Unless people are having really fast Macs, using Logic for mixing somehow makes more sense than using it for recording, since buffer sizes/latency doesn't matter when mixing. I use Logic for both, but finally bought an 8-core Mac, which means that I can have more plugin power and lower latency than I could get from my old PTHD system - especially after the 8.02 update.
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Pro tools vs logic 8 ?
- Thread starter HazzFq
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Unless people are having really fast Macs, using Logic for mixing somehow makes more sense than using it for recording, since buffer sizes/latency doesn't matter when mixing. I use Logic for both, but finally bought an 8-core Mac, which means that I can have more plugin power and lower latency than I could get from my old PTHD system - especially after the 8.02 update.
I'll readily admit that I was never a fan of the earlier incarnations of Logic... the layout, feel and workflow felt very foreign to me. Pro Tools is a bit long in the tooth, but such familiar territory that I can pretty much go through a session blindfolded. 
Having said that, I've seen Logic 8 in action (at a friend's), and I'm intrigued enough to give Logic another look.
Having said that, I've seen Logic 8 in action (at a friend's), and I'm intrigued enough to give Logic another look.
only to the size of the buffer, is my understanding.
that's my understanding of PTLE, fwiw. perhaps Logic is different?
Sorry - I missed this question.
AFAIK, Logic has a way to find out how many samples latency each latency-inducing plugin has, and moves the recorded material forward in time with the equal amount if samples to compensate.
I don't think I understand what you mean by "to the size of the buffer"...?
how to use mainstage in logic
This does not really have anything to do with the logic v. pro-tools debate but it does tie into it.
I am looking at taking the plunge and buying logic 8 pretty soon but all the sales people I have spoken to have not been able to show me how to utilize mainstage while recording in Logic. I used to use Cubase in conjunction with Amplitube for my guitar processing, and that worked perfectly but I can't seem to do the same in Logic 8.
Another question some guitarists could maybe answer for me is which effects modeling software is currently the best, and how Mainstage stacks up against analogue effects when gigging live.
Help would be appreciated.
If it is too much to post a reply feel free to shoot me an e-mail.
This does not really have anything to do with the logic v. pro-tools debate but it does tie into it.
I am looking at taking the plunge and buying logic 8 pretty soon but all the sales people I have spoken to have not been able to show me how to utilize mainstage while recording in Logic. I used to use Cubase in conjunction with Amplitube for my guitar processing, and that worked perfectly but I can't seem to do the same in Logic 8.
Another question some guitarists could maybe answer for me is which effects modeling software is currently the best, and how Mainstage stacks up against analogue effects when gigging live.
Help would be appreciated.
If it is too much to post a reply feel free to shoot me an e-mail.
how to use mainstage in logic
This does not really have anything to do with the logic v. pro-tools debate but it does tie into it.
I am looking at taking the plunge and buying logic 8 pretty soon but all the sales people I have spoken to have not been able to show me how to utilize mainstage while recording in Logic. I used to use Cubase in conjunction with Amplitube for my guitar processing, and that worked perfectly but I can't seem to do the same in Logic 8.
Another question some guitarists could maybe answer for me is which effects modeling software is currently the best, and how Mainstage stacks up against analogue effects when gigging live.
Help would be appreciated.
If it is too much to post a reply feel free to shoot me an e-mail.
This does not really have anything to do with the logic v. pro-tools debate but it does tie into it.
I am looking at taking the plunge and buying logic 8 pretty soon but all the sales people I have spoken to have not been able to show me how to utilize mainstage while recording in Logic. I used to use Cubase in conjunction with Amplitube for my guitar processing, and that worked perfectly but I can't seem to do the same in Logic 8.
Another question some guitarists could maybe answer for me is which effects modeling software is currently the best, and how Mainstage stacks up against analogue effects when gigging live.
Help would be appreciated.
If it is too much to post a reply feel free to shoot me an e-mail.
how to use mainstage in logic
This does not really have anything to do with the logic v. pro-tools debate but it does tie into it.
