Nvidia = bye bye?

[Velin]

I say good riddance to Nvidia. Their cards suck, in my experience. Literally every single Nvidia card I've had over the last four years, including PC and Apple, has blown up within eighteen months of purchase. This includes both Nvidia cards in two of my Mac Pro 2008s, both of which failed after six months.

Switched to ATI, no problems.

 

[mark28]

So what's your point? Since when do you think Apple are ever going to put either of those chips in any of their laptops?



Really? I don't think so, sure they developed there software for it but lets not forget all Nvidia GPU's have some hardware built into the chips to enable the graphics switching. If was simply 'software' driven then it would have been done 2 years ago. And if it's so easy why hasn't ATI launched anything itself? In fact what is stopping Dell or HP from making there own software to work with any ATI GPU?



Some people are mad enough to think a £80 difference is rather big consider it's a massive chunk of the overall cost

On average they are similiar priced. Zotac who made that cheaply GTX 480 can't be compared to GPU's from Asus for example

The most expensive GTX 480 is more expensive than the most expensive ATI 5970

 

[DesmoPilot]

On average they are similiar priced. Zotac who made that cheaply GTX 480 can't be compared to GPU's from Asus for example

Zotac's cards are very well built and backed by a great lifetime warranty. They're just as good if not better than ASUS cards. Not that it matters since 90% of the GTX 480s on the market are reference PCBs and quality is the same among all those cards, just the sticker on the heatsink is different.

The most expensive GTX 480 is more expensive than the most expensive ATI 5970

Proof?

 

[apolloa]

http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/2010/04/inside-apples-automatic-gpu-switching.ars

Might want to do some research before you make such outlandish claims.

Erm, well I've read that several times before. It also does not specifically state that Apple's solution relies entirely on a software solution. And I can still throw back at you, if it was entirely driven by software, just why have they not released this magic to work with the last gen unibody MacBook pro's?? I bet you can't answer that can you? Not without having to state the HARDWARE differences like that fact all Optimus enabled Nvidia GPU's have got some slight hardware changes on board for the switching capability.

 

[Ace134blue]

On average they are similiar priced. Zotac who made that cheaply GTX 480 can't be compared to GPU's from Asus for example

The most expensive GTX 480 is more expensive than the most expensive ATI 5970

Once again your wrong... Seriously stop being so damn lazy and do some research for once.

5970 1,099$ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102905&cm_re=5970-_-14-102-905-_-Product

480 649$ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130561&cm_re=gtx_480-_-14-130-561-_-Product

How the hell is the 5970 cheaper?

 

[aiqw9182]

Erm, well I've read that several times before. It also does not specifically state that Apple's solution relies entirely on a software solution. And I can still throw back at you, if it was entirely driven by software, just why have they not released this magic to work with the last gen unibody MacBook pro's?? I bet you can't answer that can you? Not without having to state the HARDWARE differences like that fact all Optimus enabled Nvidia GPU's have got some slight hardware changes on board for the switching capability.

LOL, this is too funny. You want to know why they haven't done it for the previous generation MacBook Pro's? Well why didn't Apple issue inertial scrolling the second the new MacBook Pro's got released as well? Because they weren't capable of doing it? Nope.

You are grasping at straws buddy. You have provided no evidence that the MacBook Pro's are even using a single bit of Optimus while I have provided information that they aren't. You don't need an Optimus chip to detect when OpenGL, Core Graphics, Quartz Composer or others are in use. It's all done in software as the article stated which I highly doubt you read or you wouldn't have responded.

"Apple credits its solution to the company's attention to detail when it comes to user interaction (though its original solution with its login/logout missed this mark), and because Apple is unique among PC vendors in that it controls both the hardware and software. That level of integration is much more difficult when multiple vendors control different parts of the system."

Here's another article for you to read, since the other one wasn't convincing enough for you apparently:
http://www.appleinsider.com/article...book_pro_graphics_switching_isnt_optimus.html

 

[mark28]

Once again your wrong... Seriously stop being so damn lazy and do some research for once.

5970 1,099$ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102905&cm_re=5970-_-14-102-905-_-Product

480 649$ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130561&cm_re=gtx_480-_-14-130-561-_-Product

How the hell is the 5970 cheaper?

Read my replies and you can answer that question yourself. I'm not going to repeat it for the 3rd time. If you can't read, why even bother replying.

