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The one thing I don't agree with, is Apple got rid of the headphone jack to sell more of its' own products. That's cutting off their collective noses to spite their face. That doesn't make any sense to me. Someone annoyed enough at Apple is going to buy a competitors BT headset. Apple is not alone, the supposed "biggest and badest" note 10, doesn't sport a headphone jack. How many people do you think that will annoy?
It actually very much annoys me when non-Apple companies start copying everything Apple does, particularly what I consider to be the BAD things Apple does - like unnecessary removal of headphone jacks. This is an unfortunate move on the part of Apple competitors. Additionally, if you go way back, nearly all cell phones had jacks and removable batteries, and many -like Samsung- also sported mini-QWERTY keyboards. I still miss those features, but most Android manufacturers copied Apple in going the non-removable battery route and ditching the pull out QWERTY keyboard in favor of touch-only. LG was the last holdout with batteries when it brought out the V20 three years ago, which sported not only a great sound system, but also a removable battery. My wife continues to use my old V20 phone, rotating among 3 or 4 batteries to keep it powered (they only cost around $15, so we'll stock up on a few before they stop making them). The LG V40, which I currently use, still has a great sound system and headphone jack, but no longer has the replaceable battery, so it may not even outlast its ancestor the V20. Can't speak for other people, but as long as a high quality phone can still be had sporting a jack, I'll never buy one without - regardless of its OS or other features. Sound quality is that important to me. I'm hoping that by the time even LG copies Apple in that regard Bluetooth will have improved enough to equal analog in sound reproduction. I also hope that by that time my high end wired headphones will have worn out, so that I can at least enjoy using them while jacks remain available. We have to agree to disagree about Apple's motivation being to sell more of its Apple branded Bluetooth devices. Just look at this link (below) from the Apple website at their line up of Bluetooth headphones, speakers, and chargers, running from $150-$350 a pop. If even 50% of post-iPhone 6S customers buy any of these things, that brings in a rather huge profit for Apple music accessories. When they had a phone jack, you could go elsewhere to buy wired headphones, from cheap earbuds to expensive audiophile/studio quality, that required nothing but the phone to need battery charging and chargers.

https://www.apple.com/shop/accessories/all-accessories/headphones-speakers

Anyway, that's just my opinion on it all. It really didn't become a thorny issue for me until the jack was removed, causing folks who like wired sound to "leave the Apple garden" after so many years, when Bluetooth and phone jacks can co-exist with no problems. If it wasn't done solely to increase music accessory market share, then to remove it for the sake of a few millimeters of thinness or waterproofing was a bit bogus. I need to search old Macrumors posts just to see how many people were complaining about phone jacks and thickness of iPhones prior to the release of the iPhone 7. I'm guessing such complaints were very rare, and certainly not plentiful enough to justify completely removing the jack from all iOS devices. Time for me to quit beating this dead horse and hope that Apple will do something to convince me to buy a new iMac when this one needs replacement in a few years.
 
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It actually very much annoys me when non-Apple companies start copying everything Apple does, particularly what I consider to be the BAD things Apple does - like unnecessary removal of headphone jacks. This is an unfortunate move on the part of Apple competitors. Additionally, if you go way back, nearly all cell phones had jacks and removable batteries, and many -like Samsung- also sported mini-QRTY keyboards. I still miss those features, but most Android manufacturers copied Apple in going the non-removable battery route and ditching the pull out QRTY keyboard in favor of touch-only. LG was the last holdout with batteries when it brought out the V20 three years ago, which sported not only a great sound system, but also a removable battery. My wife continues to use my old V20 phone, rotating among 3 or 4 batteries to keep it powered (they only cost around $15, so we'll stock up on a few before they stop making them). The LG V40, which I currently use, still has a great sound system and headphone jack, but no longer has the replaceable battery, so it may not even outlast its ancestor the V20. Can't speak for other people, but as long as a high quality phone can still be had sporting a jack, I'll never by one without - regardless of its OS or other features. Sound quality is that important to me. I'm hoping that by the time even LG copies Apple in that regard Bluetooth will have improved enough to equal analog in sound reproduction. I also hope that by that time my high end wired headphones will have worn out, so that I can at least enjoy using them while jacks remain available. We have to agree to disagree about Apple's motivation being to sell more of its Apple branded Bluetooth devices. Just look at this link (below) from the Apple website at their line up of Bluetooth headphones, speakers, and chargers, running from $150-$350 a pop. If even 50% of post-iPhone 7 customers buy any of these things, that brings in a rather huge profit for Apple music accessories. When they had a phone jack, you could go elsewhere to buy wired headphones from cheap earbuds to expensive audiophile/studio quality headphones that required nothing but the phone to need battery charging and chargers.

https://www.apple.com/shop/accessories/all-accessories/headphones-speakers

Anyway, that's just my opinion on it all. It really didn't become a thorny issue for me until the jack was removed, causing folks who like wired sound to "leave the Apple garden" after so many years, when Bluetooth and phone jacks can co-exist with no problems. If it wasn't done solely to increase music accessory market share, then to remove it for the sake of a few millimeters of thinness was a bit bogus. I need to search old Macrumors posts just to see how many people were complaining about phone jacks and thickness of iPhones prior to the release of the iPhone 7. I'm guessing such complaints were very rare, and certainly not plentiful enough to justify completely removing the jack from all iOS devices. Time for me to quit beating this dead horse and hope that Apple will do something to convince me to buy a new iMac when this one needs replacement in a few years.

