NYU Student Goes Undercover at Pegatron Factory, Offers Inside Look at iPhone Production

[Bacillus]

How about making the iPhone 8 $100 more costly, and using the money to pay for ethical manufacture instead of new features. Call it the "Human Rights" edition.

The fault is not Apple's. Look around you, who is buying this stuff? You can't blame Apple for wanting to make money. Although there is something to be said about the widening gap between worker income and company profit. But if Apple left another company would immediately jump in its place.
The issue that no one is really looking at, including all the displaced workers who think bringing jobs back will improve their plight, is automation. I feel bad because the very first victims of automation will be those workers in those 3rd world country factories. But automation will make its way everywhere, and when there are no more jobs to actually bring back I wonder what the rhetoric will be. It will also be interesting when prices keep going up for products, while costs go down.

Except it's Apple's own decision and responsibility to pile up such obscene amounts of money, that it can't spend itself in any purposeful way. Nor find anyone else to do so.
Given that, it could quite easily afford to pay taxes like anyone is supposed to do, pay Chinese workers more than enough being the most premium brand and still build spaceships and earn truckloads of money. But it wouldn't do so because it is never enough - and while once "thinking different", they want to keep everything the same. Which is the reason they outsource to Pegatron/Foxconn, so its outside their responsibility.
This way, Cook can freely play his diversity and SJW cards, as he's so socially globally engaged - except when it is about real money.
Same for milking the planets' rate earth and metals resources, via other firms, while selectively advertising solar projects.
Oh and let's not forget he donates 0,000001 % of his profits to Aids research, engaging customers in the product (RED) feelgood principle, to make them feel better than they actually are. Like himself.
Welcome to the bad, overcapitalist world, Mr. Student. First step to change it from the inside.

 

[cloudsurfer1733]

What a loser. This guy kicks back in his cushy middle class lifestyle, and he has the NERVE to judge what other people CHOOSE to do for a living?? How much money per month does he think that those workers were making on the farm? Huh? How productive were they there? Living in absolute poverty ridden destitution? And he has the nerve to criticize them, because he finds their work "very boring"??? And now he wants to get involved with "human rights advocacy"???

Let me guess: Shot in the dark. He wants these companies to pay their workers more. And when they're not willing or able to pay more, he'll tell the government to install a minimum wage, and price these kids out of a job. He'll FORCE them to NOT work at the rate that they thought was good for them; the rate they agreed to when they traveled from home to get the job in the first place.

These kids *think* that they'll be better off making money, instead of starving in rural China, but ohh noooo here comes the NYU intellectual to tell him alllll about how to live his life the way the intellectuals think he should live it, or else. Good think he was there to FORCE his idiotic opinions on others.

And by the way, that's about 40% of what I make in the U.S., I have all of Apples latest products, I pay my rent on time, and I save money, and their cost of living isn't nearly as high.

Maybe this kid should mind his business and shut up, instead of advocating for the violation of the rights that he claims to want to uphold. You don't have a RIGHT to INITIATE FORCE against anyone for ANY reason. Therefore, you don't have a right to tell people BY FORCE that they can't take a job, or that they can only take it under the terms that YOU prefer. Any claim to such a right is an absurd contradiction.

I wish I could say I'm shocked by your ignorance, but it is rampant online these days...

What exactly is wrong with advocating for a higher wage and higher standard of living (in any country)?
How exactly is he trying to tell these "kids" how to live?
What in the world are you eating, what utilities are you paying, and what extracurricular activities do you participate in to own all the latest apple gadgets on your income?

Take a deep breath next time you feel like posting such a proselytistic whine fest.

 

[skellener]

It's a factory, I get it. But, for a company with $250 billion in the bank and making more every second, of every day, I would think they could do a better job by making the work place less monotonous and a bit more humane and pay better and capping the hours at 40 per week so they don't burn everyone out.

 

[iReality85]

$450 for a month of 60 hour weeks. That's less than $2 per hour. It is no surprise that Apple and other companies will ship production overseas for that kind of cost savings.

Is it "cost savings" or "wider margins" though?

Therein lies the rub. It's tough to decern which it is, and this illustrates the continual problem of Capitalism (disclaimer: I have nothing against Captialism). Its practices usually eschew moral obligation (despite what CEOs and the company PR say) in favor of a relentless pursuit of shareholder value.

