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Originally posted by pilotgi
The _fact_ is that a lower clocked G5 is _not_ too hot to put in a laptop. [/B]

If this is indeed a "_fact_", please post the documentation!

Otherwise I'll believe the _indications_ which are that the G5 along with it's memory subsystem and chipset are too hot for a notebook.

Perhaps better stated: indications are that modifying the existing G5 technology to fit a notebook will produce a product no better than a G4 based system.

So, of course, if there are no G4's for a notebook this might be the only course of action and people who are more interested in a processor label than a quality product will be thrilled...

Personally, I'd prefer an improved G4 first and a G5 when it's ready.
 
Re: Why don't these rumour sites just admit they know absolutely nothing

Originally posted by LOZ23
Why don't these rumour sites just admit they know absolutely nothing about the powerbook situation........ Oh, silly me, that would mean reduced traffic and reduced advertising revenue. Please remember that the prime objective for sites like these is to make money, which is before there desire to offer advice to potential customers............ So, expect more rumors

My my, aren't you the cynical one? If the purpose of websites like these is to make money, then in my case at least, they are failing spectacularly. I've never clicked on an ad link from any of these sites once. And my perception has been that the purpose of MacRumors at least is not to make money, nor does it seem to be for any of the others. It seems the primary objective of all such sites (Except MacWhispers) is to provide information and an opportunity to discuss goings-on in the Mac community.
 
accept what you want to. there are people inside apple testing g5 powerbooks. i don't know if its for the upcoming revision, or two years down the line. i would imagine that g5 powerbooks do arrive this year (but that is only speculation on my part). i can say that heat is/was not as big of an issue as people keep saying. also, apple has had a long time to work with the g5, so its not like they just started trying to get it in a laptop after they announced the desktop.

again, accept what you want. please don't flame me for telling what i know.
 
Re: G5 Chips

Originally posted by pkradd
The current IBM chip cannot be used for a portable. It runs too hot and uses up too much battery life. Have you people noticed that the new G5 has lots of fans and heat sinks for the processor? Why are some people unable to face reality.

Wrong, wrong, wrong. You couldn't BE more wrong. REALITY is that current IBM 970 chips CAN be used in a notebook. At 1.2 Ghz, the PowerPC 970 dissipates LESS heat and uses LESS power than G4s running at the same speed. Go to IBM and look at the reality. The fans are for cooling the superfast RAM, SerialATA Hard drives, Superdrive, and system controller chip, not JUST the G5s. That and Apple's strategy was to use 8 or 9 QUIET fans than one or two LOUD ones. Use some common sense.

This doesn't necessarily mean we will have PBG5s soon, but they are entirely possible with current processors. That and the facts have been stated
a hundred times.
 
Re: Re: I wonder...

Originally posted by arn
if you read the linked articles, you would know the answer to that.
But Arn, you do know that any good web site discourages users from venturing off their web site. 😉
 
Originally posted by beloit08
Maybe, back in January when Steve said this would be the "year of the laptop," what he really meant was that we'd be stuck with the same laptop all year.
hahaha That was funny.
 
Re: G5 Chips

Originally posted by pkradd
The current IBM chip cannot be used for a portable. It runs too hot and uses up too much battery life.
I have heard that often, and I have seen the large heat sinks on the G5s, but I have one observation that I was wondering if anyone else has made:

At a local Apple store I kept one hand at the back of a G5 and another hand at the back of a G4, and it sure feels like the G5 runs cooler than the G4.

Probably just a tactile illusion, but I found it interesting. I wonder if all those fans and giant heat sinks are more for keeping the machines quiet (which they were) than just cooling the system. 🙂
 
What the heck Motorola?! More delay?

As far as I'm concerned, G4 15" Aluminium PowerBook at this point is useless, if G5 PowerBook is indeed coming early next year.

Man, Motorola stinks.
 
How come this rumor has 14 positive ratings? Are 14 people out there Happy about this, or do they just vote the opposite of everyone else.
 
Originally posted by manu chao
the design and robustness of Powerbooks would still tilt the balance towards Apple.
I think my biggest tilt, is the fact that I've spent thousands of dollars on OS X software and don't want to buy it all for a pc. Photoshop, Illustrator, GoLive, LiveMotion, Dreamweaver, Flash, Premier. Plus I wouldn't give up the ease of the iLife apps for a pc...

Another tilt is that I haven't had a virus or any major problems with my Mac. Not that I'd be foolish enough to open an email from someone I didn't know or look at the extension of the email... but hey it could be fun.
 
