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PC to Mac... now going back! g5 1.6ghz horrible!

Originally posted by me_94501


As for your problems with Apple Tech support, be persistent. I've never had problems with their tech support, but be persistent. Call often and try to talk to someone else. Some tech support guys are more flexible than others. Don't be rude. Be firm with them but don't be a jack@$$ with them on the phone. I'd hate to see you give up on the Mac so soon.
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when applecare works well, my high tech clients on the mac side are happy...and when applecare and apple support are not up to par, i hear about it even though i do not work directly for apple...right now, the support staff are lacking and i hope apple inc can repair their increasingly tarnished image there

apple has never been known to have been very nice to its customers, even when they made the best gear out there...i suppose PC companies who didn't have the initial quality knew that their only hope for survival was an excellent support and warranty staff

dell and microsoft have the best tech help and support

but apple inc makes better computers than dell and have a better operating system through the ages than microsoft does with its incarnations of windows

but on the other hand, i avoid other mac users because, since i first encountered mac users in the mid 80s, i have come across more jerks and zealots than in any group of people and this has been the main reason most PC users don't switch...who wants to use the same computers as those jerks:p

by the way i am a nice person and when many PC people meet me, they comment on how i am not stuck up about using a mac...i am not stuck up since i only use the mac, i didn't invent the darn thing ;)
 
yes..

the football analogy is great however... its more like... the football team looses the first game and after the game.. i talk to the players and they are pointing fingers at each other for the loss and i keep checking back on the team.. and yep... still at it again... and they aren't playing like a team.. how many chances do i give them? like i said.. i'll give the comp a chance.. but the service is on their last life line...

i've been on other macs and they work great! too bad the one i bought for myself isn't one of them... and i would LOVE to try another mac.. tell that to apple and their NO RETURNS/EXCHANGES AFTER 10 DAYS.. even though i started calling in the first week.. so i guess i'm stuck with this machine unless someone can get through to them to help me out... I'm on dud one.. but i don't have 10,000 bucks laying around to partake in the 5 mac test. I'm not trying to throw attitude.. but geez.. 37 documented conversations... 2 repairs... 1 frustrated new mac owner.. btw.. os X.3 is awesome too.. love the f9 and apple tab... but even though i love the os.. if windows works on my pc and doesn't freeze and is 1/2 the cost.. tell me how i should feel.
 
I understand, but I disagree

I can understand why you feel the way you do because it appears as if Apple has failed you twice, first by building a computer that is effectively DOA and then by not solving the problem. In my experience Apple has always been significantly better in dealing with problems than any other computer company, they remain Consumer Reports #1 company ahead of Dell and above the Rogues gallery of HP.
I would suggest you call Apple and ask politely for a new machine, you have 37 entries, the machine is seriously wonked, you need a new one. Don't let them fix it, just ask for a new machine.
I buy equipment for my company and last year we bought two new laptops, a Dell and an iBook, seven desktops and a server. The Dell had a power-supply failure, a bad wireless card, and the display appears to be dimming. The iBook has been dropped from a table, has traveled several thousand miles and is nothing more than a little scratched. The DP G4 we bought has been running smoothly as has all our other desktops from Dell, and our server machine has Red Hat and has been squirelly. So what's my point? Anything can fail, but Apple builds great machines with a great operating system that has worked in all possible instances for us and for me. I've had Apple machines since 1997 has every single machine continues to run even today with aplomb. My PB continues to be my favored son, even though I have a super-fast P4. Why? The PB gets what I need done, quickly, efficiently and works with my printers my camera and my BT phone without driver disks.
I'm sorry Apple has failed you, but I think the experience of a single machine and a few employees should not color your experience entirely. I've had outstanding service, but I also explicitly asked for what I wanted, asked questions and made demands all without raising my voice and saying thank you each and every time. Dell, BTW were impossible to deal with and took two weeks to fix that busted laptop.
 
No Zealots in the PC world?

