OS X 10.6 'Snow Leopard' Seeded to WWDC Developers

[RMo]

Looks like you've never removed localizations from an app package before...try it. You can get those sizes right now in any Mac OS version. Remove all but your preferred language.

I would love to do this; alas, I am a native speaker of English, fluent in Spanish, proficient in German, will be learning Chinese this fall (Standard Mandarin, not that it matters for writing), and will shortly be entering graduate school in linguistics. I feel like I am one of few people glad that Apple's apps (and many others) include all localizations built-in and that you can change it on the fly in OS X.

(Just for the record, different-language version of Windows are different boxed products, although I think that may be different for XP Pro and whatever version/s of Vista correspond to that, and every app seems to handle selecting language in a different way, undoubtedly selecting the one you weren't quite expecting. Then again, no sane person probably has a U.S. English copy of Windows set to use various non-US time settings and whatnot...except me, and you could probably argue the "sane" part.)

 

[Riemann Zeta]

Leopard does 64-bit and 32-bit applications side-by-side quite seemlessly.

Applications, yes, but applications are fairly well abstracted away from the hardware in modern operating systems. Kernel-mode drivers are another story, however. A fully-64bit kernel requires 64bit device drivers and extensions, even if it can run 32bit apps just fine. So all of the frameworks, extensions and core aspects of Mac OS will have to also be made fully 64bit if 10.6 is to have a 100% legacy-free kernel.

 

[G4DP]

Show me an application/OS that takes advantage of SSE4.1. Actually, I don't know of any compiler using it, not even by Intel. Right now the compilers are 1-2 years behind the processor's full capabilities. The advantage of that is that your "old" hardware runs faster with newer software.

Did you actually read my post?

Well go back to half way through the first line.

NEITHER HAVE THE SOFTWARE COMPANIES

 

[SimonTheSoundMa]

Apple adding some thing that windows has had for a long time? Network based OS installing.

I have been using OS X since 10.3, and you can install/update over a IP network via command line using standard OS X, Server version has a GUI to makes things even easier for none-cl users.

I distribute Apple updates via normal OS X using terminal to all Apple computers on my network in a simple one line command now. Load load from one downloaded DMG, was good for 10.5.3 as I wouldn't like to update 5 Macs all trying to download via the Internet and manually updating each. My poor 4.5Mb/s ADSL line would have struggled.

 

[MacFan78]

There is a program called monolingual that will do it for you.

Thanks for the tip, just freed up a few gig on my hard drive with that program

 

[ckurowic]

People seem to be missing the point here. Snow Leopard is all about utilizing multi-core system efficiently. Right now, most apps, even if they are multi-threaded, really suck at doing that. This is HUGE news guys, I'm not sure why most people are complaining or claiming that this is "page 2" news at best. Seems to me you are failing to see the big picture. This is the next major step in personal computing. blah blah blah another $129, wahhhh , then don't buy it! Its pretty simple! Besides its all speculation at this point anyway (how much it'll be, if its going to be 10.6, or a 10.5.x).

 

[ckurowic]

Did you actually read my post?

Well go back to half way through the first line.

NEITHER HAVE THE SOFTWARE COMPANIES

One of the few posts that have been coherent..... (no sarcasm)

 

[Eric S.]

Anyway Apple is obviously either second guessing the PPC thing or they don't want to deal with the firestorm right now but the plan the record is not to support PPC as a boot option.

Where did you see this?

 

[xStep]

Hmm, streamlined, more secure? OK I have a ton of questions:

1. Is PPC dropped yet?

If the image above your post is any indicator, PPC will still be supported. Or it at least is in this pre-release version.

 

[ingenious]

I'm still thinking this is going to be like 10.5.x ... using the 10.6 moniker would completely throw off the pay-$129-for-each system (expecting 10.1.x, of course).

Besides, with no new features (hey, i'm excited about optimization! ) there's no marketing power in it for Apple. That's why they didn't put it in the keynote, IMO.

 

[Quillz]

I'm still thinking this is going to be like 10.5.x ... using the 10.6 moniker would completely throw off the pay-$129-for-each system (expecting 10.1.x, of course).

Besides, with no new features (hey, i'm excited about optimization! ) there's no marketing power in it for Apple. That's why they didn't put it in the keynote, IMO.

It's 10.6. Both marketing literature and "About My Mac" confirm this. Also, it's not like every release of OS X has to cost $129. That's just the price that Apple is comfortable. They are free to charge w/e they want.

