Pit Bulls

[eyoungren]

Both our dogs sleep inside because they ARE indeed part of the family, daily walks/cuddles/play time is what they get, as you can see in the video posted on post 5 I take them to play dates with Rambo and he looks like he can tear you apart , that bully is 70 lbs of pure love.
https://www.facebook.com/huntersand.archers/videos/vb.100001001225419/1742159169160774/?type=3

https://www.facebook.com/huntersand.archers/videos/vb.100001001225419/1720806117962746/?type=3

this is our new addition, Rocky, he has a LOT to learn
https://www.facebook.com/huntersand.archers/videos/vb.100001001225419/1787892701254087/?type=3

My problem is that I grew up rural. Since you live in Southern Cal you may recognize Cherry Valley, CA which is north of Beaumont, CA. About 45 minutes west of Palm Springs and 30 minutes east of San Bernardino in Riverside County.

As to my problem, that rural living meant animals slept outside. We didn't keep dogs in the house and any cats that were inside were let out to do their business.

The dogs had outside dog houses with blankets, water and food. That's the way I was raised.

None of which by today's standards will fly any more. Add in former Sheriff Arpaio's jones at prosecuting animal abusers above and beyond doing his job at prosecuting human offenders and this kind of thing can get you arrested around here.

That's the major reason we no longer have dogs.

 

[jkcerda]

My problem is that I grew up rural. Since you live in Southern Cal you may recognize Cherry Valley, CA which is north of Beaumont, CA. About 45 minutes west of Palm Springs and 30 minutes east of San Bernardino in Riverside County.

As to my problem, that rural living meant animals slept outside. We didn't keep dogs in the house and any cats that were inside were let out to do their business.

The dogs had outside dog houses with blankets, water and food. That's the way I was raised.

None of which by today's standards will fly any more. Add in former Sheriff Arpaio's jones at prosecuting animal abusers above and beyond doing his job at prosecuting human offenders and this kind of thing can get you arrested around here.

That's the major reason we no longer have dogs.

Nikita (older black akita/pit mix) loves to be inside, while Rocky (younger GS/husky mix) loves to be outside even at night, she begs to come in to sleep while he at times prefers to be outside, when I lived in Mexico ALL our dogs were outside with blankets/homes , all my cats are outside since they are basically feral cats that come for food and stick around since they have no where else to go, Nikita does not bother them & we are teaching Rocky to leave them alone, going to give away the kitties (3)as right now we are up to 8 cats that hang around the home .

 

[Phonephreak]

Nikita (older black akita/pit mix) loves to be inside, while Rocky (younger GS/husky mix) loves to be outside even at night, she begs to come in to sleep while he at times prefers to be outside, when I lived in Mexico ALL our dogs were outside with blankets/homes , all my cats are outside since they are basically feral cats that come for food and stick around since they have no where else to go, Nikita does not bother them & we are teaching Rocky to leave them alone, going to give away the kitties (3)as right now we are up to 8 cats that hang around the home .

Our pitty sleeps under the covers with us. He Likes to be warm. No fat for insulation. Lean and muscular. He loves the electric blanket.

 

[maflynn]

Yet another example of a pitbull attacking a family member
http://www.wcvb.com/article/1-year-old-attacked-by-dog-in-falmouth/14772051

I have family members that foster care pitbulls and own them, so I've heard all of the excuses but sadly these types of attacks are too common for this breed then others.

 

[jkcerda]

Breed is irrelevant

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

All dogs bite but breed can be relevant when it’s a toss up between a Jack Russell biting your child or a heavily built Pitbull. Whether or not pit bulls are more aggressive by nature is debatable but they were originally bred for bull baiting due to their powerful ability.

 

[eyoungren]

Breed is irrelevant

What about breeding though?

If a particular dog is bred for a specific reason is it not realistic to expect that breed to act in a certain manner according to their nature?

For instance, dogs bred to burrow after small animals. It would not be out of their character to be digging holes in your back yard right?