I am looking at taking the plunge and buying logic 8 pretty soon but all the sales people I have spoken to have not been able to show me how to utilize mainstage while recording in Logic. I used to use Cubase in conjunction with Amplitube for my guitar processing, and that worked perfectly but I can't seem to do the same in Logic 8.
Another question some guitarists could maybe answer for me is which effects modeling software is currently the best, and how Mainstage stacks up against analogue effects when gigging live.
Help would be appreciated.
If it is too much to post a reply feel free to shoot me an e-mail.
This does not really have anything to do with the logic v. pro-tools debate but it does tie into it.
I am looking at taking the plunge and buying logic 8 pretty soon but all the sales people I have spoken to have not been able to show me how to utilize mainstage while recording in Logic. I used to use Cubase in conjunction with Amplitube for my guitar processing, and that worked perfectly but I can't seem to do the same in Logic 8.
Another question some guitarists could maybe answer for me is which effects modeling software is currently the best, and how Mainstage stacks up against analogue effects when gigging live.
Help would be appreciated.
If it is too much to post a reply feel free to shoot me an e-mail.
Logic 8 has no sound
Originally Posted by WinterMute
"To my ears, Logic 8 sounds like a toy, this is an observation from a Logic user from 4 onwards, Logic 7 sounds fine, but Logic 8 sounds too close to the artificial sound of Reason and GarageBand to me."
Logic 8 doesn't have to sound like anything. What Logic 8 is, is a great stepping stone through the levels of consumer to semi-pro to pro audio. For $500 what you get is absolutely astounding - loops, effects, synths, a lot of stuff ProTools doesn't have, resting on top of the real meat - an absolutely first class DAW environment.
Need better effects? Get a UAD-2 or a Waves bundle ($500 - $1500) - you're paying the same thing to go from 10 to 60 that a Pro Tools user is paying to go from zero to 60 - exact same stuff.
You're going to need an AD interface, potentially DA - from the Duet ($500) through the Rosetta ($1800), on to AD-16x/Lynx Aurora 16 (~$3000) up to Prism territory ($10k!) you have all the best choices you do for Pro Tools and more (Digidesign's converters universally suck for the money they charge). The high end is pretty much the same, minus the PTHD card and plus an AES EBU or MADI card. Comes out about even.
The fact is, a lot of high end guys haven't heard much Logic attached to high end gear, and when it is you can't just slap low end effects on it. Don't compare a $12,000 apple to a $500 orange. But the fact that I can trick out my $500 orange to compete VERY favorably with that $12k Digidesign apple for $4500 ( Logic Studio 8 + Aurora 16 + RME PCIe AES card) is, to say the least, a very exciting thing. Add a UAD-2 quad for $1500 and we are talking about a VERY pro setup for $6k, 32 tracks of AD/DA for $10k (add another Lynx and RME) - one that I personally think smokes most PTHD systems I've seen.
Originally Posted by WinterMute
"To my ears, Logic 8 sounds like a toy, this is an observation from a Logic user from 4 onwards, Logic 7 sounds fine, but Logic 8 sounds too close to the artificial sound of Reason and GarageBand to me."
Logic 8 doesn't have to sound like anything. What Logic 8 is, is a great stepping stone through the levels of consumer to semi-pro to pro audio. For $500 what you get is absolutely astounding - loops, effects, synths, a lot of stuff ProTools doesn't have, resting on top of the real meat - an absolutely first class DAW environment.
Need better effects? Get a UAD-2 or a Waves bundle ($500 - $1500) - you're paying the same thing to go from 10 to 60 that a Pro Tools user is paying to go from zero to 60 - exact same stuff.
You're going to need an AD interface, potentially DA - from the Duet ($500) through the Rosetta ($1800), on to AD-16x/Lynx Aurora 16 (~$3000) up to Prism territory ($10k!) you have all the best choices you do for Pro Tools and more (Digidesign's converters universally suck for the money they charge). The high end is pretty much the same, minus the PTHD card and plus an AES EBU or MADI card. Comes out about even.
