Petrol tops £1 a litre!

[Angelus520]

Public transportation rocks!

A great public transportation system is one of the things I love about Chicago. I pay $75 a month for unlimited rides on the bus or the el and get everywhere I need to go. The only time I drive is on weekends, and that's only because I DJ in the suburbs and have to haul my PA and lights, and new MacBook Pro 2.0 that kicks a**.

Gas is around $3.20/gallon here in the city, though I gassed up in the western suburbs this weekend for $2.91. I remember when I started driving gas was $0.84/gallon and for a while in the mid-'80s it was $0.69/gallon. Those were the days. Now if I could only stuff all my gear in a Prius rather than a Previa I'd be happy.

 

[Stampyhead]

In my opinion it's also time to put some decent tax on aviation fuel. Unbelievable, that there's hardly any tax on it.

Why in the world would we need to tax it more? What are you, a politician? We already have too many taxes.

 

[MacNut]

Why in the world would we need to tax it more? What are you, a politician? We already have too many taxes.

What they should do is tax the bejesus out of Nascar, do they need to go in circles for 500 miles and waste gas.

 

[dops7107]

Why in the world would we need to tax it more? What are you, a politician? We already have too many taxes.

Because, if you hadn't noticed, tax is a disincentive, thus reducing profligate fuel use. Additionally, tax has positive benefits through the redistribution of wealth. Though I also agree with the Nascar/F1 comment ^^

One of the major changes in the coming years that the West will have to get used to is that having unlimited freedom to travel, more or less when and where we want, has a high price.

 

[Lau]

Why in the world would we need to tax it more? What are you, a politician? We already have too many taxes.

Because then they can subsidise more sustainable forms of transport, therefore making train or bus travel a viable option. Case in point, I recently travelled from Bristol to Edinburgh. By train this takes approximately 8 hours, and costs £80 or so. By plane, this took 1 and a half hours, and cost me £60. Guess which one I chose? The plane. Who wouldn't? However, if the train had been £40 and the flight £100, I would have caught the train.

I think the same rationale applies to driving - if petrol is expensive and public transport is cheap (i.e. subsidised by higher taxes on fuel) and reliable, people would be more likely to use it. Unfortunately, as posts above show, there is a long way to go until public transport is at this stage. I can quite see why a lot of people choose (or have) to drive. However, I think this is what we should be concentrating on, not cheaper fuel and flights.

 

[freeny]

$3.29 here in NYC.

 

[MacNut]

The bigger concern is not the high prices but who is pocketing all the profits, Big oil pays the CEOs 400 million, So to say that we are in a shortage and have to spend more for fuel is false. Eventually gas will run out then what are they gonna do charge us 100 bucks for something that doesn't exist. It is all fraud plan and simple, Hurricane Katrina was a nice excuse to jack up the prices and while they profit everyone else suffers.

 

[caveman_uk]

The taxes should be used exclusively for developing sustainable energy alternatives.

And please don't come up with nuclear power... the demand is already double the supply at the moment.

Sadly the choices are what?

1) Burn more coal...it's cheap and we've got 300 years worth of it. Sadly it ****s our Kyoto commitments (not that that matters as the Americans and Chinese will shaft those anyway)

2) Stick a wind turbine on every hill or vaguely attractive remote place in Britain blotting the landscapes generations have sought to preserve

3) More nuclear power stations...dodgy, dangerous and expensive to decommission.

So lesser of three evils. Which do you prefer?

Or of course we could all try and use less...like that's gonna happen....

 

[gekko513]

2) Stick a wind turbine on every hill or vaguely attractive remote place in Britain blotting the landscapes generations have sought to preserve

This is the only reasonable option. People will have to choose between conserving energy and a visual impact on the landscape. There are no other options. Energy isn't free.

 

[FireArse]

Brits vs. Americans

Thing is this. In the UK its our government that hike up the prices of Gas/petrol.

