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MacRumors

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Original poster
Apr 12, 2001
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MacWorld UK reports that Pioneer has announced a new version of it's DVD/CD Writer ("Superdrive"), which is used in many Macs.

The new drive incorporates support for the DVD+R/+RW standard:

Since there are several formats in the marketplace, however, confusion is rampant, especially among beginners, who demand a product that can handle these various formats, so as to ease their worries about standard media of the future. In response, Pioneer's new DVR-A06-J DVD/CD writer is designed to handle +R and +RW discs, in addition to DVD-R and DVD-RW discs.

There were reports that some iMacs came with a Sony DVD-writer which also supports the DVD+R/+RW standard... however, Apple only officially supports the DVD-R/-RW standard at this time.
 

gotohamish

macrumors 65816
Jul 15, 2001
1,078
9
BKLN
Originally posted by Foxer
ABout time. With luck, Apple will get these in the next generation of machines.

Absolutely, the next generation DVDRW in the NEXT GENERATION Macs!:D ;)
 

Mr Jobs

macrumors regular
Apr 7, 2002
188
0
London, England
Originally posted by Wonder Boy
What is the difference between +R ,+RW discs, and -R and -RW discs? Thanks.

nothing really just a different dvd format a few companies HP being one of then decided to come up with. but the dvd+ has no advantage over the dvd-
 

Jerry Spoon

macrumors 6502a
Jan 8, 2002
624
0
Historic St. Charles
Originally posted by Mr Jobs
nothing really just a different dvd format a few companies HP being one of then decided to come up with. but the dvd+ has no advantage over the dvd-
I saw something on TechTV a few months back where they were saying that the +R and +RW were better formats b/c of a wider compatability w/ dvd players, especially older players. Also, I just spoke with a friend of mine who's father just bought a pioneer dvd burner and says he can't play the dvd-r's on his older dvd player.
Can anyone confirm or deny this compatability issue?

I guess this pioneer he purchased was a +RW. Is that all Pioneer makes for those units? I'm not sure.
 

Dunepilot

macrumors 6502a
Feb 25, 2002
880
0
UK
My parents bought a Phillips DVD+RW unit at Christmas, and of the 3 DVD players I've tried, I've yet to find another DVD player that will play back the content on them.
 

Dave Marsh

macrumors regular
Jul 23, 2002
210
0
Sacramento, CA
New iMac Superdrive

I purchased a new 17" iMac at Apple's new Sacramento Arden Fair store this past Saturday, and it came with the Pioneeer 105 DVD-R/RW drive. :eek:

I've heard only the -R and +R DVDs work in DVD players, not the RW discs. The RW format is for archiving data to a DVD.
 

Jerry Spoon

macrumors 6502a
Jan 8, 2002
624
0
Historic St. Charles
Re: New iMac Superdrive

Originally posted by Dave Marsh
I've heard only the -R and +R DVDs work in DVD players, not the RW discs. The RW format is for archiving data to a DVD.
I thought the dvd-ram was for archiving (any data). I thought -rw and +rw was specifically for video along with the -r and +r, the difference being that you could of course record over the same disc multiple times.
 

aasmund

macrumors member
Sep 7, 2002
48
0
Trondheim
Re: Re: New iMac Superdrive

Originally posted by Jerry Spoon
I thought the dvd-ram was for archiving (any data). I thought -rw and +rw was specifically for video along with the -r and +r, the difference being that you could of course record over the same disc multiple times.

It's like CD's +/-R are write once. +/-RW are rewriteable, i.e. you can erase the disc and burn it again. RAM is more like a floppy or zip disk, it provides Random Access. An extention to the + form MRW, mount rainier rewrite, allows more or less the same. Notably the new nd1300 from nec support that. All dvd roms support both + and - apparently, but when it comes to stand alone players, it seems - has a slight edge. - seems to a bit cheaper media as well, but that might change. Finally the big advantage of +, in addition to MRW support, is that there is significantly fewer errors when burning at high speeds. a 4x +R is supposed to be nearly error free, while a 4x -R apparantly has a lot of errors.

