nuckinfutz
macrumors 603
Same people said Vista was going to destroy OS X ...then it became Windows 7 and now it's Windows 8.
LOL.
Apple is ahead of Microsoft in every area they "want" to be.
OSX Lion not worth it, not impressed, nothing new
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Same people said Vista was going to destroy OS X ...then it became Windows 7 and now it's Windows 8.
LOL.
Apple is ahead of Microsoft in every area they "want" to be.
Fraaaa
macrumors 65816
Sorry can you just explaining the enforce part better for me please?
soloer
macrumors 6502a
It means even though Snow Leopard was sold as an upgrade, you could install it as a full version and it didn't check to see if Leopard was already installed.
ajvizzgamer101
macrumors 65816
Personally, I like Lion. The OS is overall cleaner and has small changes that just make it work overall better. With that said, 100+ dollars would have been to much though. I believe Apple priced it right.
Misplaced criticism
Actually, the fail is on the developers who can't get off their butts to update their fracking software to work on a modern OS without NEEDING Rosetta (They've had over 5 years now to do so). Go ahead and switch to Windows 8, but you'll have buy all new software (not just upgrade your current stuff)... if you think Microsoft is going to do a better job of supporting old software titles (their own or 3rd party), guess again. Even Windows 7 can't run some stuff that ran on XP. I'm sure Windows 8 will be even less backwards compatible.
But switch or stay, have fun with what ever you do get.
Actually, the fail is on the developers who can't get off their butts to update their fracking software to work on a modern OS without NEEDING Rosetta (They've had over 5 years now to do so). Go ahead and switch to Windows 8, but you'll have buy all new software (not just upgrade your current stuff)... if you think Microsoft is going to do a better job of supporting old software titles (their own or 3rd party), guess again. Even Windows 7 can't run some stuff that ran on XP. I'm sure Windows 8 will be even less backwards compatible.
But switch or stay, have fun with what ever you do get.
waydabber
macrumors 6502
I've been using Lion since DP1 as my main OS on my iMac and Air as a developer. I had some hard times with the betas, but DP4 is very usable now. There are several minor improvements all over the OS which makes the overall Lion experience much better than Snow Leopard. Now whenever I use a SL machine, it just feels rough and unpolished compared to Lion. I like visible stuff like the new mail, ical, address book apps, but what I really appreciate are the under the hood changes like the full disk encryption for my Air or the new low power mode which enables to charge my iPhone with the iMac even when it is sleeping, and stuff like that. So IMHO it's a great upgrade for $30. I'd pay $30 for a seamless full disk encryption software only, but I get that and many more.
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roadbloc
macrumors G3
I think you'll find that Windows has the majority market share. It already has destroyed OS X, it did it years before OS X was made.
Only thing I disagree here is the "undoubtedly" part. I remember having a conversation with a rather angry individual about Operating Systems. I was telling him about the Mac OS and he was very angrily telling me of how "Longhorn" was going to leave everything else in the dust. Comparing upcoming software with current or to a very-soon-to-be-released software is silly and plainly unfair.
Microsoft uses this all the time, though. They use the anticipation to build up expectations and keep people from going with the alternative. By the time the real product rolls around it isn't quite what everybody expected, and the competition probably has an even better product by then, but now everybody's been waiting all this time and already committed to the M$ product.
I will agree with the poster that Lion is not an earth-shattering in some respects and some people will not think it worth the upgrade. The anger against him for saying so is really ridiculous.
Apple touting full screen is a little hilarious. Pressing F11 will toggle full screen in Linux the way it always has. I mean, this is an ancient feature. Same goes for resizing from any corner. Reminds me of when Apple *finally* added a "Window" menu and a proportional scroll bar. I don't understand why they held out so long. iOS users have no idea how lucky they are to get copy and paste so soon.
That said, even though they are new only to the Mac, they are little features that are worthwhile, especially for $30. I have been wanting a system-wide full screen for some time now and things like versions, while not "new" ideas are indeed great features. An upgrade to Mail.app will be welcome. Software is not just about ideas. It is about actually taking the time to implement, test and debug them. And then there are features that are more novel as well. Airdrop reminds me a little of Sugar's ad-hoc networking visualization, though the former is obviously more focused in function.
maflynn
macrumors Haswell
Why would windows need to destroy OSX when they had the marketshare already? Windows 7 and 10.6 are on par with each other and using either one is a personal preference. To be fair the rumored win8 updates appear to be significant but are only rumored at this point, so its unfair to compare 10.7 where we have a released feature set and win8 where we don't
smallnshort247
macrumors 6502a
After reading what everyone said, I'm kind of scared to voice my opinion. Anyway, I see both peoples points. After watching some demo videos of Windows 8, it does look pretty cool. However, I don't see me switching back to Windows. I'll most likely install a copy of it via Bootcamp on my Mac. As for the people saying Lion is nothing new.. "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".. That's how I think of Mac OS X. It usually just gets the job done. Ever since I've been a "hardcore" Mac user, I've gone through two of their OS', Leopard and Snow Leopard. I was highly impressed with both. I like how Snow Leopard just works for me. So since Lion won't be too much different, that's fine by me. I'm happily looking forward to the new features in Lion though.
