Out of the Box - New 16" NOT Clean Install of Catalina?

[Nacho98]

My understanding has always been that a brand new computer out of the box contains a truly clean install of its OS (meaning, you don't need to make a boot USB stick and reinstall the OS from the USB stick like a typical clean install when you are upgrading or reformatting).

However I saw someone here in a thread refer to the 16" MBPs as having some sort of "forked" version of Catalina and it NOT being a true clean install from the factory?

Is it a true clean install from the factory or are we going to need to do a boot drive USB stick clean install on a brand new machine?

 

[mcvaughan]

Wasn't my experience. Not sure though.

 

[DeltaMac]

As with most new hardware, the macOS system that the "16" ships, is a "clean install from the factory". But, because the hardware is different (newer) than any other Mac, the system build number will be different. It's a slightly different build to support that hardware. That doesn't make that version any less "clean", just not a build that will install on any other Mac. The differences will go away as Apple continues to update the system used on other Macs, with the hardware changes included in the standard install, perhaps as soon as 10.15.2

 

[Jack Neill]

My understanding has always been that a brand new computer out of the box contains a truly clean install of its OS (meaning, you don't need to make a boot USB stick and reinstall the OS from the USB stick like a typical clean install when you are upgrading or reformatting).

However I saw someone here in a thread refer to the 16" MBPs as having some sort of "forked" version of Catalina and it NOT being a true clean install from the factory?

Is it a true clean install from the factory or are we going to need to do a boot drive USB stick clean install on a brand new machine?

Huh?

 

[chrfr]

My understanding has always been that a brand new computer out of the box contains a truly clean install of its OS (meaning, you don't need to make a boot USB stick and reinstall the OS from the USB stick like a typical clean install when you are upgrading or reformatting).

However I saw someone here in a thread refer to the 16" MBPs as having some sort of "forked" version of Catalina and it NOT being a true clean install from the factory?

Is it a true clean install from the factory or are we going to need to do a boot drive USB stick clean install on a brand new machine?

The term ”forked” just means that the 16” requires a special build of 10.15.1 because it’s a new model; it has nothing to do with it being a “clean install.” You don’t need to reinstall the OS when the computer arrives.

 

[Nacho98]

Great thanks everyone.

 

[justinf77]

I usually do a clean install because I don’t like all the space wasted by apps like GarageBand which I never use. To me, that’s not a clean install, so I always boot to recovery, format the disk, and reinstall the OS.

 

[WickedPorter]

I do a clean install on every new Mac I get ... for this one, I booted it up for the first time with the factory image, updated it to ensure the pre-boot was up to date, then booted in to recovery, wiped the drive with Disk Utility, and re-installed Catalina. So far so good/everything working well.

 

[nobackup]

I do a clean install on every new Mac I get ... for this one, I booted it up for the first time with the factory image, updated it to ensure the pre-boot was up to date, then booted in to recovery, wiped the drive with Disk Utility, and re-installed Catalina. So far so good/everything working well.

Why ? as you end up at the same point ?? just curious if i missed something

 

[WickedPorter]

Why ? as you end up at the same point ?? just curious if i missed something

It’s probably not necessary... nor should it be necessary. I do it for my own peace of mind.

 

[Nacho98]

I usually do a clean install because I don’t like all the space wasted by apps like GarageBand which I never use. To me, that’s not a clean install, so I always boot to recovery, format the disk, and reinstall the OS.

How do you delete those system apps when doing a clean install? Wouldn't a clean install just get you right back to the same place with those apps?

 

[DeltaMac]

No...
Although it comes with the "factory load" on a new Mac --- Garageband is not part of a basic (clean) system install, and it, along with others like Pages or iMovie, will not be installed unless you choose to do so after logging in to your Apple ID account.
That is also one of the reasons that I choose to format and install, even on a brand-new, out-of-the-box Mac.

(It's not as one-step simple now, with the T2 chip. You have to remember to turn off the boot security settings before you erase the boot drive on that new 16-inch MBPro.

 

[Isamilis]

Always clean install when I want major upgrade of the os. I did this to my iPad and iPhone as well. Otherwise, I just stick with the provided os and do minor update (if any).

 

[tskwara]

I was the original poster about my steps for doing a clean install of the forked OS. In retrospect there's no practical benefit in doing so at this time, given the special 'forked' version of the OS. Per earlier post in this thread, this OS variant is short lived, and goes away once the next OS version is widely available (10.15.2).

As for my original reason for doing so in the first place, I didn't want to have GarageBand or iWork apps installed, and didn't want to sift through and remove their residual support files after deletion. The only way to not have these apps installed in the first place is to do a clean install from flash - those apps are not part of the OS install.