 

[Nermal]

DVD Player 5.0.1 in Leopard 10.5.3 supports unencrypted HD-DVDs and Blu-Ray discs just fine. (I have put home movies and EyeTV recordings onto HD-DVD compliant discs for playback on my HD-DVD player. DVD Player in Leopard plays them just fine. It even tries to play commercial HD-DVDs, but fails due to the DRM. I don't have a Blu-ray drive, so I can't try "real" Blu-Ray discs, but mounting a Toast-created Blu-ray disc image, it won't play.)

Hmm, 5.0 on 10.5.0 wouldn't play anything I threw at it (other than MPEG-2 HD DVDs created in DVD SP), but I haven't tried this again since 10.5.3. I'll give it a shot tonight and see how far I get.

Edit: The DVD SP release notes mention that H.264 support was added to DVD Player 4.6.5 last year. It may therefore be possible to get commercial H.264 HD DVDs into a format that DVD Player will recognise

 

[kabunaru]

I think Snow Leopard will still have a "Leopard" feel to it. I don't think there is going to be a lot of new stuff in Snow Leopard. At least give Snow Leopard a different default wallpaper (blue tinted Aurora wallpaper).

 

[maxrobertson]

Yeah, I know, but will the average user realize that, and be willing to pay $129 for these under the hood features?

The average user doesn't update at all. I've never heard of any average user updating their operating system on their own. They are almost always told to do it by someone else, and they listen. This is a great release and I'm pretty sure it will be recommended due to the stability and speed it will bring.

 

[Mr.damien]

People seem to be missing the point here. Snow Leopard is all about utilizing multi-core system efficiently. Right now, most apps, even if they are multi-threaded, really suck at doing that. This is HUGE news guys

This is HUGE if the application are able to use all cores without any change in their code.

If you have to change something, it's only a new API on Mac OS X, that's not HUGE ...

 

[deanbo]

Did anyone else notice...

This is HUGE if the application are able to use all cores without any change in their code.

If you have to change something, it's only a new API on Mac OS X, that's not HUGE ...

Apple gave an estimated date of the next version of OS X? Approximately a year from now. Normally someone would get fired for that.

 

[knightlie]

THIS IS SHEAR INSANITY.

I just bought Leopard, and now they have Snow Leopard out. Boy am I going to rant. Let me pick some facts that aren't real. I will not pay Apple $499 for this "minor update". If there isn't some new ridiculous Core Animation like water freezing and cracking into frosty ice, then count me out, damnit. I do not know what a Service Pack is, but I think Apple should be doing that instead. Why? Because that sounds cheaper to me and doesnt negate that I had to pay for this install. Apple, you're off your rocker if you think I will pay $499 for this "new OS". Everyone vote negative, Apple needs to listen. I will only pay $20 if and when there is a Service Pack update with new Core Animation only, thank you.

Edit: Never mind. You, sir, are a genius.

 

[Mr.damien]

Where did you see this?

Here

 

[tny]

These are speculative answers, as I don't have a copy of the software or any hooks into Apple. Let me say at first that I think Sebastian's questions suggest that his priority is for OS X to be more UNIX-normative, and that I think that Apple isn't usually thinking of the UNIX power user as their main target consumer for OS X.

1. They aren't saying that PPC is dropped; but it probably will be by the release date.

2. Good question. My guess is part of my comment on your fifth question.

3. We won't really know the answer to this question until the release candidates come out. Early betas are not good for that kind of benchmarking.

4. I doubt they will.

5. Based on what they are saying about the iPhone app store, I would expect there to be some kind of Apple-hosted OS X app store by 10.6, with the same terms (Apple uses code-signing and takes a cut) and services (such as distributed updates).

6. No, Apple's X11 will probably still suck.

7. and 8. are good questions, but I'm not competent to speculate on them.

9. I doubt Carbon will be officially deprecated, but expect developers to be warned that it will be deprecated on the next release.

10. I doubt Apple will open source their Java implementation, but you never know.

11. Probably, but slowly. What does Surfin' Safari have to say?

12. Good question.

13. I think they will.

14. No. They've chosen not to include FTP support for a reason (probably to prop up the third-party developers).

15. and 16. I doubt it.

17. I think a lot of the features will be carried over, but I would expect that the Touch APIs won't be supported fully in the laptop/desktop version of the OS.

