OSX is becoming IOS Pro

Discussion in 'Mac OS X Lion (10.7)' started by jim2008, Jul 9, 2011.

  1. jim2008 macrumors newbie

    Apr 4, 2008
    Apple is making OSX more like ios, the OSX Lion is not there yet, but the trend is obvious.

    Don't get me wrong, I like ios, it's simple and fast, it works for iPhone or iPad as a light weight OS. But for OSX, as a desktop OS, I have different expectations. I expect some fundamental technology improvement at operating system level, like better memory management, power management, and a better file system like ZFS to replace outdated HFS+, some people say what's wrong with HFS+, I can tell you, no file system should require Disk Permissions Repair like HFS+ does. Instead, Apple is more focusing on application level which is supposed to be third party's job.

    OSX used to be simple and elegant, but Lion becomes somehow fancy, look at leather theme of ical and address book, they look awful and I hate it, they are more vista like. Maybe the head of OSX team came from IOS department, and he will turn OSX to a IOS Pro in the future just like they did with final cut X.
  2. Hellhammer Moderator


    Staff Member

    Dec 10, 2008
    So how is HFS+ preventing you from completing your tasks? Or the memory management? Or power management? It's easy to say from a user's standpoint that Apple should do this and this and not that. For most people, these three things you mentioned won't make a difference at all.

    In fact, a new file system would most likely cause more harm than good because it would prevent people from doing upgrade installs (you need to reformat the whole partition to change the format). Would you see that as a user-friendly approach? I can only imagine the amount of threads about "I LOST ALL MY DATA **** YOU APPLE!!!!".

    Also, do you know for sure that Apple has done nothing to memory and power management? Or maybe I should rephrase my question, what exactly is wrong with them? It's again easy to say that this and this should be better because I want 20-hour battery life and my 512MB of RAM to be sufficient.
  3. andalusia macrumors 68030


    Apr 10, 2009
    Manchester, UK
    I'm sure that once you start using Lion you'll end up liking it. Most people find it easy to bitch about things they have no experience of but try it first, then tell us how you feel. (don't start a whole new thread next time though...)
  4. stewacide macrumors regular

    Jan 6, 2002
  5. tkermit macrumors 68040


    Feb 20, 2004
    What do you mean? Permissions repair is generally used by most people only as a placebo. It's almost never really necessary.
  6. stefan1975 macrumors 6502a

    Apr 15, 2010
    hfs+ is really quite dated, they should have pursued in their implementation of ZFS, which is a brilliant fs, reminds me even of AdvFS. If they didn't start using it because of licensing (which would be a lame excuse since they are the richest company in the world) they should have tested with btrfs, but at least pursue progress here like in the linux world. EXT4 and BTRFS are really good, fast and robust filesystems.
  7. Draeconis macrumors 6502a

    May 6, 2008
    And in Lion, repairing permissions actually repairs permissions, which they broke with the introduction of 10.5.
  8. Cougarcat macrumors 604

    Sep 19, 2003
    There were licensing issues with ZFS. I think there was a rumor a while back that they decided to make their own, but it'll take time.
  9. Saladinos macrumors 68000


    Feb 26, 2008
    Essentially OSX is becoming iOS Pro, in the same way Macs (e.g. the new MBAs) are becoming like Pro iPads with keyboards and such. I don't think that's a problem, though. Touch interaction is a big step forward for human-computer interaction, and Apple are way ahead of the competition both in building new touch-only OSes like iOS, but also adapting their existing platforms in meaningful ways to benefit from touch (that's where Lion comes in as a first real step).

    There's a lot of technologies like resuming state that could be brilliant at conserving memory that come from iOS, but that make total sense in a more laptop-oriented industry as well (as the PC market has been for some years). Push notifications are also a big addition for the PC OS, as is the tight integration of the versioning system and iCloud data storage that is going to come with Lion (these are not just apps - they are baked right in to the platform SDK. They are as much a feature of OSX as the networking system or graphics frameworks).

    I like Lion. It brings some great new features to the table and helps my workflow a lot with some great concepts from iOS. OSX is going to see more changes over the years, but this is a good first step.

    Also, don't say Apple is forgetting about the technological basis of OSX: It's now totally 64-bit. Most Macs now are using 64-bit software, and they probably never even noticed they switched. Can you say the same for Windows?
  10. santaliqueur macrumors 6502a

    Aug 7, 2007
    xxx is becoming yyyPro.

    These kinds of arguments are quickly becoming tiresome. Get used to change, because there's nothing you can do to resist it.
  11. jeanRick macrumors newbie

    Apr 29, 2011
    I'm really not sure why people are freaking out so much about this. Do they really expect Apple to switch and start developing their OS kernels and stuff with iPads or something?! Mac OS in some form will be always be needed for the heavy lifting and low level stuff. Sure Lion adds some new gestures and what not, but that's far from the entirety of the upgrade as most of the complainers seem to think.
  12. Cinder6 macrumors 6502


    Jul 9, 2009
    Things like iOS:
    Optional Mac App Store
    Optional Launchpad overlay
    Scrolling (partly optional)

    If you really want to start stretching it, you can include the (optional) full-screen apps. And that would be a big stretch, considering just about every OS ever has had full-screen apps long before iOS was even an idea.