Originally posted by mainstreetmark
How come this rumor has 14 positive ratings? Are 14 people out there Happy about this, or do they just vote the opposite of everyone else.

Probably windows trolls and zealous owners of the current powerbooks.
 
Probably just a tactile illusion, but I found it interesting. I wonder if all those fans and giant heat sinks are more for keeping the machines quiet (which they were) than just cooling the system.

Yes, as has been stated a few times here and elsewhere. Unfortunately, some (not you) continue to keep repeating the incorrect perception that the mass of cooling design that went into the G5 is because the chips are little mini-nuclear reactors. It's basically an over-engineered design to make the system quiet. I'm not sure I can remember a high-powered system in recent years that was as quiet as the G5's seem to be. That's impressive, though it undoubtedly contributes a bit to the high cost and large size of the machines.

Remember also that the current G5 would go into a laptop at a lower clock rate and lower voltage than the PowerMacs, just as the G4's in existing PowerBooks run slower than those in the last PowerMac G4's.

Finally, to those who insist on repeating the fiction of how hot the G5 is: how does the cooling system look on a G4 DP1.42? Big heatsinks, loud fans. Does that mean the G4 can't go into a laptop?

I'm not saying the G5 PowerBooks are imminent, but it's not impossible. Certainly, the 90 nm 970 will be a *better* laptop processor than the current one, and it's likely that if they do come out in the near term with a 130 nm G5 in a PowerBook, that'll leave room open for a nice speed bump and/or battery life improvement when they move to the 90 nm parts.

With all that said, I do not know how laptop-ready the various support components in the G5 are. The lack of L3 cache in a G5 system should help a little, though.

Sorry for the long rant, it just drives me crazy hearing the "G5 too hot for a laptop because of 9 fans in the PowerMac" thing over and over.
 
Rumours mean nothing just before a keynote. Its coming up so soon that to read rumours and get overexcited over rumours is stupid.

And I feel your pain, guys. I want an iBook, and am waiting for the PB's get on the move first to allow the iBooks to get into the GHz zone.

Why can't IBM just make 1.2GHz G5s for us and end this madness?
 
Re: Fiscal year most likely

Originally posted by iPC
Fiscal year in the USA is generally accepted as:
1 October—30 September

That was why I *purposely* only said "year" and not "fiscal year". The original poster said the 4th quarter was only a few days old.

Without any qualifier, the 4th quarter (in Wall Street and other terms) begins Oct 1. Not Sept 1.
 
No Stock for awhile now

The channel has been dry for sometime now, so many clients are getting upset because of the lack of the 15" and the 12". The 17" which are widely available don't fit everyone's needs nor budget. This is a nitemare, how long have we been waiting now? Bring on the new machines, we need them bad!🙁
 
Re: G5 Chips

Originally posted by pkradd
It runs too hot and uses up too much battery life. Have you people noticed that the new G5 has lots of fans and heat sinks for the processor? Why are some people unable to face reality.

This has been discussed ad nauseam and no one has provided any concrete evidence to back this up. On the contrary, the evidence shows that a G5 running at the same speed will use approximately the same power as a G4. Likewise overall, it will use *less* power because it is missing some of the cache that the G4 uses. As far as the fans go, they run *low* speed, meaning low noise, meaning they need more of them to cool a dual 2Ghz machine.

What is with the "unable to face reality" comment? No one making the claim that the G5 is too hot has provided evidence of this. Instead I see baseless claims like this while refusing to point to any documentation showing something else. Last week and the week before several of us provided many links detailing the information above, by the way.

If you know of some, please tell us.
 
Motorola's fiscal year is the calendar year

According to the 2002 annual report, and the 2003 2nd quarter report Motorola's fiscal year is the same as the calendar year. (see motorola.com)

Thus both the fiscal year and calendar year are the same and begin October 1.

Perhaps that can resolve it? ;-)
 
Re: What delay?

Originally posted by Phinius
A Motorola press release clearly stated that the 7457 chips would be available in the fourth quarter of 2003. The fourth quarter starts in October, not July or August.

As amtter of fact, if you search the posts, you'll find that Motorola revised that announcement to say that the 7457's would be availabel in Q3 of 2003, meaning the end of September at the latest.

Motorola just seems to be a monument of incompetence when it comes to processor production. Perhaps they should just stick to cell phones and the like.
 
whoa whoa whoa...

