The X5550 is the dual socket one though. The prices on those are killer compared to the single socket processors.
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Psystar Exits Bankruptcy, Launches New Xeon-Based Systems Running OS X
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Dell Precision, 2.66ghz Quad Nehalem comes at around $2800. Thats $300 more than a Mac Pro, however it also comes with a Quadro and much more RAM expandability (8gb vs. 48gb).
I'm not denying that the Mac Pro is well stacked up against Dell. That doesn't change the fact that Apple (and Dell) are making a ridiculous (well over 100%) profit margin. And since the new Psystar tops out at $2000 for better than Mac Pro specs (double memory, tb hdd), then "The Mac Pro is BY FAR the cheapest" is wrong isn't it.
And this all started with the nehalem models. The old harpertown models were extremely well priced. $2799 would get you dual 2.8ghz quad xeons (dual processor, each processor cost >$700 each). Now $2499 gets you a single quad, which costs <$400. So >$1400 worth of processors, down to <$400, yet the machine is only $300 cheaper. Is it still faster? Yes. But going by the old pricing, we should be looking at the dual quad 2.66ghz model for around $2999, instead of it's current $4699.
Apple is competitive in the dual socket Xeon space. Anything with a single socket you're better off getting elsewhere. This has been the case since the original Mac Pro.
Because the single FW800 port offered by Apple's similarly priced desktop is SO much better than having 4 internal HD bays, two optical bays and PCIe slots for upgradeable video and the addition of virtually any interface you want.
Able to read it, yes. Agreed to it when I bought it, most certainly not.
The restocking fee was part of a hypothetical car EULA, but it's not like a 14-day qualifier refutes the fact that a potential restocking fee does exist.
By replying to this post, you agree to address me as "The Most Awesomest and Always Right mactonight."
Pleading ignorance is not a legal defense. The EULA is attached to the use of the product. This assumes the EULA is legally binding, which a court will decide...
just a minor point... Apple's overall profit margin is ~34%. Yes, it is high on the Mac Pro, but far fewer of these machines are sold.
One must remember that there is no price at which Macs HAVE to be sold. If Apple is selling well at current prices, then obviously they are operating at a nice point on the demand curve. If you think it's too expensive, then it's simple, don't buy it. You want Mac OS X, you pay the price Apple has deemed appropriate for its machines. If I want a PS3 but it's too expensive, it doesn't mean I can't get a console. It's just that I have to get a different, cheaper one, like the Wii. You don't want to pay for a Mac? Get a Windows or Linux machine.
Apple only sells retail versions of Mac OS X to allow current users to upgrade. Imagine if Apple made upgrading online, software-based only...
Umm, maybe close ....
You do stand a chance of getting a somewhat *close* price if you bid on used systems on eBay - actually. Regardless, the point is, if you buy the real Apple system, you're in the clear legally-speaking. You bought the whole thing from the people who actually MADE the operating system, instead of from somebody who feels they should have the right to resell said OS without the permission of the rights-holders, and is doing so despite pending legal actions against them in court.
I'm not sure it's such a great deal, owning a Psystar machine that stands a pretty good chance of becoming unsupported in the next year or two.
You do stand a chance of getting a somewhat *close* price if you bid on used systems on eBay - actually. Regardless, the point is, if you buy the real Apple system, you're in the clear legally-speaking. You bought the whole thing from the people who actually MADE the operating system, instead of from somebody who feels they should have the right to resell said OS without the permission of the rights-holders, and is doing so despite pending legal actions against them in court.
I'm not sure it's such a great deal, owning a Psystar machine that stands a pretty good chance of becoming unsupported in the next year or two.
Um, yes. I always make sure to get the exact same CPU model. BTW, I said the Dell costs 50-60% of what the Mac costs, I didn't say it was 50-60% cheaper.
Mac Pro 2.93 GHz quad (Nehalem Xeon W3540)
OS X 10.5.7
6 GB RAM 1066 MHz DDR3
2x NVidia GT120 512 MB
2x 1 TB 7200 RPM hard drives
1x Superdrive
3Y AppleCare
SEK 42,900 incl. VAT (USD 5,500)
(Double-check the price by configuring one here. It's in Swedish obviously, but you'll recognize the options)
Dell Precision T3500 2.93 GHz quad (Nehalem Xeon W3540)
Vista Ultimate 64-bit
6 GB RAM 1066 MHz DDR3
2x NVidia Quadro FX580 512 MB
2x 1 TB 7200 RPM hard drives
1x 16X DVD+/-RW
3Y warranty included in price
SEK 27,816 incl. VAT (USD 3,566)
(Configure here. Note that the prices are ex. VAT while Apple's are incl. VAT, so you need to add 25% to the price on the Dell, like I did)
So, the Dell costs 64% of what the Mac Pro costs. The Quadro cards are better than the old GT120's, but I'll throw that in as compensation for losing the aluminum case and the FW800 ports.
I could stop there, but I know from experience that Dell's prices are very much negotiable. The last time I ordered from them, the business sales rep gave me over 10% off on the two machines I bought. They weren't on sale or anything, they just love giving rebates if you call them instead of ordering online. So make that SEK 25,000 for the Dell T3500.
I haven't tried haggling with Apple, but I have a hunch it wouldn't do any good.
Seriously I almost spit out my drink when I read this nonsense. Are you high?
