Powermac G5 Quad online video performance

[PowerPCMacMan]

Sorry

My mistake.. But I do know that it would require a G5 I believe unless there is a way for it to run on a high end G4.

Maybe it was iLife 11.. I know that is Intel only.

You're wrong. iMovie 09 is totally compatible with PPC.

 

[ihuman:D]

As we have all on here been saying to you.. If you want the G5 Quad or any PowerMac PowerPC machine keep in mind that its not contemporary and software will be hard to find for it.

But, if you plan on using it for everyday stuff and don't need high end software then by all means come aboard and enjoy! I can help you also as if you need anything I can provide it to you. The best version of iMovie for the G5 Quad would be iMovie 08 as 09 is Intel only.

Actually iMovie HD 6 is much better than iMovie '08 IMO.

 

[Goftrey]

Actually iMovie HD 6 is much better than iMovie '08 IMO.

Totally agree. I still use iMovie HD even on my iMac running Lion. For simplicity & ease of use (which is the whole aim of iMovie) iMovie HD is unbeatable.

 

[lucasfer899]

Totally agree. I still use iMovie HD even on my iMac running Lion. For simplicity & ease of use (which is the whole aim of iMovie) iMovie HD is unbeatable.

With all this talk about it, when my G5 comes in, I'll definitely be a user

 

[Frost7]

Actually iMovie HD 6 is much better than iMovie '08 IMO.

I agree. I haven't really been a big fan since iMovie HD 6. I used iMovie to create some killer videos back in college, so I'll always love that old interface.

 

[blppt]

Sorry for bumping this old thread, but I ran across this when doing some G5 related searches on Google.

One thing I wanted to clear up---the VERY LAST version of flash for PPC Macs was indeed SMP aware, and actually scaled very well to decode the bloated mess that is flash video. For some 1080p youtube vids (using flash not HTML5), the CPU utilitzation on my G5 Quad with 10.5.8 could go above 300%, which means, of course, that it was using all 4 cores.

I *think* the version is 10.1.102.64, which you can find if you do a google search. Its also probably the best performing version for scrolling webpages and such as well...although for the smoothest browsing experience you should probably use Click2Flash along with a G5 compiled browser like WebKit (there is a G5 version out there---works really well on my Quad) or iCab browser, which is surprisingly fleet.

Just For Anybody who is still interested.

Also, for multithreaded mkv or likewise playback, I find Mplayer OSX Extended and the last version of VLC for PPC (2.0.9?) are both multithreaded on PPC and work very well on 1080p mkvs and the like. Just dont turn on the sharpen filter---apparently that is NOT multithreaded in FFMpeg, and can really make things choppy on 1080p vids even on my Quad.

One more thing...one guy claims to be running 4k vids on his G5 Quad...I seriously dont know how that is possible---4k vids can tax even my i7-3770k, which is a magnitude more powerful than a G5 Quad. Its pretty much impossible unless its a very low bitrate and/or a very efficient decoder that is significantly better than VLC (multithreaded FFMpeg version) or MPlayer OSX extended.

Not that it really matters anyways---I dont think even a flashed 512MB 7800GTX/Quadro could ever output a 4k signal to a monitor/TV.

 

[ihuman:D]

Welcome to the POWERC Forums blppt! Very good info. If the guy was Rabidz7 just ignore him.

 

[gavinstubbs09]

Never knew that the latter of Flash was SMP aware... that's interesting. Shoot, attempting to watch 4K youtube videos on my Mac Pro lags out even with a upgraded graphics card.

 

[Intell]

I don't think PowerPC Flash is SMP aware. I've never seen TFF or Safari/WebKit use more than 110% of a dual PowerPC CPU on Leopard or Tiger when playing Flash content. Intell Macs, yes. But never on a PowerPC Mac.

 

[blppt]

I don't think PowerPC Flash is SMP aware. I've never seen TFF or Safari/WebKit use more than 110% of a dual PowerPC CPU on Leopard or Tiger when playing Flash content. Intell Macs, yes. But never on a PowerPC Mac.

Here ya go, screenie I just ran of a 1080p youtube flash video, you can see the Flash version in the other browser window, and Activity Monitor shows over 200% cpu usage for WebKit. (2+ cores being used).