Regards.
 

MacAficionado

macrumors 6502
Oct 5, 2002
435
0
An awesome place
I believe -R is the most compatible...

according to the Screensavers as far as I remember!

I've made about 10 DVD's so far for two clients and for myself. All of them have played perfectly in my older Toshiba DVD player I had since 99.

The first few I used generic DVD-R from Circuit City and worked fine, for my clients I use Verbatim.
 

Dave Marsh

macrumors regular
Jul 23, 2002
210
0
Sacramento, CA
Re: I thought the dvd-ram was for archiving (any data). I thought -rw and +rw was specifically for video along with the -r and +r, the difference being that you could of course record over the same disc multiple times.

That's correct, -/+RW is supposed to work in regular DVD players, but in practice there are many DVD players that have problems with them. However, the -R format seems to be more compatible at the moment with many drives still around.

The DVDRW Alliance of course claims otherwise: http://www.dvdrw.com/,
as does Phillips: http://www.licensing.philips.com/information/dvdrw/.

Time will sort these compatibility issues out, but we'll probably have to purchase new DVD players by then for all the formats to work uneventfully...or some of them will die alá Betamax. :D
 

Jerry Spoon

macrumors 6502a
Jan 8, 2002
624
0
Historic St. Charles
Re: I believe -R is the most compatible...

Originally posted by MacAficionado
according to the Screensavers as far as I remember!

When I wrote that I saw that the +R/RW format was more compatable, I believe it was from an episode of Fresh Gear. I actually find Screensavers to be a better program though. I must have missed that episode.
 

maxvamp

macrumors 6502a
Sep 26, 2002
600
1
Somewhere out there
Here is the scoop

I saw something on TechTV a few months back where they were saying that the +R and +RW were better formats b/c of a wider compatability w/ dvd players, especially older players. Also, I just spoke with a friend of mine who's father just bought a pioneer dvd burner and says he can't play the dvd-r's on his older dvd player.
Can anyone confirm or deny this compatability issue?

I guess this pioneer he purchased was a +RW. Is that all Pioneer makes for those units? I'm not sure.

Pioneer is the king of -R/RW and Philips is the king of +RW (HPs are Philips ). Up until now, each only made those formats they are kings of. Compatibility between the two have been a heated debate ever since both consortiums started comissioning studies. Odd how the outcome changed based on who paid for the study <grin>.

Generally, the - and + R discs are more compatible on older players, as they have a dye that is burned to make the disk. The color of this dye, depending on the manufacturer of the disc, makes it easier for the laser to reflect the light, and data to get back to the player. While technically, the -R format is more compatable, as it's data structure most closley matches that of a real DVD disc, the variable of the dyes used kinda makes this a moot point between the two. Generally the + and - R formats are about 90% compatable with the players out there.

NOW.....

RW is another story. The way a RW disc is written is that a crystal array ( very tiny ) is hit with a certain intensity of light, and that causes it to go opaque. When hit with another intensity, it causes it to clear ( some ). The reflectivity of these discs are only about 40% of that of a normal DVD disc, causing older players, that have no idea how to adjust their laser power of less reflective media, not to be able to read these discs. There are between 40%-60% of the players that will read these discs. In this cases, studies have shown the the -RW format is more compatable, but of course, that depends you your DVD player.

In short, If you have a DVD burner ( not including RAM, which really isn't a DVD in any way but name ) use the write once media (R) for the best compatability, and use good blank stock from a major vendor, such as SONY, Verbatum, or Apple ( which I believe is actually Verbatum) .

Just what I know...

Max

P.S. the diference between the two formats is that +R is indexed so that in a computer, DVDs can be used like floppies. This feature became less important when the -R consortium changed the rules so that -R discs were not absolutly required to be finished ( VR format ).

The two formats have matched each other in features, and it is only a firmware upgrade away from being the same format.

Until then a -R disc still will not burn in a +R recorder.