The fact is, a lot of high end guys haven't heard much Logic attached to high end gear, and when it is you can't just slap low end effects on it. Don't compare a $12,000 apple to a $500 orange. But the fact that I can trick out my $500 orange to compete VERY favorably with that $12k Digidesign apple for $4500 ( Logic Studio 8 + Aurora 16 + RME PCIe AES card) is, to say the least, a very exciting thing. Add a UAD-2 quad for $1500 and we are talking about a VERY pro setup for $6k, 32 tracks of AD/DA for $10k (add another Lynx and RME) - one that I personally think smokes most PTHD systems I've seen.
The odd thing is that we are now getting reports of Logic 8 sounding different on the Mac Pro platforms than on the earlier hardware...!
Some of my master students are replacing old hardware and are commenting that Logic 8 sounds much better on the new machines.
This may mean that apple have merely upgraded the DA or the audio firmware.
Audio recorded in logic 8 sounds like audio recorded in Protools when passed through a decent DA, but any sort of native processing in Logic imparts some very odd timbres to the work.
I'm transferring a couple of biggish sessions from Protools to Logic so I can play with Logic with a little more objectivity, I'll let you know how that goes.
Apparently we are to expect a "shocking" press release from Digi sometime soon, but I have no other info and no-one is talking. I surmise a native version of HD with a firewire 192 style interface, this may be a Mac only product.
I think Digi need to get hold of the routines that will allow HD to utilise all of the cores in the 8 core systems (currently they only use what? 2? 4? I don't know offhand) and Apple's price for that code may be the restriction of Protools to the Mac platform. Digi and Avid are getting their arse kicked by Apple currently by Logic and FCP being able to harness the power in the octa-core systems.
This is not in any way a rumour, but it is a current discussion topic in a department stuffed with industry and research audio pros...!
Watch all the spaces.
Some of my master students are replacing old hardware and are commenting that Logic 8 sounds much better on the new machines.
This may mean that apple have merely upgraded the DA or the audio firmware.
Audio recorded in logic 8 sounds like audio recorded in Protools when passed through a decent DA, but any sort of native processing in Logic imparts some very odd timbres to the work.
I'm transferring a couple of biggish sessions from Protools to Logic so I can play with Logic with a little more objectivity, I'll let you know how that goes.
Apparently we are to expect a "shocking" press release from Digi sometime soon, but I have no other info and no-one is talking. I surmise a native version of HD with a firewire 192 style interface, this may be a Mac only product.
I think Digi need to get hold of the routines that will allow HD to utilise all of the cores in the 8 core systems (currently they only use what? 2? 4? I don't know offhand) and Apple's price for that code may be the restriction of Protools to the Mac platform. Digi and Avid are getting their arse kicked by Apple currently by Logic and FCP being able to harness the power in the octa-core systems.
This is not in any way a rumour, but it is a current discussion topic in a department stuffed with industry and research audio pros...!
Watch all the spaces.
Hi people!
Its import to master your tools and music.
If I have enough money to buy PT-HD, I would buy it, that really compensates.
You stop worrying less about buffers and latencies etc. and concentrate more on what you are doing, music...
I have PT LE, and I compare LE and M-powered with PT free, its just to give you a taste about the system.
If you want to create bigger projects at home, then the best is logic 8 to avoid the track limitation.
Another gap of PT LE and M-powered its that doesn't compensates automatically plug-ins latency.
PT8 is comming out, lets see if its gonna shake peoples mind...
Its import to master your tools and music.
If I have enough money to buy PT-HD, I would buy it, that really compensates.
You stop worrying less about buffers and latencies etc. and concentrate more on what you are doing, music...
I have PT LE, and I compare LE and M-powered with PT free, its just to give you a taste about the system.
If you want to create bigger projects at home, then the best is logic 8 to avoid the track limitation.
Another gap of PT LE and M-powered its that doesn't compensates automatically plug-ins latency.
PT8 is comming out, lets see if its gonna shake peoples mind...
Logic 8 better on Intel/Mult. Core Macs
I've heard that too. Typical Apple - if you didn't have a reason to upgrade before, here's one now.
I do have to say, I'm a big Logic fanboy but I am an admitted (heavy-duty) amateur - I want to make great mixes like anyone else who cares about this forum, but for those who are pro or really,really serious about getting there, Digi is the standard.