Originally posted by jefhatfield
when applecare works well, my high tech clients on the mac side are happy...and when applecare and apple support are not up to par, i hear about it even though i do not work directly for apple...right now, the support staff are lacking and i hope apple inc can repair their increasingly tarnished image there

apple has never been known to have been very nice to its customers, even when they made the best gear out there...i suppose PC companies who didn't have the initial quality knew that their only hope for survival was an excellent support and warranty staff

dell and microsoft have the best tech help and support

but apple inc makes better computers than dell and have a better operating system through the ages than microsoft does with its incarnations of windows

but on the other hand, i avoid other mac users because, since i first encountered mac users in the mid 80s, i have come across more jerks and zealots than in any group of people and this has been the main reason most PC users don't switch...who wants to use the same computers as those jerks:p

by the way i am a nice person and when many PC people meet me, they comment on how i am not stuck up about using a mac...i am not stuck up since i only use the mac, i didn't invent the darn thing ;)
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Two things, MS and Dell have been very poor in their customer experience. In my last instance, MS blamed Dell and Dell blamed MS for a weird firmware issue for weeks before it got solved. And Dell, if you can get a hold of a real person, seems to hire some very rude people.
Second, the PC zealotry is just as vicious and uninformed:
I've run into 'Intel or die,' 'Dell is the greatest thing since the wheel,' or my personal favorite and a real quote: "You use a Mac! What are you retarded?" And what about all those MS fanboys who post on Slashdot how all Macs users are homosexuals and Linux users Communists. Very reasoned and well positioned.
Buy a computer because it's what you need, not for some quasi-political-sociological experiment, it's just a tool.
 
That sucks...

I had a similar 6 month struggle with Apple, which turned out to be a bad simm, which my vendor had installed. I eventually just guessed and pulled the simm. I was getting Kernel panics when waking from sleep on a semi-regular basis (that was the simm). The other one was my machine turned itself on and off, that was the cinema display which they fixed.

But a couple of suggestions, which may save you time and headaches.

First: when you take your machine into service, sit with them when they check the machine. Don't go until you can reproduce the errors. If they happen all the time, this isn't a problem, if it is intermittent, as the service shop to keep a log of what they did to check your machine make sure they use it, not just let it sit.

Second: Try and isolate your issues. It is a pain, but it is worth it. Start from a clean machine and no installed software or peripherals. Again, run the machine a try and reproduce the errors, add software and hardware one at a time and try and break it again. If your machine with just OS X no software or peripherals added crashes regularly, you should have no problem showing them it is a hardware problem.

It would be nice if they would just take machines back, but they never will. They fixed my monitor with a ship back, no problem. I fixed my machine by pulling a simm. I just slowed down and double checked everything.

You can read all the crap I went through here.

https://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=39038

https://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=38164

https://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=35137

https://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=27736&lemon

Good luck, sucks to have a lemon, I've been there, but now my machine is crash free and happy.
 
Re: No Zealots in the PC world?

Originally posted by hulugu
Two things, MS and Dell have been very poor in their customer experience. In my last instance, MS blamed Dell and Dell blamed MS for a weird firmware issue for weeks before it got solved. And Dell, if you can get a hold of a real person, seems to hire some very rude people.
Second, the PC zealotry is just as vicious and uninformed:
I've run into 'Intel or die,' 'Dell is the greatest thing since the wheel,' or my personal favorite and a real quote: "You use a Mac! What are you retarded?" And what about all those MS fanboys who post on Slashdot how all Macs users are homosexuals and Linux users Communists. Very reasoned and well positioned.
Buy a computer because it's what you need, not for some quasi-political-sociological experiment, it's just a tool.
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being microsoft certified, on the desktop end, and having been a dell, compaq, and apple warranty tech, i can say with five years in the high tech field, that dell is the top customer service company in the field

apple builds a better machine

dell has better service...heck, maybe they break down more ;)

as for zealots, in the 26 years i have used apple inc gear, and known others who have, there is not a nastier group of people and i refuse to go to the local mac users club...it's all about the past and how bill gates ripped them off of their birthright to rule the computer business, etc...yada yada

most PC users seriously do not care about mac users, or linux users, or users of be os...because they are a non factor
in their eyes...yes, there are PC zealots, but they are increasingly rare and if they were as nasty as the majority of mac users, we would live in a terrible world
:p
 
i am happy that arn has banned very mean people from this website...in the early days there were some very hardcore mac zealots here and they swore up a storm and viciously attacked PC users or mac users who did not think like them

