PSA: Do Not Migrate System & Network Settings From Snow Leopard Or Earlier

Discussion in 'iMac' started by mikey8811, May 21, 2019.

  1. mikey8811, May 21, 2019
    Last edited: May 21, 2019

    mikey8811 macrumors member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2019
    #1
    Hi

    Just a cautionary warning for folk moving on from an old Mac using Snow Leopard or earlier to a new one on Mojave. The same may apply to later Mac OS too.

    I did the above on a new iMac, 3 weeks ago via Migration Assistant. Everything occurred without much ado and was successful. The shared folder locations migrated too and I was able to access the data.

    However, I then discovered that I could no longer edit the sharing permissions nor delete shared folders in the Sharing section of System Preferences. I posted about the issue here:

    https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/unable-to-edit-or-remove-shared-folders-on-new-imac.2180484/

    Calling Apple Care did not really do much - they were essentially clueless. I am in Asia and the service people are not technically competent. They have to pass the case on to their site engineers in a somewhat inefficient manner. You cannot deal directly with a site engineer and they take 2 days to respond to to the service staff at Apple Care handling the case. My suspicion is that the site engineers also do not know much and worse still do not understand basic English. After much to and fro for 3 weeks, they reverted to say it was an issue with the migration screwing up the Open Directory. They themselves did not know what to do and basically asked me to reset the iMac to factory settings and set it up again from scratch - not like that was something I could not think of doing myself. That was the shocking thing - they were unable to give a definitive answer or a solution. They were just suggesting I try things out just as you would do on your own. Why are we paying for support from people who have really no expertise to speak of?

    The service attendant had extended my return period on the iMac and I will be returning it. I really do not think it is my job to help Apple troubleshoot their software bugs, especially not when i paid good money for a new computer - and from what I have seen too much at that.

    I basically wasted 3 weeks setting up a computer and installing software. I hope Apple service is better elsewhere in the world because it really seems to me that they have no clue as to what they are doing. My prior experience with Apple support up till now has been different although the last time of my contact with them was a long while ago. It does seem that they make software with too many glitches now and the support people are not really up to scratch to help you fix the issues. The whole ease of Migration Assistant is hyped up on the Apple website but the truth of my experience could not be more different. The only thing I migrated was System & Network settings. I created everything else from scratch and am still facing issues.

    It's a shame my new Mac experience ended up this way. I'll sit it out for a while and think about getting something else.

    So whatever you do, please do NOT use migration assistant to migrate System and Network settings because Apple will not be able to help and you will end up with a Mac where you are unable to change or edit sharing folders for good.
     
  2. nambuccaheadsau macrumors 68000

    nambuccaheadsau

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    Location:
    Nambucca Heads Australia
    #3
    Shame you waited eight operating systems to update.
     
  3. mikehalloran macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2018
    Location:
    The Sillie Con Valley
    #4
    Yea, that.
    What bugs? You've given no info to support that.

    You missed two important watersheds for the Mac OS. The first was OS 10.8.2; the other was 10.11. Way too many things were changed under the hood too many years ago.

    If it was System Settings only, I don't see that there would have been much of a problem—if any. It's everything else, especially Application support files. Many are now inaccessible to you and need to be cleaned out by disabling SIP first. In addition, there are files and apps that will crash the Mac on a regular basis if not thoroughly cleaned out.

    You could start from scratch and do a clean install but there's a problem with that. There are still applications that work over Mojave but the installers stopped working years ago. For example, the Office 2008 installer last worked over Yosemite but, thanks to Migration Assistant, I can use it on my iMac Pro.

    I don't envy what you're going through at all.
     
  4. mikey8811, May 29, 2019
    Last edited: May 30, 2019

    mikey8811 thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2019
    #5
    No difference as it turns out. Read the lengthy posts on the Apple forums

    https://discussions.apple.com/thread/8574987?answerId=250746908022#250746908022

    Same issues with migration from much later OS'

    Apple's engineering team themselves admitted the bugs. As per their message:

    "When you used the migration assistant to migrate the use, you have bought the old Open Directory to the new computer and it seems to have issues.

    Removing / replacing the Open Directory is not recommended.

    Erasing and reinstalling macOS clean, setting up all users manually and using Time Machine application (definitely not any assistants) to recover just the user data (nothing else) is the Site Support engineers recommendation."

    In other words, Migration Assistant or any other assistant will not work! Their words not mine.

    This is consistent with all the posts in the Apple forum I linked. Many were migrations from recent OS.

