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Hello thanks for all your comments,
I think I will go with MBP although my dad will not be too happy
I made a deal so that I pay for the anything above $1500

As for the $250 premium thing I was wondering if people could tear it down anymore financially... but bascially it seems to be impossible to strip down beyond $500 or whatever.

I have been waiting for right entry point into Mac since 2001 and I thought now was right time because of price(as in its not as scaringly expensive as it used to be) and compatibility. And I still do think it is right time to go and Mac OS X seems to be worhtwhile reason having had few minutes experiences with it in the shop...

Hope new MBP is coming soon...
 
You might also look into refurbished MBPs. The quality will be indistinguishable from that of new MBPs, except they'll come in a brown box and be hundreds of dollars cheaper. You'll get the same warranty protections and so forth. Just something to keep in mind.
 
Thank you very much for this!
This should cure my temporary insanity and my dad's hostility towards Apple.

Keep in mind, that was all marketing fluff from Apple. Not a real and unbiased opinion of the system. I'll have the pleasure of debunking all of that information in a second here ;)

I know people have mentioned Mac OS X advantage and iLife etc. but their monetary value would equal to only about $200 so accounting this its $600 difference.

XPS uses CCFL so being generous say slash $100 which brings down difference to $500.

The only advantage LED gives you is longer estimated life. Apple's own words state that users should not notice any difference in image quality between a LED and CCFL screen.

Better build quality?

Apple's build quality has gotten terrible. MacBooks have issues with cracking from heat, discoloration, case separation, uneven backlight (I've had almost all of those issues on 2 MacBooks!). MacBook Pros have issues with screen lighting, warping due to heat, denting, scratching, etc.

Software functionality premium?

OS X doesn't do anything that Windows Vista doesn't do out of the box, or with a couple of pieces of freeware that are every bit as good as what is built in to OS X. Realistically, the only iLife app besides iTunes you will regularly use is iPhoto. Vista's built-in software and Picassa are every bit as good. Many feel Picassa is even better.

Vista Ultimate(so at least it is some way in line with Leopard),

Vista Home Premium is just fine. The only thing that OS X offers over Vista Home Premium is a built-in encryption utility. But TrueCrypt takes care of that and offers FULL DISK encryption rather than "Home Folder" encryption. I'm using TrueCrypt's full disk encryption on my HP right now and it works beautifully. It also goes above and beyond FileVault in OS X. FileVault uses 128-bit AES to encrypt your Home Folder and Disk Utility can create AES-256 disk images. TrueCrypt can use a combination of AES256, Twofish, and Serpent encryption all at once, all 256-bit algorithms, and SHA-512 hashmarks.. essentially, every human alive today would be dead several times over by the time your system encryption could be hacked.

Plus Vista Home Premium comes with Media Center which mops the floor with Front Row in terms of looks and capabilities.

One important thing, if you want to play DVDs, blu-ray, HD DVD, or even just H.264, divx, or xvid videos.. Windows (XP and Vista) have system wide hardware acceleration. With that GeForce, you will get FULL hardware support for all of those and the image quality will make you wonder how Apple can get away with pushing DVD Player as one of Leopards 300 improvements over Tiger. The image quality is just that much better in Windows.

Also, save some money and upgrade the memory yourself. You can get 4GB of RAM for less than what Dell charges for a 2GB upgrade.

Don't forget that Fingerprint Reader as well. That is EXTREMELY cool. Instead of typing your password to log in to Windows or your favorite websites, you just swipe your finger and it does the rest.

1. A Mac is the perfect computer for life on campus.
With a Mac, students have a competitive edge in college. That’s because they are more productive, more creative, and more connected to their academic and extracurricular life. With a bulletproof operating system, the ability to integrate effortlessly with Windows PCs, and preloaded digital media software, a Mac is also available to every college student at a special education discount. What more could you ask for?

Bulletproof operating system? Hardly. I've had OS X crash more times in the last year than I've ever had Windows crash. I've also been through 4 Leopard reinstalls due to general instability.

2. Microsoft Office runs on a Mac.
A Mac can run everything a student needs to be productive: Microsoft Word, Excel, PowerPoint, and Entourage. In fact, Microsoft has put additional features in the Mac versions that don’t exist on Windows. For more information on Microsoft’s products check out www.mactopia.com.

That was in the past. Not the case now. The Windows version is ahead of the OS X version at this point.