And if Dell is so ****** why doesn't your beloved Apple have a bigger market share then Dell ?
I do just wish that Apple would take the easy way out. Produce a motherboard with no CPU or RAM that fits in a regular case, bundle a licensed copy of OS X with it, and let the savvy users build up their own systems based on that board. Why is that so hard?
I'd never buy one but I always like to root for the underdog.
But yeah anything that could possibly force Apple to make something expandable but not starting at nearly $3k (like my $800 overpriced Quad MP) I'd be a future happy-camper.
But yeah anything that could possibly force Apple to make something expandable but not starting at nearly $3k (like my $800 overpriced Quad MP) I'd be a future happy-camper.
I do just wish that Apple would take the easy way out. Produce a motherboard with no CPU or RAM that fits in a regular case, bundle a licensed copy of OS X with it, and let the savvy users build up their own systems based on that board. Why is that so hard?
Amen to that! Let the rest of us who know how to build computers have a cheaper DIY option for cheaper. (Just like in the windows world).
I don't know what kind of prices you're getting, but speccing a base model Precision 3500 comes out to just under $2k. However, take into account that the Precision 3500 doesn't have ANY kind of Firewire unless you toss in the $50 card, does not come with Bluetooth (or even a BTO option for it!), no optical audio options, and one ethernet port, then you're looking at further upgrades and a couple of occupied PCIe slots to get a closer equivalent. About the only thing the Dell has going for it is the Quadro, but we're looking at a lower-end Quadro in the base model. Even without that, the Dell is still not 50-60% cheaper by a long shot. I don't know what things are like in the Swedish store, but the US store doesn't show that at all.
That and it looks like you went for the build with the widest difference in price. It seems that the prices are closer with any other basic configuration, especially if you shoot for a dual CPU rig. In fact, a dual 2.26ghz quad Xeon Dell is only a few hundred shy of a Mac Pro with the closest specs.
I do just wish that Apple would take the easy way out. Produce a motherboard with no CPU or RAM that fits in a regular case, bundle a licensed copy of OS X with it, and let the savvy users build up their own systems based on that board. Why is that so hard?
because there would always be the idiots who put in the wrong CPU or screw something up. then it takes away from the aura of the
Mac Experience (I'm suggesting Apple's thinking, not mine)apple is all about providing the entire ecosystem, which is what makes their products so appealing. most of their users don't want to get into the nitty-gritty of doing their own systems. I see exactly where you're coming from and agree to a point, but you represent a miniscule minority that Apple doesn't see as part of their agenda. I'm guilty of this as well, but it's hard to remember that informed communities like MacRumors represent a very small fraction of the total potential and actual Mac user base.
On the old Mac Pro the margins were also around 30%. Apple knows its pro market will stick, so they can bump up the margins to what they like. Then again, now that a Mac Pro costs the same as a PC, Apple have left their pro software (FCS, Aperture) in the dark ages, Windows 7 is looking good, I wouldn't be surprised to see a lot of professionals move.
Would I still buy a Mac Pro? Yes, it's priced well in comparison to its competitors, plus OS X is worth a lot to me. I'm still going to moan about its shortcomings however.
Hehe, ok, so, instead of a combo hardware + software where Apple can profit from both, they could just sell the software... riiiiight... Hey wait! Someone already did that on the market! Yes, and the software costs 3 times what a Mac OS X costs... it is buggy, unstable, hum....
Where is the deal here again?
The savvy users have already figured out ways to build their own systems without Apple's "help". If it was easy, the users would no longer need to be savvy, would they?
What a load of crap - why don't you read up on this stuff before posting ?
If you did look up how Apple worked with Xerox you would see how foolish you sound. I quote from Steve Wozniak - from a question regarding the film Pirates of Silicon Valley:
Q From e-mail: Did Apple "steal" the GUI from Xerox (at PARC), or did they develop it themselves? And a personal question; how do you think the MacOS is better than Windows? What about MacOS X (any future?)? Sorry to be intrusive, but I am naturally inquisitive, and I figure if anyone would know the answers to these questions, it would be you. Thanks for your time. John
WOZ: Apple worked with Xerox openly to bring their developments to a mass audience. That's what Steve portrayed Apple as being good at. Xerox got a lot of Apple stock for it too, it was an agreement.
Microsoft just took it from Xerox or Apple or whomever. It took them a long time to get it halfway right.
I just hope Apple wipes them out sooner rather than later.
I thought Apple was going to take them down a year ago?
Im not a fan of Psystar, maily because they dont give credit to the fellows that actually make this possible, but i kinda respect what they are doing. They arent afraid to stand toe-to-toe with a giant corporation, and that takes balls.
Really? How's that? The Apple I and II had OSes that were "purchased" off-the-shelf?
I just cant wait to see what Apple Does.
Although I do care that Apple is abel to continue supporting pure hardware and software together.
Hell, I wouldnt care if they only sold OSX with a machine. I agree with everyone using the fine jewelry or fashion as an analogy.
Although I do care that Apple is abel to continue supporting pure hardware and software together.
Hell, I wouldnt care if they only sold OSX with a machine. I agree with everyone using the fine jewelry or fashion as an analogy.
I don't think the people that would be buying it would be the ones to make those kinds of mistakes.because there would always be the idiots who put in the wrong CPU or screw something up. then it takes away from the aura of the