    See Apple's own link on using Migration Assistant

    https://support.apple.com/en-my/HT204350

    with the emphasis

    "Make sure that your old Mac is using OS X Snow Leopard v10.6.8 or later."

    These are the steps I followed to the point. I even called up Apple support before doing it to have them walk me through the steps.

    That they still did not bother to change the page or put a warning on it is pretty negligent and is false advertising.

    It was systems and network settings only plus one standard user with read and write sharing permissions. That was literally all I migrated. No applications, nothing else. it was as close to a clean install as I could think of while preserving my sharing settings which were all i wanted to preserve.

    If that isn't a bug i do not know what is

    Packed up the 2019 iMac today. Can't say I am sorry to see it go, given the pain and hassle.

    Rebooted the old MacBook running Snow Leopard - ran without a glitch. None of the USB drives unmounting by themselves shenanigans like the 2019 iMac. Most importantly, network file sharing works. Jeez, sometimes upgrading is overrated! Apple used to make gear that works ;)
     
  5. mikehalloran macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2018
    Location:
    The Sillie Con Valley
    #6
    You were given good advice on that thread and by Apple Support but you state that you will return the computer instead.

    Yet this rant continues.

    That isn't anyone admitting a bug. Sorry. It just isn't and no amount of insisting changes this.

    You reject doing a clean install because you've "spent three weeks on this". A clean install won't take nearly that long and I know a few tricks to shorten the time.

    Oh well.
     
  6. mikey8811, May 30, 2019
    Last edited by a moderator: May 30, 2019

    mikey8811 thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2019
    #7
    Of course I would opt to return the computer and get my cash back. Why wouldn't I when a brand new computer malfunctions when I have performed the installation as instructed by the manufacturer.

    This ain't a rant. It is to caution folk against following the steps on Migration Assistant and doing a clean install instead as the title says, in spite of what Apple tells you on their website.

    Again, here we have to disagree. If it isn't a bug why would following the officially sanctioned steps lead to a malfunctioning that the Apple site engineers themselves cannot fix.

    The users on the Apple forum have indeed good suggestions, primarily in 2019, do NOT use Mac OS as a file server.

    I am not bothering with a clean install because I won't bother with buying a Mac again unless the issues I encountered get fixed.

    FYI it was the Apple engineers and so called support who dragged out the debacle for 3 weeks expressedly so I would not return the computer until I insisted.

    Your experience with Apple may be the bees knees but sad to say, it wasn't the case for me nor others on the Apple forum who used Mojave as a file server. I am just letting people know so they can avoid what I went through. They can decide for themselves.
     
  7. Fishrrman macrumors P6

    Fishrrman

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2009
    #8
    mikey wrote:
    "I am not bothering with a clean install because I won't bother with buying a Mac again unless the issues I encountered get fixed."

    Fearless prediction:
    They're not going to "get fixed" for a version of the OS "that far back".

    Enjoy your new Windows machine ;)
     
  8. mikey8811 thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2019
    #9
    Thanks, will do. Just ordered a Dell today.

    If you have read the Apple thread, it affects all recent Mac OS too not just mine which admittedly goes far back.

    Most folk there who do any kind of serious file sharing are switching to Windows.
     
  9. retta283 macrumors 6502a

    retta283

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2018
    Location:
    Kingman, AZ
    #10
    Coming from Snow Leopard I can imagine Mojave is quite the disappointment if you're a desktop user. I've been using a Windows computer for a little bit as a secondary machine, and it's not been too bad.
     
  10. fisherking macrumors 604

    fisherking

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2010
    Location:
    ny somewhere
    #11
    why would that be? SL was a great moment in mac os history, but mojave, and it's parity with the era we now live in, is pretty great; am not (personally) having any issues, and my apps, and my macs in general, are running fast, and stable.

    isn't that the point? i mean... why do people romanticize the past? is it just fear of moving forward? (am asking, seriously, as i don't get it).
     
  11. retta283 macrumors 6502a

    retta283

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2018
    Location:
    Kingman, AZ
    #12
    Loss of iSync, heavy tweaking to Disk Utility and AirPort Utility, changes to finder functions, spotlight became slower, changes to group management, loss of Front Row and QuickTime 7, not compatible with iPhoto or Aperture, some window peeking features have gotten worse, and finally, the complete destruction of Mac OS X Server. The current server app is a complete joke. No real server features. I'm sure I missed some.

