PlayFair - Back Online

[TRiPod]

Uhm...directly from Apple's website....

"Best of all, you can use any song you purchase to accompany an iPhoto slide show, play behind a motion menu in iDVD or set the proper mood in your newest iMovie project."

Ummm directly from my programs...

"This computer is not authorized to play this music." (From a quicktime file)

then in iMovie, try dragging an m4p file in there.

While these are limitations that need to be addressed, it's no reason to run out and grab this piece of crap software that will be shut down anyway. If you're gonna use Hymn, just use Poisoned. Your wasting your money by pretending to be legal and use iTMS but stripping the DRM.

 

[greg75]

When did listening to digital music become a civil liberty?

Learning to Love Big Brother

Naive people who think Apple is not a corporation, Steve Jobs is Santa Claus and Bill Gates is teh Devil need not reply.

 

[greg75]

it's no reason to run out and grab this piece of crap software that will be shut down anyway.

Their new hosting provider has stated they will not take the software down, but go to court instead. Then there's DeDRMS which Apple has not taken any action against, because they know they'll lose.

If you're gonna use Hymn, just use Poisoned. Your wasting your money by pretending to be legal and use iTMS but stripping the DRM.

The only reason to use iTMS is because it's legal? Oh, well, I guess you're right, since iTMS screws the artists too.

 

[xijukid]

How it all will end

If programs such as this do not stop think what the future will hold...

All of the record exec's driving the Mercades that most people are complaining about will continue to drive their Mercades, but in order to do so the price of CDs will rise and programs such as the ITMS will have to shut down because the record companies will no longer trust online music sales.

On the other hand, think of how cool music downloading could be if people would stop stealing music. Perhaps the price would go down because the record companies would be making more money.

Everything has a cause and an effect. It seems to me that most people are not thinking long term when they choose to download programs that infringe upon copyright laws. As an artist myself, I'm glad that art is protected and it's a shame that people think they own pieces of art. You can look at a piece of visual art in a book for hours, but you can't do whatever you choose with it unless you own it. Music is the same...do you own any bands?

 

[coolsoldier]

If programs such as this do not stop think what the future will hold...

All of the record exec's driving the Mercades that most people are complaining about will continue to drive their Mercades, but in order to do so the price of CDs will rise and programs such as the ITMS will have to shut down because the record companies will no longer trust online music sales.

Except... nobody loses money (or even makes less money) when programs like this are used.

 

[greg75]

On the other hand, think of how cool music downloading could be if people would stop stealing music. Perhaps the price would go down because the record companies would be making more money.

Which planet are you on? It can't be Earth.

 

[ethernet76]

Good Lord -- you are actually going to equate copyright law and slavery? I don't even have a snarky comeback for that...I'm just too dumbfounded...

You said, "it's the law." I'm proving the law isn't always fair. Maybe you had hoped I'd use more friendly examples of the law trampling on an individuals rights.

However, it is fair to compare the DMCA towards any of those issues as it had its advocates and its detractors. While where not talking about trading people for money or how much a black person should count for in the census, you have to look at the context of the arguement.

There are those who honestly believed in the 18th century a black person shouldn't be considered a person. Just as there are those today that agree the RIAA shouldn't have to go through a subpeona. Congress deemed that an "officer of the court" – anyone from a court clerk to a judge – were allowed to hand out mandatory information-requests to ISPs.

The DMCA unfairly moved power from judges to anyone. It would be the equivalent of allowing a intern vote in place of your senator.

We can see the DMCA slowly get chopped away. As has been happening with Verizon and others refusing.

 

[whooleytoo]

What would you prefer? How 'bout HEaR Music ANywhere?

How about HEar Music Of Random otheRs, witHOut Investing DollarS. HEMORRHOIDS!

(Known to non-English speakers as PILES - Pleeeeze, I Listen Everyone's tuneS??)

 

[frank5050]

So back to the Roku Soundbridge thing. Let's say I had hypothetically spent $500, $1000 on iTMS songs, then sometime later decided I wanted a Soundbridge. My m4ps are unplayable on a Soundbridge. However, I can burn all those songs to CD and re-rip them, and not make anyone unhappy. Of course, this would be a big hassle, waste a lot of CD-Rs (which I would probably just throw away) and mean some loss of quality (which I may or may not be able to notice).

Or, I could re-purchase all those CDs, rip them, and have equal-quality m4as without making anyone unhappy. The drawbacks here are obvious, though.

I'm not a screw-the-industry kind of guy. I'm also not too sure I'd feel "entitled" to the music I had already bought. But, given the burdens brought on by options A and B, I'm sorry, I'd go for option C and strip out the DRM. Some of you will argue "you should have thought of this when you made the agreement with Apple, even if you didn't expect to buy a SoundBridge" and I'd listen to that, it's a rational argument. But seriously, in the end I would still go with option C and not feel much of an ethical problem with it.