In the States (when you lot are screwing over $3/gallon) your president wants to investigate why the prices are so high? It's no wonder the Brits are leaving 'The Great British Rip-off' country in their hundreds/year.

http://www.thebostonchannel.com/consumer/8979826/detail.html

Don't get me wrong, I love London, I love the city, and I realise me and my car (and other parts of my lifestyle) aren't all that healthy for this 3rd rock from the sun. I make efforts to switch off stuff, to drive economically (my Nissan Primera gets 39MPG through normal day to day driving) and to walk or cycle when i can.

What pisses me off is industry wasting it more and paying less.

With regards to energy, industries have low cpst contracts purely because of the amount they use. You use more, you pay less per unit. Like bulk buying, so does this attitude or strategy support the homeowner or rural family who have to drive their kids to school?

Don't even get me started on airfares. I really think people should travel abroad a lot less. these days with RyanAir and EasyJet, we can pay £30 single to Spain or Portugal. But this really doesn't represent the amount it costs the environment. I really think we need to sit down and look at our lifestyles. Should we be going abroad as often as we are? If so, why dont we get the train?

Bah. Life costs too much. It costs less in America. Like previous posters have said, stuff for £1 you can get for $1. I mean, WTF?! Have you seen the exchange rate recently? We were teetering on $1.80 to the pound. While this is great for when we come over - it feels like we're paying too much for the same things you lot are.



After graduating this summer, I'll start work for Transport for London as an Electrical Engineer. My job will be focused on getting poeple out of their cars. Like others have said, I just wish that the public transport out here is as good as within London - but it costs waaay too much to live in London.....and the cycle goes on and on and on.....

 

[satty]

Why in the world would we need to tax it more? What are you, a politician? We already have too many taxes.

I am not a politician. I would say, I am the opposite of a politician. My friends would say, I am the way a politician should be. I actually work close to the energy business for nearly a decade. You might be surprised: I don't like taxes, too, but sometimes they're unavoidable.

Here some reasons, why energy should be taxed more:

1. Our main energy resources are finite, i.e. oil, natural gas and uranium.
2. Our energy resources are either close to the supply peak or already over it.
3. Our energy consumption is simply unsustainable.
4. Our survival - agriculture - depends on energy supply.
5. Our environment is already severely damaged by high energy consumption.

Therefore it is essential for our own generation and future generation to conserve energy and to find/develop alternative energy sources.

There are two ways to achieve it:

1. People are acting responsibly.
2. People have to be forced to act responsibly.

Unfortunately or better sadly, the first option looks like a joke (just read some comments in this threat). Which leaves only option two: We have to convince the people very hard to conserve energy and we have to prepare the world for the time after the finite energy resources are running out.

Little bit off-topic:
It is interesting to see what people are doing with their freedom(s): Many exploit it nowadays. In my opinion every freedom you get is directly linked with responsibility. So if you don't use your freedom in a responsible way, it should be taken away from you (like freedom of consumption, freedom of speech, freedom to wear a weapon [mainly US]...). It's like you have to treat a small child.

Sadly the choices are what?
...
2) Stick a wind turbine on every hill or vaguely attractive remote place in Britain blotting the landscapes generations have sought to preserve
...
Or of course we could all try and use less...like that's gonna happen....

It will be a combination of the two, including other regenerative energies (solar, water and biological gas). For many/most of people this means good-bye to the life-style they have at the moment in a couple of years time.
I can hear all the people saying: "How am I going to survive this?"
I still can remember the life-style of my grand-parents (about 20 years ago): No car, nearly no public transport, electricity just for the three light bulbs, a radio and a TV (they owned only one TV their whole life and never spent more time than the news in front of it), no supermarket, shops and no other crap you don't need in your life... and they were the happiest and most satisfied people I ever met in my life!



Btw: Thanks for your support, Lau. Some good points, FireArse.

 

[FireArse]

we'll need new transport mechanisms!

For many/most of people this means good-bye to the life-style they have at the moment in a couple of years time.

This statement is so true. I have thought about this recently - and think the sooner I apply pressure to myself by thinking about the consequences of my choices the better.