It does scare me a little that Mac OS X will be mixed with iOS a bit now, but I haven't even used Lion yet, so I think it's a bit too early to panic about what I or we don't like about it. On top of that, it's only 30 bucks! I can see if they were charging more, but I've blown $30 in less useful ways.
It does scare me a little that Mac OS X will be mixed with iOS a bit now, but I haven't even used Lion yet, so I think it's a bit too early to panic about what I or we don't like about it. On top of that, it's only 30 bucks! I can see if they were charging more, but I've blown $30 in less useful ways.
Even before blowing the $30, go in to an Apple store and play with Lion when it's released. Make sure it won't break anything badly for you. Also, remember don't rush to upgrade as you don't know about every app that will break with Lion.
Indeed. £21 (the Lion price across the pond) is basically two small rounds of drinks in London. They're hardly breaking the bank with OS prices anymore, and why should they when they're making so much money from hardware and the App Stores?
haravikk
macrumors 65832
Corrected you there, as you of course realise that Windows sells for over $150 for a full copy or over $100 for an upgrade.
For $30 in Lion you get a slew of features, some of which are nearly worth the price on their own! All of the core usability apps (Finder, Mail, iCal, Safari, Address Book, more?) are new and improved, which is great, as I use these things all the time.
Auto-save and Versions, as well as Pause and Resume for apps are all features that apps can give us today, and yet by building them into the OS Apple is setting a new trend for more usable applications across the board. And this can only be a good thing; they may seem minor but it's this kind of forward thinking that means in a few years time, all of OS X will be better, not just the operating system. Even the improved fullscreen feature, which at first I thought "hang on, don't apps do fullscreen already?" sets a new precedent for richer applications that do more with your screen-space, and allows OS X to actually depart in a way from the old, permanent menu-bar that has served us so well, by hiding it till we need it, just like we've enjoyed with the Dock for so many years.
FileVault 2 I would pay $30 for on its own, in this age of security and paranoia over data theft, why wouldn't I want full-volume encryption that can be performed live on my startup drive? Add in the further improved sand-boxing and other security features and Lion is showing a keen desire to keep up to date on the security issues that threaten modern computer users.
Hell, even a bunch of the other things are big improvements; I hate having to use spaces and Exposé separately when they both perform a very similar task, so Mission Control might seem like a tiny improvement, but for something that I use all the time it is a massive improvement to the way I use my computer day-to-day. So are other seemingly innocuous things like scroll-bars that hide themselves; saving screen-space for what matters, i.e - the things I actually want to do with my computer.
So to be honest; I love the direction of Lion, sure it doesn't have any huge marketable features, it has lots of little ones. And this heap of little features is exactly what I need, an OS that lets me do what I want, and provides me, and the developers of the applications that I use, the tools with which to do it.
jaw04005
macrumors 601
As operating systems age, we tend to get a little nostalgic about the previous changes that came with each update.
In reality, Mac OS X has always had fairly evolutionary OS releases in terms of user features. In fact, Apple has spent a tremendous amount of effort over the years putting marketing spin on developer-centric features like Core Image and Quartz Extreme (or my personal favorite the Pixlet codec --- who ever used that?) to beef up each update's feature list.
There have been a few major OS X releases (like 10.4 Tiger and 10.5 Leopard with the latter being the most ambitious OS X update to date), but the vast majority of OS X updates had three or four new user features and that's it (go back and read the feature list for Puma, Jaguar, Panther and Snow Leopard).
Lion is not the exception in that regard. I do think if Apple would have held off on the App Store and just released it for Lion, it would appear to be a bigger release.
There are a lot of things to like about Lion. However, it seems like a stop gap for the moment between iOS and OS X.
As for Windows 8, yes Microsoft is really trying to change the desktop GUI paradigm. However, by the time it's finally released (they're shooting for 2012 likely a summer RTM so OEMs can get it ready for the 2012 holiday season) Apple will probably have already started discussing 10.8.
In reality, Mac OS X has always had fairly evolutionary OS releases in terms of user features. In fact, Apple has spent a tremendous amount of effort over the years putting marketing spin on developer-centric features like Core Image and Quartz Extreme (or my personal favorite the Pixlet codec --- who ever used that?) to beef up each update's feature list.
There have been a few major OS X releases (like 10.4 Tiger and 10.5 Leopard with the latter being the most ambitious OS X update to date), but the vast majority of OS X updates had three or four new user features and that's it (go back and read the feature list for Puma, Jaguar, Panther and Snow Leopard).