Originally posted by ColoJohnBoy
Motorola just seems to be a monument of incompetence when it comes to processor production. Perhaps they should just stick to cell phones and the like.

Their cell-phones aren't too great either... in fact, I'd say they're on par for this debacle..
 
This has been discussed ad nauseam and no one has provided any concrete evidence to back this up. On the contrary, the evidence shows that a G5 running at the same speed will use approximately the same power as a G4. Likewise overall, it will use *less* power because it is missing some of the cache that the G4 uses. As far as the fans go, they run *low* speed, meaning low noise, meaning they need more of them to cool a dual 2Ghz machine.

What is with the "unable to face reality" comment? No one making the claim that the G5 is too hot has provided evidence of this. Instead I see baseless claims like this while refusing to point to any documentation showing something else. Last week and the week before several of us provided many links detailing the information above, by the way.

If you know of some, please tell us.
I agree.

I think people see giant heat sinks and fans on G5 and deduce that it runs hot, which is not unreasonable guess.

But I believe number of fans has to do with cooling "zones" that Apple set up. And size of heat sinks has to do with taking burden off fans in order to reduce fan noise which was big complaint in last G4 Power Macs.
 
Please check out these pages.

http://www-3.ibm.com/chips/techlib/techlib.nsf/techdocs/A1387A29AC1C2AE087256C5200611780

http://www-3.ibm.com/chips/techlib/techlib.nsf/techdocs/7874C7DA8607C0B287256BF3006FBE54

If you bother to look they detail that at 1.2GHz the 970 consumes about 19 Watts. The older document ( pre-production ) shows 1.8 GHz@42Watts and 1.2@19Watts. The newer document only lists the 1.8GHz chip @ 47Watts. Assume that productions numbers scaled comparably for 1.2Ghz and you get a number of around 22Watts (est.)

And CentaurAtlas is right - this info has been posted numerous times!

I suspect that there are several reasons for the cooling system design ( or over-design ).

1.) Quietness - a common complaint for the PM G4.
2.) Realibility of the processors and other high spec components.
3.) Long life of the current chassis design. I think that this is important to consider as the chassis looks design to not only handle today's architecture but more powerful, potentially hotter architectures in the future.

That said, I do have concerns with the G5 in a laptop. For one, the system controller chip is susposedly a major heat source. Apple probably has a laptop version in the works but was the design concurrent? Who knows...

Also, the dual RAM banks would seem to take up quite a bit of room in a laptop.

I doubt that a G5 will be ready by Paris - one of the reason I doubt this is related to the supply. It is highly doubtful that such a computer would be available for immediate shipping. Current stock levels point to a upcoming revision to ship immediately.
 
The thing that a lot of people are failing to grasp is that even if a model came out a day after you bought yours, that wouldn't change how good yours is. I can see why someone may be mad if they bought something and then a week later a new model came out but as far as months it shouldn't matter. The pc market spits out new computers on a continuous basis and yet some of you would freak out if a better mac was released a few months later. Thats technology and although its getting easier to predict from 10 years ago there will always be new models out and it' something that one has to deal with. Just remember that it doesn't affect your model at all except prevents you from toting that you have the latest and greatest.
-Steve
 
A prediciton......

I had a dream last night that the 15" powerbooks were finally realeased with intel-based architecture.

MAKE IT STOP!!!!!
MAKE IT STOP!!!!!


peej
🙁
 
as a pc user and a mac-switcher-wannabe all I can say is for anyone in my shoes (want/need new laptop), hold out. we've all waited this long, we can wait a little longer.

at this point, it can't be too much further down the road (as everyone else is saying) befor the G5 powerbooks come out. if moto was doing an excellent job of supplying cpus to apple, we would have g4 PBs now and they would have the contract for the next big apple processor.

that's not the case, and ibm now has apple's attention so it's pretty clear that apple will switch over ASAP to the G5 line in all their comps, probably by the end of '04.

even if the new PBs have a speed bump moto cpu, look for apple to use them as temporarily as possible to hold off the market craze until the G5 PBs can be released.

here's a thought, maybe apple will release the g4 PB upgrades as the new iBooks and announce the new G5 PBs as being released in Jan/Feb.

until then, I'm pc building and crossing my fingers for a (more) timely release of the G5 PBs
 
I'm about to sell my 17" iMac and buy a 12" powerbook.. so I should wait until Paris Expo???

I just want a fast notebook with a combo drive for less than $1600 (current 12"ers are at that price point.. but I'm hoping the 12" will get a speed bump, but no price bump..).
 
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