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Why do people keep cherry-picking history to prove their point?

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there's nothing to stop them collaborating with a more specialist workstation manufacturer to plug the holes in their range - just as they have done with LG on displays, BlackMagic on eGPUs, Promise on MacPro internal storage etc.

But given that that's not even remotely the scenario that's happening here with "OpenCore Computer", it makes perfect sense the cmaier only told part of the history.
 
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Why found a company based on a (hysterically misguided) belief that an event that has not occurred yet — and there have been zero signals of it potentially ever occurring — will occur in the next couple weeks?

Goodness.

A simpler explanation exists: It’s illegal, they know it’s illegal, and they don’t care.

given they know it’s illegal and who they are going up against this should immediately raise red flags. The obvious scam of take your bit coin deposit for a pre order, get shut down, then never return the money seems all to likely
 
Considering how many problems people experience running macOS on the hardware configurations Apple does produce - hardware configurations they have complete control over - I honestly shudder to think how it would be if they sold macOS for use with "home-brew hardware" configurations using off-the-shelf parts.

This ^^^^^^

Back in the day macOS was solid (not without bugs, but solid anyway). Now no-so-much and it is getting worse.
 
The official Mac clones of the 1990s were probably more of a symptom of Apple's problems than the cause - selling licenses was a way to quickly raise cash. At the time, Apple's range was a mess of poorly differentiated beige boxes, their scheme to replace the outdated MacOS was failing to deliver anything and they had a whole host of side-projects (Quicktake, Newton) which would have been great if they had a $1.5 trillion market cap, but not so much when they were teetering on the verge of bankruptcy.

Job's dividing Apple's product line into 4 quadrants helped save Apple by focusing on a few things they could do real well. Until then, resources were spread way too thin and Sculley, with his soft drink background, thought the computer industry could work like the soft drink - spin off a lot of products with different features to reach as many consumers as possible. Unfortunately it's a lot easier to tweak a formula, put a different coat of paint on a standard can, and sell a new product.

Plus, the 90s were the peak of the era when it was nigh-on impossible to sell anything that didn't run Windows. Apple were about the only mainstream non-'Wintel' personal computer platform to actually survive the decade and - however brilliant Jobs' rescue plans were - his real success came from building on Microsoft's failure to embrace the Internet and mobile market, which wouldn't have worked 5 years earlier (if affordable mobile internet had been available for the Newton in 1993 then it might not have been killed by a Doonsbury cartoon and, today, Apple's lecture theatre might have been named after John Sculley).

The Newton was really ahead of it's time. I had an OMP, and later reviewed the 2K and the 2K had a lot of potential. Graffiti gave it stylus input to make up for its generally bad HWR, and the keypad made it a nice portable for basic writing etc. to be later transfered to a PC.

I guess it depends on whether you're more worried about the future of the Mac platform or the future price of Apple stock (the latter will doubtless continue to boom until the day when a "Yo! My dad has an iPhone" meme goes viral on twitter and the iPhone bubble bursts overnight).

Yo, the iPhone is the minivan of mobile phones. Now get off my lawn...
 
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There is no proof that Apple is doing well with the Mac desktop. How come Macbook Pro and MacBook Air are the only product getting annual updates while Mac desktops arent?

iMac's design itself is 8 years old with minimum changes. Do you really think they are doing well? Gosh... Mac mini didnt update for 4 years until 2018. iMac Pro didn't update for almost 3 years. Mac Pro finally updated after 6 years!

What Apple is doing for Mac desktop is such a disaster.
Yes and it is a shame IMO. Their OS MacOS is great. way better than windows. I know many windows users wanting to use macOS. they just find the computers to expensive or they don't have the specs.

edit:typo
 
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Actually, they tried it twice - they licensed the Apple ]['s OS for a while as well.
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Price. Cheaper to buy and if upgrading you simply keep your monitor.

Yep, monitors don't change in any essential way for 10+ years, computers 4 or 5 years. But the problem is that Apple today is changing for changes sake, not to really improve. They want people to buy new computers needed or not because that is their DNA and it is required to support current macOS releases.

Computers today are a commodity, not new fast changing technology. Apple is still caught up in the 90s where computers improved so much in 2 years that new ones were wanted. Today, I don't want a new computer every 2 or 3 years just in order to run a current Apple macOS. This is the problem that Apple does not understand and why the 90s strategy worked during the 90s and does not now. It is Apple that has not adapted, not me.
 