I showed you the prices in the UK 3 times already, i'm not going to do for the 4th time.

edit: And I checked Neweggs just for fun, they don't have the most expensive GTX 480 listed, only the most expensive ATI 5970. There is a GTX 480 that is more expensive than that ATI card you listed in the UK.

edit2: I just looked at Neweggs more, and for you guys the GTX 480 is lower priced on average. That doesn't mean the same holds true worldwide though. Not everybody is from America

 

[apolloa]

LOL, this is too funny. You want to know why they haven't done it for the previous generation MacBook Pro's? Well why didn't Apple issue inertial scrolling the second the new MacBook Pro's got released as well? Because they weren't capable of doing it? Nope.

You are grasping at straws buddy. You have provided no evidence that the MacBook Pro's are even using a single bit of Optimus while I have provided information that they aren't. You don't need an Optimus chip to detect when OpenGL, Core Graphics, Quartz Composer or others are in use. It's all done in software as the article stated which I highly doubt you read or you wouldn't have responded.

"Apple credits its solution to the company's attention to detail when it comes to user interaction (though its original solution with its login/logout missed this mark), and because Apple is unique among PC vendors in that it controls both the hardware and software. That level of integration is much more difficult when multiple vendors control different parts of the system."

Here's another article for you to read, since the other one wasn't convincing enough for you apparently:
http://www.appleinsider.com/article...book_pro_graphics_switching_isnt_optimus.html

You still have NOT provided any factual proof that Apples graphics switching uses solely a software solution which is what you are trying to tell everyone. in fact here is a line from the Apple insider line:

Apple on Tuesday introduced its new line of MacBook Pros, with the 15- and 17-inch models sporting the proprietary graphics switching capabilities. The feature dynamically switches between the 330M for peak performance, and the integrated Intel HD Graphics for more energy efficient operation. Apple said the tightly integrated software and hardware solution allows battery life of 8 to 9 hours on the new MacBook Pros.

I am not grasping at any straws, just stating facts that you cannot. I've read all the articles several times before and again not one states that Apples solution is 100% software driven.

I am picking on you because you said this on page one:

Uhh, they already have spent money to develop their own software for GPU switching. They are not using NVIDIA's Optimus technology. That MacBook Pro you own? The switching is all done via software that could be translated to an ATI GPU with no effort.

And so far have failed to back it up with any facts.

 

[aiqw9182]

You still have NOT provided any factual proof that Apples graphics switching uses solely a software solution which is what you are trying to tell everyone. in fact here is a line from the Apple insider line:

Apple on Tuesday introduced its new line of MacBook Pros, with the 15- and 17-inch models sporting the proprietary graphics switching capabilities. The feature dynamically switches between the 330M for peak performance, and the integrated Intel HD Graphics for more energy efficient operation. Apple said the tightly integrated software and hardware solution allows battery life of 8 to 9 hours on the new MacBook Pros.

I am not grasping at any straws, just stating facts that you cannot. I've read all the articles several times before and again not one states that Apples solution is 100% software driven.

I am picking on you because you said this on page one:

Uhh, they already have spent money to develop their own software for GPU switching. They are not using NVIDIA's Optimus technology. That MacBook Pro you own? The switching is all done via software that could be translated to an ATI GPU with no effort.

And so far have failed to back it up with any facts.

LOL, you've read all the articles. If you read all of the articles you could clearly see that even NVIDIA themselves claimed that Optimus has absolutely ZERO to do with Apple's new graphics switching. It's clear that you are just trying to justify your purchase.

First you said that the graphics switching had nothing to do with software, now you change your mind and say its a combination. Nice strawman. I'm done with you and this thread, as it's pretty clear that you enjoy pulling random **** out of your ass with no information to back it up. So don't bother responding, I won't be reading it.

 

[kny3twalker]

LOL, you've read all the articles. If you read all of the articles you could clearly see that even NVIDIA themselves claimed that Optimus has absolutely ZERO to do with Apple's new graphics switching. It's clear that you are just trying to justify your purchase.

Read the entire thread and don't see the justifying of purchase.

First you said that the graphics switching had nothing to do with software, now you change your mind and say its a combination.

Can you quote where it is claimed that graphic switching has nothing to do with software because I never read that? I believe the argument was Hardware and Software VERSUS Software Only.

 

[apolloa]

LOL, you've read all the articles. If you read all of the articles you could clearly see that even NVIDIA themselves claimed that Optimus has absolutely ZERO to do with Apple's new graphics switching. It's clear that you are just trying to justify your purchase.

First you said that the graphics switching had nothing to do with software, now you change your mind and say its a combination. Nice strawman. I'm done with you and this thread, as it's pretty clear that you enjoy pulling random **** out of your ass with no information to back it up. So don't bother responding, I won't be reading it.

What the HELL??? Trying to justify my purchase?? What are you? a frigging 10 year old??
My God you are most DEFINITELY the one that is clutching onto every single tiny minuscule straw if your coming out with crap like that mate.
I'm sorry but I seriously DO NOT FEEL THE NEED TO JUSTIFY ANYTHING TO YOU!!