as a singnature, there were several users back then , including mischief and me, who are still here, who called ourselves members of the anti-zealot campaign and we brought a more compassionate way to love macs ...and not hate PCs or PC users

in the end, the site got populated with civilized mac users who are not out to "kill bill"...he he...and as most of us know many other mac sites on the net can suffice a mac zealots appetite for hating PCs and their users...but not here thanks to arn and the moderators...and the feature of being able to report mean posts

a nice and friendly mac user sees that any PC user, including that rare PC zealot, could one day be a mac user

and to you mac zealots out there who want apple inc to win...let the mac speak for itself...we don't need mac users acting like a bunch of idiots at a mob to convince a PC user that os x is better or that macs a built better
 
Re: oh the ie question

Originally posted by dankim723
ie = the most universally use browser in the world hands down... meaning more website are designed to be compatible with ie... meaning less bugs... i'll wait a bit until netscape puts gets their feet back in the game and see.... i guess my answer is i don't trust the african safari hunt browser yet..
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And therefore perpetuate the "one browser web" that locks everyone into MS standards and not the standards laid out by the W3C. Well done.

Netscape is dead, killed by MS. Mozilla is still going strong, and both it and Safari are fine, standards compliant browsers.
 
Originally posted by jefhatfield
but before you can accurately make that statement, you have to have been "there", too

in the last few years, the two have been very close when it comes to value for money

my ibook is tougher, lighter, and has a better battery time

my PC laptop i got at the same month is cheaper, has more software on it that came with it right out of the box, and i have a larger selection of titles to choose from when i go to the computer stores near me...some titles can only be found on PC

objectively, both platforms have their pros and cons and the best way to really know it is to have had several PCs and several macs over several years' time
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well i guess i can say ive bene there. ive serviced so many pc's and macs over the years and be around so many that i can make my choice accuratly.

iJon
 
Originally posted by iJon
well i guess i can say ive bene there. ive serviced so many pc's and macs over the years and be around so many that i can make my choice accuratly.

ijOn
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you have fixed PC boxes so then i know you have been there;)

xp is still definiteley better than win 3.1 or 95a...at least you have to give microsoft that
 
Originally posted by jefhatfield
you have fixed PC boxes so then i know you have been there;)

xp is still definiteley better than win 3.1 or 95a...at least you have to give microsoft that
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yeah i like xp alot, but the only reason i like it is because it doesnt crash, thats where my standards are when it comes to windows, if it doesnt crash its good.

iJon
 
call cupertino, it's worked for us a couple of times when I had problems. Amy Antonelli (sp?), pretty high up in Executive Customer Relations helped us a great deal last time with a bastard authorized repair place that wouldn't honor my apple care.

Those people really go WAY out of their way to help. If you do a little nudging, Apple definitely can have the best customer service of any company out there.
 
Originally posted by iJon
yeah i like xp alot, but the only reason i like it is because it doesnt crash
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I just don't like how crowded it is with the default theme. Yes, you can change the theme but most people like things to work well out of the box
 
Originally posted by iJon
yeah i like xp alot, but the only reason i like it is because it doesnt crash, thats where my standards are when it comes to windows, if it doesnt crash its good.

iJon
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in the last few weeks, here's been the scary part

as a mac and pc tech myself, i am not happy with panther crashing as much as it does and one client of mine had to reinstall panther due to a bug in the way it works with a G5

but i do have hope apple will stabilize panther by 10.3.1 or 10.3.2...at least they better get it right by then

when apple inc was slow with os x development and inplementation, the PC side got to do a lot of catching up these last many months...and being that the PC gear is cheaper and faster, it's not a good sign for apple inc

it's possible that apple's market share will still be below five percent two or three years from now and the PC side may still be faster, cheaper, and have more available software

you can blame it on os x developers, motorola and the slowly evolving G4, steve jobs, the economy, apple's ineffective advertising and marketing, or whatever...but if apple inc had a speed or software advantage in the past a few years ago, it is not there now

as great as steve jobs was bringing apple back from the depths, he is not perfect and he is still just one man...it takes a coordinated effort for apple to be the best and today, it's harder than ever to convince a regular non techie user that a mac is the better machine or better for the money
 