If you are an old-school hacker, sure. Sounds like fun. But, if you want a viable machine for getting things done, no way.

nah, i‘ve been working professionally (editing videos, color grading, animating, music) on various hackintoshes since around 2007 - i’ll admit, my first install took around a day, because I didn‘t have the right hardware - my first hackintosh was just a pc with components not bought for hackintosh in mind. but since then they’ve been running without any fuss, and were no more complicated to set up than a windows-install. i‘ve had to reinstall a broken osx once, just as i had to on my macbook. and even if the hackintosh hardware ever breaks down, I could go to he next store and buy a replacement-part and be up and running in no time vs. sending in the mac and also paying for all the parts soldered to the damaged one.

granted, if i had the money, i‘d buy a macpro, and never waste a second thought on it. but I don‘t have that amout of change lying around, and so do most pros I know, even big TV-companies (most of which just buy windows machines because of that). sure, we could afford it, if we had to - it‘s a tool that also makes money - but it’s a luxury tool with the money better invested in other things. otoh, i can build a hackintosh that‘s - using applications in my field - just as fast as a 12-core macpro for less than a quarter of the price with the only real world advantage of the macpro making even less noise and being shinier.
 
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Yep, monitors don't change in any essential way for 10+ years, computers 4 or 5 years. But the problem is that Apple today is changing for changes sake, not to really improve. They want people to buy new computers needed or not because that is their DNA and it is required to support current macOS releases.

Computers today are a commodity, not new fast changing technology. Apple is still caught up in the 90s where computers improved so much in 2 years that new ones were wanted. Today, I don't want a new computer every 2 or 3 years just in order to run a current Apple macOS. This is the problem that Apple does not understand and why the 90s strategy worked during the 90s and does not now. It is Apple that has not adapted, not me.
I was just saying this the other day. I really wish Apple would for once leave well enough alone and focus on stability instead of change. They can't though. That is simply not Apple. They have to continually stir the pot, breaking many things along the way. They do not care who gets rolled over in their path. I understand there might be great potential with ARM, but do we really need ARM Macs? I mean, do we not hit a threshold of performance which in the real world the gains are no longer relevant? I feel sorry for a lot of these smaller 3rd party devs that simply can't keep up. I wish Apple would have just teamed up with AMD and called it a day. At least then they wouldn't have the excuse that Intel is holding them back.
 
Just wondering if any of these Hackintosh companies can beat the system by just building the computer to spec, then just not selling it with the Mac OS but with online instructions from a “third party” website on how to install the OS?

then they’d just be hardware to spec dealers. Maybe at worst, with modified BIOS etc.
 
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Apple doesn't have a proper desktop at around $3000 and it's a big issue.
Well, it's a big issue apparently only for a handful of critics and shorts. The company is approaching $1.5 trillion market cap, so it's not an issue for Apple, their target market, or their long shareholders. Could you help us understand what you mean by "a proper desktop"? I suspect it's an area of computing that has a slim margin.
 
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But given that that's not even remotely the scenario that's happening here with "OpenCore Computer", it makes perfect sense the cmaier only told part of the history.

My point was that the licensing program was probably not the main thing that nearly bankrupted Apple in the 90s.

Job's dividing Apple's product line into 4 quadrants helped save Apple by focusing on a few things they could do real well.

He introduced the "4 quadrants - focus on what Apple does best" model because Apple's Mac range was a confusing shambles and needed revising with extreme prejudice... and yet the next thing he did was to introduce a personal stereo, and then a phone, which were both complete departures for Apple (try to compete with Sony, Nokia and Blackberry? Don't be silly!) However much the authors of business studies courses may want it to be true, people like Jobs don't succeed by adhering to simplistic rules that will fit on a powerpoint slide. "4 quadrants" may have saved the company from actual ruin, but it was ignoring that rule and taking a huge gamble that turned it into a massive success. Superficially, the Newton or the QuickTake made just as much sense at the time - the devil is in the details (plus a large dollop of luck).

(Slightly o/t rant:) It's like the "Jobs wanted everything to be a sealed-up appliance" meme: He may have wanted the original Mac and iMac to be domestic appliances but, under Jobs, Apple also released the 'blue and white' G4 tower, the PowerMac G5 and the original Mac Pro, which set new standards for 'tool free' access to the innards.

Even the new MP fails in that respect - to re-seat a wobbly PCIe card you have to unplug all the cables, roll it out from under the desk on those $700 wheels and lift up the entire cover by the full height of the system... (or there's the rack-mount version, which turns out to need the full depth of a server rack, meaning it won't fit in a lot of studio A/V racks... and where the RAM slots are underneath the case...) But, hey, the PCIe slot covers are machined from solid aluminium (even though the typical customer who's just paid thousands of pounds over the odds to get 8 PCIe slot is going to chuck most of them away) and when you're flat-out on the floor changing the RAM, the hatch closes with the thunk of a BMW door.
 
I just don't understand their business model. They don't tell you where they are or, really, who they are. They set up a complex payment schedule using bitcoin -- BITCOIN! -- as though that's a common currency of exchange. They send you a photo of the computer as though it's an exchange of a kidnapping victim. They (claim to) have a warranty but don't tell you how to get this freaky Frankenstein serviced. They use a CPU that is widely known not to be fully compatible with Hackintoshes. Their website is wonky. All it's missing is a Nigerian prince. Who would buy this thing?
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Just wondering if any of these Hackintosh companies can beat the system by just building the computer to spec, then just not selling it with the Mac OS but with online instructions from a “third party” website on how to install the OS?

then they’d just be hardware to spec dealers. Maybe at worst, with modified BIOS etc.
It's a creative thought but, no. It would still be illegal. It would be a case of inducement to infringe, and still violates patent and copyright laws.
 