18. Good question. I hope so.

19. I doubt it.

20. I really doubt it.

Hmm, streamlined, more secure? OK I have a ton of questions:

1. Is PPC dropped yet?
2. Has Apple started using code signing for anything other than what they currently are?
3. What is the difference in battery life between a laptop playing a movie in Quicktime on Leopard and a laptop playing a movie in Quicktime X on Snow Leopard?
4. Does Apple bundle MacPorts?
5. Will Apple add in any sort of package manager or app manager at all? If not, then will they at least provide a way for developers to plug-in to Software Update?
6. Will X11 finally not suck?
7. Does OpenCL use CUDA and does it work with both NVIDIA and ATI cards?
8. Will QuartzGL finally be turned on by default?
9. Will the rest of Carbon finally be officially depreciated?
10. Will Apple open source their Java implementation?
11. Now that the WebKit team has a new JavaScript interpreter, will they follow in the footsteps of Mozilla in adding features newer than JS1.5, and will they add features from ECMAscript, and in particular, IronMonkey?
12. Will they redesign the Firewall security pane to include more features from ipfw?
13. Will they make it boot able from a ZFS volume?
14. Will the file manager finally have write FTP support?
15. Will they add support for /proc?
16. Will the directory structure be more in line with the Filesystem Hierarchy Standard?
17. Will the Cocoa Touch APIs be partially or wholly merged into Mac OS X?
18. Will they finally add Attributes to the Finder?
19. Will ELF compatibility be added?
20. Will the Help System be overhauled and that evil floating window destroyed?

No clearly I'm not expecting a yes to all of these, but each of them could be a piece of the foundation for future work on Mac OS X.... heh.

Sebastian



AAAHHHHH... while I was making a list of 20 questions... Apple put this page up? Dammit, I looked earlier and the page didn't exist at that time.

Sebastian

 

[Sky Blue]

Here

bye bye PPC!

 

[I WAS the one]

I don't see myself installing Leopard on my main Macs... maybe I'll try it with one of my old ones, but seriously it seems that it may damage a lot for people that depends on regular software and daily tasks....

 

[Eric S.]

Here

The fact that the "preview" disk was Intel-only does not necessarily mean anything for the final release. It only makes sense that they wouldn't go to the effort of creating installation disks for both at this point, since it's just a demonstration and not supporting the customer base.

I am not saying PPC support won't be dropped in 10.6, in fact I predicted it when they dropped Classic mode in Leopard. But I haven't seen anything yet to indicate that's the official word. It could well be that Apple hasn't made a final decision, given that it's a year away.

 

[wrldwzrd89]

The fact that the "preview" disk was Intel-only does not necessarily mean anything for the final release. It only makes sense that they wouldn't go to the effort of creating installation disks for both at this point, since it's just a demonstration and not supporting the customer base.

I am not saying PPC support won't be dropped in 10.6, in fact I predicted it when they dropped Classic mode in Leopard. But I haven't seen anything yet to indicate that's the official word. It could well be that Apple hasn't made a final decision, given that it's a year away.

*sigh* Well, I guess it's gonna be time to finally retire my iMac G5 Rev. C... or relegate it to running Tiger with the Classic environment (for those old games that were never updated).

That said, I do think you make a valid point. Apple may not have made a final decision yet as far as PPC support goes. However, I suspect that they have - remember the Java 6 Developer Previews after they were reinstated? Those were Intel-only.

 

[milo]

I thought it was going to be a full 64 bit system?

That screenshot was taken on a 32 bit machine, core duo. If they totally dump 32 bit, it would drop support for the first generation of intel boxes.

Brilliant!

Today has amused me, after years (literally, years) of unqualified people complaining about 'bloat' in iterations of OS X, we now have people saying "What? Remove the bloat? NO! I WANT NEW FEATURES DAMNIT!'



AppleMatt

To be fair, the vast majority of the comments have been that apple may charge (and maybe $129) for an update that is all optimizations and no new features. Has someone really objected to doing optimizations and bug fixes instead of new features?

I hope the PPC thing turns out not to be true, and if it is I hope apple has the balls to come out and tell customers now. I'm tired of all the speculation - can someone with the release confirm that it says it is intel only?

 

[chr1s60]

If 10.6 will be a more stable OS, then I will shell out the money for it. It is nice to get cool new looks and features like we did with Leopard, but sometimes it is the stuff that isn't visible on your screen that makes the biggest difference. I'm sure that eventually there will be tweaks to some visual aspects, even if they are only minor.