Price aside, what is actually wrong with the Late-2016 MBP?

Discussion in 'MacBook Pro' started by benguild, Nov 16, 2016.

  1. benguild macrumors 6502a

    Jul 29, 2003
    Honestly, I can't understand what everyone is upset about.
    • I agree these computers are expensive, but if you buy a well-spec'ed one it should last you at least 3-4 years.
    • I would always just get the SSD-size I need from Apple, and wouldn't remove it unless it was being replaced by Apple anyway.
    • The size/build and color options of the computer are better.
    • USB-C is exactly what I've been waiting for, because from time to time I needed 3x USB3 ports on my current rMBP. This gives much more flexibility.
    • The processors will obviously be bumped up next year, probably alongside 32GB of RAM. You can just wait 9-12 months and buy then.
    • Yes, the ESC key being gone is weird but not the end of the world.
    ... I do miss MagSafe, but what is actually wrong? It seems like everything is exactly on-par with what I expected/hoped for.

    My only annoying costs:
    • 1 x extra AC adapter for my work bag
    • Third-party replacement USB-C cables for my external devices from Monoprice or whatever. (cheap, who cares!)
    • A new USB-C Ethernet adapter instead of my current Thunderbolt one. (not expensive)
    ... That's a small price to pay to have everything be more universal.

    Seems fine. What's up? :confused:
  2. leman macrumors G3

    Oct 14, 2008
    Nothing is wrong, some people just have unreasonable expectations.
  3. largefarrva macrumors 6502a

    Jun 30, 2012
    So far I'm pretty happy with mine. Keyboard is loud and will take some getting used to, but just like going from my old desktop keyboards to the one on my 2012 rMBP, I got used to it quick enough. Love this display and the speed of this machine. Well worth it. I'm positive it'll last me a good 4-5 years like my 2012 did.
  4. CpGER macrumors newbie

    Nov 7, 2016
    As I wrote often.
    - I have no problem with USB-C but only if there are some legacy ports.
    I need a portable laptop and the necessity of carrying a bag of dongles is not my definition of portable and for my use cases it is unacceptable. Especially the missing SD card slot and the missing mag safe connection is a huge step back.

    - Even worse is the keyboard (for me personally) it is complete nightmare, too less movement.
    Feels like constantly jumping on concrete with barefoot.
    It is far too loud to use in quite office environment or at home. If the sound of the keyboard disturbs my thoughts something is wrong.
    - The touch bar is nothing less than a battery draining gimmick with no use to me.

    - Missing 32GB option
    - Missing 2TB ssd option

    Apple could have kept the size and put more storage and battery power in it.
    It seems people like it but I need a battle horse and not a donkey with fancy spoilers on it.
  5. kokhoong0624 macrumors regular


    Aug 23, 2015
    There is a 2TB SSD Option. :)
  6. Chupa Chupa macrumors G5

    Chupa Chupa

    Jul 16, 2002
    Yes, because there has never been an Apple pro laptop with a diverse selection of on-board ports on it. Crazy to expect something like that. Absolutely nuts.

    Seriously what exactly are the unreasonable expections that people had? That Apple would keep battery life steady, not backtrack? That it would forgo slimming down the case by mere mm's to avoid a flat butterfly-type keyboard? That it would not go warp speed into the future with connectors that a still a bit ahead of the game or at the very least would include an adapter in the box? Or is that too much to ask of a $1700-4000 laptop?

    Reality is I've yet to see one 100% glowing review for this laptop even from usually Mac positive reviewers. Sorry, but there is a lot of legitimate disappointment in this release. Unfortunately, it represents the future of Apple's flagship laptop so we will have to get use to it. But that doesn't mean it's great.
  7. CpGER macrumors newbie

    Nov 7, 2016
    I was talking about the 13 inch model.
  8. Newtons Apple, Nov 16, 2016
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2016

    Newtons Apple macrumors Core

    Newtons Apple

    Mar 12, 2014
    Jacksonville, Florida
    It lacks the ports I need daily.