 

[blppt]

Welcome to the POWERC Forums blppt! Very good info. If the guy was Rabidz7 just ignore him.

LOL, thanks. Just wanted to shorten the search time for G5 new owners---it took me quite a while to track down the best performing flash version.

 

[Intell]

Here ya go, screenie I just ran of a 1080p youtube flash video, you can see the Flash version in the other browser window, and Activity Monitor shows over 200% cpu usage for WebKit. (2+ cores being used).

I'm unable to reproduce those results using similar parameters. Still maxing out at a little over 100%. Flash Player didn't include SMP functions until 10.2 and multithreaded abilities until 11.4, as per the engineering release notes.

 

[honam1021]

How well can a G5 play iTunes HD film once the movie is decrypted with a HDCP compliment intel Mac or Windows PC?

 

[blppt]

I'm unable to reproduce those results using similar parameters. Still maxing out at a little over 100%. Flash Player didn't include SMP functions until 10.2 and multithreaded abilities until 11.4, as per the engineering release notes.

Well, I'm telling you, without multithreading ability there would be no way I could play 1080p Youtube videos on flash. HD Flash Video is ridiculously cpu-intensive. It IS multithreaded in 10.1 for PPC at least. Actually, I wouldnt be able to play most 1080p content in a single-threaded player---using a 1080p VLC would drop frames or make for some awful performance before VLC adapted the multithreaded fork of FFmpeg (I believe sometime around 2.0 or so).

That engineering paper is clearly inaccurate, unless you believe that I managed to fake the results above somehow. And as you can see, there is nothing else being done in the 2 windows i have open of Webkit that would be using 200+% cpu.

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How well can a G5 play iTunes HD film once the movie is decrypted with a HDCP compliment intel Mac or Windows PC?

It depends, if its 1080p, and you are talking a single-core G5, I'd imagine it wouldnt work very well.

If you dont have to use itunes or Quicktime to play this decoded file, the last version of VLC for PowerPC (2.0.9 I believe) should be able to handle 1080p video on a multi-core G5. You'd really be pushing in on a Dual Core G5, unless you have one of the later PowerMac Duallies.

 

[Intell]

Well, I'm telling you, without multithreading ability there would be no way I could play 1080p Youtube videos on flash. HD Flash Video is ridiculously cpu-intensive. It IS multithreaded in 10.1 for PPC at least. Actually, I wouldnt be able to play most 1080p content in a single-threaded player---using a 1080p VLC would drop frames or make for some awful performance before VLC adapted the multithreaded fork of FFmpeg (I believe sometime around 2.0 or so).

That engineering paper is clearly inaccurate, unless you believe that I managed to fake the results above somehow. And as you can see, there is nothing else being done in the 2 windows i have open of Webkit that would be using 200+% cpu.

Flash 10 is not multithreaded. It wasn't until 11.4. There was lots of hoopla when it became multithreaded because of that. It simply is not because of how it is designed to be. You're stating that the engineering papers, the people who made it, are inaccurate? That's like Apple stating Macs don't use Intell CPUs in their current machines.

 

[blppt]

Flash 10 is not multithreaded. It wasn't until 11.4. There was lots of hoopla when it became multithreaded because of that. It simply is not because of how it is designed to be. You're stating that the engineering papers, the people who made it, are inaccurate? That's like Apple stating Macs don't use Intell CPUs in their current machines.

I'm sorry, but you are wrong. You must be talking about other elements of flash (non-h.264 video) that aren't multithreaded prior to 11.4. The video h.264 portion (i'm assuming that youtube is still using 264 ATM) is, quite clearly, multi-core aware in 10.1.102.64. And if you downgrade 10.1 to 9.x on PPC, voila---flash youtube 1080p doesnt use more than 100% cpu and 1080p videos are unwatchably slow.

Try this on your multicore PPC mac:

First uninstall old flash version(s):

http://helpx.adobe.com/flash-player/kb/uninstall-flash-player-mac-os.html#main_10_4

Then, download 10.1.102.64:

http://fpdownload.macromedia.com/ge...hive/fp_10.1.102.64_and_9.0.289.0_archive.zip

Install the 102.64 version in the archive.