Originally posted by jefhatfield
in the last few weeks, here's been the scary part

as a mac and pc tech myself, i am not happy with panther crashing as much as it does and one client of mine had to reinstall panther due to a bug in the way it works with a G5

but i do have hope apple will stabilize panther by 10.3.1 or 10.3.2...at least they better get it right by then

when apple inc was slow with os x development and inplementation, the PC side got to do a lot of catching up these last many months...and being that the PC gear is cheaper and faster, it's not a good sign for apple inc

it's possible that apple's market share will still be below five percent two or three years from now and the PC side may still be faster, cheaper, and have more available software

you can blame it on os x developers, motorola and the slowly evolving G4, steve jobs, the economy, apple's ineffective advertising and marketing, or whatever...but if apple inc had a speed or software advantage in the past a few years ago, it is not there now

as great as steve jobs was bringing apple back from the depths, he is not perfect and he is still just one man...it takes a coordinated effort for apple to be the best and today, it's harder than ever to convince a regular non techie user that a mac is the better machine or better for the money
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yeah my g5 and panther have been crashing at least 5 times a day. and they are hard crashes, plain lock ups like the old os 9 days. but with my experience with apple i am not mad. i obviously know this is probably a problem with the g5, and not really panther. its just since i have a powerbook as well i have been using it more until i get around to working on the g5. i will probably put jaguar back on there and see how it runs if 10.3.1 doesnt do the trick, and if jaguar crashes it i will diagnose further.

iJon
 
Originally posted by jefhatfield
...
but i do have hope apple will stabilize panther by 10.3.1 or 10.3.2...at least they better get it right by then
...
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From all appearances, 10.3.1 appears to be doing just fine for people so far.

I agree that the issues on 10.3 are inexcusable, especially from my perspective on the testing side. Apple rushed 10.3 for some reason known only to them.

It's too bad that they will have some damage control to do to repair their image after this.
 
Originally posted by iJon
yeah my g5 and panther have been crashing at least 5 times a day. and they are hard crashes, plain lock ups like the old os 9 days. but with my experience with apple i am not mad. i obviously know this is probably a problem with the g5, and not really panther. its just since i have a powerbook as well i have been using it more until i get around to working on the g5. i will probably put jaguar back on there and see how it runs if 10.3.1 doesnt do the trick, and if jaguar crashes it i will diagnose further.

iJon
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i sure hope the issues you have are with panther, then all you would have to do is wait for 10.3.1

but if there is something inherently wrong with the G5's design, then that is truly a bad sign for apple inc...apple very rarely designs a whole line of lemons and if a certain build of a motherboard is not suitable or fully compatible with video cards, optical drives, etc, then they don't release they darn thing

os x development is not as easy as some people may have thought and it's rock solid reputation for not crashing has been tarnished in recent weeks...it's really too bad and it's not a good internal sign of how apple inc is being run

i know the thread starter may be angry at apple for his one incident of getting a lemon, but what hurts apple much more is releasing a new "dot" upgrade and have it be that buggy right out of the box
 
G5 Is an Engineering Nightmare

I don't blame Daniel one bit. trying to deal with Apple Computer from a customer standpoint can still be frustrating. Forget talking to them on the phone. If you don't fit into one of their little scripted cubby holes, then you're placed on permanent hold. Their customer service and warranty policies still stink BIG TIME. I've had better luck going to an Apple store - but they still make you wait a very long time at the "Genius" counter before helping you out.

I won't buy a G5 machine until they get the processor heat issue resolved. From a design standpoint it's ridiculous to have all those fans, and make different aspects of the OS dependent on fan operation. Apple, in it's need to keep up with wintel speeds just threw the KISS (Keep It Simple, Stupid) principle out the window.

I've got an eMac 1ghz machine and it's great - I couldn't be more pleased. When the G5s are reported to work as dependably and simply as the G4 machines, then I'll be happy to upgrade one day.
 