 

[Nacho98]

I was the original poster about my steps for doing a clean install of the forked OS. In retrospect there's no practical benefit in doing so at this time, given the special 'forked' version of the OS. Per earlier post in this thread, this OS variant is short lived, and goes away once the next OS version is widely available (10.15.2).

As for my original reason for doing so in the first place, I didn't want to have GarageBand or iWork apps installed, and didn't want to sift through and remove their residual support files after deletion. The only way to not have these apps installed in the first place is to do a clean install from flash - those apps are not part of the OS install.

I received my 16" today...why would the fact the 16" runs a forked OS for right now negate the benefits of doing the clean install now? Looking at your old post about it, you said you still were able to get rid of the junk like Garageband, so why wait until 10.15.2?

I don't plan on doing a clean install at every 10.15.X update, so I guess I don't see the difference in doing a clean install today from USB on 10.15.1 to get rid of the junk and then doing the normal update path to 10.15.2 and beyond once available, vs. waiting until 10.15.2 to do the clean install and then following the same normal update path to 10.15.3 and beyond.

 

[chrfr]

I received my 16" today...so right now I can't even do a clean install from USB until 10.15.2 comes out?

It's by far easiest to do it from internet recovery.

 

[DeltaMac]

No one said you can't do a clean install...
It's just a different build from standard. If you want to make your own installer, it's a simple process to download the correct version with the python script that finds the correct installer.
You can also do that by booting to Internet Recovery, erasing your drive, then installing macOS from the menu screen.
(Don't forget to turn off those T2 boot security settings before you begin. forgetting to do that will mean a quick trip to your local Apple store, as they have the tools to reset your system, if you ignore that little tip.)

 

[mightyjabba]

I do a clean install on every new Mac I get ... for this one, I booted it up for the first time with the factory image, updated it to ensure the pre-boot was up to date, then booted in to recovery, wiped the drive with Disk Utility, and re-installed Catalina. So far so good/everything working well.

This makes no sense to me at all. Best base scenario, you accomplish nothing. And in the worst case you could end up messing something up because you're installing a slightly different system than the one Apple shipped on the computer.

 

[Nacho98]

So I just finished the supplemental update installation.

I have never done clean installs from Internet Recovery, always used a USB stick, but if internet recovery does the exact same thing with less effort and allows me to not have Garage Band, etc., I suppose I'll try to do that this time instead. I'll see if I can find a how to for that.

(Don't forget to turn off those T2 boot security settings before you begin. forgetting to do that will mean a quick trip to your local Apple store, as they have the tools to reset your system, if you ignore that little tip.)

Where are the T2 boot security settings?

EDIT: Found a how to on Apple Insider.

So I guess to be sure, to do a clean install there are two steps:

1) Turn off T2 boot security settings
2) Use either the USB stick method, or the Internet Recovery method to do a clean install without the junk

 

[Mr. Dee]

I remember when the Power Mac G5 required a special 10.2.8 release back in 2003. This was the same month Panther was released too.

I believe there have been subsequent releases since like 10.4.4 for Intel Macs.

 

[DeltaMac]

The only reason that I always wipe/reinstall a brand new, out-of-the-box Mac, is the (mostly illogical, slightly OCD) history that I have had with Macs. I have had two, over the years, that had faulty installs, new from Apple. Granted, this was years ago (about 1996, or thereabouts), and pre-OSX, of course. But, it still makes sense, in my own mind, to continue with my own idea that I might get one of those bad installs, and wipe/install makes me feel better. I will NOT try to convince anyone else that is a good plan. It's simply something that I do with new Macs. No one can convince me otherwise, and I understand a similar response in someone else.

The boot security settings are in the Utilities menu when you boot to your recovery system. (Restart, holding Command-R)

 

[chrfr]

I remember when the Power Mac G5 required a special 10.2.8 release back in 2003. This was the same month Panther was released too.

I believe there have been subsequent releases since like 10.4.4 for Intel Macs.

There have been machine specific builds for macOS since the very beginning.

 

[Fravin]

So I guess to be sure, to do a clean install there are two steps:

1) Turn off T2 boot security settings
2) Use either the USB stick method, or the Internet Recovery method to do a clean install without the junk

You don't need to do this.

Just restart your computer while holding Command+R

Then enter your password, after this you will get the installer screen. Reformat the drive and install MacOS.

T2 equiped Macs won't let you install Catalina from an USB. Not anymore.

 

[DeltaMac]

Huh... Really?
How was I able to do just that (install Catalina from a USB drive) just last week - twice?
You do have to turn off the boot security settings first.

 

[Nacho98]

So is there any pros/cons to using Internet Recovery vs. USB boot drive or is the net result exactly the same? Security settings have now been turned off.