 

[Huntn]

What about breeding though?

If a particular dog is bred for a specific reason is it not realistic to expect that breed to act in a certain manner according to their nature?

For instance, dogs bred to burrow after small animals. It would not be out of their character to be digging holes in your back yard right?

Yes, exactly, so breed does make a difference.. We had a border collie who had never been around sheep, yet tried to herd the fake sheep that we had in our front yard.

 

[arkitect]

Yes, exactly, so breed does make a difference.. We had a border collie who had never been around sheep, yet tried to herd the fake sheep that we had in our front yard.

Now that's interesting.

Fake sheep in the front garden?

I've heard of plastic pink Flamingos… or Gnomes.

Fake sheep? That's a new one.

 

[Huntn]

Now that's interesting.

Fake sheep in the front garden?

I've heard of plastic pink Flamingos… or Gnomes.

Fake sheep? That's a new one.

They were really stylish, a flat piece of plywood cut out in the shape of a sheep, about 3’ tall and painted black. The body was a rounded pillow stuffing-like material covered with a white berber-like fabric that looked like wool. We had two big ones and a baby. From the street they had a really nice appearance. I just did an online search to see if I could find something like this, but did not.

 

[arkitect]

They were really stylish, a flat piece of plywood cut out in the shape of a sheep, about 3’ tall and painted black. The body was a rounded pillow stuffing-like material covered with a white berber-like fabric that looked like wool. We had two big ones and a baby. From the street they had a really nice appearance. I just did an online search to see if I could find something like this, but did not.

Rare as hens' teeth.

 

[ThisBougieLife]

What about breeding though?

If a particular dog is bred for a specific reason is it not realistic to expect that breed to act in a certain manner according to their nature?

For instance, dogs bred to burrow after small animals. It would not be out of their character to be digging holes in your back yard right?

I don't think that's unrealistic at all. People who have had nothing but positive experiences with a certain breed don't want to hear that said breed is responsible for an inordinate number of fatal attacks, but if that is the case, it's hard to argue with the statistics. How to act on those statistics is a completely different issue, however.

I find a similar problem arises when talking of human demographics and their relations to crime statistics. Statistics are cited as a valid reason for racial profiling, for example. Does the same apply to dogs?

 

[eyoungren]

I don't think that's unrealistic at all. People who have had nothing but positive experiences with a certain breed don't want to hear that said breed is responsible for an inordinate number of fatal attacks, but if that is the case, it's hard to argue with the statistics. How to act on those statistics is a completely different issue, however.

I find a similar problem arises when talking of human demographics and their relations to crime statistics. Statistics are cited as a valid reason for racial profiling, for example. Does the same apply to dogs?

I think there are a few issues involved here.

1. People do not like (at all) being wrong in their choices.
2. People think "X" won't happen to them.
3. People believe that environment trumps breeding.
4. People tend to see their pets as members of their immediate family.
5. Some dog lovers go beyond #4 and see their dogs as people.

Now, I know that this is a thread about Pit Bulls, but all of the above can be applied to any dog and in fact it has. I see many small dogs held in-arms by their owners walking around Walmart and other stores. It really gives me the heebie-jeebies when these animals are in the produce section or the meat/dairy sections. Additionally, anyone can go online and buy a service animal outfit for their dog. Whether the dog meets the requirements or not, well who is checking?

#4 and #5 I see as the larger issue. It's one thing to consider your animal part of the family, but it's another to put animals above humans and/or ascribe human aspects to animals.

Just my opinion.

 

[Huntn]

I think there are a few issues involved here.

1. People do not like (at all) being wrong in their choices.
2. People think "X" won't happen to them.
3. People believe that environment trumps breeding.
4. People tend to see their pets as members of their immediate family.
5. Some dog lovers go beyond #4 and see their dogs as people.