I'll tell you what. As it has become quite clear that you are totally incapable of backing up any of your so called facts. A quick 10 second Google (Which seems to be beyond your capability's) has revealed a simple Anwser:

http://www.reghardware.com/2010/04/14/apple_gpu_switching_macbook/
http://crave.cnet.co.uk/laptops/apple-updates-macbook-pro-faster-chips-longer-battery-life-49305454/

So Apple does NOT use Nvidia's Optimus but it DOES use HARDWARE AND SOFTWARE (unsurprisingly) to perform the graphics switching.
May I offer some advice? Please think before you talk? It'll make it a whole lot easier for you

 

[apolloa]

On average they are similiar priced. Zotac who made that cheaply GTX 480 can't be compared to GPU's from Asus for example

The most expensive GTX 480 is more expensive than the most expensive ATI 5970

Ok, I'll link to Scan as they can be expensive:

480GTX most expensive first:

http://www.scan.co.uk/Shop/Computer-Hardware/All/GPU-NVIDIA/NVIDIA-Geforce-GTX480-PCI-E-(480-Cores)

5970 most expensive first:

http://www.scan.co.uk/Shop/Computer-Hardware/All/GPU-ATI/ATI-Radeon-HD5970-PCI-E-(3200-Cores)

The Asus 480GTX is £70 cheaper then the cheapest 5970. Sorry but on average the 5970 IS more expensive. And by a fair bit of the overall cost too.

 

[Ace134blue]

Read my replies and you can answer that question yourself. I'm not going to repeat it for the 3rd time. If you can't read, why even bother replying.

I showed you the prices in the UK 3 times already, i'm not going to do for the 4th time.

edit: And I checked Neweggs just for fun, they don't have the most expensive GTX 480 listed, only the most expensive ATI 5970. There is a GTX 480 that is more expensive than that ATI card you listed in the UK.

edit2: I just looked at Neweggs more, and for you guys the GTX 480 is lower priced on average. That doesn't mean the same holds true worldwide though. Not everybody is from America

Your still wrong.

5970 587$
http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/...ics-ATI/ATIHD5900Series/EAH5970G2DIS2GD5.html

GTX 480 410$ http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/...vidia/NvidiaGTX480FermiSeries/VGA-480-A1.html

177$ difference... See what i mean? Do research...

 

[mark28]

Your still wrong.

5970 587$
http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/...ics-ATI/ATIHD5900Series/EAH5970G2DIS2GD5.html

GTX 480 410$ http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/...vidia/NvidiaGTX480FermiSeries/VGA-480-A1.html

177$ difference... See what i mean? Do research...

http://www.amazon.co.uk/SPARKLE-GeF...5?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1281496639&sr=1-5

GTX 480 - £783.02

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Sapphire-RA...4?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1281496787&sr=1-4

ATI 5970 - £733.85

edit: Before you accuse someone of not doing research, make sure you did it yourself. Again, you failed to find the most expensive GTX 480. And for that same price of that average GTX 480 you listed, you can easily buy an ATI 5970 for the same money. For all GTX 480 you can buy an ATI 5970 for the same kind of money with the exception of 1.

 

[mark28]

Ok, I'll link to Scan as they can be expensive:

480GTX most expensive first:

http://www.scan.co.uk/Shop/Computer-Hardware/All/GPU-NVIDIA/NVIDIA-Geforce-GTX480-PCI-E-(480-Cores)

5970 most expensive first:

http://www.scan.co.uk/Shop/Computer-Hardware/All/GPU-ATI/ATI-Radeon-HD5970-PCI-E-(3200-Cores)

The Asus 480GTX is £70 cheaper then the cheapest 5970. Sorry but on average the 5970 IS more expensive. And by a fair bit of the overall cost too.

See here a listing of the prices of the ATI 5970.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/qid=12814...&rh=n:560798,n:!560800,k:ati+5970&sort=-price

And see here the listing of the prices of the GTX 480.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gtx-480-Ele...tx 480&rh=n:560798,n:!560800,k:gtx 480&page=1

For the same kind of money, you can find an ATi 5970, unless you settle with the Zotac of the GTX 480. That's the only GTX 480 that is cheaper than any other ATI 5970.

Hence they are priced pretty similiar if you can find an alternative ATI 5970 for all the GTX 480, with the exception of 1.

 

[Ace134blue]

http://www.amazon.co.uk/SPARKLE-GeF...5?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1281496639&sr=1-5

GTX 480 - £783.02

Most of them are around £500.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Sapphire-RA...4?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1281496787&sr=1-4

ATI 5970 - £733.85

Most of them around are £500 too.

edit: Before you accuse someone of not doing research, make sure you did it yourself. Again, you failed to find the most expensive GTX 480.