3. Learning on a Mac prepares students for the “real world.”
A Mac can help a student thrive in any major. Mac OS X is based on industry standards, which means students learn skills that can be used on any operating system. More important, the Mac provides the freedom to innovate. Instead of worrying about fitting in, students can choose the platform that allows the greatest professional and personal expression, flexibility, and growth. And if you need special help, Mac OS X offers innovative solutions for those with vision, hearing, or other disabilities, ensuring that everyone can have a customized computing experience.

Windows does all of the same things.. Buying a Windows PC isn't about "fitting in", its about getting hardware that fits your needs.

4. Apple offers industry-leading support.
Every Mac comes with 90 days of toll-free phone support and a one-year limited warranty. In 2006, Apple’s warranty was rated number one for the fifth year running. And Apple is the only company that can provide hardware, software, and operating system support in one phone call. Students can even extend the toll-free phone support for up to three years with the AppleCare Protection Plan. Many campuses also have knowledgeable Mac service centers.

90 days of toll-free phone support thats closed on the weekends and closes every night at 6PM Pacific. Dell offers on-site support for the first year of warranty as well as 24/7 phone support. HP offers 24/7 phone support and their turn around time for mailing systems in is MUCH faster than Apple. Plus you have to worry about your Apple system being sent to Flextronics for repair. If it gets sent out to Flextronics, you'll likely be without your system for WEEKS while you send it back and forth trying to get Flextronics to repair the damage they caused the previous times!

5. Students save cash on every Apple product.
Students enrolled in or accepted to U.S. higher education institutions are eligible for substantial discounts on Apple hardware and software. For details on discounts extended to students, visit the Apple Store for Education, and be sure to check with the local campus computer store. And if you’re looking for financing, we’re committed to making purchasing options as flexible as possible.

oooh a $100 discount. Other manufacturers offer this too.

6. A Mac is loaded with everything you need.
When comparing prices with our competitors, make sure the Windows machine you’re pricing has the same features. Take a look at the extensive list of software and hardware included on a Mac before drawing any conclusions. iLife, Apple’s award-winning suite of digital media applications including iPhoto, iMovie HD, iDVD, GarageBand, and iWeb,1 is preloaded on every Mac. For similar applications on a PC, you’d have to spend hundreds of dollars.

VirtualDub is freeware video editing that is much more powerful than iMovie. Vista has built-in DVD making software that is onpar with iDVD but it doesn't have the fancy "themes". GarageBand is just like any freeware music application on Windows, just with a better interface. Same goes for iWeb. Picassa, in some peoples opinion, is better than iPhoto and Vista's built-in software is every bit as good as iPhoto.

7. iPod is a learning device.
iPod is more than just a music player. Students can use iPod and Griffin’s iTalk voice recorder to record class lectures, keep track of their appointments with a built-in calendar, and back up papers and class projects on gigabytes of hard drive space. Plus iTunes2 is more than just music. In addition to having instant access to countless songs, iTunes users can search for the best podcasts on the planet. And now, with iTunes U, universities across the country are beginning to use iTunes to distribute digital content to their students.

Many other MP3 players can do this without an additional accessory.

8. The Mac now has Intel inside.
Faster processing speeds, longer battery life, better compatibility. All of this is made possible by Apple’s partnership with Intel, announced in 2005. Every MacBook Pro, iMac, and Mac mini ships with an Intel chip inside, delivering high performance and exceptional value.

"And because of our improper cooling systems causing the MacBook and MacBook Pro to get extremely hot during regular use, you don't have to worry about those drunken frat parties resulting in any unplanned children thanks to the heat from your Mac making you sterile!"

9. Apple notebooks are the best way to connect.
Mobility, particularly in the age of wireless connectivity, is central to campus computing lifestyles. And while a desktop system will certainly do the trick, most students find that the freedom and flexibility of a notebook computer serves them better through their years at college. A quick glance at the competition reveals that MacBook and MacBook Pro are the best wireless notebooks in the industry.

My HP with an Intel Pro Wireless card (the whole Centrino Duo thing) has no problem connecting to and getting the same signal strength as my MacBook.

They also offer their extended warranty (as does Dell) which, for AppleCare lasts three years (and extends full phone support to three years as well).

But AppleCare still closes at 6PM every night and on the weekends. While Dell's extended warranties offer next day on-site repair, accidental damage coverage, even theft recovery.

