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Price fixing by Apple?

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mgguy said:
What is it about Apple products that make them so different?
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I would say that it is market share. Unfortunately, Apple products do not have a very high market share compared to the PCs being sold in CompUSA, etc. (I suppose the exception is the iPod, which, as people have already mentioned in this thread, are discounted from time-to-time.)

Personally, I have no problem with Apple's pricing. When I was in the market for a new computer (about six months ago now), I compared the MacBook Pro with several other equivalent (which is important) PCs. The MBP really wasn't that much more expensive than, say, the DELL, and - whilst I would obviously like to pay less - I get a certain amount of reassurance from the fact that Macs are consistently priced; it may even suggest that Apple doesn't make a huge profit of each unit.
 
mgguy said:
Artful Dodger, actually, if you had a good understanding of economics and business models you would realize that sometimes there is a greater profit potential in reducing prices, even below costs. How else can you explain why there are so many extreme markdowns in every Sunday ad by Fry's, CompUSA, and others? Would you consider these companies "stupid?" I disagree that "they have an amount that they wish to make every time." Businesses are constantly changing their prices and the profit margin on various products they sell. What is it about Apple products that make them so different?
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The practice you describe in this instance is called "loss-leading." Grocery stores do it all the time. Advertise great deals on select items and get people in the door. They then generally buy more than what they saw advertised (few people go to a store just to buy a couple of six-packs of soda). But loss-leading only works if the goods you advertise as such are those in high demand. You're not going to lure in a heckuva lot of customers with a special on Caffeine-free Diet Dr. Pepper, after all. Further, the product has to be something that would not, in and of itself, be the sole reason for a trip to that store (e.g., an iPod, an iMac, a MBP). Otherwise that might well be all that the customer would buy, thereby eliminating the whole point of loss-leading in the first place.
 
Good points, Cepe Indicum and TechHistorian. I have been a consistent Mac user at home and at work for over 20 years. I am about ready to start looking for a 24" iMac or Mac Pro. I have to admit that the stable prices and my confidence that I am getting the highest quality product for my money has always made my Mac shopping experience a lot less hectic and less time consuming.
 
I do agree about sell more for less as a friends dad does just that and makes a very nice living from this practice. Also when I was selling nutraceuticals I had my cost and could charge whatever I wanted but the company had a suggested retail price as most will. I never charged full price but anywho since I and most can't speak for Apple some examples will very. One could be with a LCD stand I just bought. This store had one that cost $68.93 yet when I had to go to it's other store it was $99.93 :confused: When the owner came over to adjust the price to the other locations price it was as he put it. The first shipment was bought at said price, which was higher, but the next shipment was lower because he bought more to get the greater discount and adjusted the price as well. Sounds odd but no complaining on either of our parts and life went on.
As of now I will buy my :apple: items from Amazon since it works out better in the end for me. Still I know that either way Apple got a sale from me and I got a very good product and less stress than my friends trying to buy their PC from other places selling the same item at different price points.
 
If Apple drops prices on Macs routinely as new hardware comes out as you say then its worth waiting for the next iMac. As for all the denials that Apple is price fixing it looks dam like they are to me and I am shocked that any country allows it but most governments do favour businessess over consumers because thats who bankroles them in their run for office.
 
"Apple does not price fix. Full stop, end of story." And the moon is made of cheese.
 
Governments

BML said:
...and I am shocked that any country allows it but most governments do favour businessess over consumers because thats who bankroles them in their run for office.
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Aren't we still at a point in time where "most" governments do not "run for office"?

And for those countries where officials are elected, shouldn't this be a reason to push for a ban on "career politicians"? Should we spend our time being mad at Apple, or pushing for a 12 year per person limit on elected offices?

;)
 
BML said:
"Apple does not price fix. Full stop, end of story." And the moon is made of cheese.
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Only one of these statements is true:

(1) The moon is made of cheese.
(2) You haven't read through this thread.

This issue has already been discussed extensively in this thread. Please, do everyone who contributed to this thread the courtesy of reading their comments on this subject before reintroducing it as though no prior discussion had ever taken place. Thank you.
 
I became interested in the question of Mac price fixing when I started to consider whether or not to buy a Mac primarily for editing family videos and building photographic slide shows, a decision that I have still not been able to resolve. During this process I obviously looked at what sort of price I would have to pay for the appropriate machine when I had taken sufficient advice to make such a decision.
It was during this process that I discovered that all Mac outlets and all Mac advertisements showed the same prices give or take a few pennies. One would have to be extremely generous to reach tany conclusion other than that this phenomenon is an example of price fixing rather than a coincidence

This issue has, and still is, being discussed extensively in many forums not just this one and where I have contributed to the discusion I have most certainly read all the comments in the threads on this subject.

I contributed to this thread when it reached the stage where it appeared to me that loyalty to Apple outweighed what is glaringly obvious which is that the prices of a MAC is not a coincidence and as such must result from price fixing and one would not need to be a student of economics or the law to recognise this.
 