Now, I'm a big Apple fan, and as for the whole Apple music monopoly thing, so far that doesn't seem like too bad a thing but then apple needs to complete the puzzle. Bring on the Apple set-top box, and a bunch of us on this thread would have nothing to bitch about.

Until then ... long live Option C.

While trying not to go off on too many tangents at once ......

1) A number of people have mentioned the Roku Soundbridge, does anyone actually have one of these devices? (pre-order stage still?) I have the same problem being discussed but it's with a product from Slim Devices (SliMP3). Since Roku will use the same server software I assume the problems will be the same though.

2) To solve the problem of making my iTMS purchased music easily playable on my home stereo through a SliMP3 I don't make CD's and re-rip but instead simply use the Lame encoder at --alt-preset-extreme setting to rip to MP3 and strip out the DRM (for use only through my SliMP3). No CD-R or -RW's to deal with. Problems with this include: loss of quality, time to re-encode, larger file sizes, managing 2 sets of the same songs, violation of iTMS EULA, etc. but it's what I do nonetheless.

If Apple or the RIAA are going to go through the process of tracking me down and prosecuting me that's a chance I'll have to take but as long as I don't make these songs avaiable for others to download (and I don't) I'm not too worried.

(does anyone know if this Lame encoder method is now broken with iTunes 4.5?)

3) Although Hymn/Playfair might make this process easier for me to accomplish I do lament the fact that it's past and recent availability might eventually change the tems of Apple's current Fairplay scheme to be more restrictive. I'm already disappointed that the iTMS now no longer works for me since the v4.5 release as I've never upgraded from iTunes v4.0 (what can I say, I hate to upgrade unless it's to solve a serious problem or because there's a new feature I can't live without).

Thus I understand both sides of the argument, I just wish Apple would make it possible for Slim Devices, Roku, Tivo, & others to be able to play iTMS songs over network audio devices or, as dloomer suggested, come out with their own set top box.

frank

 

[pooky]

<I>... simply use the Lame encoder at --alt-preset-extreme setting to rip to MP3 and strip out the DRM...

(does anyone know if this Lame encoder method is now broken with iTunes 4.5?)

I used to do this as well, but I can attest to it being broken under 4.5. I would assume that the new "features" designed to prevent programs like Toast from using the files also prevent the LAME encoder from doing its thing.

 

[xijukid]

Which planet are you on? It can't be Earth.

Costs of goods rise when the cost to maintain the company rise. If a company does well the costs of goods 'usually' stay the same or slighlty move upward. I take back my comment that the ITMS prices would drop...

 

[ethernet76]

I hear this argument a lot, but it is not really valid. If you simply compare a CD to the same ITMS album, you actually have more freedom with the iTunes album. You can put that album on 5 computers and play them simultaneously if you desire. With a CD, the medium itself is limiting. You can only play it on one computer at a time. (I am not talking about importing the music from the cd onto your computer, just the CD itself). If you want to do more with the music than the medium allows, then there are ways around that both for CD's and ITMS music. The only real difference is in the quality of the medium.

You also have to compare the portability of the medium. CDs I can take anywhere. Do anything with. I'm not concerned with letting aanyone hear my music. I just want to be able to take it around like my vinyl or CD.

So, you want all the benefits of a CD, but don't want to buy the CD. So you buy from ITMS, fully aware of its limitations and the DRM that comes along with it, and then complain because it is not the CD????

Why are you implying digital music is a second-class format? All formats are created equal. I am not buying a format. I am buying notes, chords, vocals, and mixing.

When did listening to digital music become a civil liberty? You mention putting your sister's computer on your network. This is a prime example of why there is DRM. In the past, if your sister liked a CD that you had, she would go buy her own (eventually you would get tired of trying to share that CD). With the digital age, you want to put your sister on the network and simply share that music with her. And you could share her music. That way you would never have to buy any duplicates of music. Great for you, but not for anyone involved in the making of that music. They are now making less money because you are sharing that music with 5 computers. Eventually there will have to be a new model for making money from music. Until that happens we are stuck with DRM. And there is no loss of civil liberties while there are still a ton of other options out there.

My collection is passworded both here and when I'm at school. Only a few people have the password, people I would normally lend my music to. I am not freely sharing, copying, or distributing my music. I have broken no copyright laws. However, I am a criminal.

A House of Representatives sub-committee is now considering legislation that would grant users more rights, and "would protect consumers from being prosecuted under anti-circumvention regulations in instances where no copyright law has been broken," according to a PCWorld.com article. The legislation would also require clear labeling of copy-protected CDs to be clearly labeled. Fair measures that any home user can respect.

Opponents argue that one copy could turn into 100s of illegal copies and there is no way to control the number of copies made. This the same arguement made against VHS recorders in 1984. The same arguement made against CD burners.

Pirates are pirates, they will always find a way around restrictions and encryption. I am not a pirate. Please let me listen to my Hendrix.