I was just at a guy's place buying a mic, he was a pro, had this SWEET 30k ProTools rig in an Argosy desk, just stellar setup. He just grabs his Glyph drive and carts his home mixes around to different studios. Me being a computer geek, I hook him up with a good free FTP client so he can just broadband his stuff over. More and more studios are opening up to Logic in this way, but it is not by any means ubiquitous (all over) like Pro Tools is (yet), might not get there if Digi puts forth a good answer with version 8. But if they don't, Logic's ballooning market share can't be ignored by the studio cogniscenti (another SAT word!) much longer.
My point is, I think Logic as a product is powerful enough to compete with ProTools (with the modern hardware, it was definitely built with the intel mac in mind). It's at a much, much lower price point. And if Digi doesn't either drop prices drastically or come up with another answer soon, it's going to become standard practice for many more "real" studios to accomodate Logic users. If this does happen, Digi is in a LOT of trouble.
That being said, if you're making music for a living right now in any kind of way that you have to deal with outside studios (Jingles, lead-ins, incindental, foley, voice-over, etc.) you have to consider the fact that the standard IS ProTools. No question. And that alone may justify the extra expense.
I've heard that too. Typical Apple - if you didn't have a reason to upgrade before, here's one now.
I do have to say, I'm a big Logic fanboy but I am an admitted (heavy-duty) amateur - I want to make great mixes like anyone else who cares about this forum, but for those who are pro or really,really serious about getting there, Digi is the standard.
I was just at a guy's place buying a mic, he was a pro, had this SWEET 30k ProTools rig in an Argosy desk, just stellar setup. He just grabs his Glyph drive and carts his home mixes around to different studios. Me being a computer geek, I hook him up with a good free FTP client so he can just broadband his stuff over. More and more studios are opening up to Logic in this way, but it is not by any means ubiquitous (all over) like Pro Tools is (yet), might not get there if Digi puts forth a good answer with version 8. But if they don't, Logic's ballooning market share can't be ignored by the studio cogniscenti (another SAT word!) much longer.
My point is, I think Logic as a product is powerful enough to compete with ProTools (with the modern hardware, it was definitely built with the intel mac in mind). It's at a much, much lower price point. And if Digi doesn't either drop prices drastically or come up with another answer soon, it's going to become standard practice for many more "real" studios to accomodate Logic users. If this does happen, Digi is in a LOT of trouble.
That being said, if you're making music for a living right now in any kind of way that you have to deal with outside studios (Jingles, lead-ins, incindental, foley, voice-over, etc.) you have to consider the fact that the standard IS ProTools. No question. And that alone may justify the extra expense.
I agree that Digi have to do something to counter the raw grunt of Logic on a Mac Pro, but if the audio is as good as reported then that removes one of my major concerns.
I still maintain that the workflow through Protools is better than anything in the marketplace, but that alone is simply not enough for PTHD to maintain it's place.
I still maintain that the workflow through Protools is better than anything in the marketplace, but that alone is simply not enough for PTHD to maintain it's place.
Workflow is as workflow does
I am a software developer by trade (keeps me in music gear) and one of the first things you learn in my business is that people think what they've gotten used to is easy, anything new is hard. I've had to convince people on green screens where everything's a terminal code that a client server application with buttons and menus was the way to go (and often I just had to give up, telling them that the decision was made and they'd have to get used to it one way or another). My point here? You think ProTools is easy for the most part because you know it.
But this is the software - I think the big workflow difference is in the hardware.
The one part I've always found interesting in the Digi/Logic debate is how closely it parallels Mac/Windows. Except in this case, Apple is like Windows and Digi is like Apple.
On the one side, you have in Digi a system that is "locked up tight" - likes to manufacture it's hardware in house with a very few exceptions (other AD/DA converters are entering the mix, not unlike the Mac graphics card situation). I've seen some VERY nice ProTools control surfaces - that C24 is the bomb. And they integrate seamlessly, because when you make your own stuff you test your own stuff until it works as advertised, don't throw out any updates that pooch the hardware, etc.