And by the way it looks, trying to keep from using these 'life essentials' (yeah right....) will save me a lot of money.

Give it a few years time, I'll buy a horse and go to Sainsbury's on that - no road tax, no petrol and no queues! I'l feed it grass and tie it up while I'm inside

Best of all - little / no pollution, with free fertilizer!!

 

[After G]

Well, I'm trying to be more energy-conscious by:

- only driving when necessary (2 days a week)
- turning off items that require electricity when not using them
- letting my Mac sleep, and turn on and off at a preset time each day

But it doesn't help to have a roommate that:

- has four computers with a total of six monitors and leaves them on 24/7
- drives every day to law school which is 3 minutes away from the apartment

Hey, at least I don't need a heater in the winter ...

 

[Eric5h5]

So lesser of three evils. Which do you prefer?.

Nuclear power. Rather less dodgy and dangerous than coal, and has caused far fewer health problems. Still not a great option and also not sustainable...I recommend that someone should discover a workable cold fusion solution.

--Eric

 

[zap2]

That's because the rest of the world luuuurves supporting America's cheap petrol prices.

cheap( compare the rest of the world i know) how much is it in the oil rich nation

Well it help the enviorment, or it should sooner or late

 

[vniow]

americans dont have that luxury of the bulk of its population being able to "commute" by public transportation.

we love our suburbs too much.

This is true. When I lived in the rural Midwest, the only way to get around was by car. No buses, no trains, hell, there were hardly any taxis. There was far more land than people and I guess they liked it that way but it made it awfully incovienent to get around if you didn't have one.

Even in places like the SF bay where I live now public transit is lacking. BART is excellent (I take it to work every day) but the bus system could be improved. While MUNI in SF has a great range where it travels, the experience is not something to have fond memories of. Many of the buses seem ilke they're past the time of decommision and especially if you're travelling a busy route, it takes forever to get where you're going, frustrating to the point where if I'm going somewhere that there's plenty of free parking avaliable, I just drive. The only things I actually like to ride around here are the trains. They're actually tolerable.

I think the greater SF Bay has a decent public transit system overall, its still pretty spread out compared to most European metros so there's only so much you can do but there's certainly room for improvement, particularly on when you're trying to get from one system to another.

Besides, my next big car purchase will be something that supports SVO. I'm tired of the high gas prices and being dependant on oil. I know that prices are much higher elsewhere so I'm not complaining too much but it really starts to add up when you have no choice but to drive in order to get to where you're going.

 

[bigandy]

Only because our dollar is in the tank.

As you know it is dangerous to compare directly like that.

Based on my short visit to London in late February I view the Pound as being equal to the US Dollar in terms of we we lived there. A double burger at McDonalds is 99p in the UK, and 99 cents here in the US. With the job listings I saw seemed to 1 on 1 with what is offered here in the US (meaning that if a job paid 20k pounds, that same job would see 20k US $.

I was impressed by mass transit in London. Even being in what I thought was the core of London (Westminster, Picadilly, and the such). Traffic (cars)seemed to move. Every Underground station I got on or off at had local guides to the buses and where they went.

I stayed at a B&B in Hammersmith-Fuller. I was able to tube any where I wanted. But did take IIRC the 9 bus back from Picadilly to Hammersmith. If getting around the DC area was so easy.

yeah, and go to scotland and you're screwed without wheels.

 

[bigandy]

i think this is the highest index, because it's not happened up here in scotland. yet.

what really annoys me is my car is booked in for it's MoT later today (when it gets light out again ) and i'm probably going to be spending over £300 on it (new, sweeeet performance ceramic brakes all round), because the busses to my Uni are just so pathetic. it says "UP TO EVERY 10MIN!" on them. yeah right, you're lucky if they turn up every 10 days!

pah. public transport is but a dream in scotland.

