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How about making the iPhone 8 $100 more costly, and using the money to pay for ethical manufacture instead of new features. Call it the "Human Rights" edition.

How about we don't? How about we get the author to send them money every month instead?
 
FYI, the labor laws in Italy are far, far, far, far, far more worker friendly than in China. Better than in the US too, in many respects.

Oh I know, there is a strike every other week. :) But hey every country has its own standards based on what the people are happy with.
 
(1) since he wasn't able to take pictures(obviously), where was
his proof that he actually worked inside the factory?

(2) someone needs to invent a camera that's embedded inside a
tooth.(most logical place, since it can be passed off as metal
dental filling/crown/implant, if detected by metal detectors)
 
USD 450 per Month for working 12 hours a day. I am officially ashamed of having bought a device which could pay one factory worker for 2.5 Months..

Something is SO wrong in this here world where YouTube "Starlets" Bendgate and Smash Phones which worth could support a family man for almost a year when smashing several.

They work their behinds off so that we westernized folks can run about and stare at a USD1000 smart phone instead of being social.

Think I need to revise my life here
 
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Agree. Story sounds like typical fake news disinformation. $450 a month is a huge amount of money in China. They're going to pay you that much just to put a sticker on the back of a iphone? Come on. In Taiwan--the most civilized, free Chinese country in the world, the average unskilled worker works a 72 hour a week, bosses work you to death and you make $600 a month.

And what's the background of the graduate student? The spelling of his name suggests he's a foreign student from China, a Party plant. Surprise, surprise...

I did a Master's degree in Hong Kong, our class was full of Chinese government tools.
 
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What a loser. This guy kicks back in his cushy middle class lifestyle, and he has the NERVE to judge what other people CHOOSE to do for a living?? How much money per month does he think that those workers were making on the farm? Huh? How productive were they there? Living in absolute poverty ridden destitution? And he has the nerve to criticize them, because he finds their work "very boring"??? And now he wants to get involved with "human rights advocacy"???

Let me guess: Shot in the dark. He wants these companies to pay their workers more. And when they're not willing or able to pay more, he'll tell the government to install a minimum wage, and price these kids out of a job. He'll FORCE them to NOT work at the rate that they thought was good for them; the rate they agreed to when they traveled from home to get the job in the first place.

These kids *think* that they'll be better off making money, instead of starving in rural China, but ohh noooo here comes the NYU intellectual to tell him alllll about how to live his life the way the intellectuals think he should live it, or else. Good think he was there to FORCE his idiotic opinions on others.

And by the way, that's about 40% of what I make in the U.S., I have all of Apples latest products, I pay my rent on time, and I save money, and their cost of living isn't nearly as high.

Maybe this kid should mind his business and shut up, instead of advocating for the violation of the rights that he claims to want to uphold. You don't have a RIGHT to INITIATE FORCE against anyone for ANY reason. Therefore, you don't have a right to tell people BY FORCE that they can't take a job, or that they can only take it under the terms that YOU prefer. Any claim to such a right is an absurd contradiction.
Hope you dont mind z400.. i quoted you on Appleindider.. put a direct link to your post.
 
USD 450 per Month for working 12 hours a day. I am officially ashamed of having bought a device which could pay one factory worker for 2.5 Months..

Something is SO wrong in this here world where YouTube "Starlets" Bendgate and Smash Phones which worth could support a family man for almost a year when smashing several.

They work their behinds off so that we westernized folks can run about and stare at a USD1000 smart phone instead of being social.

Think I need to revise my life here

For perspective, could you post how much the average person in the same geographical area makes per month assuming a similar age, no university degree, and not working at Foxconn/Pegotron/etc.? Thank you.
 
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For perspective, could you post how much the average person in the same geographical area makes per month assuming a similar age, no university degree, and not working at Foxconn/Pegotron/etc.? Thank you.

I'd like to know that too.

If work at Pegatron is so horrible with low pay... why do people work there? Seems like you'd look for a better job that pays more.

Though something tells me there's not much choice for jobs in these parts of the world.
 
This is BS. You notice how he fails to explain what 124$ is worth in that country! The misinformation campaigners and virtue signalers never want you to know the whole truth. If they did then their angle would be ruined and they would not be able to manipulate you into thinking the way they want you to.

The cost of living in America is much higher.

Indices Difference
Consumer Prices in United States are 70.63% higher than in China
Consumer Prices Including Rent in United States are 85.38% higher than in China
Rent Prices in United States are 125.34% higher than in China
Restaurant Prices in United States are 148.02% higher than in China
Groceries Prices in United States are 60.10% higher than in China
Local Purchasing Power in United States is 82.69% higher than in China

I compared my home town to what I think is a close example, but maybe not. IDK i'm not an expert, but there is what I got:

You would need around 30,443.27¥ (4,409.84$) in Sacramento, CA to maintain the same standard of life that you can have with 23,000.00¥ in Shanghai (assuming you rent in both cities).

You would need around 29,675.56¥ (4,298.64$) in Sacramento, CA to maintain the same standard of life that you can have with 20,000.00¥ in Beijing (assuming you rent in both cities).