On the other, you have some people who threw some software out there and put out an open call for people to make hardware for it. The Mackie MCU is pretty nice, I have that, the Euphonix stuff is supposed to be great. Still a little light here, there's no direct competition for the C24 (which is $10k by itself, fwiw). I think Digi has a high end edge here, but Logic has hardware to compete with the 8 and 003, and from a software "get for the money" perspective it wins hands down - 32 track limit? Are we in tracking Russia? For those of us who don't envision spending the kind of money we'd put into a car on recording equipment Logic will take you farther on the dime, no doubt. (I save the big loot for amps and guitars)
My big point here, though, is that while controllers ease workflow, you still have to figure out how to make things work under the hood. And when you're already a stud in Product X, it's usually not very fun gong through the "pwned n00b" phase while getting up to speed with Product Y. As a capper, I put this out there - can you really remember back to when you didn't know either of these products, and how hard it was to learn X vs. Y? I think from a blank slate n00b perspective the difficulty of the learning curve is pretty much a wash.
I am a software developer by trade (keeps me in music gear) and one of the first things you learn in my business is that people think what they've gotten used to is easy, anything new is hard. I've had to convince people on green screens where everything's a terminal code that a client server application with buttons and menus was the way to go (and often I just had to give up, telling them that the decision was made and they'd have to get used to it one way or another). My point here? You think ProTools is easy for the most part because you know it.
But this is the software - I think the big workflow difference is in the hardware.
The one part I've always found interesting in the Digi/Logic debate is how closely it parallels Mac/Windows. Except in this case, Apple is like Windows and Digi is like Apple.
On the one side, you have in Digi a system that is "locked up tight" - likes to manufacture it's hardware in house with a very few exceptions (other AD/DA converters are entering the mix, not unlike the Mac graphics card situation). I've seen some VERY nice ProTools control surfaces - that C24 is the bomb. And they integrate seamlessly, because when you make your own stuff you test your own stuff until it works as advertised, don't throw out any updates that pooch the hardware, etc.
On the other, you have some people who threw some software out there and put out an open call for people to make hardware for it. The Mackie MCU is pretty nice, I have that, the Euphonix stuff is supposed to be great. Still a little light here, there's no direct competition for the C24 (which is $10k by itself, fwiw). I think Digi has a high end edge here, but Logic has hardware to compete with the 8 and 003, and from a software "get for the money" perspective it wins hands down - 32 track limit? Are we in tracking Russia? For those of us who don't envision spending the kind of money we'd put into a car on recording equipment Logic will take you farther on the dime, no doubt. (I save the big loot for amps and guitars)
My big point here, though, is that while controllers ease workflow, you still have to figure out how to make things work under the hood. And when you're already a stud in Product X, it's usually not very fun gong through the "pwned n00b" phase while getting up to speed with Product Y. As a capper, I put this out there - can you really remember back to when you didn't know either of these products, and how hard it was to learn X vs. Y? I think from a blank slate n00b perspective the difficulty of the learning curve is pretty much a wash.
Down to the real point...
I'm 19.
Awaiting delivery of my new Mac Book Pro 15" with the 2.8ghz as well as M-Audio Profire 610.
I love the look of Logic, it should run sweet on my new computer... Right?
After cruising for many days Pro Tools seems to have a lot of problems from the fact that it is obscenely frustrating to install to impossible and equally frustrating customer service.
I'm a singer/songwriter producing anywhere from a Presets-esk house/electronica feel to jazz and blues.
Is it as simple as Logic for Songwriting and Pro Tools for Producing or am I missing something.
As far as it goes, I'm pretty set on the Logic but could someone please give an answer based on an amateurs point of view and not that of a professional studio.
Thank You
I'm 19.
Awaiting delivery of my new Mac Book Pro 15" with the 2.8ghz as well as M-Audio Profire 610.
I love the look of Logic, it should run sweet on my new computer... Right?
After cruising for many days Pro Tools seems to have a lot of problems from the fact that it is obscenely frustrating to install to impossible and equally frustrating customer service.
I'm a singer/songwriter producing anywhere from a Presets-esk house/electronica feel to jazz and blues.
Is it as simple as Logic for Songwriting and Pro Tools for Producing or am I missing something.