 

[bigandy]

(i would edit the prev post but this should be more prominent!)

this site is incredibly useful for us UK drivers!

it's free to use but you need to register (but tis brilliant because they send you emails about the cheapest places!)

when you're logged in, type in a postcode or town and it'll show you the cheapest places on a map! great! cheapest places in Stirling, Scotland, are 93.9p / litre. Which isn't bad.

but it is, when you consider when i started driving they were 62.7p/litre. And i'm only 24.

edit: for a breakdown of what a 90p/litre cost would be, check out this -47.1p would go to the government, as duty, then another 13.4p as VAT. ouch. it's not 75%, but it's still a lot. if there was no duty or vat, it would be a measily 29.5p/litre. we can all wish. then my tank may not cost £73 (almost $170) to fill!

 

[Lau]

pah. public transport is but a dream in scotland.

Although, I used to live in Edinburgh, and recently spent 2 weeks there for some work experience, and the public transport there's pretty good. Part of the reason I'm moving back up there, as it happens. (One of many parts, I'm not that much of a public transport geek )

 

[gauchogolfer]

...I recommend that someone should discover a workable cold fusion solution.

--Eric

Sounds good, I'll get right on it. I'll let you know how I'm doing in a week or so.

 

[FireArse]

Aberdeen

pah. public transport is but a dream in scotland.

Aberdeen has a great Bus network. There are literally busses EVERYWHERE!

It is a good city - I do like it. I'd live up there.

F

 

[Chundles]

I wish we had better public transport, sure, in and around the cities it's great - Melbourne is a stand-out. Problem is our cities are so damned far apart (much further than the US/Europe etc - Perth is the most remote metropolis in the world) and inter-city public transport is old, slow and expensive.

It's a 5 hour drive at 110kmh from my folks' house to the closest state border and to drive costs roughly half of what it does to take the slower, hotter, more-packed-full-of-smelly-weird-people train.

Our prices are cheaper than the UK but more than the US, we could use a VFT link between Brisbane -> Sydney -> Canberra -> Melbourne but as usual, politicking got in the way and the government decided to do nothing. Absolutely nothing. We could have a train that would go from Sydney to Melbourne in a fraction of the currently 12 hour road journey but they decided to do nothing.

We should have fast, clean, cool and comfortable trains zipping around the coasts and darting into the great void that is the interior rather than the lumbering pieces of crap we have now.

 

[Applespider]

It is a good city - I do like it. I'd live up there.

Having lived there for 4 years in the past, I wouldn't

 

[Glen Quagmire]

I've visited Vienna (Austria) a couple of times and the public transportation system is stunning. You can choose from a bus, trams, the U-Bahn (underground), the S-Bahn (surface train), as well as conventional trains. There is nothing like it that I've seen here in the UK. Coming back and navigating the London Underground was thoroughly underwhelming and stressful after spending some time in Vienna.

In Vienna, everything runs on time. You can catch a U-Bahn to a station, walk outside and you're at a tram stop or at a bus stop. Public transport is clean, efficient and safe. And cheap (€1.50 per journey for the U-Bahn) The ticket machines have instructions in multiple languages, so there's no need to get stuck. You can see exactly how long it'll take for your journey and - lo! - it indeed takes that amount of time.

Fossil fuels are finite. They will run out one day. Unless we (humans) work out how to reduce our consumption radically, that day will get closer and closer and then we're all up the creek without the proverbial paddle. It is frightening to see how much of the stuff in every day life is made from fossil fuels (oil). I was waiting for the kettle to boil in the kitchen at work and decided to amuse myself by counting the number of items that were plastic. I was still finding items when the kettle boiled.

People need to be educated that buying a three tonne SUV for taking Jill and Jack three miles to school every day is a bad idea. Fuel prices need to be increased (I'd be happy to pay them, despite paying £46 for a load of diesel this morning). The government (in the UK) need to throw billions at the public transportation system to improve the railways (why do people need to take a flight from London to Edinburgh - pointless), build tram and underground systems and so on. I'd be more than willing to use them.

Oh, and Formula 1 using normal unleaded is particularly annoying. F1 is supposed to be the pinnacle of technology - why not allow ethanol or alternate fuels, such as hydrogen? Might make it more interesting, for the viewer and for the manufacturers/teams.