You would need around 30,683.10¥ (4,444.59$) in Sacramento, CA to maintain the same standard of life that you can have with 13,000.00¥ in Jinan (assuming you rent in both cities).

Facts are better then someone skewed presentation.
 
USD 450 per Month for working 12 hours a day. I am officially ashamed of having bought a device which could pay one factory worker for 2.5 Months..

Something is SO wrong in this here world where YouTube "Starlets" Bendgate and Smash Phones which worth could support a family man for almost a year when smashing several.

They work their behinds off so that we westernized folks can run about and stare at a USD1000 smart phone instead of being social.

Think I need to revise my life here


Your life is fine. its society that has gone to crap. Sadly this stuff is job related for them, they are trying for tube fame and hits. Which have some way to pay out later on it seems for some.

And, well, you get the brain deads who watch this stuff to make it viable.

It takes 2 to tango...the idiot to film and the idiot to watch. Get enough watching idiots...it encourages the filming idiots to film more.

Phone part....that is society going to crap too. When I go to Korea I lose my cell signal (I won't pay roaming charges...I am physically with the 2 people I need to be with, wife and son and that is all I need). Several days off the grid. And back to basics. talking with the people face to face, want to find something to do just explore (vice pin drop directions and there....sometimes the longer unguided journey of getting there is better than the actual destination), etc.

Work hates it when I do this. How can we get ahold of you? You can't....what part of vacation do I need to spell out for you. Your hotel have wireless? yeah I guess. But on vaca's i am out all day. At night after dinner and such I drop the wife and kid off at the hotel, bath time for the my son, put them to bed, assemble my arsenal and go out for night shooting around the area with the Nikon. Come back late, sleep. early rise next day....rinse lather repeat. I bring a laptop...but only to back up the camera's memory sticks really after shooting for the day done lol.
 
What a loser. This guy kicks back in his cushy middle class lifestyle, and he has the NERVE to judge what other people CHOOSE to do for a living?? How much money per month does he think that those workers were making on the farm? Huh? How productive were they there? Living in absolute poverty ridden destitution? And he has the nerve to criticize them, because he finds their work "very boring"??? And now he wants to get involved with "human rights advocacy"???

Let me guess: Shot in the dark. He wants these companies to pay their workers more. And when they're not willing or able to pay more, he'll tell the government to install a minimum wage, and price these kids out of a job. He'll FORCE them to NOT work at the rate that they thought was good for them; the rate they agreed to when they traveled from home to get the job in the first place.

These kids *think* that they'll be better off making money, instead of starving in rural China, but ohh noooo here comes the NYU intellectual to tell him alllll about how to live his life the way the intellectuals think he should live it, or else. Good think he was there to FORCE his idiotic opinions on others.

And by the way, that's about 40% of what I make in the U.S., I have all of Apples latest products, I pay my rent on time, and I save money, and their cost of living isn't nearly as high.

Maybe this kid should mind his business and shut up, instead of advocating for the violation of the rights that he claims to want to uphold. You don't have a RIGHT to INITIATE FORCE against anyone for ANY reason. Therefore, you don't have a right to tell people BY FORCE that they can't take a job, or that they can only take it under the terms that YOU prefer. Any claim to such a right is an absurd contradiction.

This guy is trying to make the world the better place and get involved, and here you are crying about it on the internet. First of all no one chooses to work a crappy job that borders on abuse of human rights. Some people don't have any options. Second of all I can garantuee that even the people who want to make iPhones wish the working conditions weren't so abusive in China.
 
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$450 for a month of 60 hour weeks. That's less than $2 per hour. It is no surprise that Apple and other companies will ship production overseas for that kind of cost savings. In America that amount of labor would cost over $2,000 plus benefits like social security, medicare, worker's comp, and unemployment.

Of course the flip side is Apple is still paying the local population more than they would be making elsewhere.

It is really no different than with the auto industry as jobs shift from the $50/hour union jobs in Detroit to the $20/hour jobs in the American South and eventually to the even lower wages in Mexico and South America. The locals who are in much more dire financial straits will welcome any job over the poverty they currently experience.

Apple is probably one of the few companies who possibly could shift production to the USA and get away with the higher prices for their goods, but eventually commoditization will catch up and they would be forced to shift to areas with low labor costs.

Welcome to the future, your job is only as stable as a companies ability to build a factory and ship the product back over here cheaper.


I don't think we'll see production come back to US until we have more robots doing it. Then corps don't need to worry about paying a lot of people when they can pay fewer robot techs to maintance the robots who build their products.
 
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Apple=slave labor
Keep waxing poetic about diversity, gay rights, giving jobs to other countries, etc.
Gee, you're a swell guy Tim Cook.
:mad:
 
You do realise there's not only Nike or Adidas around, right? You can easily find sportswear from brands that manufacture in the US or Europe. It is going to cost you more, that's for sure, so try to pick up and be satisfied with less, more durable stuff.

So let's not pay these workers anything at all and make everything in the USA right? Let them all starve to death. Great!

You do realise that things like food and housing are a fraction of what they cost in the USA right? So looking a straight dollar amounts for wages is absolutely stupid.
 
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I'd like to know that too.