Max
 

P-Worm

macrumors 68020
Jul 16, 2002
2,045
1
Salt Lake City, UT
From what I have heard the -R and +R formatas are relatively the same just incompatible with on another. I think it is good that Apple's branching out and staying on top of things. Now Macs can have it all except DVD-RAM!

P-Worm
 

maxvamp

macrumors 6502a
Sep 26, 2002
600
1
Somewhere out there
Some Macs have DVD-RAM

I have noticed in the notebooks, Apple likes to put Toshiba DVD drives in them. If you look up the model in a particular Apple notebook on the Toshiba web site, I believe you will find that some of the drives ( SD-R2012 I think is one ) read ( not write ) DVD-RAM discs.

This is a feature almost never advertised, but a lot of PC and Mac notebooks out there have this feature.

I guess you could say that there is a Mac out there for all DVD formats.

Max
 

rockman2023

macrumors member
Apr 27, 2003
83
3
NYC
Is it possible to replace my internal CD/RW drive with a Superdrive. I know it's probably a hell of a lot cheaper to buy an external DVD drive, but ultimately, I'd like to keep the amount on my desk to a minimum. Also, I don't want to have to worry about possible drive speed issues.

-733 Quicksilver G4
 

MisterMe

macrumors G4
Jul 17, 2002
10,709
69
USA
Originally posted by P-Worm
From what I have heard the -R and +R formatas are relatively the same just incompatible with on another. I think it is good that Apple's branching out and staying on top of things. Now Macs can have it all except DVD-RAM!

P-Worm
Wrong! Beginning in 1999, the Blue and White PowerMac G3 and the original PowerMac G4 (Sawtooth) shipped with optional DVD-RAM. With the explosion of CD-burning on the Wintel side, Apple abandoned DVD-RAM in favor of the SuperDrive (CD-RW/DVD-R). Before making anymore silly comments about Apple computers, please check the Apple history website.
 

Dave Marsh

macrumors regular
Jul 23, 2002
210
0
Sacramento, CA
Replace Quicksilver DVD

It's my understanding you should have NO problem replacing the built-in DVD/CD-ROM drive in your G4 Tower. I believe if you stick a Pioneer 105 Superdrive in that MacOS 10.2.6 will recognize it immediately and you can even use iDVD with it. However, you cannot use iDVD with any external DVD drives. For an external drive, you'll need to use a third party product.:D
 

eric_n_dfw

macrumors 68000
Jan 2, 2002
1,517
59
DFW, TX, USA
I replaced my old Blue & White G3's DVD-ROM with a Pioneer 104 DVD-R drive and (under OS X) iDVD 2 and 3 work fine with it. I have since bought a Dual G4 500 and replaced the stock DVD-RAM drive with the same DVD-R drive and, again, it works fine.,

BTW: An internal DVD-R is much cheaper than an external one as you are basically paying for the IDE drive plus a firewire drive case on the external models.

Also, iDVD 3 lets me burn DVD-R's and DVD-RW's which both play just fine in my 3 year old Sony DVD player and my sister in-law's cheap, APEX DVD player.

Lastly, while DVD-RAM's are different beasts, they do share similar technologies to DVD's. A DVD-RAM drive usually can play DVD's and later models of DVD-RAM disks were supposed to be readable (data only) in DVD-ROM drives. (or so I've read... I ripped the DVD-RAM drive out of my DP G4 the same day I bought it!)
 

zach

macrumors 65816
Feb 14, 2003
1,204
0
Medford
Re: Some Macs have DVD-RAM

Originally posted by maxvamp
I have noticed in the notebooks, Apple likes to put Toshiba DVD drives in them. If you look up the model in a particular Apple notebook on the Toshiba web site, I believe you will find that some of the drives ( SD-R2012 I think is one ) read ( not write ) DVD-RAM discs.

This is a feature almost never advertised, but a lot of PC and Mac notebooks out there have this feature.

I guess you could say that there is a Mac out there for all DVD formats.

Max

Wow. I am quite confused....

I thought that DVD-RAM's were those things in plastic cases that couldn't even fit into a regualar drive....


If anyone could clear this up, i would be most greatful...
 
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