Is it morally right to pay overseas factory workers $2/hr when you're commanding 60% profit margins (e.g. after costs) back home on your products? Is it jutifiable for these companies to say labor at home is unaffordable when they have (as in Apple's case) $200+ billion in cash sitting in the bank?

Clearly, Apple has the cash (and margins) to pay higher wages- if they wanted to. It would be nice if Apple, as well as other companies, applied more of those huge margins toward higher wages and living standards for people around the world.

 

[Michael Scrip]

These people are slaves? And they exist on a cup of rice, presumably per day? I'm genuinely curious. Can you expand with details on living conditions, cost of living, etc for the geographical area.

I think you quoted someone else in the multi-quote... I didn't say anything about slaves in my earlier comment

 

[IbisDoc]

Wait, the factory workers could not afford to buy the iPhone? What a shame! Let me ask at www.ferrari-rumors.com if the Ferrari workers all own Ferraris.

Good point. Ferrari, cellphone, what's the difference?
[doublepost=1491961355][/doublepost]

Even worse human right issues out there: Boeing and Airbus workers can't afford aeroplanes!

Good point. Aeroplane, cellphone, what's the difference?

 

[citysnaps]

I think you quoted someone else in the multi-quote... I didn't say anything about slaves in my earlier comment

Holy smokes! You're right. Something got messed up there. That was supposed to be in response to someone else.

 

[Kaibelf]

I look forward to his next expose about how workers at Boeing can't afford jets, or how his works has increased the cost of everything in his house so much that he loses his cushy middle class lifestyle because he chose to "rescue" people he thinks want his help.
[doublepost=1491963326][/doublepost]

It's not the consumer's fault for demanding some sort of affordability, and the answer is not necessarily to jack up wages.
The problem stems from investors who sit on their asses demanding extreme efficiencies in business processes. These "efficiencies" far exceed what is needed to maintain a well rounded business model (benefiting the suits, workers, and customers).
But instead, everyone hides behind the "fiduciary responsibility" like it's a catch-all justification.

As a small shareholder of their stock, how about you risk YOUR money instead of asking me to risk mine.

 

[WaxedJacket]

Good for him I guess...

 

[OldSchoolMacGuy]

The reason why this is and should be news is because few people care when Chinese workers feel dehumanized by dehumanizing and underpaid work. When a US student (who middle+ class readers will empathize with) experiences this, people listen, and attention can be drawn back towards the more typical China based worker.

Instead of criticizing the student, or media coverage of the student's experience, that criticism should be redirected towards pressuring US clients of China based manufacturers to equalize the importance of a US-based workers' experiences with Chinese workers' experiences, and the reverse.

You obviously didn't read the article did you? It says that the workers at the factory are paid well above the average wage and their housing is also provided for them.

The work isn't fun or exciting, but it's not dehumanizing as you claim. That was never stated in the article. It actually said the conditions were good. I'm sure an American at a GM plant who puts the same tires on cars over and over and over all day wouldn't be super excited about the work either. Do we need to raise the flag of awareness to this issue with those guys too?
[doublepost=1491964046][/doublepost][QUOTE="rGiskard, post: 24488113, member: 1491950175]
You try doing such a rote task for 12 hrs a day on work days. You would be surprised at how dehumanizing such work can be even for well-compensated workers.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, we hear tons of complaints from all the American workers that work assembly lines at Honda, Hyundai, GM, and others who work doing the same tasks every day. We also hear so many complaints from the accountants who do nothing but prepare taxes all day, over and over.

So what's your complaint here? That they have to suffer a horrid repetitive job because they can't possibly turn down a job that pays more than the average wage?

 

[Zaqfalcon]

Welcome to the world of work.

Sounds no worse than a bunch of places I worked whilst growing up in the UK. Hardly the dark satanic mills.

 

[I7guy]

Except it's Apple's own decision and responsibility to pile up such obscene amounts of money, that it can't spend itself in any purposeful way. Nor find anyone else to do so.
Given that, it could quite easily afford to pay taxes like anyone is supposed to do, pay Chinese workers more than enough being the most premium brand and still build spaceships and earn truckloads of money. But it wouldn't do so because it is never enough - and while once "thinking different", they want to keep everything the same. Which is the reason they outsource to Pegatron/Foxconn, so its outside their responsibility.
This way, Cook can freely play his diversity and SJW cards, as he's so socially globally engaged - except when it is about real money.
Same for milking the planets' rate earth and metals resources, via other firms, while selectively advertising solar projects.
Oh and let's not forget he donates 0,000001 % of his profits to Aids research, engaging customers in the product (RED) feelgood principle, to make them feel better than they actually are. Like himself.
Welcome to the bad, overcapitalist world, Mr. Student. First step to change it from the inside.