I am getting a Mac because I am so fed up with PC's its beyond belief. I have owned Gateway, Dell, HP, Compaq, and currently a VAIO. Every single one of them has become useless around the 2-3 year mark despite what should be usable specs. I don't know what it is they just start to slow down so much I need to buy another (planned obsolescence anyone?). Viruses and spyware are everywhere constantly despite my numerous anti-virus programs (not cheap). Whats almost worse are the residual files, folders, and constant pop ups/update screens for anti virus software I have tried to delete. This happens with non anti virus software as well though. I am so fed up with warnings from programs I deleted a year ago or more. Some of them won't even let me delete them ( they say I am not authorized). When my computer is telling me I can't do something it pisses me off. Then there is the whole "restart your computer now or I will restart on my own in 3 minutes" message. WTF is that?? I should be able to restart whenever I damn well please.

I've been using Windows for 17 years, started when I was 9 years old, and I have never had a virus. Not one. Nor have I ever had spyware.

It sounds to me like you are not running Windows Update regularly and that you are clicking on every single banner ad on websites and installing everything that websites want you to install. And you are visiting shady sites that normal people would NOT visit.

Or you're just lying.

By the way, there is freeware anti-virus and anti-spyware software out there that works just as well as the paid stuff. But you really only need those two if you are visiting suspicious sites and taking part in "shady" activities.

If you didn't know, OS X has problems with residual files and folders too. Even if you use AppDelete or AppZapper, files and folders still get left behind from uninstalling software.

Everything you've described in your post basically wouldn't happen as long as you A) ran the uninstaller to get rid of software you no longer wanted and B) didn't take part in shady activities or visit sites that are suspicious.

Anyway the point is I don't know if Mac has these problems or not, but I KNOW PC's do after all these years so I am taking the chance that Mac will not suck as bad as PC's seem to.

I have both. Macs have their own set of problems. However, again, the problems you described with your PC wouldn't happen as long as you used uninstallers and kept away from suspicious sites and activities.

I've used PCs for years, and I think every one has failed at some point due to some hardware issues I believe.

I've used a Mac for years and already had multiple hardware failures ;)

For me, OS X means simplicity. Sure my WinXP box operates fine, but that's because I run regular maintenance -- defrags, spyware check, adware check, *virus check*, occasional reinstallation of the OS itself (which includes backups, reinstalling favourite apps), etc. This adds up to a huge amount of my time that has been sunk into keeping my PC operating at a good performance level for my needs.

The beauty of OS X is that I don't need to waste my time doing any of this, especially defragging, virus checking, and wiping the drive and reinstalling the OS. It's just not necessary on a Mac. The system takes care of most of this, and a virus program is virtually pointless.

You haven't had a Mac for long, have you? I've had to reinstall Leopard 4 times just because of instability issues. OS X also requires occasional reinstalls because of files and folders left behind by software being installed and uninstalled.

Defragging the hard drive can be done automatically when you're not using the system. Spyware and virus checks are only needed if you say YES to installing everything and anything websites want you to install. Stay away from that and you'll be fine. Or just run Firefox.

Only the MBP will offer you the ability to access the entire Windows software catalog (natively or through emulation) as well as offering OSX related software.

OS X software, in most cases, still isn't up to snuff with what you can get on Windows. Toast compared to Nero.. well, Nero mops the floor with it. DVD Player lags behind everything on Windows, even Vista's built-in decoder because it takes full advantage of hardware GPU features for video. DVD Player does not.

The OS isn't the only difference between PCs and Macs. Macs just have more expensive parts in them than Walmart specials. iSuppli did a tear-down of iMac, and the cost of parts was near $900. That doesn't include cost of assembly, packaging, shipping, advertising, nor R&D.

Then why is it that the MacBooks and MacBook Pros have so many build quality issues? You don't see a $500 Wal-Mart special falling apart the same way a $1400 MacBook does.
 
You haven't had a Mac for long, have you? I've had to reinstall Leopard 4 times just because of instability issues. OS X also requires occasional reinstalls because of files and folders left behind by software being installed and uninstalled.

Well, my MBP for 10 months, plus an G4 iMac for 3+ years. Not as long as some, but long enough to know that I have spent way more time tinkering with my XP system than I have with my two Macs combined over all that time. Granted, I use my XP system a lot more than the old iMac, but both are used regularly.
Sorry to hear of your troubles with Leopard. I've seen a lot of people on these forums complaining of the same. I've also seen a lot of people who have had no problems at all, who run Leopard fine, etc. I am one of them. I installed a month ago and my machine just keeps purring. It didn't even blink.