If work at Pegatron is so horrible with low pay... why do people work there? Seems like you'd look for a better job that pays more.

Though something tells me there's not much choice for jobs in these parts of the world.

Exactly. No Choice. That is why the Western World chooses to produce there. If they produced the iPhone in the States, no one in the working class would be able to afford it. This is NOT just Apple - it is everything. Shoes, Clothing, TVs - everything. Imagine a pair of Nikes costing $500 ? They would if it weren't for "lovely" ASIA !

Produced where folks have no choice. There is a word that, slavery ! But thats the way it is. I am am no better with my 4 Macs, 3 iOS devices, NIKE Shoes and other clothing. But I am not lying to myself about it. I am ONLY able to purchase all the stuff I own because other people suffer. Thats the way it is. And the way it always will be. There is always going to be someone to do the dirty work so that others can profit. McDonalds isn't exactly paying their employees large sums monthly. A cleaning lady/man is not exactly living luxury while the people whose houses they clean are !
[doublepost=1491955605][/doublepost]
For perspective, could you post how much the average person in the same geographical area makes per month assuming a similar age, no university degree, and not working at Foxconn/Pegotron/etc.? Thank you.

It is in this here post. Just read it. Apple was quoted stating they pay more than the average sal. in that area.

If one slave gets 1 portion of rice more than his neighbor-slave - does that make him less a slave ?
 
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The fault is not Apple's. Look around you, who is buying this stuff? You can't blame Apple for wanting to make money. Although there is something to be said about the widening gap between worker income and company profit. But if Apple left another company would immediately jump in its place.

The issue that no one is really looking at, including all the displaced workers who think bringing jobs back will improve their plight, is automation. I feel bad because the very first victims of automation will be those workers in those 3rd world country factories. But automation will make its way everywhere, and when there are no more jobs to actually bring back I wonder what the rhetoric will be. It will also be interesting when prices keep going up for products, while costs go down.
People who don't stand for anything fall for everything. All of this is as basic as training a dog. No company should do what Apple has done. No Government should allow Apple to do what it does, and no customer should buy products from a company that does what Apple does. We should simply not trade with nations that systematically mistreat their citizens and instead reward nations which do treat their citizens well. You can replace Apple with Bosch, Toshiba, LG, Lenovo, etc etc etc, because they all do it. We are just feeding the monster and it will come back to bite in time.
 
most americans don't realize how awful factory work is in general

Many Americans think "Friends" was real and they could live that lifestyle.



We should simply not trade with nations that systematically mistreat their citizens and instead reward nations which do treat their citizens well. You can replace Apple with Bosch, Toshiba, LG, Lenovo, etc etc etc, because they all do it.

Ok real question, how are you writing you comment, on what type of device?

Yes you are correct, "they all do it." and so do you and I.
 
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Ok real question, how are you writing you comment, on what type of device?

Yes you are correct, "they all do it." and so do you and I.
Exactly right. We don't have a choice, I looked and basically no device in our town was available that wasn't made in China. However the point remains. Individuals are less responsible than companies and governments for this problem.
 
So...

Grad student learns factory work is not thrilling thing to do. Did it for 6 years....it served needs. Need was I could work 3rd shift to take college classes during the day. HR videos lie....dramatic driving music, cheerful narrator, staged actors happy, etc. I came in, worked tasks around a printing press by the numbers for my 8-12 hours...went home. It paid bills, was not something to find deep meaning from.

They have learned chinese wages are not great. thanks for the info....we had no clue why outsourcing became a thing. Really, we didn't. Now he needs to infiltrate india...I am not sure why they are a hot bed of IT programming development and support outsourcing either.

And an American based person learns asia has different work ethics and practices. Even Japan has some messed up stuff. They are big into "salary" payscale. Why? easiset way to pay you for 40...and get 60+ from you. Have known some Americans try the Japanese side. They worked their 9-5 as it were, packing up to leave. And boss is going wtf, where are you going. 8 hours of work bossman, its quitting time. Walk with me, we need to talk about how things work around here...

Taiwan mentioned..same thing. this is an asian thing. Japan can pay better....but they draw blood from a stone for that money really in worst cases I know.

Some like me have a phrase for these people. Salary men/women. Its not jsut a name to reference their job class...it has many meanings. Working long hours, rushing to catch that late night and most likely last train home and if train missed a fun night of crashing at places like kissaten (think manga/comic book coffee shop places with food with lounges) if not capsule hotels are included meanings.

Also seems a wide eyed college boy who thinks ones job should be their life found it lacking. Good for them to learn that early. Me...it took several bad events in my life in close timing to each other to realize one should make ones life their life and not their job. Several events taught the adage of "no one on their death bed says you know...I wished I would have spent more time at work". to be full of wisdom. Wisdom best taken in sooner than later.
 
It is in this here post. Just read it. Apple was quoted stating they pay more than the average sal. in that area.

If one slave gets 1 portion of rice more than his neighbor-slave - does that make him less a slave ?

These people are slaves? And they exist on a cup of rice, presumably per day? I'm genuinely curious. Can you expand with details on living conditions, cost of living, etc for the geographical area.
 
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