Now, I know that this is a thread about Pit Bulls, but all of the above can be applied to any dog and in fact it has. I see many small dogs held in-arms by their owners walking around Walmart and other stores. It really gives me the heebie-jeebies when these animals are in the produce section or the meat/dairy sections. Additionally, anyone can go online and buy a service animal outfit for their dog. Whether the dog meets the requirements or not, well who is checking?

#4 and #5 I see as the larger issue. It's one thing to consider your animal part of the family, but it's another to put animals above humans and/or ascribe human aspects to animals.

Just my opinion.

My impression is the service dog scam is utilized on occasion when flying to avoid the cost of transporting the animal.

 

[maflynn]

Breed is irrelevant

Just saying that doesn't make it true, as noted below.

If a particular dog is bred for a specific reason is it not realistic to expect that breed to act in a certain manner according to their nature?

Yes, exactly, so breed does make a difference

ASPCA Position Statement on Pit Bulls

Today’s pit bull is a descendant of the original English bull-baiting dog—a dog that was bred to bite and hold bulls, bears and other large animals around the face and head. When baiting large animals was outlawed in the 1800s, people turned instead to fighting their dogs against each other. These larger, slower bull-baiting dogs were crossed with smaller, quicker terriers to produce a more agile and athletic dog for fighting other dogs.

And while the article does go on to mention random breeding may have diluted that tendency and the dog can be around other dogs and what not, its clear the intended purpose of the pitbull was for fighting and given how the breed has a dubious distinction of being responsible for 65% canines killing people as noted in this post its clear that breed is relevant. Its also clear no matter how many touchy feely stories about how a person's pitbull is a just a big baby and won't hurt anyone just doesn't alter reality. All too often we hear how a loving family dog turned on a family member.

 

[jkcerda]

https://pethelpful.com/dogs/The-Pit...anny-Dog-What-Happened#compose_comment3724685

 

[ZapNZs]

They can certainly be very sweet animals, but they account for a disproportionate amount of bites and fatal attacks. How much of this is can be linked to the owner (some correlations between violent dogs and violent owners have been associated and human factors are absolutely associated with behavior) versus how much of this can be linked to genetics is certainly an ongoing discussion. There is also the fact that attacks by pit bulls are associated with higher morbidity and mortality rates than with other breeds. And there is the complication of what constitutes a pit bull isn't always clear (and, as an outcome, bites may be over-reported for the breed.) Even more complicating is how the effectiveness of breed-specific legislation appears to be limited and there are all sorts of problems with this method (1) (2) (3).

 

[RedKite]

I can’t stand those dogs! One of them attacked one of my labradoodles about 15 years ago. She survived but was so shook up from the experience that she didn’t want to be let off the lead ever again.

So to correct some false information. Dogs do have genetic tendencies towards, not violence, but ‘unknown reactions to new stimuli’. As in some dog breeds may react violently at any given moment due to some triggering event. There are numerous breeds with that wiring and when combined with “tough” looking dogs that idiots buy and mistreat. Well you’re gonna have a bad time. They even react violently to loved ones after training making ownership so dangerous. Thankfully most dogs are scared of children and even if they hurt a dog then chances are they won’t attack them back.

Remember this was seen as a desirable attribute in early fighting dog breeding. It is as much a real feature as how some breeds are more intelligent, some better at hunting, sniffing, running.

It’s sad when an animal behaves in a way that results in its own death. I wish people would not be harmed by them.

 

[Phonephreak]

I think there are a few issues involved here.

1. People do not like (at all) being wrong in their choices.
2. People think "X" won't happen to them.
3. People believe that environment trumps breeding.
4. People tend to see their pets as members of their immediate family.
5. Some dog lovers go beyond #4 and see their dogs as people.

Now, I know that this is a thread about Pit Bulls, but all of the above can be applied to any dog and in fact it has. I see many small dogs held in-arms by their owners walking around Walmart and other stores. It really gives me the heebie-jeebies when these animals are in the produce section or the meat/dairy sections. Additionally, anyone can go online and buy a service animal outfit for their dog. Whether the dog meets the requirements or not, well who is checking?

