus since I could get over both on the new machines pretty easily I think.

All in all I am really happy with this purchase. When I got my mid-2010, I never thought that the next one I'd get would be a 3.5 year old base model, but I'm really happy with it. And despite the age, which I know some people would never pay $1750 for this today, it feels like such a sensible buy coming in well under the $2k mark as Apple prices become more and more asinine - this is a huge upgrade over what I had, and it didn't take a lot of money to get it. Any 15" MBP under $2k is a steal IMO.

Super happy with it.
Maybe I missed this.. why didn’t you get a 2018 model?
 

jerryk

macrumors 604
Nov 3, 2011
7,415
4,204
SF Bay Area
I got one like that. Shipped straight from Shanghai, but upon opening the lid and inspecting it, I found a series of sharp nicks along the left hand edge near the speaker. Definitely not shipping damage, nothing about the outter brown box, the inner white box, etc. showed any sign of damage. You just have to give them a good going over these days.

Hope this one works out well for you!


Nicks (actual scratches) by the speaker is pretty common on the 2016 MBP pro. Some say it had to do with the manufacturing process since they are always in the same place.
 
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puma1552

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Maybe I missed this.. why didn’t you get a 2018 model?

Keyboard Problems
Crackling Speakers
Bridge OS T2 Kernel Panics
Dongles needed to drive my 24" Apple Cinema Display

Basically this machine is just a stopgap for a couple years until Apple gets it together, then I will go all out and buy another $3k machine and keep it 6-8 years. I like to keep my machines a long time and the current machines aren't going to be ones you want to keep outside the 4 year keyboard warranty (assuming they add the 2018 to that program, which they probably will).
 
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BeatCrazy

macrumors 601
Jul 20, 2011
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Keyboard Problems
Crackling Speakers
Bridge OS T2 Kernel Panics
Dongles needed to drive my 24" Apple Cinema Display

Basically this machine is just a stopgap for a couple years until Apple gets it together, then I will go all out and buy another $3k machine and keep it 6-8 years. I like to keep my machines a long time and the current machines aren't going to be ones you want to keep outside the 4 year keyboard warranty (assuming they add the 2018 to that program, which they probably will).

Interesting. Well the first three issues above are not as widespread as forums would have you believe. As for the dongle issue: it's basically just another 5" worth of cable you'll stick on the end of your connection to the ACD, right?

Anyways, enjoy!
 

SDColorado

macrumors 601
Nov 6, 2011
4,360
4,324
Highlands Ranch, CO
Nicks (actual scratches) by the speaker is pretty common on the 2016 MBP pro. Some say it had to do with the manufacturing process since they are always in the same place.

I am quite sure that you are correct. The lid and that paper are over it when the lid is closed, so it was obvious that the damage occurred before the final assembly and shipment.

They definitely weren’t just scratches though, some little chunks of aluminum gone.

Apple offered me a $300 credit if I was willing to live with it. But while small, one was rather sharp and kept snagging material on my sleeve. Taking a file and smoothing it would have made it look worse. I declined and sent it back.
 

Plutonius

macrumors G3
Feb 22, 2003
8,962
8,255
New Hampshire, USA
Interesting. Well the first three issues above are not as widespread as forums would have you believe. As for the dongle issue: it's basically just another 5" worth of cable you'll stick on the end of your connection to the ACD, right?

Anyways, enjoy!

There are 100+ pages in the T2 Bridge OS error discussion and, although it may not be as widespread as people think it is, it seems to me it is a significant issue.

My opinion only but I'll buy a product with a known failure mode if it's documented and I know what the repair is.

The T2 Bridge OS error is intermittent when it occurs. Apple hasn't said why it occurs (even though it's an old problem since the iMac Pro release) and they haven't announced a fix. One reason that I left Windows was to get away from the random "blue screen of death" crashes.
 

BeatCrazy

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Jul 20, 2011
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There are 100+ pages in the T2 Bridge OS error discussion and, although it may not be as widespread as people think it is, it seems to me it is a significant issue.

My opinion only but I'll buy a product with a known failure mode if it's documented and I know what the repair is.

The T2 Bridge OS error is intermittent when it occurs. Apple hasn't said why it occurs (even though it's an old problem since the iMac Pro release) and they haven't announced a fix. One reason that I left Windows was to get away from the random "blue screen of death" crashes.

I guess everyone is different. On Wednesday, I bought my second T2 machine (13" MBP) and it arrived yesterday. I knew full well of the issues in that tread (and read most of it), but I still think the benefits and performance of these new models outweighs something that may not even happen to me. Based on the minor issues I've had with my iMac Pro, I think this will eventually be solved via a software fix.
 

puma1552

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I guess everyone is different. On Wednesday, I bought my second T2 machine (13" MBP) and it arrived yesterday. I knew full well of the issues in that tread (and read most of it), but I still think the benefits and performance of these new models outweighs something that may not even happen to me. Based on the minor issues I've had with my iMac Pro, I think this will eventually be solved via a software fix.

Hopefully you have no issues. For me the speaker crackle and T2 issues wouldn't be deal breakers, assuming that those are both software issues, as most things are even when they seem like they might be hardware problems. But the keyboard is just plain hardware and that's unfortunate.
 

BeatCrazy

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Jul 20, 2011
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Hopefully you have no issues. For me the speaker crackle and T2 issues wouldn't be deal breakers, assuming that those are both software issues, as most things are even when they seem like they might be hardware problems. But the keyboard is just plain hardware and that's unfortunate.

Keyboard on the 2018s? I've officially had the 2016, 2017, and now the 2018 keyboards. Maybe I've been lucky, but I've never had any keyboard issues.
 

puma1552

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Welp it's been about a month now and I'm happy to report there has been no drama whatsoever. Machine is working flawlessly with no issues and is rock solid. Totally happy with my purchase.
 

Polymorphic

macrumors regular
Dec 23, 2010
164
453
I find it pretty sad that people are willing to pay $$$ for three-year-old machines. Tells a lot about how good they were and the direction Apple is going today.

Congrats on finding an acceptable 2015 model, OP. They are great machines.

With Apple these days, staying on the bleeding edge really is an uncomfortable place to be. A client has a business full of 2016 MBPs that are succumbing to keyboard failures. We never saw this kind of failure rate with previous generations, not even those with the infamous Nvidia GPUs.

I had a 2017 MBP for six months; now I’m back on a 2015 and much happier.

But after nearly 30 years of Mac usage and advocacy, I think there’s a high chance this will be my last Mac laptop. I’m not holding my breath that Apple will turn this ship around. The Mac isn’t a significant enough contributor to Apple’s bottom line in 2018. Macs will continue to exist to the extent necessary to support iOS development, but beyond that, I think professional Mac users need a contingency plan.
 
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