Quake 4, Complete with Cross-Platform Multiplayer, Arrives on the Mac App Store

[*LTD*]

Really? And what is the business rationale behind this redesign of yours?

Self-entitlement.

There just isn't enough demand for a Mac "gaming" computer - and even if there were, the absence of such a machine (competitively priced) tells you another thing: Apple doesn't think it's profitable and worth their time. In its current state, Apple's Mac business is wildly profitable. They've outpaced the rest of the PC industry in growth for years now, and given the direction in which the technological wind is blowing, it is more likely they're concerned with getting the power and architecture of their iDevice offerings just right.

Nor does Apple make a gaming console. They do, however, do *very well* in terms of mobile gaming (iPad, iPhone.) So they do, in fact, have gaming covered.

A lot of people have computers, but not many people have multipurpose gaming PCs.

Apple has absolutely no incentive to do what he wants. Of course, because Apple doesn't address the needs of a particular segment of the market (seemingly, for the sheer reason that it just exists, nothing more) then they allegedly have their head up their A$$.

Meanwhile, there are about 100 billion dollars' worth of reasons they don't (and that they're probably the only ones who don't.)

 

[ppilone]

I agree. I can't see tablets becoming anything other than a nice shiney toy.
I honestly don't see what's so good about them apart from dicking about on youtube/the net/checking emails.

But that's what 90% of people that use computers do. Maybe we (MacRumors members) use our computers for more that that but most people don't.

It can't be called a "niche product" and then say it's good at all of the things 90% of people do on a computer.

 

[3282868]

Self-entitlement.

There just isn't enough demand for a Mac "gaming" computer - and even if there were, the absence of such a machine (competitively priced) tells you another thing: Apple doesn't think it's profitable and worth their time.

So

1) You're assuming there isn't a demand for such a system (example a mid-tower)

2) What Apple thinks is the be all end all, cause they're Apple, and have never made mistakes (such as the G4 Cube, puck mouse, MacBook Pro nVidia fiasco, Newton, etc, etc)

3) The professionals who used PowerMac's and Apple Cinema Displays who have now left for Unix or Windows systems due to Apple's lack of pro-Apps and professional grade hardware are meaningless

4) Apple can not focus on both consumer and professional hardware, given their $100 billion dollars in cash

 

[*LTD*]

So

1) You're assuming there isn't a demand for such a system (example a mid-tower)

Retailers can barely get desktops to move. Even AIOs are a hard sell (except for the iMac.) It's all about portability and mobility in today's market.

2) What Apple thinks is the be all end all, cause they're Apple, and have never made mistakes (such as the G4 Cube, puck mouse, MacBook Pro nVidia fiasco, Newton, etc, etc)

They choose what to produce and what not to produce. Their current strategy is mistake-free. They don't have to give you something just because you happen to want it. There is a universe of other factors to consider. When it comes to operating and succeeding in the most forward-looking, progressive markets, they're at the front of the pack. As for the old desktop paradigm . . . you won't find much luck with Apple. And one can't really blame them for that.

3) The professionals who used PowerMac's and Apple Cinema Displays who have now left for Unix or Windows systems due to Apple's lack of pro-Apps and professional grade hardware are meaningless

Of course it's meaningless. One market traded for another. Apple is making a killing from their current Mac lineup, and their current Mac strategy is yielding them the most profits in the industry. And that's *without* serving Pros to they extent they did in the past. Apple has shifted strategy TOWARD greater profitability and has shifted their attention to the most profitable market - Consumers. Especially Prosumers.

Business is business.

4) Apple can not focus on both consumer and professional hardware, given their $100 billion dollars in cash

Who says they even need to? Who says they HAVE TO? Companies stop serving one segment of the market (or transition away form it) in favour of another ALL THE TIME.

LOL how the hell do you think they got to $100 billion in cash??

 

[3282868]

Retailers can barely get desktops to move. Even AIOs are a hard sell (except for the iMac.) It's all about portability and mobility in today's market.

Not true. Source?

Of course it's meaningless. One market traded for another. Apple is making a killing from their current Mac lineup, and their current Mac strategy is yielding them the most profits in the industry.

So the developers who make all those iOS apps are meaningless (note: most of us use Mac Pro's)

LOL how the hell do you think they got to $100 billion in cash??

Gee, before the iPhone there was the iPad in 2004. How do you think Apple got all the money for R&D for iOS and iDevices? From the professionals who used PowerMac's and ACD CCFL LCD's!