    All for the sake of thinness!:(
  9. Samuelsan2001 macrumors 604

    Oct 24, 2013

    Nothing is wrong at all, Apple followed through on what they have been doing with the MacBook Pro line for the last decade, exactly as anyone's with any sense would have expected.
  10. CpGER macrumors newbie

    Nov 7, 2016
    People use computers for various reasons and users have also hundreds of different use cases and I honestly feel insulted if somebody just completely invalidates my needs with such a wording. Honestly seems to me a little bit egoistic/narcissistic.
    If the computer is fine for you be happy but don't tell us we have unreasonable expectations if you look at the rational arguments it is impossible to me to see how they are unreasonable.
    --- Post Merged, Nov 16, 2016 ---
    That is interesting I am always impressed from such visionary abilities.
    So you knew 10 years, 2 years ago that apple would drop all ports, mag safe, build a butterfly keyboard in a professional machine and including a battery draining touch bar gimmick to interfere with "PRO" users who use shortcuts frequently.

    Users like me have at the moment no accepatble portable computer lineup except the 2015 macbook pro.

    P.S.> Maybe you can give me a hint of next lottery numbers you seem so gifted.
  11. leman macrumors G3

    Oct 14, 2008
    Asking for a 100W+ GPU or 32GB RAM are unrealistic expectations. Why so? Because Apple has followed a fairly clear line of though with their laptop line for at least the last decade. Which is making a super-portable laptop and at the same time cramming as much performance into it they can technically, without sacrificing the portability.
  12. brynsmith23 macrumors regular

    Jan 24, 2007

    So you want a 13 inch with 32gb and a 2 Tb SSD.

    Yeah, thats not happening anytime soon.
  13. Uplift macrumors 6502

    Feb 1, 2011
    I dont get the CPU hate.. everyone was waiting for Skylake, it gets delivered and now it's a POS and everyones waiting for SomethingElseLake.

    MagSafe though, worst decision EVER! and thinness will never be a good argument, or convenience, nothing was safer or more convenient than magsafe. I actually predict it will return... it was one of the thinnest ports on the Macbook.

    People are just never happy and always want more, more than they need, underestimating power of whats infront of them.
  14. CpGER macrumors newbie

    Nov 7, 2016
    Your selective perception is really impressive.
    My points are in an order and it is funny how you focus on points that are at the end of my list.
    As I wrote the deal breakers are the ports, the butterfly keyboard and the touch bar.

    The 32GB ram would be nice to have and it would be more 32GB or 2 TB but as I said nice to have.
  15. AdonisSMU macrumors 603

    Oct 23, 2010
  16. CpGER macrumors newbie

    Nov 7, 2016
    I would not call a laptop that needs a bag of dongles super-portable but as I said before everyone has a different definition of that.
  17. aristobrat macrumors G5

    Oct 14, 2005
    Which also doesn't have 32GB of RAM or the 2TB SSD option that you need???
    --- Post Merged, Nov 16, 2016 ---
    Out of curiosity, what peripherals do you travel with that would require dongles? Surely you're not dragging along wired keyboards and mice with you (because that would negate your frustration with the built-in keyboard). So is it just thumb drives?
  18. CpGER, Nov 16, 2016
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2016

    CpGER macrumors newbie

    Nov 7, 2016
    Hm, I thought my wording made it clear or implied it what my real deal breakers are, the rest is nice to have optional.

    Deal breakers are the ports, the butterfly keyboard and the touch bar.

    The slots I miss the most are the missing SD-card reader, at least one legacy usb port and mag safe.
    I could probably live without hdmi but the above ports are not easily replaceable for me.

    If I travel and make pictures I just want to be able to put the card out and do it inside my laptop also the circumstance that I need a new cable to connect my Iphone 7 with my laptop is ridiculous.

    I also write between 8-12 hours daily on my laptop and I can't do that in the same comfort as before on that keyboard. It is like jumping barefooded on concrete floor over and over again, it really physically hurts.
  19. JackDaniels3 macrumors member

    Jan 13, 2016
  20. benguild thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Jul 29, 2003
    Can you explain what ports you need that aren't available? As far as I can tell, the only difference would be something that does not have a wire you can change out.