Hardly anyone orders Pc parts from amazon. Its your own fault for not going to a good Pc part website. It is known that amazon bloats the prices for everything. Next time find a credible pc part website... Like the one i showed you.

What the hell.. Nice LINK about the 480.. Know why its so damn expensive? It comes with 2 200$ 3D VISION GLASSES.. Thats worth 400$..

This is the most expensive 480 that does NOT come with ACCESSORIES. http://www.amazon.co.uk/INNO-3D-GeF...?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1281498153&sr=1-17

So on amazon... 5970 733$ GTX 480 541$. As i said do your RESEARCH.

 

[mark28]

Nobody orders Pc parts from amazon. Its your own fault for not going to a good Pc part website. It is known that amazon bloats the prices for everything. Next time find a credible pc part website... Like the one i showed you.

Your credible website has an average GTX 480 as the most expensive

And amazon prices are good. Macbook pro's from amazon are alot cheaper than from Apple store and other sellers

 

[mark28]

Hardly anyone orders Pc parts from amazon. Its your own fault for not going to a good Pc part website. It is known that amazon bloats the prices for everything. Next time find a credible pc part website... Like the one i showed you.

What the hell.. Nice LINK about the 480.. Know why its so damn expensive? It comes with 2 200$ 3D VISION GLASSES.. Thats worth 400$..

This is the most expensive 480 that does NOT come with ACCESSORIES. http://www.amazon.co.uk/INNO-3D-GeF...?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1281498153&sr=1-17

So on amazon... 5970 733$ GTX 480 541$. As i said do your RESEARCH.

For every GTX 480, there is an ATI 5970 to be bought

One can argue that with the 733 ATI 5970, it's so expensive because of the monster cooler.

 

[synth3tik]

I produce music and do some work with graphics. No gaming or anything that is all that intensive. When even I go to upgrade my GPU I do go for the ATIs, I have had luck with them. As the debate over Nvidia or ATI is the best is far from over I'd take a guess that both will be available.

 

[apolloa]

I still say on average the GTX480 is cheaper then the 5970, especially if you remove the TWO pairs of Nvidia 3D glasses from the card used in the example above!!

 

[thunng8]

I must disagree about ATI drivers being better.

Serious gamers will run bootcamp on their Macs, so OS X graphics drivers are null and void. ATI still hasn't perfected GPU switching, unlike Nvidia.

ATI updates their drivers (for Windows) twice a year, after new hardware releases. Nvidia updates their drivers once a month, with significant speed increases for recently released games.

What the heck are you talking about? ATI updates their driver for windows every single month. It is Nvidia that has less frequent updates.

 

[apolloa]

What the heck are you talking about? ATI updates their driver for windows every single month. It is Nvidia that has less frequent updates.

Unfortunately none of that matters as Apple is sooo lazy when it comes to drivers. Lets just keep our fingers crossed that they release the new drivers they are supposedly working on very soon.
It's utterly ridiculous to put all this hardware in your machines only to be too bloody bone idle to make decent drivers for it or update them anymore then twice a year.
Sorry, just would like Starcraft 2 to play nice and smooth in OSX.

 

[panzer06]

I say good riddance to Nvidia. Their cards suck, in my experience. Literally every single Nvidia card I've had over the last four years, including PC and Apple, has blown up within eighteen months of purchase. This includes both Nvidia cards in two of my Mac Pro 2008s, both of which failed after six months.

Switched to ATI, no problems.

+1 no nvidia if I can avoid it.

@appolloa. What settings? SC2 works great on my iMac 24 with the ATI4850 on high. Ultra causes lag.
Cheers,

 

[apolloa]

@appolloa. What settings? SC2 works great on my iMac 24 with the ATI4850 on high. Ultra causes lag.
Cheers,

I use the recommended settings from the link that was posted in the gaming forums thread. Mostly on low bar a couple of settings and the game lags in some places when the action is intense. From what I've read people with the same machine as me (see sig) have said it plays much better at higher settings in bootcamp Windows. I don't really want to install bootcamp if I can avoid it.

 

[panzer06]

I use the recommended settings from the link that was posted in the gaming forums thread. Mostly on low bar a couple of settings and the game lags in some places when the action is intense. From what I've read people with the same machine as me (see sig) have said it plays much better at higher settings in bootcamp Windows. I don't really want to install bootcamp if I can avoid it.

Yeah the nvidia card is much weaker than my ATI. I don't like using bootcamp anymore either. I bought the gaming rig in my sig for windows games but my iMac handles OS X games just fine.