I fully agree with your comments. I received my first cell phone from my employer in 1998. It was a Motorola Star Tac. I then moved on to various Blackberry's from work and Nokias for personal use. All had removable batteries. While operating systems may have evolved for the better since then, there is no reason (other than pure greed) that current phones could not have batteries that the owner (the person who purchased the phone, not Apple who thinks they still own a phone after the user has bought it) could remove and replace. It is very unfortunate that the users of Apple phones (and other companies who have copied Apple) who are under a certain age know nothing else other than batteries that are glued in and are not permitted to be replaced by third parties, let alone the user who only forked over $ 1,000 for the device.
 
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so judging from all the advertising of these, if you wear glasses, you can't wear these???
Indeed I wear glasses and getting them on is an endeavor (even without glasses on it's a pain, and annoying if you're coming from AirPods).

In addition I have constant issues with the left pair not coming on (and maybe 10% neither)... I'd say 25% of the time I have to take them off, put them back in the case, and then try again :(

My AirPods were true magic (but I run and sweat like hell)... my PB3 are great as well (though they've gone bad after a few months... on my 4th return pair) My Jabra units pair *better* than the PBPros.

Also the PBPros though sound better than the AirPods are underwhelming in terms of sound quality... It still feels that the Beats brand is geared toward those with more money/vanity than brains... I'd like to see Apple branded sport phones... at least with those they're not going to risk the brand with crap... and I've already spend around $2000 on headphones looking for that perfect set... hopefully someone will make them before it crosses $3000.
 
I cannot possibly imagine a "decent" DAC that could fit in an iPhone. The on-board version is adequate for low power headphones. If you know what a DAC is and you think you need one, you should also know that it would be impossible to have a high end DAC in an ~8 mm phone that is already cramped with modems, antennae, processors, batteries, etc. It would more than double the size, shape, and weight of the device. My little portable USB-based SoundBlaster DAC would never fit in any smartphone, at least not one that ever made a major impact on the industry. I don't even think this little guy would qualify as "decent" for many audiophiles, but it sure is a quantum leap better than the Realtek crap in my work laptop...

Now that I've gone and made sweeping claims about the audio industry... do you (or anyone else) know of an ultra-compact DAC that competes with large, discrete-component DACs? :)
Warning, this is t.m.i. for most folks. Just wanted to answer Adoniram.

You should really try out the LG V20/30/40 line. LG specifically focuses on sound reproduction with the V-series phones, beginning with the V20 release three years ago. Its DAC is quite good - about as good as a portable smartphone can accomodate - and is activated whenever the system detects a high impedance speaker device plugged into the jack, at which point the "Sound quality and effects, DTS:X 3D Surround, Hi-Fi Quad DAC" software is enabled. No external amplifier is needed for speakers under 100 ohms. The photos below show some of the sound adjustments available for the internal DAC once activated (none of this works with Bluetooth). I guess this is relevant to iPhones, as I'm using my 6S+ to take these photos of my V40, retrieved the photos via iCloud to my iMac, from which I'm posting this ...

IMG_0275.JPG IMG_0276.JPG IMG_0277.JPG IMG_0278.JPG IMG_0279.JPG

I'm aware of what D-to-A converters and amplifiers are, and that there are some very high end external ones available. I may purchase one when I have the money available. Right now I make do with mid-high end headphones, a smartphone with nice overall spec's and great sound, and fairly inexpensive DAC/Amp devices to use with my headphones when needed. I can't at this time recommend high end DAC, as I don't have the bucks to purchase one right now. You are correct that my low end DAC/Amps aren't "audiophile" quality. Right now I have to settle for some nice headphones (wired). I have two <100 ohm Sennheisers (open and closed) which work very well with the V40 and my laptops. My laptops have pretty good sound software to enhance the analog signal coming out of their jacks - enough to power either of my Beyerdynamic 150 ohm ear covers.

In any case, my overall point regarding this topic is that, by eliminating the 3.5 mm jack, Apple cannot approach what LG is doing for sound on its V-series phones. Even my 6S+ with jack doesn't approach LG's offerings for great sound quality - it just doesn't have the same quality DAC or software needed. That isn't to say that Apple can't do this - they just won't. My hope is that LG doesn't cave to the trend of removing the jack from all mobile devices.
 
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My pair (in black) is on a Qantas plane shuttling between Melbourne and Los Angeles. Was such a long flight that I took them off and fell asleep and they are somewhere on the aircraft but couldn't find them! Had no luck finding them after contacting the airline multiple times.

If Tim wants to talk to me about Jonny's role, I'm available...
 
$250? Really? And reviews say they sound very similar to the Powerbeats 3...I bought a few pair of those recently for $30 each used like new...$30 vs $250 is a no brainer to me...Be smart people, buying this only tells Apple their prices are spot on
I have both. The new Powerbeat Pro sound considerably better. The wireless functionality/connectivity is far superior. I am not sure if it worth the extra price, but these a premium headphones that compare to other headphones in this price range.
 
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