Defragging the hard drive can be done automatically when you're not using the system. Spyware and virus checks are only needed if you say YES to installing everything and anything websites want you to install. Stay away from that and you'll be fine. Or just run Firefox.

No, I would say not. A virus scanner on a Windows box is a necessity for anyone who regularly needs to look at email attachments and documents. Virtually all of my virus scanning is done outside of my browser for work, school, and home, not for my web surfing activities. On OS X I have to be conscious of accidentally sending infected files on to others, but I don't have to worry about my own machine itself being infected.
 
Hello thanks for all your comments,
I think I will go with MBP although my dad will not be too happy
I made a deal so that I pay for the anything above $1500

As for the $250 premium thing I was wondering if people could tear it down anymore financially... but bascially it seems to be impossible to strip down beyond $500 or whatever.
You dad's generous; tell him you appreciate it. :)

Forget the hardware cost comparison. Either you want a Mac or you don't. And either you pay for one or you don't. It doesn't matter if the Dell is free: it still doesn't run OS X, if that's what you want or need.

But, to this (belabored) point: The MacBook Pro was priced very closely, feature to feature, to an equivalent WinXP laptop last summer when I bought. I can only assume that in the past six months PCs have gotten a bit faster and a bit cheaper while the MBP has remained fixed in its configuration. If a new MBP comes out tomorrow, I would expect it to be within 20% of an equivalent high-end laptop from Dell.

And again, if you want a Mac but still have reservations about the MBP premium, buy an iMac or MacBook.
 
Well, my MBP for 10 months, plus an G4 iMac for 3+ years. Not as long as some, but long enough to know that I have spent way more time tinkering with my XP system than I have with my two Macs combined over all that time. Granted, I use my XP system a lot more than the old iMac, but both are used regularly.
Sorry to hear of your troubles with Leopard. I've seen a lot of people on these forums complaining of the same. I've also seen a lot of people who have had no problems at all, who run Leopard fine, etc. I am one of them. I installed a month ago and my machine just keeps purring. It didn't even blink.



No, I would say not. A virus scanner on a Windows box is a necessity for anyone who regularly needs to look at email attachments and documents. Virtually all of my virus scanning is done outside of my browser for work, school, and home, not for my web surfing activities. On OS X I have to be conscious of accidentally sending infected files on to others, but I don't have to worry about my own machine itself being infected.

I've spent more time dealing with software issues in both Tiger and Leopard (mostly the operating system crashing for no reason) in the last year I've owned a Mac than in 17 years of using Windows. All while Windows existed happily on the Boot Camp partition without ANY problems. It didn't even freeze!

Also, anybody who runs Windows Update regularly knows that email viruses and such haven't been an issue since.. oh.. Windows 98 and the "Melissa" virus.

Not to be a jerk, but it really sounds as if you've fallen victim to Apple's blatant lies about the "virus problem" with Windows.

I've never had a virus. Never had spyware. Never. Also, the previous post about "will shut your computer down in 3 minutes blah blah blah" yeah, thats because of the lack of Windows Updates and visiting sites or doing things that most people would consider "shady".
 
Many of us here have switched to Macs for a reason. I don't hear about many people who switch from OS x to Windows.
3rd party software, or cheap routers seems to be the biggest reason some have experienced problems with Tiger or Leopard.
 
Hello thanks for all your comments,
I think I will go with MBP although my dad will not be too happy
I made a deal so that I pay for the anything above $1500

As for the $250 premium thing I was wondering if people could tear it down anymore financially... but bascially it seems to be impossible to strip down beyond $500 or whatever.

I have been waiting for right entry point into Mac since 2001 and I thought now was right time because of price(as in its not as scaringly expensive as it used to be) and compatibility. And I still do think it is right time to go and Mac OS X seems to be worhtwhile reason having had few minutes experiences with it in the shop...

Hope new MBP is coming soon...

Wait until launch, there may be price cuts in the offing. Looking at competitor's prices and component costs, I think that it's more likely than not that there will be.

.
.

There's another factor that you ought to consider/mention to your Dad, especially if he's particularly cost-concious:

Apple's retain their resale value. If you go to eBay right now, 2+ year-old Core Duo MacBook Pro's, even beaten up, still go for $1000+. When I first got into buying Macs a few years ago, several year-old iBooks were still going for $500+. Indeed, I paid $600 for a 700 Mhz G3 iBook several months before the Intel transition. Which was a rip-off, but I digress.

