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How does this work if the EULA is posted @ Apple.com. Does this imply that the software company has to force the end user to read the agreement before a transaction takes place?

That is the usual practice when you buy something that comes with a long contract. In fact, the only thing I ever bought that came with a contract that long was a flat. And they did, in fact, read out the entire thing to me.

USUALLY, when I buy something there is no contract involved other than the implicit contract.

Why Apple and Microsoft think that buying software should be more like buying a house than buying a book, I don't know. To me software seems more like a book than like a house.

Or possibly before they enter the store they sit through a EULA keynote presentation?

That's basically what other vendors that sell goods that come with complicated contracts do, yes.

Lately it just seems that ignorance and tolerance are now more important than common sense.

That is true also.

Don't get me wrong; I understand what your saying, it just irks me that it has to be so drawn out.

It irks me too, that's why I am so offended by software companies who have decided to make it so. I never said that software must come with long contracts to read and sign. That was Microsoft's (and other companies') idea.

I find it appropriate for a house, not appropriate for books (where it isn't done) and software (where for some reason there is a long contract involved).

If it was up to me, this matter would be easy.


And again, with that rational... I have never signed a copy of the US Constitution nor have I had a government representative sit down and explain to me copyright laws, therefor I should be exempt. ;-)

If you become a US citizen, you do swear an oath on the constitution, which is, I guess, the equivalent of "signing" it. (For social compacts only the author(s) sign(s) it, everybody else swears oaths.)

If you are born a US citizen, the constitution is not binding to you, because you have not signed it, and you are free to leave the area the constitution claims as its area of legitimacy.

If you stay, the constitution is your law.

A EULA, on the other hand, is a contract, not a constitution or law enacted under the constitution. And I don't see why a EULA should be regarded as "law" like the US constitution rather than like a contract.
 
If you are born a US citizen, the constitution is not binding to you, because you have not signed it, and you are free to leave the area the constitution claims as its area of legitimacy.

If you stay, the constitution is your law.

Need a flat mate? ;-)
 
Yes, I know that, thanx but we're talking about the future. And Mac OSX is the face of Apple computer, see that the image of Macbook Macbook Pro, iMac both have the beautiful Leopard on the screen.

It doesn't really matter what people believe the face of Apple to be.

Apple is not an OS company, they just simply have a better Operating System for the systems they provide. Which, is quite sad considering some organizations are OS only companies, and they are 2nd rate.

Having the marketing material for the software side of their hardware device sounds like normal business practice to me, not acknowledgement that they are an OS company.

Would you rather they had cute little kittens or a pretty princess on the images of Apple's computers?

People want what they can't have...
 
You do realize that this happened about 2 years ago, right? Thousands of people are running Mac OS X via VM Ware illegally on their Windows and Linux boxes as we type.

Yup. Last Friday I installed 10.4.8 under vmWare on my work computer to see if I could do it. My boss thought that was cool and I think he planned to do it on his pc this week. I'm on vacation so I don't know his progress.

How does one change from BIOS to EFI? I don't think it's as simple as 'installing EFI'

I believe there is something you install that is kind of like an EFI emulator.
 
How does one change from BIOS to EFI? I don't think it's as simple as 'installing EFI'

The question I have is why wouldn't it be as easy as flashing the BIOS chip with EFI instead of BIOS? I mean if you can do it for a video card then why is a motherboard any different?
 
30% faster eh?

Most negative comments regarding Mac's always end up being about price... If you can't afford it, then I guess thats really all you got left. Good luck with that.

Besides, I heard that nearly 96% of all statistics are made up.

Hmm, considering I own 6 macs and 2 pc's (1 PC that is running leopard), I should know.

And if you are stupid enough to dispute the fact that desktop processors are indeed FASTER than laptop processors (that iMac's use), then I'd suggest you do some additional research on your own spare time.

My $500 custom built quad core PC running MacOS/Vista dual-boot is MUCH faster than anyone's iMac....period.
 