Why shouldn't they "pile up obscene amounts of money"? And who said they tax evading, which is illegal, as opposed to tax avoidance, which is perfectly legal.

They have stepped in to ensure foxconn has humane working conditions. And you think apple is the only company milking the "earths resources"?

And whatever apple donates to just causes it's more today than it was yesterday. But let's not let facts get in the way of some good hyperbole.

 

[raghu8912]

How about making the iPhone 8 $100 more costly, and using the money to pay for ethical manufacture instead of new features. Call it the "Human Rights" edition.

Nobody will buy it, it is easy to say, but would you buy made in US products if the product costs 50% more ?
Unfortunately it is business, they want to make the phone for cheapest cost.
I don't know how this is human rights issue, people are free to quit the job if they are not paid enough or if it is boring.

 

[kobalap]

Are many surprised at the number of completely insensitive cold hearted remarks here? When this level of exploitation hits your life with little choices to stop it, then perhaps you will get it. Let's bring manufacturing back to the USA and put people back to work in company towns, read some history to see how that worked out. Most here have no clue what hardship and no hope for the future feels like., but your turn is coming by the way things look.

Another person barking up the wrong tree.

The only way to manufacture iPhones in the U.S. and keep pricing/profit margins constant is to pay the American worker 47 cents/hr. If you want to pay the American worker a fair wage, either the price of iPhones have to go up (which punishes the consumer) or the profit margins goes down (punishes the stockholder). Or maybe you have to do both.

If you want to direct your indignation at someone, direct it at consumers who are unwilling to pay the extra money it takes to manufacture products outside of third world countries.

 

[raghu8912]

USD$450 is not such a bad wage in China. It translates to around CNY3100/m. When I was working there I saw textile workers paid CNY1100/m who were able to sustain a living.
The important factor is not what the exchange rate is but what the local purchasing power of the currency is. Food is extremely cheap as is housing so the wages are more than enough to buy food, clothes, shelter etc and at Pegatron's level have some left over. It's not a high wage but entry level positions never are.

I don't like when people convert income from other country into US$ and make it look like low wages, it is not Apples to Apples comparison, Cost of living is different in each country.

 

[kobalap]

It's not the consumer's fault for demanding some sort of affordability, and the answer is not necessarily to jack up wages.
The problem stems from investors who sit on their asses demanding extreme efficiencies in business processes. These "efficiencies" far exceed what is needed to maintain a well rounded business model (benefiting the suits, workers, and customers).
But instead, everyone hides behind the "fiduciary responsibility" like it's a catch-all justification.

As a stockholder, that's the way I want it. In the end, the reason I invest is to get a return. If you want to use your money to right the wrongs of the world, knock yourself out. For me, I have bills to pay.

 

[raghu8912]

That's comparing apples and elephants, don't you think?

Because as you scale the kind of product you build, the more out of reach the product because. As an example, pretty much no one building a nuclear submarine can afford to own one.

As an aside, no not every person who works at the BMW factory can afford to buy a BMW car. But a huge percentage of them can. And if you are talking about the percentage of them that can afford to buy a BMW motorcycle, I would imagine that the answer changes to - all of them can afford to buy one.

Majority of employees at BMW probably can afford BMW, but we are not talking about what % of Pegatron employees can afford iPhone, we are talking about what % of workers on assembly line can afford iPhone.
Second: I am sure BMW assembly is heavily automated, iPhone manufacturing line may not be because wages are cheap in China.
So the comparison is not fair.
[doublepost=1491967832][/doublepost]

Tim Cook said the biggest obstacle of moving production to America was that Americans lack the vocational skills which Chinese workers have... Sooo I guess Americans don't know how to slap on a sticker and put a screw into an iPhone??

So you are assuming that Pegatron has only workers assembling phones and don't have any other employees doing other things ? It is basically a full blown factory with lot of other employees doing other things, testing, designing fixtures, working in finance, supply chain.

People in China get 2 vacations 2 weeks each, and work for 6 days a week.
I am surprised when people say there are no jobs in US, i see every store/restaurants have a sign that says now hiring, people don't want to find a work because they don't pay enough ?

