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Orbo- perpetual energy?

0098386

0098386

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Original poster
Jan 18, 2005
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I've been following this story for a while now. Apparently some smart folk in Dublin have come up with a device that breaks pretty much everything we know about the laws of Thermodynamics. In that it creates energy, and has an effeciency of 200-400%
They claim to have a device that can power an MP3 player or even a car. It works (partially described in the songs on their site :D ) by sending a ball through a magnetic field.

http://www.steorn.com/orbo/

Now. The rather brilliant situation is that a group of respected scientists have been evaluating and testing devices. I believe this started a while ago, and the fact they haven't jumped out instantly and dismissed it as fake is a great sign. They also seem quite committed to getting this out into developing countries which is quite noble.
Theres to be a mass demo of it in London next month. I'd like one in my iPod plz :p shame not much else is really known about it. Oh, and that the components are patented to hell and back.

What do you think of it all?
 
None of this is directed at the OP, by the way, only the linked claimants. Never one to be accused of unneccessary flaming :eek:

Total BS, without qualification.

I've seen so much pseudo- and semi-scientific claims asserting the same thing, that it's almost a no-brainer any longer.

"Orbo is based upon the principle of time variant magneto-mechanical interactions. The core output from our Orbo technology is mechanical. This mechanical energy can be converted into electrical energy using standard generator technology either by integrating such technology directly with Orbo or by connecting the mechanical output from Orbo to the generation technology. The efficiency of such mechanical/electrical conversions is highly dependent on the components used and is also a function of size."

What utter babble. Bottom line, you STILL cannot create or destroy energy, it is simply converted from another form, and in doing so, there is loss. Entropy is not a theory, it is observed and reproduceable fact. All these "transferences" from magnetic to mechanical to electrical energy - without loss? Give me a break. Um, ever hear of friction?

This assertion does actually not explain anything - it is a collage of mumbo-jumbo, as are all from perpetual motion or free energy snake-oil peddlers.

Absolute, unadulterated, bile-inducing CRAP.

Now, if you want to know how I really feel :rolleyes:
 
You can't break the laws of thermodynamics. No way, never. There's a reason they're called 'laws'. An efficiency of 200% means that somewhere inside energy is being made and anyone who's done basic science knows you can't do that.

Don't you think that if this really worked everyone would know about it?
 
SpookTheHamster said:
You can't break the laws of thermodynamics. No way, never. There's a reason they're called 'laws'. An efficiency of 200% means that somewhere inside energy is being made and anyone who's done basic science knows you can't do that.

Don't you think that if this really worked everyone would know about it?
Click to expand...

So if you can't create energy then how did the energy that is here now get made?
 
raggedjimmi said:
Now. The rather brilliant situation is that a group of respected scientists have been evaluating and testing devices.
Click to expand...

Do you have the names and affiliations of these scientists, or a link (not associated with the company) where they are listed?
 
Of course, the best way to prove something is to link to a highly biased site and then to believe what they say.

Obviously, matter can be converted to energy. Lighters, ants, cars, and atomic bombs all prove this.

Steorn (which must be some anagram of "Ha ha, suckers!" in some language) makes no such claims. They claim to multiply mechanical energy.

Anything that doubles the energy while consuming nothing would be very, very, very easy to prove. Put numerous mechanisms in a helicopter, placed in serial to allow the doubling to massively increase the initial energy, and hover. Forever. On a live webcam. Over the Thames. You'd need no other power source once the first was "kick-started" - just feed half of the doubled energy back into it, and use the rest to power the chain.

That'd impress me.
 
As much as I'd like perpetual energy, like anyone else, I highly doubt this. These scientest testing the validity probaly aren't that respected. Stuff like this is like tabloids in the science world. But hey, I don't really know much about science.
 
gauchogolfer said:
The Big Bang really was quite large.
Click to expand...

exactly what I was trying to point out, except you didn't seem to think about where the energy for it came from it had to be created from nothing. I doubt that these people have figured out how to do it, but it must be possible.
 
mrkramer said:
exactly what I was trying to point out, except you didn't seem to think about where the energy for it came from it had to be created from nothing. I doubt that these people have figured out how to do it, but it must be possible.
Click to expand...