Yup. I think it's hilarious when people make it sound like running OS X on a non-apple is easy / stable. The only people that believe that are people that haven't tried to do it.

And those who think it's so hard, havent tried it. Continue to wear your blinders. No one really cares.

what in the world is so hard about loading EFI, popping in leopard and installing it? Are you the kind of guy who went to the genuis bar to get your leopard installed? rofl.
 
How does one change from BIOS to EFI? I don't think it's as simple as 'installing EFI'
Its similair to the method Bootcamp uses BIOS even though the motherboard is EFI. It doesnt change your BIOS to EFI, thats impossible, its just a bootloader on the HDD, it never touches the actual BIOS rom. It allows a virtually unmodified copy of OS X to run on a Core 2 Duo PC just like Windows on a Mac. And its very simple to install, you just put the files on a USB stick, boot with the OS X DVD and run a couple short commands in terminal, its Darwin too which is all open source. Its not Apple's EFI with actual functionality like Bootcamp and the bong sound, its a very rudimentary bootloader using Darwin that looks similair to the generic Windows multiboot menu.
 
And those who think it's so hard, havent tried it. Continue to wear your blinders. No one really cares.

what in the world is so hard about loading EFI, popping in leopard and installing it? Are you the kind of guy who went to the genuis bar to get your leopard installed? rofl.

Please feel free to forward me information to the magic that will allow OS X to run on any hardware with full or even almost full functionality. I could make good money with such knowledge.
 
Its similair to the method Bootcamp uses BIOS even though the motherboard is EFI. It doesnt change your BIOS to EFI, thats impossible, its just a bootloader on the HDD, it never touches the actual BIOS rom. It allows a virtually unmodified copy of OS X to run on a Core 2 Duo PC just like Windows on a Mac. And its very simple to install, you just put the files on a USB stick, boot with the OS X DVD and run a couple short commands in terminal, its Darwin too which is all open source. Its not Apple's EFI with actual functionality like Bootcamp and the bong sound, its a very rudimentary bootloader using Darwin that looks similair to the generic Windows multiboot menu.

Exactly. Finally someone who knows something. =)
 
Please feel free to forward me information to the magic that will allow OS X to run on any hardware with full or even almost full functionality. I could make good money with such knowledge.

Why don't you crawl back into your dark hole. Maybe next time you'll think before you start bashing other people's posts without knowing a single thing about it. Now run along.
 
Why don't you crawl back into your dark hole. Maybe next time you'll think before you start bashing other people's posts without knowing a single thing about it. Now run along.

Thank you for the information. You've changed my mind. :rolleyes:
 
That is the usual practice when you buy something that comes with a long contract. In fact, the only thing I ever bought that came with a contract that long was a flat. And they did, in fact, read out the entire thing to me.

USUALLY, when I buy something there is no contract involved other than the implicit contract.

Why Apple and Microsoft think that buying software should be more like buying a house than buying a book, I don't know. To me software seems more like a book than like a house.



That's basically what other vendors that sell goods that come with complicated contracts do, yes.



That is true also.



It irks me too, that's why I am so offended by software companies who have decided to make it so. I never said that software must come with long contracts to read and sign. That was Microsoft's (and other companies') idea.

I find it appropriate for a house, not appropriate for books (where it isn't done) and software (where for some reason there is a long contract involved).

If it was up to me, this matter would be easy.




If you become a US citizen, you do swear an oath on the constitution, which is, I guess, the equivalent of "signing" it. (For social compacts only the author(s) sign(s) it, everybody else swears oaths.)

If you are born a US citizen, the constitution is not binding to you, because you have not signed it, and you are free to leave the area the constitution claims as its area of legitimacy.

If you stay, the constitution is your law.

A EULA, on the other hand, is a contract, not a constitution or law enacted under the constitution. And I don't see why a EULA should be regarded as "law" like the US constitution rather than like a contract.

Your details state you are from Ireland. You are not in a position to be making statements of fact about the US constitution nor do you deserve the position to do so. Once you become an American, you may have that opportunity. Until then, suck another Guiness down and stick to your own politics.
 