    I still think macOS is the best OS (I hate Apple's current laptops though and won't buy them until the keyboard/throttling is fixed) but it has fallen from its peak with SL.
     
  12. fisherking macrumors 604

    fisherking

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2010
    Location:
    ny somewhere
    #13
    some of us find these things improved; photos over iphoto, new finder options. QT7 still works (i've used it since the 1800s).. but won't with the next OS.

    SL was great... in it's day. i would never want to go back tho.
     
  13. mikey8811, Jun 1, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2019

    mikey8811 thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2019
    #14
    You've hit the nail right on the head. For me the immediate issues are the screwing up of Mac OS X Server for anyone running Mac OS as a file server. Really, it is a joke that it is easier to share Windows files with a Mac rather than Mac files with another Mac!

    Then the USB 3.1 implementation. External HDD's unmount themselves for no apparent reason. They disappear from Finder but still appear mounted in Disk Utility. You cannot unmount them from Disk Utility or using the diskutil command in Terminal.

    A much slower Spotlight and changes to Finder functions come next. Case in point - my old MacBook is a Core 2 Duo machine with 2 Gb of RAM running Snow Leopard. Spotlight indexing of the same external drives (some 8 Tb) was a walk in the park compared to the 2019 iMac with a much faster processor, more RAM and Mojave where it literally took a couple of days to a week.

    To be fair what I liked about Mojave were the "hand off" functions with other Apple devices - specifically iCloud syncing of Notes, being able to accept calls on the iMac, etc. But overall, these are superficial attributes - slickness if you will vs the basic functions outlined above that are more important as far as my usage goes. The 5K Retina screen is also nice in spite of the outdated thick bezels.

    Sure, also the iMac starts up faster on SSD but you are paying through your nose for that. I still got the coloured spinning wheel as far as accessing data from external HDD's go. I know some of you will say that won't happen with external SSD's but then most of us do not have unlimited resources. Even those with fatter pockets are seeing the drawbacks of the current Mac's, see the link to the following post by someone with a spec'ed out iMac Pro

    https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/imac-pro-mini-solution-for-constant-crashes.2183063/

    In contrast, a Windows machine may not be as slick and nice to use but the basic functions do work. If not, it is really easy to troubleshoot online. Much easier than relying on Apple Care support and engineering who from experience are not much help at all. Also, budget wise, Windows machines are much more affordable - the base Dell equivalent is spec'ed with a 512 Gb SSD plus an internal 2 Tb SATA HDD with 16 Gb of RAM, something you would cough out blood for Mac wise. Definitely in my case, the value proposition of an iMac running Mojave is a lot less compelling, especially since it doesn't really work well for my needs!
     
  14. codernova macrumors member

    codernova

    Joined:
    May 13, 2019
    #15
    Enjoy your new issues in Windows 10. Been using Windows since 3.0 (every version), it has its benefits but it isn't greener grass.

    I have Windows, Mac, and Linux machines. Don't expect any of them to be perfect.
     
  15. mikey8811, Jun 1, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2019

    mikey8811 thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2019
    #16
    Not romanticising, it's just the tasks I use the Mac for seem to work without a glitch on Snow Leopard and supposedly outdated hardware but not so well on Mojave on a much better spec'ed computer - go figure

    No, I don't expect them to be perfect but one would at least expect them to work. The above tasks I mentioned are pretty basic and work on Windows 10 without a glitch. Windows just ain't as slick but then everyone knows that - that's the Mac selling point.
     
  16. fisherking macrumors 604

    fisherking

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2010
    Location:
    ny somewhere
    #17
    humble reminder; your experience speaks for you, not for everyone. why do people think that the problems they have are always everyone's?
     
  17. mikey8811 thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2019
    #18
    No, I do not presume to speak for others. No more than any of the folk such as yourself who post here do.

    I am only relating my personal experience so that others who are in similar circumstances can avoid the same pitfalls. I have learned much from these boards - including what to avoid, from the experience of others here.

    I do apologise if that irks you.
     
  18. fisherking macrumors 604

    fisherking

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2010
    Location:
    ny somewhere
    #19
    no, it's fine, but good you're admitting that your experiences are your own, and not everyone's. too many people on this forum think they speak for all (i have done that myself, to be honest). but i've never posted a thread title that proclaims "the current mac OS breaks this, or ruins that, or shouldn't be installed".

    at it's best, this forum is a great place to discuss, and get help. at it's worst, there's a lot of whining, and explaining in absolute terms things that are not, in fact, absolute.
     

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18 May 21, 2019