    Things unlike iOS:
    Everything else

    Seriously, here is what needs to happen before you can say OS X is becoming iOS. If it reverts to cooperative multitasking, forces full-screen apps, hides the filesystem completely, disallows installs outside of the App Store, or sandboxes processes and files on a per-app basis, then you have a case.

    Those are fundamental changes that need to happen in order for the naysayers to be correct. If any of those things come come to pass, then I'll be the first one complaining. But all of the changes in Lion to "iOSify" it are either purely cosmetic (hidden scrollbars), purely optional (Launchpad, App Store), or reversible (scrolling direction).

    tl;dr Think for yourself instead of blindly repeating the drivel you hear other people saying.
  13. MaartenG macrumors newbie

    Jul 14, 2011
    Apple is getting rid off the filesystem. I believe they will further fusion iOS and OSX and make it available on an "pro" iPad.
  14. nutmac macrumors 68040

    Mar 30, 2004
    It's more accurate to say Lion represents one of the first steps toward increased convergence between two platforms (the very first step is probably Mac App Store introduced on 10.6.6).

    If you take a look at the history of iOS, it originally started as a stripped down version of [Mac] OS X, with minified UI and touch API thrown in. Since then, it has received many of OS X's more advanced features while adding features of its own.

    So why shouldn't OS X gain features from iOS fork as well? Granted, certain iOS-esque Lion features are questionable (e.g., Launchpad, iPad-like Address Book and iCal UI), but it also gains some that add true values for most users (e.g., iPad-like Mail UI, full-screen mode, app resume with auto save).
  15. Soliber macrumors regular

    Nov 6, 2009
    I must confess: the first thing I thought when I saw the title of this thread was: "not again".
    I sincerely hope this meme of "OS X is turning into iOS" dies down asap. Half of this forum has probably already offered a rebuttal by now in the various threads, and still new people pop up claiming the same thing -_-
  16. akm3 macrumors 68020

    Nov 15, 2007
    I think for the average user, iCloud and the Mac App Store means they will never have to THINK about the file system, which is almost the same as getting rid of it. But like the Terminal (again which average users probably don't even know it exists) just because you don't have to think about it doesn't mean it isn't there if you want it.
  17. jeanRick macrumors newbie

    Apr 29, 2011
    Exactly! The file system exists, and has to exist for the whole thing to work. It just will not be necessary for the average Joes to poke around in it to get work done. Sure over time it will get hidden more and more, but I think it will accessible to those who need it, just like the UNIX backend (though hidden) is.
  18. stewacide macrumors regular

    Jan 6, 2002
    IMHO far and away the scariest thing about Lion is the App Store. As things stand it's totally optional, and not very pervasive (e.g. I can still get into app bundles and the like, and the apps aren't crippled or sandboxed), but it's entirely possible in the future they will try to lock things down. God help us if we ever have to jailbreak our Macs :eek:
  19. *LTD* macrumors G4


    Feb 5, 2009
    Strange, Photoshop bloatware still runs on this "iOS Pro" you speak of.

    It's just easier and more enjoyable to get to this time around.
  20. santaliqueur macrumors 6502a

    Aug 7, 2007
    It's so scary, they decided to make it...TOTALLY OPTIONAL!!

    Don't walk into the dark room, the monster may eat you. Or you can politely ask him not to and he will respect your wishes!
  21. maflynn Moderator


    Staff Member

    May 3, 2009
    Actually HFS+ lacks the features found in EXT4

  22. Darien Red Sox macrumors regular

    Dec 13, 2010
    CT, USA
    For those of us who are long time Mac users Apple had an add on, around system 7.5 to right around before OS X came out, called At Ease which could hide the file system for some users. Very innovative and almost iOS like, I am sure system admins loved how easy it made it to lock everything down. This is not at all a new feature to the OS but rather giving us part of something back they took out a long time ago.
  23. nuckinfutz macrumors 603


    Jul 3, 2002
    Middle Earth
    If someone is prepared to say that Apple hasn't put in work to improve Mac OS based product and iOS based devices then please articulate how?

    Lion makes some nice steps forward.

    Memory Management - LLVM with ARC helps


    ZFS wasn't necessary as Apple's Enterprise ambitions just aren't there. We've got the differentials (delta updates), encryption (FileVault 2) and more without having to replace the fs yet.

    Lion has a modern AV API as well which is finally ready to assume the mantle (replacing Quicktime for the modern stuff)

    What's important to realize is that Mac OS X and iOS will NEVER merge. There is clear distinction between UIkit programs and Appkit programs. Note how Apple doesn't allow or likely even want you to run iOS apps on a Mac?
  24. torbjoern macrumors 65816


    Jun 9, 2009
    The Black Lodge
  25. GimmeSlack12 macrumors 603


    Apr 29, 2005
    San Francisco
    I'd prefer the whole "Lion is Apple's Vista" crap would go away. Just because things 'look' different does not a Vista they make. Lion works fine, Vista did not, Lion has changed a few things*, Vista broke a lot of things.

    *Please give me back Spaces and Exposé how they used to be!

    What are you showing exactly?

    I remember At Ease. I remember realizing that you could install whatever you want onto any machine if you used a floppy with an installer on it. You could also open any file from the hard drive once you were in a separate program (i.e. ClarisWorks). Thus I installed a keylogger into my high school's network computer and within a day had the password to the Library computers. Ahhh those were the days.

    I'm sure Admins hated that crap!

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