What a lot of those comments mean is that people who have been using Mac's (not just iMacs and PowerBooks, but PowerMacs and the ACD CCFL LCDs) are tired of iPhones, iPads and iOS taking the front seat while the power systems that once frontlined MacRumors are given as much regard as the Mac Pro.

Yes, Apple made its current fortune with iOS and consumer focus, but at the cost of the professionals who initially supported Apple during its rough years. Where do you think Apple got the funding to get into the mobile market? From those of us who used Apple PowerMac's and displays; the photographers, film editors, designers - all that money into R&D for iOS and mobile devices.

iPads and iPhones are cheaper than Mac's, cross platform and gave people a taste into the Mac ecosystem. Yet most are consumers buying notebooks for their kids, or iMacs to surf the web. Try real film editing on an iPad or even a quad MacBook Pro, compared to my 12-Core Mac Pro, HD rendering is a PITA on my MacBook Pro. Not many who used PowerMac's for heavy lifting are going back to Apple, and not because there's no money in the market for them, but because Apple just doesn't care.

So yeah, some of us who depended on Apple for work, our livelihood, now have to face iPads and iOS features weakening the systems we have come to use for almost a decade or more.

Please, don't bother responding, we all know it will turn into an endless pissing contest. We both have differing opinions, let's leave it at that.

 

[3282868]

LOL how the hell do you think they got to $100 billion in cash??

idk, from all the professionals that used Apple DESKTOPS for working on developing your devices and iOS? No, couldn't be...

I can't with this one...

 

[zorinlynx]

You know this exists already? Quake Live?

QuakeLive is but a shadow of the original Quake 3 Arena. They modified the gameplay a bit, removed the ability to use add-ons (so no Threewave, *original* Rocket Arena, etc.) and it's a bit crashy/unstable and also removed all the gibs, which was a good 30% of the fun of the original Q3A.

It just doesn't replace it. Granted, I've played it quite a bit, but still long for the original Q3A to get a proper port.

 

[*LTD*]

idk, from all the professionals that used Apple DESKTOPS for working on developing your devices and iOS? No, couldn't be...

I can't with this one...

Are iOS developers complaining they don't have the tools they need? Lol, not likely. Apple still sells systems that are more than capable of handling iOS development. Apple sells Mac Pros that are more than powerful for power-hungry "Pro" tasks. In fact, their iMac line is quite powerful as well. But I didn't realize "Pros" need a new videocard every two months (which they don't.) As for developing the devices themselves, Apple and their partners have that covered.

 

[gotluck]

Retailers can barely get desktops to move. Even AIOs are a hard sell (except for the iMac.) It's all about portability and mobility in today's market.

I think you are underestimating the amount of 'build your own pc'ers' that could be swayed by a reasonably priced (not mac pro grade) 'open' mac tower.

 

[*LTD*]

I think you are underestimating the amount of 'build your own pc'ers' that could be swayed by a reasonably priced (not mac pro grade) 'open' mac tower.

Build your own PC'ers don't want Macs that aren't as flexible as roll-your-own PCs, and not for that cheap. There will NEVER be a Mac like that. These folks might as well do it cheaper and hit up Newegg, OWC, and whoever else makes parts, and they'll already *know* that a hackintosh is also an option.

You can't just build a genuine Mac from parts from different vendors.

So what you're saying, by implication, is that Apple should spend money to serve a minority of a minority of the PC market (the majority *does not* build their own PCs.)

That just doesn't seem sensible. And it hasn't seemed sensible to either Apple (given their Mac strategy for the past few years) or industry analysts. There's a reason for that. Apple runs the numbers and gets a certain result. The other players in the industry are experiencing downturns while Apple, with a very specific, focused lineup that doesn't contain any fluff or a boatload of configurations . . . is not.

Just because Apple *can* do something (to satisfy a minority, no less) doesn't mean they *should.*

Saying "there's no reason Apple can't do this or won't do this" is baloney. There IS a reason they're not doing it. There's no such thing as no reason, especially when it concerns Apple. And chances are, if they actually let you in on it, paperwork, numbers and all, you'd walk away a 100% believer in their explanation. If anyone understands the market, it's Apple. Hell, they've been teaching the rest of the industry about it for years now.

It comes down to costs vs. benefits, the integrity of the platform, economics, etc. Apple, at this stage, has to think long and hard whether a minority of a minority are worth allocating resources to. Waste is waste, even when it's tiny. Today more than ever, tech companies are looking to trim operations and slim down product lines.

 

[3282868]

Hardly sensible.