Originally posted by jefhatfield
i sure hope the issues you have are with panther, then all you would have to do is wait for 10.3.1

but if there is something inherently wrong with the G5's design, then that is truly a bad sign for apple inc...apple very rarely designs a whole line of lemons and if a certain build of a motherboard is not suitable or fully compatible with video cards, optical drives, etc, then they don't release they darn thing

os x development is not as easy as some people may have thought and it's rock solid reputation for not crashing has been tarnished in recent weeks...it's really too bad and it's not a good internal sign of how apple inc is being run

i know the thread starter may be angry at apple for his one incident of getting a lemon, but what hurts apple much more is releasing a new "dot" upgrade and have it be that buggy right out of the box
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well i dont think its panther because ive been using panther on my powerbook and all the computers at work, including other g5's and i am the only one who has this problem. i tried to pinpoint to software but that proved useless, each crash was random.

iJon
 
Ok. I know exactly how you feel. I went through this with my refurbished iMac. I was constantly on the phone to apple. Eventually we figured it out, it was a bad mouse and keyboard. Weird. How could something so small cause so many problems? Well, they sent me a new keyboard and mouse for free and it still works great. It was frustrating but they honestly helped as much as they could. I am sorry you are so frustated. It's not apple's fault, probably some little thing somewhere made by someone across the planet. They will fix your problem, have patients.
 
Originally posted by Rower_CPU
You do know that 10.3.1 came out yesterday, right jef?
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a step in the right direction..i hope they stabilize it

i know apple's intentions are good so that is a start...apple usually prides themselves in having a stable operating system, especially since that has not been microsoft's strong point for many years, back in the recent past

as in...he he:

windows 3.1...crashes, and crashes some more

windows 95a and 95b...still crashes, but less so, but no usb support

windows 98 and 98 SE...gets corrupt after time and needs to be reinstalled

windows ME...crashes

windows 2000...initially not compatible with that many PCs when it was released and it had a small hcl (hardware compatibility list)
 
Re: oh the ie question

Originally posted by dankim723
ie = the most universally use browser in the world hands down... meaning more website are designed to be compatible with ie... meaning less bugs... i'll wait a bit until netscape puts gets their feet back in the game and see.... i guess my answer is i don't trust the african safari hunt browser yet..
Click to expand...

no offense dank - but this is the dumbest thing i've ever read (and that's saying a LOT).

furthermore, a lot of your story doesn't add up... i've owned 19 Apple computers over the years, and have never experienced anything remotely like what you are talking about. i've received one "dog" (Titanium laptop that was flickering) - called them up, they sent me a box and i had my replacement in 2 days).

if your computer isn't working - drag it into the Apple Store, set it down on the counter and DEMAND they fix it or swap it. easy as that. they will fix it or swap it - they have no choice.

don't post your whining in the Macrumors discussion board - and don't post your whining on Apple's support site. fricken' call them and DEMAND to have it fixed NOW... why are you wasting time posting in all these forums??? just FIX THE DAMN THING.

sorry for the rant - but all these "i'm switching back" bullsh*t stories are weak.
 
Re: yes..

Originally posted by dankim723
the football analogy is great however... its more like... the football team looses the first game and after the game.. i talk to the players and they are pointing fingers at each other for the loss and i keep checking back on the team.. and yep... still at it again... and they aren't playing like a team.. how many chances do i give them? like i said.. i'll give the comp a chance.. but the service is on their last life line...

i've been on other macs and they work great! too bad the one i bought for myself isn't one of them... and i would LOVE to try another mac.. tell that to apple and their NO RETURNS/EXCHANGES AFTER 10 DAYS.. even though i started calling in the first week.. so i guess i'm stuck with this machine unless someone can get through to them to help me out... I'm on dud one.. but i don't have 10,000 bucks laying around to partake in the 5 mac test. I'm not trying to throw attitude.. but geez.. 37 documented conversations... 2 repairs... 1 frustrated new mac owner.. btw.. os X.3 is awesome too.. love the f9 and apple tab... but even though i love the os.. if windows works on my pc and doesn't freeze and is 1/2 the cost.. tell me how i should feel.
Click to expand...

Your comment on my football analogy reminds be of the Oakland Raiders this year. :)

OK, fair enough. If you feel it's best for you to move back to the PC, feel free and do it. I'd hate to see someone leave the Mac so soon though.
 
Re: Re: oh the ie question

Originally posted by bitfactory


sorry for the rant - but all these "i'm switching back" bullsh*t stories are weak.
Click to expand...

and who are you, god?:p

but if you are not god, are you santa or nostradamus?
 
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