    As mentioned in my first post, I can just buy a few cheap USB-C cables for my existing devices... which were usually USB-A to B or micro or whatever and that's what's great about the USB standard.
    --- Post Merged, Nov 16, 2016 ---
    I agree that's an odd design decision but the speaker grilles do look nice. I'm in the market (eventually) for a 15-inch MacBook Pro though.
  21. PaulWog Suspended

    Jun 28, 2011
    Price is what's wrong with it (that's not unreasonable to say).

    Is the laptop fine as it is, price aside? Probably! (I haven't read enough on battery life tests). But, does price still matter? Yes!

    Aside from price, here are two issues (and these issues certainly are not unreasonable):
    1) 8GB of RAM still standard in the 13", that's scarily low
    2) 720p front facing camera... that's just lazy on Apple's part, lazy and downright embarrassing really

    Getting a little bit further from hard facts and more into opinion:
    - Apple is making the consumer pay out the nose for future tech that isn't here today (USB-C)
    - Apple is making the consumer pay out the nose for a touch bar tech that isn't even wowing those who now have their hands on it (the tech screams "We can't innovate, so let's pretend that we're still innovating & redesign one of the most boring parts of the laptop with something that doesn't really improve the experience much!").
  22. Samuelsan2001 macrumors 604

    Oct 24, 2013
    Ha ha ha I like the sarcasm, but the thinner lighter with an all day battery life was the main thrust (along with a better screen) until late 2013, since then Intel and AMD have concentrated on efficiency over massive performance increase. Apple and Intel have been the instigators of USB c and TB3 and collaborated on the port so the sole use of it after the MacBook was released 18 months ago was a matter of time only. Apple have stated many times that they don't believe touchscreen inputs are the right way to go on a notebook and the touch bar is their answer to a changeable input it wasn't that much of a stretch and was leaked months ago.

    I did think they might keep MagSafe to be honest that's the only thing I didn't predict.

    I don't give two hoots for what your needs are expecting any manufacturer of anything to make a product with YOU only in mind is futile to say the least.

    It's a great computer that I have no current need to upgrade to but it is a great computer none the less if it's not what you want or need well that's just life get over it move on buy something else's Like a well adjusted person would.
  23. littlepud macrumors regular


    Sep 16, 2012
    To quote myself from another thread...

  24. aristobrat macrumors G5

    Oct 14, 2005
    Fair enough. When I travel with my digital camera, I almost always use the USB cable to transfer pictures, so that the camera charges while it syncs. So for me, the impact would be replacing a cable I already carry in my bag with a different cable (USB-C to micro-USB instead of USB-A to micro-USB).

    Seems like having just one legacy USB port would create the potential for a bottleneck. What if you've got your external HDD plugged in (doing a Time Machine backup that's going to take 30 minutes) and you need to print something? Or your iPhone is charging and you want to copy something to a thumb drive. In those situations, unless you have USB-C cables for your peripherals, you've got to either interrupt something that's going on, or wait for it to finish. So in that sense, I see some logic in not having just one legacy port left behind. Instead, you get four ports, and you get to choose what kind of port each one of those will be used for (USB-A, USB-C, Thunderbolt, charging).
  25. leman macrumors G3

    Oct 14, 2008
    Well, the thing is that the post you quoted was before you wrote the post with your points (and frankly, I didn't even see your post when I was writing my reply). When I wrote 'unreasonable expectations', I was primarily thinking about people who want a fast GPU and 32GB RAM, as that was (and still is) a very hot topic here on the forums. So again, mine and your posts are completely orthogonal.

    As you your points: I am more then convinced that the butterfly keyboard is a question of subjective taste and habituation. We have two people here who use the 12" MB, and they too were disappointed by the keyboard first, but after a year they both were saying that the keyboard allows them to type much faster and causes less finder fatigue. The issue with ports is IMO completely overblown as they do not require that many more dongles then before. With my 2015 MBP, I am carrying around an ethernet dongle and TB2-to-VGA dongle (for presentations). With the new MBP, I will be carrying around an ethernet dongle and a TB3-to-VGA dongle. In contrast, my user experience in the office will be improved dramatically, because I will only need a single cable to connect my computer to all the peripherals. Sure, some people might need a USB-C to USB-A dongle for an occasional foreign thumb drive and also many will need an USB card reader. Personally, I don't see it as a big issue. Many photographers already needed a card reader because they were working with cards that the older MBP didn't support.

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