As far as it goes, I'm pretty set on the Logic but could someone please give an answer based on an amateurs point of view and not that of a professional studio.
Thank You
Mac Book Pro
I run Logic 8 on that machine, no issues (some hardware had firewire issues, but Mac's 8.0.2 update supposedly handled all of that).
Whichever way you go, there will be a learning curve. With Logic 8, recommend you buy a book - their manual is a good reference but a crappy tutorial.
I think the only "simple as that" answer between these two right now is that if you are interfacing regularly with pro studios, they always can utilize your Pro Tools files, not always true with Logic. But if you're not doing that (me either) then Logic is really cheap for all that you get.
Some "audio on laptop" pointers - watch your hard drive space - Logic is 50 gigs by itself and then you're recording a lot of audio data onto that thing. I subbed in a 200 gb 7200rpm drive with a 16mb cache (good upgrade for recording) and I put together an expressCard34 1TB external drive (7200/32mb cache) - you'll need the space eventually if you record a lot. Make sure your external enclosure works with the expressCard if you're recording with your firewire slot. Lastly, recommend you upgrade your memory to the full 4GB, it's cheap now (crucial.com is good) and ITB (In The Box) audio stuff chews through memory like crazy.
I run Logic 8 on that machine, no issues (some hardware had firewire issues, but Mac's 8.0.2 update supposedly handled all of that).
Whichever way you go, there will be a learning curve. With Logic 8, recommend you buy a book - their manual is a good reference but a crappy tutorial.
I think the only "simple as that" answer between these two right now is that if you are interfacing regularly with pro studios, they always can utilize your Pro Tools files, not always true with Logic. But if you're not doing that (me either) then Logic is really cheap for all that you get.
Some "audio on laptop" pointers - watch your hard drive space - Logic is 50 gigs by itself and then you're recording a lot of audio data onto that thing. I subbed in a 200 gb 7200rpm drive with a 16mb cache (good upgrade for recording) and I put together an expressCard34 1TB external drive (7200/32mb cache) - you'll need the space eventually if you record a lot. Make sure your external enclosure works with the expressCard if you're recording with your firewire slot. Lastly, recommend you upgrade your memory to the full 4GB, it's cheap now (crucial.com is good) and ITB (In The Box) audio stuff chews through memory like crazy.
I will be running 4gb Ram with a 320gb 7200 internal memory.
I also have a 1 TB brick that I will be using. I was correct in reading that you can load all the 50 odd gigabytes of Logic stuff on an external drive wasn't I?
The expresscard I think will be an issue but one I imagine I can easily address later.
On the issue of interfacing with a pro studio, I do not think I would be likely to be in that situation any time soon and when the time came I would simply buy Pro Tools. But even still there surely most studios would be able to handle both Logic and Pro Tools? These are the two industry base standard aren't they?
Any suggestions on a good book?
This is all very helpful, thank you!
I also have a 1 TB brick that I will be using. I was correct in reading that you can load all the 50 odd gigabytes of Logic stuff on an external drive wasn't I?
The expresscard I think will be an issue but one I imagine I can easily address later.
On the issue of interfacing with a pro studio, I do not think I would be likely to be in that situation any time soon and when the time came I would simply buy Pro Tools. But even still there surely most studios would be able to handle both Logic and Pro Tools? These are the two industry base standard aren't they?
Any suggestions on a good book?
This is all very helpful, thank you!
Sounds good
It seems like your laptop is tricked out just fine - you've got your hardware as wrapped up as it's going to get on a laptop.
I can recommend "Logic Pro 8 and Logic Express 8" by David Nahmani, is a good introduction to Logic workflows. You'll have a much better concept of what's what after reading that.
The only thing I'd say is that you do have to choose where to put 100% of Logic from what I remember of my install. It's such a core program for anyone that cares that I'd throw it on the 320 instead of the 1TB - I threw my 50GB at a 200GB drive. It's not an always on server or anything, and if you want to work on anything away from your studio area dragging around a brick is a pain. Stuff like Toontrack DFH I put on my brick, and when I'm in my main tracking space I track straight to the brick (I love my expresscard!). I do my backups to there, have my "low priority" mp3's there, etc.
