Well, I'm just thinking, the File, Edit, etc meus seem to be becoming more and more obsolete, as things move into the main window, look at Google Chrome, or Office 2011, I know Apple apps haven't done it yet, and maybe it's just because I'm from Windows recently, but it just seems to take up space unnecessarily... however, your opinions?
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OS X 10.7 - Top Menu Bar?
- Thread starter jamied95
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It will not happen, as it has been with Mac OS since its inception and when it still was titled System instead of Mac OS.
It also adheres to Apple's intention to simplify things.
In 1984 it looked like this:
Btw, it would add clutter and make the interaction more complicated if one had to evoke the menu bar via other means.
The Menu Bar is one of the reasons I switched.
It also adheres to Apple's intention to simplify things.
In 1984 it looked like this:
Btw, it would add clutter and make the interaction more complicated if one had to evoke the menu bar via other means.
The Menu Bar is one of the reasons I switched.
Menu Bar is VERY nice with Photoshop for example. There are hundreds of different things that can't be used without something similar to Menu Bar.
Chrome and MS Office are non-Apple apps that have elected not to follow the Mac methodology. Apple isn't going to adapt Mac OS X to 3rd party app developers. It's up to them to adapt to Mac OS X, if they choose.
It will not happen, as it has been with Mac OS since its inception and when it still was titled System instead of Mac OS.
It also adheres to Apple's intention to simplify things.
In 1984 it looked like this:
That's all good and well, but if you apply the same logic, it means it will be there for as long as the OS is, which I don't think will happen... everyones touting 10.7 to have multitouch, so the menubar presumably wouldn't work with that model? Also I thought Apple was a company that looked into the future, presumably a nearly 30 year old UI is not the most practical in the moden age.
It may well be, but, with Windows, it's just appears at the top, not taking up any extra room, just a slightly different implementation, however if you look at Google Chrome, the Menu Bar doesn't need to be there, the top bit is self contained... and on a 13" screen, every pixel is valuable - even IE9 lets the page shine through, with OS X you have the menu bar, and the dock (yes, I know you can send to back, but then it isn't as easily accessible as it always seems to hang before it shows), which is probably double what the taskbar in Windows is ...
And anyway, it has to be said, that digging around a menu, I don't think, is actually all that simple, whereas icons etc are much better, especially in something like mail, where things life Font are in a completely separate windows, when it could just be a drop down box in the actual top bar (the white plastic theme bit, I think it's called), which at the best of times, is taller than it needs to be, and empty (and yes, I know it can be minimised, but then it's even more clicks before you can do anything productive), anyway just my opinion...
I'm very much aware of that, as I pointed out in the original post, but I was using them as references, and with Chrome, you can't exactly get much cleaner, can you?
While I agree on some points with you, I doubt that Mac OS X 10.7 will be full multi touch, thus the menu bar is there to stay, at least for the life time of Mac OS X. Multi touch is still in its infancy and can't be easily applied to desktop or notebook computers, as the strain of touching the screen all the time is bringing us the term "gorilla arm" and the accuracy of a finger is less than of a mouse pointer. Trackpads are a way, but they are less accurate too, and there are still many people out there who use a computer for other things than www and its companions, thus accuracy, which also leads to quicker handling, is still needed.
Anyway, as losing the Menu Bar would be quite a paradigm shift for Apple, it will not happen for Mac OS X 10.7, especially since only some applications do it and violate the Apple Human Interface Guidelines.
Btw, there is always www.apple.com/feedback .
Have you seen iTunes 10, I'm pretty sure that breaches their own guidelines?
iTunes is a good and bad example, I give you that. The Menu Bar is more important though. We'll see next week, if there is a preview of Mac OS X 10.7 and if they lose the Menu Bar and go all touchy, I will stay with Mac OS X 10.6 as long as I can until the Menu Bar is back.
I would agree that Apple won't be removing it in 10.7. OS X relies on the principle that an application can run in the background and not have a window open. That's one of the main reasons for the menubar currently.
I suppose, but to be fair, everyone hates change, but sometimes change is the way forward, if it's really going to be a "major" update, I would expect to see some UI changes, which, if theiy're going to keep the same general look, probably would be hard to achieve, seen as it's, as far as I can, pretty refined as is - although I can't say that the overall greyness is my cup of tea... or the silly blue buttons/scroll bars which looks embarrassingly old fashioned and ugly.
Have you seen iTunes 10, I'm pretty sure that breaches their own guidelines?
Apple sets the guidelines and they themselves then disregard those same guidelines.
I don't see anything happening to the menubar, that type of change would be too disruptive to everyone who wrote a OSX program and way too disruptive to the vast majority of Mac users.
While I do believe apple will be adding multitouch into 10.7 and I also believe this will be the last version of OSX (as it will be called iOS desktop or something like that), we are all just speculating on what it may or may not be.
That it doesn't need the menu bar, as it has all it's functions built into the app itself.
WTH? That's a completely different issue. I wasn't talking about the Dock at all. The dock can be rightfully criticized. So what? You think because I defend one of Apple's UI decisions, I must automatically agree with all of them? Back to what this thread is about (the menu bar):
http://www.asktog.com/basics/firstPrinciples.html#fittsLaw said:
Indeed it is - which is why they moved the menu bar to the top of the screen in the first place
That was the most incomprehensible article I've ever read. Not to mention it's over 6 years old.
To be fair, as far as I can tell, it doesn't seem to have changed in the last 6 years
Also the silly green button that does nothing useful? That, in my opinion should go too. It seems to need to be clicked everytime you go to a new page in Safari to get it to the "right" size, just make it maximise, please?
Everyone someone comes from Windows, they always have the same complaints/suggestions. Getting rid of the menu bar in favor of window-specific contextual menus is not an improvement or a space saver, it's just to make it work like Windows users are used to. The green button is not a maximize button, but resize-to-fit. It resizes the size of your window to fit it's contents.
Pretty much everyone comes from Windows though, plus it doe save space, look at Google Chrome on Windows, now on a Mac, I bet you can see more Website on Windows. Also, if you are browsing, say 50 sites per hour, that means you have to click that retched button 50 times to "resize-to-fit" when in reality, all you want if to see the page, and if you go from a thin page, to a really wide page, to an even wider page, it's not much good, is it?
Nailed it. In Windows if you want to leave an app running it needs a system icon.
You can have Mail running and polling without an open Window. Safari can be downloading without open Windows. Spotify can be playing music without any Windows open. It's useful.
To be fair, as far as I can tell, it doesn't seem to have changed in the last 6 years
Also the silly green button that does nothing useful? That, in my opinion should go too. It seems to need to be clicked everytime you go to a new page in Safari to get it to the "right" size, just make it maximise, please?
The button doesn't need to go away so much as Apple needs to implement it correctly. The fact that OS X does not have a working 'maximize' button is stupid. I shouldn't have to install a third party utility to get that functionality. It's one of my biggest qualms with the OS.