 

[kobalap]

This is BS. You notice how he fails to explain what 124$ is worth in that country! The misinformation campaigners and virtue signalers never want you to know the whole truth. If they did then their angle would be ruined and they would not be able to manipulate you into thinking the way they want you to.

The cost of living in America is much higher.

Indices Difference
Consumer Prices in United States are 70.63% higher than in China
Consumer Prices Including Rent in United States are 85.38% higher than in China
Rent Prices in United States are 125.34% higher than in China
Restaurant Prices in United States are 148.02% higher than in China
Groceries Prices in United States are 60.10% higher than in China
Local Purchasing Power in United States is 82.69% higher than in China

I compared my home town to what I think is a close example, but maybe not. IDK i'm not an expert, but there is what I got:

You would need around 30,443.27¥ (4,409.84$) in Sacramento, CA to maintain the same standard of life that you can have with 23,000.00¥ in Shanghai (assuming you rent in both cities).

You would need around 29,675.56¥ (4,298.64$) in Sacramento, CA to maintain the same standard of life that you can have with 20,000.00¥ in Beijing (assuming you rent in both cities).

You would need around 30,683.10¥ (4,444.59$) in Sacramento, CA to maintain the same standard of life that you can have with 13,000.00¥ in Jinan (assuming you rent in both cities).

Facts are better then someone skewed presentation.

A couple of points here:

- I don't understand what your numbers are trying to indicate. If I had $4500/yr (I assume you mean per year) and lived in Sacramento, I would be living in a cardboard box. Are you saying that the people in China have such a crappy life that they essentially live like a homeless person?

- I don't know why you would use Sacramento as a basis for comparing anything to anything. Sacramento is pretty much a toilet.

 

[raghu8912]

You guys should hear the stories I could tell from my time undercover at the Intertrode factory.
[doublepost=1491950175][/doublepost]

You try doing such a rote task for 12 hrs a day on work days. You would be surprised at how dehumanizing such work can be even for well-compensated workers.

I understand, but what is the solution Automation ?
if Pegatron/Apple automate the routine tasks like these what will all the people assembling will do ? loose their jobs ? what next ?
There are lot of jobs that are difficult, tiresome, boring, fortunately there are people who are ready to work in these jobs.
Automation will just kill jobs, this is partially responsible for loss of jobs in US.

 

[Michaelgtrusa]

I'll have to look more at his claims before I can say he's a agent.

 

[ndolebay]

Agree. Story sounds like typical fake news disinformation. $450 a month is a huge amount of money in China. They're going to pay you that much just to put a sticker on the back of a iphone? Come on. In Taiwan--the most civilized, free Chinese country in the world, the average unskilled worker works a 72 hour a week, bosses work you to death and you make $600 a month.

And what's the background of the graduate student? The spelling of his name suggests he's a foreign student from China, a Party plant. Surprise, surprise...

I did a Master's degree in Hong Kong, our class was full of Chinese government tools.

You lost.

 

[whiteonline]

As a stockholder, that's the way I want it. In the end, the reason I invest is to get a return. If you want to use your money to right the wrongs of the world, knock yourself out. For me, I have bills to pay.

The problem isn't the expectation of a return on investment. The problem is when investors expect never-ending increasing returns. But thanks for proving my point.

Enjoy paying your bills bud.

 

[bobdobalina]

"Zeng: We also needed to get injections. We had to get vaccinated. But before we got vaccinated, they asked if you have any serious diseases or if you have something going on with your immune system, which was intended for HIV patients, please stand up. And he asked a few questions before we got the injections. I saw it as a violation of privacy because we were in a big room with more than 100 people."

 

[yakapo]

I can't afford an iPhone 7. The last iPhone I had was a 5s and it cost me $79. Having said that, I'm blessed to live here in the US. Frankly, these factory workers live a middle class life (in china). Visit Myanmar or Haiti if you want to see real poverty. There are over 18 million street children in India (most reported numbers are less but inaccurate).

 

[Jaaz]

In my hometown, in a country, part of the European Union, around 40% of the employed population works in the same branch. Producing parts for the automotive industry. Most of these workers are on the assembly lines, doing shifts, being paid roughly $305/mo. My mother-in-law, after working for nearly 40 years, has a pension of around $150/mo. Bear in mind that this is happening in EU, therefore the cost of living is high. (~$4.50 for a gallon of gas, $3.80/gallon of milk, etc)

So, what was this article about?!