I think you'll find more and more studios that deal with Logic precisely because of guys like you and me - independents coming out of the woodwork that want someone to take the reins from mixdown or mastering phase, but don't necessarily want to re-track. But for the most part, the day in, day out pros are still very, very Pro Tools-oriented. And if you've already invested $30k and up in a system that Logic competes with, but definitely doesn't surpass, then I don't see why they'd switch unless/until they saw that they were leaving too much cash on the table to ignore. I just don't think they've hit that point yet, and it'll be hard to get there until the current crop of hardware and software is obsolete.
Digi has to be careful - Logic is starting to own the Mac-side consumer to "pro"sumer market, is competitive as a pro product (making big inroads in movie sound - see SpiderMan3 article ) and outside converters are absolutely killing the 192 IO (Apogee AD-16x, Lynx Aurora) in independent testing - they're getting hit on all sides and unless they step up their game they stand a chance of having too little cash flow to support themselves. Luckily for them they've been making money hand over fist for a while now - monopolies are great when they're yours.
It seems like your laptop is tricked out just fine - you've got your hardware as wrapped up as it's going to get on a laptop.
I can recommend "Logic Pro 8 and Logic Express 8" by David Nahmani, is a good introduction to Logic workflows. You'll have a much better concept of what's what after reading that.
The only thing I'd say is that you do have to choose where to put 100% of Logic from what I remember of my install. It's such a core program for anyone that cares that I'd throw it on the 320 instead of the 1TB - I threw my 50GB at a 200GB drive. It's not an always on server or anything, and if you want to work on anything away from your studio area dragging around a brick is a pain. Stuff like Toontrack DFH I put on my brick, and when I'm in my main tracking space I track straight to the brick (I love my expresscard!). I do my backups to there, have my "low priority" mp3's there, etc.
I think you'll find more and more studios that deal with Logic precisely because of guys like you and me - independents coming out of the woodwork that want someone to take the reins from mixdown or mastering phase, but don't necessarily want to re-track. But for the most part, the day in, day out pros are still very, very Pro Tools-oriented. And if you've already invested $30k and up in a system that Logic competes with, but definitely doesn't surpass, then I don't see why they'd switch unless/until they saw that they were leaving too much cash on the table to ignore. I just don't think they've hit that point yet, and it'll be hard to get there until the current crop of hardware and software is obsolete.
Digi has to be careful - Logic is starting to own the Mac-side consumer to "pro"sumer market, is competitive as a pro product (making big inroads in movie sound - see SpiderMan3 article ) and outside converters are absolutely killing the 192 IO (Apogee AD-16x, Lynx Aurora) in independent testing - they're getting hit on all sides and unless they step up their game they stand a chance of having too little cash flow to support themselves. Luckily for them they've been making money hand over fist for a while now - monopolies are great when they're yours.
Setting up new studio
Hi,
I just bought a set of pro tools m-powered 7 yesterday along with the m-audio profire 2626. I do understand that I will be getting the free upgrade to M-POWERED 8 so that really is the true comparison... I already own logic studio (unopened). After a night of research, i went with the above but now am not sure which route is best. I will be doing BOTH band (my) live recording and creating compositions on a regular basis. In all I've read both softwares seem the way to go but right now having to learn them both I really should decide on one and stick with it for a while. My other concern is that which interface (at least 8 inputs needed for live recording) would be best if I end up with both softwares. NOTHING IS OPENED YET AND I HAVE TO START RECORDING THE BAND TOMORROW EVENING SO I NEED QUICK HELP!!!
Thanks
Hi,
I just bought a set of pro tools m-powered 7 yesterday along with the m-audio profire 2626. I do understand that I will be getting the free upgrade to M-POWERED 8 so that really is the true comparison... I already own logic studio (unopened). After a night of research, i went with the above but now am not sure which route is best. I will be doing BOTH band (my) live recording and creating compositions on a regular basis. In all I've read both softwares seem the way to go but right now having to learn them both I really should decide on one and stick with it for a while. My other concern is that which interface (at least 8 inputs needed for live recording) would be best if I end up with both softwares. NOTHING IS OPENED YET AND I HAVE TO START RECORDING THE BAND TOMORROW EVENING SO I NEED QUICK HELP!!!