If you buy a new MacBook Pro for $1900ish, the odds are that - if you want to switch or upgrade in a year or two, you'll easily stil get $1000+ for the thing.

By way of comparison, I think you'd be lucky, a year from now, to get $700 for that XPS.
 
Many of us here have switched to Macs for a reason. I don't hear about many people who switch from OS x to Windows.
3rd party software, or cheap routers seems to be the biggest reason some have experienced problems with Tiger or Leopard.

I basically switched from Windows to OS X. Used OS X for several months. Switched back to Windows. Why? Hardware. OS X didn't have a lot of the software I wanted or needed to run. However, the major push was the hardware. You can get a PC with 3GB of RAM, dedicated GPU, HD DVD, etc. for under $1,000. You also don't have to worry about the thing cracking from heat or falling apart in your hands due to bad build quality.
 
Who the hell am I to go justify a purchase for you? If you want one go buy one and can afford the premium that Apple charges then go buy one, simple as that.
 
I think by not considering even the MacBook, you're making a huge mistake. It costs significantly less and it does exactly what you need it to do.

But, it's not my money you're spending, so I could care less. I thought I'd just interject, though.

Congrats on the new Apple - I hope you enjoy it!
 
I basically switched from Windows to OS X. Used OS X for several months. Switched back to Windows. Why? Hardware. OS X didn't have a lot of the software I wanted or needed to run. However, the major push was the hardware. You can get a PC with 3GB of RAM, dedicated GPU, HD DVD, etc. for under $1,000. You also don't have to worry about the thing cracking from heat or falling apart in your hands due to bad build quality.

What laptop do you have now?
 
Many of us here have switched to Macs for a reason. I don't hear about many people who switch from OS x to Windows.
3rd party software, or cheap routers seems to be the biggest reason some have experienced problems with Tiger or Leopard.

You'll see a lot more of switching to Windows in the years to come: Bugs, bad customer service (in Europe) combined with less than good build quality and products that are crippled way, way too much will make people do that.
 
There's a name for using the words Dell and Support in the same sentence...

...it's called an oxymoron.


Dell is still nothing more then a branded whitebox clone --- very little goes into R&D of the internal parts --- they are built based on the decisions of the corporate offices. "We're building a "product" - it must sell for $xxx.xx; and must have xx% profits...now go make it happen".


I've spent 20+ years working in the computer industry (even stints with Dell & IBM); and as a tech, hearing the term "Dell" is like having hot oil poured onto you.

If you're considering a PC; look at a true system builder (HP or IBM) not a whitebox clone (Dell).

All my servers are Linux; and I'm in the process of replacing my last PC laptop (HP Pavilion zv5000) with Apple (awaiting the new MBP's) --- and will not miss the PC's at all. Fact is that an Apple can do everything a PC can do & more...and yes you do pay more for that.

Good luck
 
You'll see a lot more of switching to Windows in the years to come: Bugs, bad customer service (in Europe) combined with less than good build quality and products that are crippled way, way too much will make people do that.

LOL - not with the current M$ management...

They flopped with Vista (even Gates stated this in his post-CES interviews)

They won't have the successor to Vista ready till at least 2011

They flopped with Xbox 360 - especially supporting HD-DVD

They flopped with Zune

They just flopped with their attempted take-over of Yahoo!

They just bought Danger Inc. (makers of the Sidekick) = smells of more desperation





M$ = no longer ruling the world... Guess who's stepping to the plate and making BIG waves???

:apple:
 
I'm not 100% sure it is an $800 difference

Dell XPS 1530 @ $1825 from their educational store

http://premierconfigure.us.dell.com...id=RC1084719&~tgt=cfg&l=en&s=k12&cs=RC1084719

Apple Macbook Pro @ $2299from their educational store
http://store.apple.com/1-800-780-50...9904007/wo/M648Qw0BViLH2yPPXfLQ8gGBDq3/7.?p=0

This is with no extra software , same 1 year warranty, CPU, memory and HD options.

Maybe I am missing something but they look alot closer in price. Furthermore the apple laptop is ~ an 8 month old setup , most likely it will be updated either by the time most read this or in 3-4 months max. At that point the mac will probably have the same price but have some features increased.

Its really six of one half a dozen of another. Best thing you can do is spend some time using each one and finding which feels more intuitive and natural for you. As you can see from the arguments here, its close enough to call that opinions will come at you from both sides of the fence.
 