Your details state you are from Ireland. You are not in a position to be making statements of fact about the US constitution nor do you deserve the position to do so. Once you become an American, you may have that opportunity. Until then, suck another Guiness down and stick to your own politics.

Just because he's in Ireland means he (or indeed she ;)) automatically know nothing about the US? Maybe he's an American staying in Ireland. You do not know, so kindly shut up.
 
I'm not here to change your mind. Only to point out how stupid your earlier comments were. Job complete and now moving on.

How about pointing out how stupid they are with information rather than name calling? I want to see this magic that makes this happen. Produce it.

Getting OS X to run well on a virtual machine is a whole lot easier than it is on a hodge podge of equipment. By design, the driver support just isn't there. OS X is only designed to run on very specific hardware.

A virtual machine can "virtually" supply that specific hardware. A random $500 dell cannot.

I've seen claim after claim about how easy it is to run OS X on a random PC. I've yet to see any evidence of such claims. It can be done. But it's not easy and it requires very specific equipment, and a lot of patience, and even then it's not fully functional.

But feel free to continue call me names simply because I refuse to believe you just because you say so. It proves your point so well.
 
Just because he's in Ireland means he (or indeed she ;)) automatically know nothing about the US? Maybe he's an American staying in Ireland. You do not know, so kindly shut up.


Do you know? Did you check before commenting? In this country we have free speech, and we left you folks behind long ago.
He's not, I've asked before. So take your own advice and .... have a nice day :D
 
I find it appropriate for a house, not appropriate for books (where it isn't done) and software (where for some reason there is a long contract involved).

If it was up to me, this matter would be easy.




If you become a US citizen, you do swear an oath on the constitution, which is, I guess, the equivalent of "signing" it. (For social compacts only the author(s) sign(s) it, everybody else swears oaths.)

If you are born a US citizen, the constitution is not binding to you, because you have not signed it, and you are free to leave the area the constitution claims as its area of legitimacy.

If you stay, the constitution is your law.

A EULA, on the other hand, is a contract, not a constitution or law enacted under the constitution. And I don't see why a EULA should be regarded as "law" like the US constitution rather than like a contract.

The EULA isn't a "law" -- it's a license to use the product. When you buy a book, you buy the actual physical copy of the book. Only one person can read a book at a given time.

Software, however, is different. And thus the software manufacturers have to come up with a mechanism to ensure that only one person uses a given copy of the software at a given time (unless, of course, the license provides otherwise as in Apple's family packs).

BTW, the US Constitution isn't a "law" per se but rather the delineation of the structure of the government and the enunciation of certain rights guaranteed to Americans. It's more akin to the English Bill of Rights (1689) than to the German Grundgesetz of 1949 even though the Grundgesetz does set up the framework of the Federal Republic. Moreover, the Constitution is indeed binding on people born in the US regardless of their consent -- individuals are guaranteed the same rights (life, liberty, due process of law, etc.) even if said individuals refuse to recognize the authority of the federal government (see the militia movements for example).
 
Your details state you are from Ireland. You are not in a position to be making statements of fact about the US constitution nor do you deserve the position to do so. Once you become an American, you may have that opportunity. Until then, suck another Guiness down and stick to your own politics.

Oh that really made my evening. This statement is so .... "interesting" in so very many different ways. Is there a scoreboard for the most asinine statements to grace MacRumors? This one must surely be a contender.

A good chuckle was had - thank you. :rolleyes:
 
I've seen claim after claim about how easy it is to run OS X on a random PC. I've yet to see any evidence of such claims. It can be done. But it's not easy and it requires very specific equipment, and a lot of patience, and even then it's not fully functional.
Behold the magic of the internet: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5GEZgwh2Eas

Does that look hard to do? It looks pretty similair to isntalling OS X on a real Mac plus a couple extra steps which a monkey could do. Only the weirdest and most obscure motherboards have problems, a lot of boards work without doing anything at all, and some just need some numbers changed in a kext to recognize the ethernet. Boards with an Intel chipset are pretty much guaranteed to work. Whats funny is that it supports dozens more video cards than a real Mac does. Virtual machines are much less compatible and way harder to get working. And yes its 100% functional, there is not a single thing that my Core 2 Duo machine cant do that my mac can, the only difference is that the PC is faster since its overclocked to 3ghz.
 