#4 and #5 I see as the larger issue. It's one thing to consider your animal part of the family, but it's another to put animals above humans and/or ascribe human aspects to animals.

Just my opinion.

They are members of the family. Otherwise you shouldn’t have a dog.

 

[eyoungren]

They are members of the family. Otherwise you shouldn’t have a dog.

I don't have a dog.

But even when I did have one, I did explain how I was brought up to treat animals in an earlier post in this thread..

I don't believe in abusing animals, and I am fond of my pets (particularly cats). But they are still animals. I am not going to give them human traits or treat them like a human because that's not what they are.

While they may actually BE part of the family, they have the status of a pet because that IS what they are. They are not equal to any member of my family, immediate, or otherwise because they are not human.

That may be something that you and a lot of other people disagree with and that's fine. Again, I don't own a dog.

I am and always have been a cat person. Cats tend to take care of themselves, aren't needy and because they do not demand my attention don't go into a depression when they don't get it.

 

[Phonephreak]

I read your post before and have no problem with it. I am a dog lover. We have 2 cats also. They are great but are not my boy. Not everyone is a dog lover. Enjoy your kitty’s.

I don't have a dog.

But even when I did have one, I did explain how I was brought up to treat animals in an earlier post in this thread..

I don't believe in abusing animals, and I am fond of my pets (particularly cats). But they are still animals. I am not going to give them human traits or treat them like a human because that's not what they are.

While they may actually BE part of the family, they have the status of a pet because that IS what they are. They are not equal to any member of my family, immediate, or otherwise because they are not human.

That may be something that you and a lot of other people disagree with and that's fine. Again, I don't own a dog.

I am and always have been a cat person. Cats tend to take care of themselves, aren't needy and because they do not demand my attention don't go into a depression when they don't get it.

 

[eyoungren]

I can’t stand those dogs! One of them attacked one of my labradoodles about 15 years ago. She survived but was so shook up from the experience that she didn’t want to be let off the lead ever again.

So to correct some false information. Dogs do have genetic tendencies towards, not violence, but ‘unknown reactions to new stimuli’. As in some dog breeds may react violently at any given moment due to some triggering event. There are numerous breeds with that wiring and when combined with “tough” looking dogs that idiots buy and mistreat. Well you’re gonna have a bad time. They even react violently to loved ones after training making ownership so dangerous. Thankfully most dogs are scared of children and even if they hurt a dog then chances are they won’t attack them back.

Remember this was seen as a desirable attribute in early fighting dog breeding. It is as much a real feature as how some breeds are more intelligent, some better at hunting, sniffing, running.

It’s sad when an animal behaves in a way that results in its own death. I wish people would not be harmed by them.

I'm a cat person. There are a few breeds of dog I am not fond of for the particular reason that they tend to be aggressive with cats.

For that matter, I don't like coyotes either. They've killed several of the cats I've owned.

I've lost a few cats that were let outside because the neighbor's stupid dogs decided to treat them as rag dolls. One of the last times was a very sweet kitten that I loved. Didn't make it to a year old because those dogs broke it's neck.

I've had some great dogs, but because of that one issue there are breeds I will never get.

 

[Falhófnir]

What frightens me, is when the owner physically is incapable of restraining a dog - I've had the dubious life experience of seeing a couple of bullmastiffs in person - they seemed very placid, but Jesus tap-dancing Christ they were scary. If one had gone for you, you would have been a goner.

 

[AustinIllini]

What frightens me, is when the owner physically is incapable of restraining a dog - I've had the dubious life experience of seeing a couple of bullmastiffs in person - they seemed very placid, but Jesus tap-dancing Christ they were scary. If one had gone for you, you would have been a goner.

They're completely benign, though. They don't want to hurt you.

 

[Falhófnir]

They're completely benign, though. They don't want to hurt you.

That’s fallacy, any dog can bite, any dog can get agitated or spooked...