Lion is not the exception in that regard. I do think if Apple would have held off on the App Store and just released it for Lion, it would appear to be a bigger release.
There are a lot of things to like about Lion. However, it seems like a stop gap for the moment between iOS and OS X.
As for Windows 8, yes Microsoft is really trying to change the desktop GUI paradigm. However, by the time it's finally released (they're shooting for 2012 likely a summer RTM so OEMs can get it ready for the 2012 holiday season) Apple will probably have already started discussing 10.8.
it should be cheap, MS spent YEARS with Vista(Longhorn), and it was crap. Vista was expensive and not even remotely worth it. Then they magically came up with the greatest marketing scheme in history. Lets fix our Vista bugs change the look and feel so no one recognizes it as Vista and call it Windows 7. W7 was still expensive somehow, much more stable and user friendly than Vista but since they screwed everyone it should have been free.
Now they are slapping a screen with some pretty tiles on there with a few more features and it's the most groundbreaking thing since man discovered fire.I have been turned off my MS for years. I used their software since Windows 3.1. Every few releases are a flop like Windows ME, and Vista. I switched to Linux in about 2004 and Mac OSX about a year and a half ago. I have been happy with pretty much everything so far with OSX, and to me Lion looks like it's going to be a winner.
I personally like Lion quite a bit more than Snow Leopard. No one is forcing you to upgrade, but honestly, for $30 it would be ignorant not to.
rmbrown09
macrumors 6502a
Losing Rosetta.. that'll stop a lot of people. And piss off the rest that don't know what Rosetta is or why their programs won't run.
Lion should have a huge warning label on the front.
FroMann
macrumors 6502
What important apps use Rosetta? I recently switched to a Mac and have downloaded a few other apps like VLC, Gimp, Chrome, Steam, Dropbox, Caffeine, iMousefixit, OnyX, AppCleaner, etc. None of which require Rosetta.
I think the only piece of software I was going to use that requires Rosetta was Unreal Tournament 2004, which I can play on Windows.
I think the only piece of software I was going to use that requires Rosetta was Unreal Tournament 2004, which I can play on Windows.
Which should read:
"Caution: may enable the industry to move forward by ditching ye old legacy crap. Shake your fist and frown if this upsets you."
If you recently switched, that would explain it. Apps written 2005 and earlier need Rosetta unless they have been updated with intel support. Games are rarely maintained long after release, so that's one of the biggest losses. Quicken, Freehand, and older Adobe CS releases are also important to many people.
Mackilroy
macrumors 601
How many people have switched to Macs since 2005 though? I would daresay a larger number than people who have been long-term Mac users and have pre-Intel software that needs Rosetta. And even then not every one of the latter has an issue – I've been using Macs from 1995 but I haven't touched Rosetta since perhaps 2009.
I think if you really need Rosetta, you should either stick with Snow Leopard, find alternative software that doesn't require it, or petition Apple to make it a part of Lion (though the last is unlikely to work).
roadbloc
macrumors G3
The first OS X was exactly the same. Always the same when you're pretty much starting from scratch with an OS.
well, here are my thoughts on lion
.
i can understand why apple did what they did. there are far more ios users out there than os x users and by bringing some of ios'eses features over to mac os x they make a possible transition of a windows user with an i-device a much more pleasant experience. as long as i can turn some of that ios features off, fine by me
but, i expected to see an improved finder. it would be really nice to have tabbed finder windows. another feature i miss and would come really handy especially on small screens are things like aero snap or window previous. i know there are 3rd party apps that do things like that, but it would be nice if they were integrated into the os.
one other thing i miss is the customization of how lion looks. don't get me wrong, i think the aqua interface looks pretty nice, but after seeing for three years the same gray windows and blue folders, i got a bit tired of that. it would be nice if apple gave us 3-4 themes to choose from or, even better, give us a theme manager and let the people create some nice themes, which you can then download and apply. there are many creative people working on the mac platform and i'm pretty sure some really good things would come out of this.
these are just small things, which would have a huge impact at least i think they would.
i can understand why apple did what they did. there are far more ios users out there than os x users and by bringing some of ios'eses features over to mac os x they make a possible transition of a windows user with an i-device a much more pleasant experience. as long as i can turn some of that ios features off, fine by me
but, i expected to see an improved finder. it would be really nice to have tabbed finder windows. another feature i miss and would come really handy especially on small screens are things like aero snap or window previous. i know there are 3rd party apps that do things like that, but it would be nice if they were integrated into the os.
one other thing i miss is the customization of how lion looks. don't get me wrong, i think the aqua interface looks pretty nice, but after seeing for three years the same gray windows and blue folders, i got a bit tired of that. it would be nice if apple gave us 3-4 themes to choose from or, even better, give us a theme manager and let the people create some nice themes, which you can then download and apply. there are many creative people working on the mac platform and i'm pretty sure some really good things would come out of this.
these are just small things, which would have a huge impact at least i think they would.