Behold the magic of the internet: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5GEZgwh2Eas

Does that look hard to do? It looks pretty similair to isntalling OS X on a real Mac plus a couple extra steps which a monkey could do. Only the weirdest and most obscure motherboards have problems, a lot of boards work without doing anything at all, and some just need some numbers changed in a kext to recognize the ethernet. Whats funny is that it supports dozens more video cards than a real Mac does. Virtual machines are much less compatible and way harder to get working.

LOL A youtube video is not proof. Send me links on EXACTLY how to do it. With the binaries needed and all.

And you are dead wrong. A virtual machine is designed to mimic exactly the target hardware. It would be 0 trouble to use a virtual machine designed to "be" a mac.
 
Apple has 100% the right to choose what their software is installed on. They designed it, they built it and therefor they get to define the rules of it's use.

I find the EULA rules attitude by mac users a bit hypocritical. We are talking about virtualization I mean the EULA of Vista says only vista ultimate can be virtualized but we've had numerous threads about virtualizing home premium and the consensus was go ahead uses parallels to run it. Now the shoe is on the other foot and all mac users are saying we have to respect EULA. I'm just confused if we can break microsoft's EULA why can't we break apple's?
 
LOL A youtube video is not proof. Send me links on EXACTLY how to do it. With the binaries needed and all.

And you are dead wrong. A virtual machine is designed to mimic exactly the target hardware. It would be 0 trouble to use a virtual machine designed to "be" a mac.
Arent you a close minded one. How is that not proof? There are several other similair videos on youtube using iATKOS. Theres also BrazilMac, Kalyway, and ToH versions.

If you want to know how to do it then go to this site and look at all the tutorials and threads about people getting it to run on their PC: http://forum.insanelymac.com/

But you probably think that the 148,000 registered members are all part of the conspiracy.

If you want the long complicated procedure then this thread was one of the first solutions to getting Leopard on a PC, it involves patching the actual Leopard DVD on a Mac so it has a bootable file system on a PC: http://forum.osx86scene.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=2008

Virtual machines are garbage, its all emulation and very generic emulation, virtual machines dont emulate real hardware like a Geforce so they dont use good drivers. And emulation is never better than a native install.
 
LOL A youtube video is not proof. Send me links on EXACTLY how to do it. With the binaries needed and all.

And you are dead wrong. A virtual machine is designed to mimic exactly the target hardware. It would be 0 trouble to use a virtual machine designed to "be" a mac.

Alright, salty, if you come to Portland, Oregon, I'll show you how to do it in person. It took me about one hour. (To satisfy the license freaks, I have a 'Family Pack' license, and only have it on three computers. So I have two licenses to 'spare'.) The hour consisted of about 10 minutes of running a single command on an existing Mac to create the customized install DVD, and 40 minutes of what felt like a bone-stock-standard install on the non-EFI machine. To avoid the copyright infringement difficulties with Torrents of the OS X install discs, I used a program (readily available if you search for "OSx86",) that uses no Apple copyrighted or licensed files to modify the file structure of an existing OS X install DVD. It copies your OS X DVD to your own drive, modifies the files necessary, then burns it back to a new DVD.

Since seeing it in person seems to be the only way to convince you, I'm making the offer. And yes, it is a legitimate offer. Let me know by PM when you'll be in Portland, and I'll adjust my schedule to show you.

As for creating a virtual machine that can 'be' a Mac, the problem is that so far, all VM software emulate a BIOS system, and Macs (and by extension OS X,) are EFI-based. So yes, if someone were to re-write their VM to emulate EMI, it would be possible to have it pretend to be a Mac instead of 'generic PC' the way they do now.
 
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