Situation is different today. Older Macs had ports, upgradable RAM and hard drives - even the batteries were replaceable. Today everything made at Apple is kept together by rivets glue and solder. No ports, no standard interfaces, no Wifi6 ...
********. Back then everyone wanted “choice” too. People bought the clones because they were cheaper, faster, more expandable. And if your point is that demand for clones would be even higher today, that proves my point. The reason apple’s previous foray was a disaster was NOT because nobody bought the clones. Quite the opposite. So you are proving my point.

learn from history.
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Because I think it’s a scam. They won’t ship anything.
They may as well throw in three doses of COVID-19 vaccine with every purchase.
 
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Take a good look at the Terms and Conditions. You'll note that many areas of the obviously boilerplate are skipped. Examples include "...in accordance with the laws of without regard...", missing what country/state the governing law is located; "If a revision is material we will try to provide at least days notice prior", without noting the number of days.

SCAM!
There's also no imprint, no company address, nothing. No details on which 3rd parties they share your data with in the privacy policy. At least in the EU this alone is highly illegal.

Apple doesn't have a proper desktop at around $3000 and it's a big issue.
Tell me more. How exactly is it a big issue?

Mojave was released on September 24th, 2018 - that was when they warned people they wouldn't support 32-bits anymore. And even then, most developers I know didn't really believe them.

I don't have any idea why developers continued to release software that was 32-bit only for so long, but to act like it's only ancient software with this problem is being completely ignorant of the mac platform.
It's not Apple's fault if developers don't believe them. Transition to 64 Bit started with OS X 10.4 Tiger in 2005, gradually increasing the amount of software being written in 64 Bit over the following releases. The writing has been on the wall for over a decade. I said it before and I will say it again: Every developer who had only the slightest intentions to keep his code up to date had plenty of time to do so.
 
Well, it's a big issue apparently only for a handful of critics and shorts. The company is approaching $1.5 trillion market cap, so it's not an issue for Apple, their target market, or their long shareholders. Could you help us understand what you mean by "a proper desktop"? I suspect it's an area of computing that has a slim margin.
It IS an area with slim margins, and apparently not one where Apple sees a lot of potential. MacBooks are their best sellers, and stand to benefit the most from the ARM transition.
 
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If someone is stupid enough to judge Apple over a hack containing ZERO Apple components then that is on them. It certainly wouldn't tarnish Apple's rep. As a matter of fact it might actually backfire and help Apple. Someone might get fed up and realize they need to buy the real thing. Then they've paid Apple twice LOL. Who knows...? I will say it again. I am not a proponent of Hackintoshing.

You live in this interesting made up world.
 
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Neither iMac and Mac mini are normal desktop. Each of them is an AIO desktop and mini desktop. Far from what people demand.

More like: Far from what whiny tech nerds get frothed up about on tech forums.

Apple knows its customer base. That's why Apple is one of the most successful companies in the world. And why its customers are repeat purchasers, opening their wallets paying premium prices, year after year after year.
 
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I understand there might be great potential with ARM, but do we really need ARM Macs? I mean, do we not hit a threshold of performance which in the real world the gains are no longer relevant? I feel sorry for a lot of these smaller 3rd party devs that simply can't keep up. I wish Apple would have just teamed up with AMD and called it a day. At least then they wouldn't have the excuse that Intel is holding them back.

The point with the ARM chips is differentiation. Apple wants to avoid their products being commoditized. Switching to Intel was necessary in 2005, but I doubt even Steve Jobs thought it would be permanent. Since then, mobile devices have generated the bulk of their revenue, and they have invested so much into the ARM architecture that it has become viable for its Mac line. While others are starting to close the gap, Apple has shown for at least the last 7 years that they have the best chip designs. And since they control the OS and the chip design, they’ll be able to optimize both in a way that others won’t be, at least initially.
 
The point with the ARM chips is differentiation. Apple wants to avoid their products being commoditized. Switching to Intel was necessary in 2005, but I doubt even Steve Jobs thought it would be permanent. Since then, mobile devices have generated the bulk of their revenue, and they have invested so much into the ARM architecture that it has become viable for its Mac line. While others are starting to close the gap, Apple has shown for at least the last 7 years that they have the best chip designs. And since they control the OS and the chip design, they’ll be able to optimize both in a way that others won’t be, at least initially.

That's it exactly. Relying on commodity CPUs pretty much levels the playing field among computer manufacturers. Apple designing their own CPUs permits custom functions, architectures, and other secret sauce not available to competitors. And that includes being able to better trade performance/power dissipation/thermals/etc for different products.

Other benefits are cost and Apple not having its success (or downturns) driven by Intel's roadmap.
 
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