Now, load up a 1080p youtube video with Activity Monitor on the right (make sure you aren't in the HTML5 trial of Youtube, make sure you've selected 1080p in the video frame) and if you still arent getting above 100% cpu on a multicore system, there's something wrong with your computer. I've reinstalled OSX twice on my quad in its lifetime, and not once has flash 10.1.102.64 failed to be multicore-ready for flash video.

 

[Intell]

Stating that I'm incorrect is the same as stating Adobe is incorrect, when it clearly is not. Flash Player up to 11.4 was mono-threaded for every singular element. A video file is a single element within the Flash world. Of course Flash 9 would have worse playback, it's an older version that isn't as well optimized for PowerPC. The release of 10.0 and more so the early 10.1 releases brought about may enhancements for the PowerPC architecture.

Now you're blaming my systems as having a problem when you know nothing of them. Flash responded the same was with little over 100% total usage one two dual G4s, three dual G5s, and two quads. All of them running stock Leopard with the latest version of Flash for PowerPC Macs tested with both TenFourFox and WebKit/Safari. Same results across the board.

 

[blppt]

Listen, I dont know what your problem is, but you are wrong. There is no explanation for me being able to play 1080p youtube videos smoothly on a G5 quad other than h.264 flash being multithreaded.

Unless the 1080p flash video in question was such a low bitrate as to not even make it worthy of even 720p.

I'm starting to wonder if you actually have any of those PPC systems, or have tried the last flash version for PPC (10.1.102.64) because your blatant denial of what has already been shown to you is puzzling to say the least.

I gave you visual proof of multithreading, and you act like I made it up and it didnt happen. So far I'm not seeing any proof on your end of you running 10.1.102.64 and an 1080p youtube video on a multicore G5, and the process going no higher than 100%.

And even if you did post a screenshot of that exact situation on a G5 quad, I'd still say you didnt set something up properly---BECAUSE IT WORKS ON MY MACHINE---and you have proof it does.

Saying "I'm wrong" is like saying---yeah, I see a screenshot--with my own two eyes--with Mavericks running on non-apple hardware, but its not possible because some Apple propaganda told me it wasn't.

 

[Intell]

It isn't my fault you are somehow achieving the impossible with multithreaded Flash. It has been clearly outlined and documented that Flash is not multithreaded on version 10. If you fail to realize that, please go read through Adobe's documentation on ActionScript and how it isn't able to do more the one thing on pre-11.4 Flash Player. It's rather silly how you are going on about my "blatant denial" when you yourself are still denying Flashes multithreading abilities.

In summation, one random (as per the Internet as a whole) versus a large corporation such as Adobe. Screenshots are meaningless. They are easily faked and can be altered. I've seen Mac OS X running on non-Apple hardware. There's nothing in Mac OS X's code that is actively preventing that. Whereas Flash Player, a closed sourced binary, is somehow able to do something that is not within its codebase? Simply untrue. A better analogy would be having Snow Leopard natively running on a PowerPC Mac. Something is missing (the PowerPC code), yet it somehow magically works.

 

[blppt]

In summation, one random (as per the Internet as a whole) versus a large corporation such as Adobe. Screenshots are meaningless. They are easily faked and can be altered. I've seen Mac OS X running on non-Apple hardware. There's nothing in Mac OS X's code that is actively preventing that.

More nonsense. You have to have a FakeSMC hack plugin to BYPASS the protection Apple has built into OSX for Intel in order to make OSX to run on non-Apple hardware.

And explain to me, what, exactly, would I personally gain by creating a photoshop promoting a depreciated plugin for a company I dont work for? For a DEAD apple platform????

The conspiracy theories, my God. You can live in your little world of denial if you choose, but I know for certain I can play 1080p Youtube videos smoothly on my Quad. And I've proven it. We know this is IMPOSSIBLE without a multithreaded h.264 renderer---no single G5 core ever made has the horsepower to play 1080p flash due to its (flash) massive overhead for HD videos.

Even *if* the videos didnt play smoothly (which you of course, cannot see from a still screengrab) look at Activity Monitor! Something in WebKit is using 2 and 80% of a third core! There are two windows open---one has an 1080p youtube video playing, and the other has the adobe flash checker webpage (to prove the version to you). Explain what, exactly, is using that cpu time???