Resell value plays a part as well. When you want to sell your MBP, you will get a lot more money for it than your XPS.
 
What car should I buy. I need a new one. The one I have now is a '93 model with 165,000 miles. Please, please help me I can't decide....

Would kind of help if I told you a little about how I might use the car. Maybe I have a wife and four kids. Maybe I'd siingle and have a 50 mile daily commute. Maybe I work At home.

I always wonder if these people who need to ask what kind of a PC to buy even need a PC at all. They never seem to say what they DO with the computer. OK you need a computer, But why... Tell us.

Are you editing HD format video? Do you like Apple's "Aperture". Is the machine mainly used for web surfing? For playing DVDs? Taking Notes in school and for controlling instruments in a lab? Maybe you are into video games? Do you spend much time building web pages with Adobe Dreamweaver? The fact that you are concidering a MBP says you have to professional level use for a computer what is that?

Can we make it a "skicky" post maybe that the price of asking "What computer should i buy?" is a 500 word easy on what you do with computers. Or to put this another way -- How can anyone expect to get informed advice if they don't provide any information?

QFT.

For all we know, the starter of this thread would be just fine using a 5-year-old iBook. There's no reason to buy a MBP just because everyone else does. A MacBook would actually be just fine for many people who buy MBP's. And the Macbook tax is far less.
 
You'll see a lot more of switching to Windows in the years to come: Bugs, bad customer service (in Europe) combined with less than good build quality and products that are crippled way, way too much will make people do that.


I haven't had any issues with build quality, but as more and more hardware is made in China, I imagine Apple will suffer in that area- just like every other manufacturer.

I strongly believe 3rd party software and user error are the main causes of problems. If the software were bad, everyone would experience the same problems.
 
Just tossing in my two cents..

The only advantage LED gives you is longer estimated life. Apple's own words state that users should not notice any difference in image quality between a LED and CCFL screen.

It's brighter and looks more even throughout (at least to me). The whites are whiter, blacks are darker. Subjective, of course, but I prefer LEDs.

Apple's build quality has gotten terrible. MacBooks have issues with cracking from heat, discoloration, case separation, uneven backlight (I've had almost all of those issues on 2 MacBooks!). MacBook Pros have issues with screen lighting, warping due to heat, denting, scratching, etc.

True, but Dells have such uneven build quality it's not even funny. Unique gaps everywhere, the whole part around the keyboard looks cheap, etc. The only thing that looks or feels expensive is the back of the LCD - the solid lid. Even then, some people's Dell logos have a tendency to fall off.

OS X doesn't do anything that Windows Vista doesn't do out of the box, or with a couple of pieces of freeware that are every bit as good as what is built in to OS X. Realistically, the only iLife app besides iTunes you will regularly use is iPhoto. Vista's built-in software and Picassa are every bit as good. Many feel Picassa is even better.

Meh Vista just isn't as smooth as OS X, and I don't even own a Mac.


Don't forget that Fingerprint Reader as well. That is EXTREMELY cool. Instead of typing your password to log in to Windows or your favorite websites, you just swipe your finger and it does the rest.

Sometimes it takes a few swipes... somewhat annoying :mad:

Then why is it that the MacBooks and MacBook Pros have so many build quality issues? You don't see a $500 Wal-Mart special falling apart the same way a $1400 MacBook does.

I hate the mushiness and creaks and whatever else that comes with $500 Wal-Mart specials. I had enough experience working with (and fixing) such machines. Quite irritating, actually.


I think the LED screen, design/build quality, and small additional features like the backlit keyboard and mag-safe power cord all make the MBP worth that little bit more than an XPS M1530. I'm not sure I like the M1530 design or how they're put together, the fat bezel around the screen, the look of the keyboard, the uneven gaps, etc.

*shrug* I don't own either one, I was making the same decision a while ago haha
 
I haven't had any issues with build quality, but as more and more hardware is made in China, I imagine Apple will suffer in that area- just like every other manufacturer.

I strongly believe 3rd party software and user error are the main causes of problems. If the software were bad, everyone would experience the same problems.

My HP was built in China and it does not have any build quality issues like the 2 MacBooks I've owned have. Theres really no way this case could discolor or simply fall apart. And if the optical drive fails, I don't have to perform major surgery on the unit. Remove a single screw, buy a new drive, slide it in, put the screw back in.
 
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