While we don't know the origin of the material that was present in the Big Bang, that doesn't mean it's possible to create energy where none existed before.

It's my personal belief (not based on any evidence) that the material in the universe has always existed, and that we've gone through an infinite number of Big Bangs, followed by expansion, contraction, collapse, and another Bang, starting the cycle over again.

Saying that this group has figured out a way to circumvent the laws of thermodynamics is just silly. :)
 
As much as I would like to just ignore this and say it won't work, I just want to see it. The idea of breaking the laws of thermodynamics fascinates me.

I read somewhere (i don't know if its on the site or not, i didn't poke around too much on there yet) that they are planning to unveil this thing in July.
 
wonga1127 said:
As much as I would like to just ignore this and say it won't work, I just want to see it. The idea of breaking the laws of thermodynamics fascinates me.

I read somewhere (i don't know if its on the site or not, i didn't poke around too much on there yet) that they are planning to unveil this thing in July.
Click to expand...

I read on their site that their 'independent testing labs' verification process would be done at the end of 2007.

Oh, and check this out: http://the.second.law.of.thermodynamics.willbedefeated.com/
 
I think this is stupid.

jsw said:
claim to multiply mechanical energy.

Anything that doubles the energy while consuming nothing would be very, very, very easy to prove. Put numerous mechanisms in a helicopter, placed in serial to allow the doubling to massively increase the initial energy, and hover. Forever. On a live webcam. Over the Thames. You'd need no other power source once the first was "kick-started" - just feed half of the doubled energy back into it, and use the rest to power the chain.
Click to expand...

What?
 
The external verification is to conclude in late 2007, and it's going to be publicly displayed in July.

I probably should have said sooner. But I don't know whether or not to believe this. It's been many months and no claims have surfaced that this is fake, and it's been mentioned on the forums that "big claims require big evidence". God knows why they'd be putting on an event next month if it was all BS.

Conversely Steorns financial reports are a little grim. Big publicity stunt?
 
obeygiant said:
perpetual anything is impossible.
Click to expand...

What about electrons orbiting the nucleus of an atom?
Until that atom breaks down etc...

What about movement in space? What factors (assuming an object doesn't enter any orbit) reduce movement? There's no air resistance or friction.

I'm not trying to prove you wrong, I've just been wondering about that for a while, now.
 
raggedjimmi said:
God knows why they'd be putting on an event next month if it was all BS.
Click to expand...

Wouldn't be the first time. Carl Tilley's perpetual motion car comes to mind, but there have been lots of these. There will inevitably be some kind of unfortunate mechanical difficulty that prevents the demo from proceeding.
 
Vidd said:
What about electrons orbiting the nucleus of an atom?
Until that atom breaks down etc...

What about movement in space? What factors (assuming an object doesn't enter any orbit) reduce movement? There's no air resistance or friction.
Click to expand...

Its not that in certain circumstances motion can be kept on for a very very long time: its the claim that energy can be extracted from such a system and it will keep running.

Bottom line: In any system Energy in = Energy out when you sum up all the inputs (chemical, solar, heat, mechanical etc) and outputs (including losses to friction, waste heat, etc.) The only exception to this is if you convert mass to energy in the form of nuclear fusion or fission - even then you are "creating" energy by consuming a fuel.

All you are doing in any type of device is converting energy stored in one form, to energy expended as work or stored in another form. And in no case is there 100% efficiency.
 
CanadaRAM said:
Bottom line: In any system Energy in = Energy out when you sum up all the inputs (chemical, solar, heat, mechanical etc) and outputs (including losses to friction, waste heat, etc.) The only exception to this is if you convert mass to energy in the form of nuclear fusion or fission - even then you are "creating" energy by consuming a fuel.
Click to expand...

Exactly.

Even if something could move forever, how are you going to extract energy from it and keep it in motion? If it's producing energy, where is it producing it from? It's coming from something, somewhere, whether it's somehow producing it or mass is converted into energy (and really, this machine isn't going to do that).
 
CanadaRAM said:
Its not that in certain circumstances motion can be kept on for a very very long time: its the claim that energy can be extracted from such a system and it will keep running.
Click to expand...

Ah, thank you.
I hadn't taken it to be solely involved with the efficiency of a system.
 
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