Thanks
Download the manual for the ProTools product you have purchased and check out the track limit - I bet it's 8 - does this allow you all the tracks you want? If so, have a long chat with your drummer about why his toms are going to feel lonely - I've eaten up 8 mics on the kit alone. Non -virtual doubling out the window. All of that extra functionality gone. Listen, I hate loops, all that GarageBand crap I don't use. But there's a half-decent virtual synth in there (it ain't Reason 4, but it'll get a lot of stuff done). And there's no track limit imposed by your software because it wants you to upgrade when you're ready to get real. I vote Logic all the way.
has anyone compared these two programs? if so lets hear it
Oh boy... apparently you haven't tried Googling "Pro Tools vs Logic". There are billions of threads about this. But that's okay - let's open the can of worms again for the sake of tradition.
My thoughts are as follows:
Pro Tools pros:
- Quick to chop up and move audio clips around.
- Quick to make and manipulate groups.
- Industry standard
- Exists for Windows as well (not that you'd want to use Windows)
Pro Tools cons:
- Can't hide the app using Cmd+H and cannot work around this via system prefs. Breaks Apple's conventions.
- There are many critical commands that should have keyboard shortcuts but don't.
- There are many redundant confirmation dialog boxes that appear with each step. Don't ask me where I want to store my audio files each time!
- Bouncing a track out takes forever. You can't just render it - you need to let it play out while you watch paint dry or count the hairs on your body. If you are bouncing each stem, be prepared to spend all afternoon.
- When you move session files from one machine to another and open them up you are guaranteed to get errors that linked files or fades can't be found.
- Interface could be better optimized for speed.
Logic pros:
- Easy automation of plug-ins etc.
- MIDI integration is superb.
- Bundled with some fantastic plug-ins, instruments, and samples.
- Can render audio quickly without needing to play in realtime from start to finish.
- Great solution for notebooks since no external hardware is required.
- Key commands are totally customizable and can be saved in a prefs file for transportation to other studios.
Logic cons:
- Tool-specific editing is slower than the Pro Tools approach which relies more on key shortcuts and less specialized tools.
- Interface could be better optimized for speed.
- Some feel it to be less intuitive at first. In other words, steeper learning curve. But this has greatly improved with 8.
To be fair though I have used Pro Tools for longer so there are surely more Logic pros and cons I'm not yet aware of. Also the version of Pro Tools I use is not the most recent, so some of the cons I mentioned may have been addressed.
In summary, Logic caters to composers and Pro Tools caters to recording engineers.
wowo great opinions here on both programs...I thought I was up in the air before I am way more now...Thanx guys
At the momment I just purchased a MBP 4 gig ram, and I am thinking about the mbox pro with pro tools, I am more on those grounds, cause pro tools is a big thing, and I see my homys use it and it seems to be the shxt...But I dont want to get this program and cry myself to sleep in fear of waking up lol.
At the momment my plan is to record a record as proffesional as I can, maybe get it mixed and mastered in a pro studio...Heres a link to my music, http://www.myspace.com/officialUgLy At this point it is pre-pro done with a Pc and sonar 4 lol...Do any of U even know what that is lol..
Sorry for going off topic here, but you all got me trippen now.
At the momment I just purchased a MBP 4 gig ram, and I am thinking about the mbox pro with pro tools, I am more on those grounds, cause pro tools is a big thing, and I see my homys use it and it seems to be the shxt...But I dont want to get this program and cry myself to sleep in fear of waking up lol.
At the momment my plan is to record a record as proffesional as I can, maybe get it mixed and mastered in a pro studio...Heres a link to my music, http://www.myspace.com/officialUgLy At this point it is pre-pro done with a Pc and sonar 4 lol...Do any of U even know what that is lol..
Sorry for going off topic here, but you all got me trippen now.
If it's constantly happening to you, then I can guarantee that it's based on user error.
I do this for a living. Create/record music at my studio, save session, take it to the big mastering studio where I'll make tweaks in accordance with client requests (tv ads). I don't think I've ever had a problem like you describe.