Its also one of the reasons why Macs keep their value longer.
Discount something, and people think there is either something wrong with it, or something else is on the way. Apple just doesn't refresh it's productlines that often enough to warrant that practice.
:apple:
 
BML said:
I became interested in the question of Mac price fixing when I started to consider whether or not to buy a Mac primarily for editing family videos and building photographic slide shows, a decision that I have still not been able to resolve. During this process I obviously looked at what sort of price I would have to pay for the appropriate machine when I had taken sufficient advice to make such a decision.
It was during this process that I discovered that all Mac outlets and all Mac advertisements showed the same prices give or take a few pennies. One would have to be extremely generous to reach tany conclusion other than that this phenomenon is an example of price fixing rather than a coincidence.
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What I have failed to read in ANY POST is the fact that to buy any "computer" with the same programs to do the same functions as you mention, one can find on any given day, the same PC for 3-4 different prices in 3-4 different places. So when will I read "price gouging" from someone? Same PC so the lowest price place must mean that the others are charging more than they "should/could" and why?
Really, again if I'm only going to make $100 from selling a Mac (or a PC, see if this gets read) why would I sell it for $20 above cost if said unit doesn't sell as fast as others? How much time would it take to find a dealer that would or does or even hear about it?
Why do some people that build PCs for a living charge the same prices for the one's they build over and over?
Further why doesn't "Windows" ever sell at a lower price point? How many places would one have to look to find it $50 under "list price"? Sorry EDU prices not included because it can't benifit everyone. I know plenty of friends that wanted it but they all paid the same price time and again and look at how many Windows units are sold everyday (just to be fair by leaving Apple out on this Q).
Last what stores carry Dell's? Why are prices all the same for all the model numbers (base price for each model #521 say). The next model a bit more and so on?
So to be fair now compair a Sony, Dell, HP, Adobe, Avid and so on since the term "PC" is used very loosely in place of each company being compaired to Apples prices and apps. included.
 
BML said:
It was during this process that I discovered that all Mac outlets and all Mac advertisements showed the same prices give or take a few pennies. One would have to be extremely generous to reach tany conclusion other than that this phenomenon is an example of price fixing rather than a coincidence
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Please go back and read this thread again. This is not an indication of price-fixing (since it doesn't involve Apple's competitors), it is an indication of price-setting and minimum-advertised-pricing.
 
BML said:
It was during this process that I discovered that all Mac outlets and all Mac advertisements showed the same prices give or take a few pennies. One would have to be extremely generous to reach tany conclusion other than that this phenomenon is an example of price fixing rather than a coincidence
....what is glaringly obvious which is that the prices of a MAC is not a coincidence and as such must result from price fixing and one would not need to be a student of economics or the law to recognise this.
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No, just pigheaded.

You are saying:
A result of pricefixing is that prices are uniform. Apple machine prices are observed to be within 3% of the Apple online store price. Therefore, Apple is engaging in pricefixing (through some unexplained mechanism) and there is no other explanation.

Try this:
The vast majority of arrests for public drunkenness occur between 11 PM and 4 AM. It is observed that it is always dark between 11 PM and 4 AM. Therefore, public drunkenness is caused by darkness.

IF you had understood any of this thread, you would know that Apple sellers are free to set their own prices. However, with the gross margin between wholesale and retail on Apple computers being 3% - 5% (net margin after freight and transaction costs 1% - 3%) then it's not surprising at all that you will see less than a 3% variation in price on Apple machines between sellers, with no need to resort to any kind of price fixing.
 
To state that, “This is not an indication of price-fixing (since it doesn't involve Apple's competitors), it is an indication of price-setting and minimum-advertised-pricing.” is to turn logic on its head. One could call an elephant a cow but if it has a trunk I would still be inclined to call it an elephant.
Calling those who do not agree with you pigheaded and stating that this is a crap thread merely because you disagree with it brings this forum into disrepute and I would hope that the moderator would take action on such insults.
 
BML said:
To state that, “This is not an indication of price-fixing (since it doesn't involve Apple's competitors), it is an indication of price-setting and minimum-advertised-pricing.” is to turn logic on its head. One could call an elephant a cow but if it has a trunk I would still be inclined to call it an elephant.
Calling those who do not agree with you pigheaded and stating that this is a crap thread merely because you disagree with it brings this forum into disrepute and I would hope that the moderator would take action on such insults.
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You are ignoring the fact that price fixing has a particular definition in practice and in the law, which cannot be what controls the price of Apple products. (Since it is not collusion between Apple and it's competitors).

You're the one calling an elephant a cow and you just don't get it. Read the Wiki article I linked to in my first post in this thread so many moons ago. https://forums.macrumors.com/posts/3451786/

B
 
Wow, the next time I walk into the local Saturn dealer to buy or really look at a car I will yell "price fixing" since you pay just what the sticker says. No more no less on a car made by them and sold at a dealers lot. Of course used items are different but so is this thread ;) :apple: Just what is a platypus then?
 

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