As of right now, I cant even be sure you even own a PowerMac, nevermind the 4 or so you claim to have tried 10.1.102.64 on. None of what you've said to explain away my "magical G5" has made a lick of sense.

I sure as heck do not have access to the flash source code nor the programming ability to rebuild their 264 rendering engine from scratch.

 

[Intell]

FakeSMC isn't needed to bypass Apple's checks when using a properly modified kernel or DSDT.aml file. I'm treating this like a scientific paper. It is not proven unless other third parties are able to achieve the same results using the same process. I myself have not been able to achieve the same results, rendering the whole experiment null and void. Much like the cold fusion fiasco that went through the scientific community. I'm still fascinated how you state I cannot see something when you yourself is unable to read Adobe's release notes. If you don't have access to Flash's source code, then that makes your claims even more bogus.

 

[ifrit05]

Flash 11.3 and versions under don't offer multithreading at all, on any platform/archetecture. It states so in the Adobe Documentation on ActionScript; it's that simple, go read it.

FakeSMC.kext is a System Management Controller Emulator. The SMC is a low level device on intel Macs that control things like fans, collect system temp info, etc. It's the only absolutely mandatory kernel extension in a Hackintosh, unless you have proper edits in your DSDT or proper kernel patches. It has nothing to do with bypassing any Apple system checks or equivalent.

I think this thread has gotten outta control.

 

[blppt]

FakeSMC isn't needed to bypass Apple's checks when using a properly modified kernel or DSDT.aml file.

Nope. The DSDT only allows certain hardware configurations such as ports or audio devices to work properly. You still need other hacks with it or you will never reach the desktop. I have a Hack, and it has both a patched DSDT in /E/E and FakeSMC in /S/L/E.

And now, you are talking about modding the kernel or adding a patched DSDT ? Uhhh, is that *not* something that has to be done because Apple is trying to keep OSX off of non-Apple hardware? What exactly was the point of your last post then???

But I digress...this is about Flash 10.1.102.64. I have posted proof, you still deny.

" If you don't have access to Flash's source code, then that makes your claims even more bogus."

Wha? What is WRONG with you? I posted screencaps from my own Quad PROVING it is multithreaded, which is what is known as "REAL LIFE EXAMPLES" and all you can do is mention some whitepaper document vaguely.

" I myself have not been able to achieve the same results, rendering the whole experiment null and void."

Either you havent even tried, or there is something wrong with your Quad. Maybe you have an old version of flash 9 that refuses to be removed by that uninstall tool.

There is absolutely no way for me to achieve the results you saw with your own eyes other than it being multithreaded, but hey, go on, continue to deny.

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Flash 11.3 and versions under don't offer multithreading at all, on any platform/archetecture. It states so in the Adobe Documentation on ActionScript; it's that simple, go read it.

Nope. You are confusing the h.264 rendering engine, which is DEFINITELY multithreaded as I showed, and other elements of the Flash rendering engine.

I dont NEED to read any whitepapers--the mere fact that 1080p flash plays smoothly on Youtube on my Quad is proof. It would not be possible otherwise. I think we can all agree on that, no? Look at Activity Monitor.

 

[Intell]

You're taking this all too far. It cannot be done by any stretch of one's imagination. You're still presenting disproven material using falsified screenshots against the maker's proven and published whitepapers. Please stop. You're making yourself look rather ridiculous. ifrit05 is correct about the hackintosh points. Little more than a kernel patch or properly working DSDT.aml is needed. If you've never gotten to the desktop without other hacks, you may want to reevaluate your chosen hardware for better compatibility.

 

[ifrit05]

I'm not going to get involved in this anymore than I have but I'm telling you at least versions 11.1 and below DO NOT offer ANY video decode multithreading.

One of the new features that came out of 11.2 WAS multitheaded video decoding. As PPC Macs cant run any 11 version of flash, that ability is not available to the platform.

Yes my Dual G5 can play 1080p also but it lagged out on the Radeon 9800XT. Using the nVidia GeForce 7800GS HD videos play smoothly (flash included). So it might just be the GPU that helps a bit, not flash itself.