Or, has been stated, Apple could make money off that segment as it does exist. It isn't a small segment as you claim. Movie houses, editors, photographers - pro's that need the power iPads and iMacs and MacBook's cannot provide. Many have Mac Pro's, use pro-Apps, need the power. I don't know why you're so oblivious to this fact and are eating up this non-sense that ARM processors and iDevices and quad Core 15" MacBook Pro's are sufficient. Movie editors, such as myself, need at least two good displays and a viewing monitor. Using FCP alone my displays are taken, and my cores on my Pro are maxed out. So Apple choses to ignore it, you don't know why, you're merely GUESSING. Steve Jobs was notorious for having tunnel vision, doesn't mean he's always right.

----------

I think you are underestimating the amount of 'build your own pc'ers' that could be swayed by a reasonably priced (not mac pro grade) 'open' mac tower.

Amen. I guess some people just see things one way. It isn't unreasonable to make room at the table for everyone. LTD claims Apple will lose money on the pro-market. They still make pro-devices and app's. Using his logic, Apple should just drop EVERYTHING pro cause there's no money in it, but they aren't so it stands to reason they must be making some money. Following this to a logical conclusion, more focus on this segment with their billions will create more profit. Otherwise, Apple wouldn't do it, right?

 

[xTRIGGER092x]

You could wait for a sale. It's already been 7 years. Whats a few more months? And get an iTunes card from Best Buy when they have a 20% off deal and then stack up the discount on a sale for an even cheaper price.

People always complain of high prices, but I always get everything in the iTunes store and Mac App store for far cheaper by getting gift cards.

I'm not wanting to buy the game; I bought it on Xbox 360 already back in 2005. Charging $20 for a game that old is absurd.

 

[*LTD*]

Steve Jobs was notorious for having tunnel vision, doesn't mean he's always right.

The most profitable computer business in the entire industry, for years now. A fiendish predilection for saying "NO", a tendency to keep product lines as slim and focused as possible, but one that will appeal to the broadest segment of the market possible.

The result? You've seen the results. They need no reiteration.

Yeah, Steve was right all along. Even about stuff no one else knew about at the time.

Thank God for "tunnel vision" (translation: FOCUS.)

The industry at large could with a lot more of this "tunnel vision." It would cut down on all the junk.

 

[3282868]

The most profitable computer business in the entire industry, for years now. A fiendish predilection for saying "NO", a tendency to keep product lines as slim and focused as possible, but one that will appeal to the broadest segment of the market possible.

The result? You've seen the results. They need no reiteration.

Yeah, Steve was right all along. Even about stuff no one else knew about at the time.

Thank God for "tunnel vision" (translation: FOCUS.)

The industry at large could with a lot more of this "tunnel vision." It would cut down on all the junk.

Ok man, you definitely have your mind set, so there's no point. As I stated before, it just becomes a pissing contest. Take care!

 

[MythicFrost]

A-MEN

A friend of mine working at Pixar had a great suggestion.

Imagine a Mac Pro, similar to the size of the ill fated G4 Cube. Enough room for processor(s), RAM, HDD/SSD, maybe a graphics card and two PCIe slots (or more) and Thunderbolt ports. You can place it in a closet, attach HDD's and maybe a graphics box via Thunderbolt, and have one Thunderbolt cable running to your HID's and display. Bam! That would be awesome.

Haha yeah, that would be pretty neat!

 

[Can't Stop]

Ok man, you definitely have your mind set, so there's no point. As I stated before, it just becomes a pissing contest. Take care!

Yeah, it’s hard to argue with him when he’s right.

 

[Data]

Mulitplayer is not COOP, and thats the most fun in my opinion

So why not coop like LMS support, like this its no fun at all.

 

[Irishman]

Apple would gain customers like me who wont buy mac until they have decent non mobile graphics cards that are user upgradeable in a model more affordable than a mac pro. I don't need 12 cores - I just want a regular damn graphics card.

People love to boast about the longevity of Apple's products, but if you care about games you can forget about the longevity. My ~'07 (aside from the graphics card) C2D PC with an UPGRADED graphics card can run newly released games at playable rates - Apple's products should be able to do the same (save for the mac pro which I believe can), considering they are premium products in other capacaties.

Sounds like your needs would be better served by a Hackintosh.

 

[Irishman]

QuakeLive is but a shadow of the original Quake 3 Arena. They modified the gameplay a bit, removed the ability to use add-ons (so no Threewave, *original* Rocket Arena, etc.) and it's a bit crashy/unstable and also removed all the gibs, which was a good 30% of the fun of the original Q3A.

It just doesn't replace it. Granted, I've played it quite a bit, but still long for the original Q3A to get a proper port.

I have been schooled.

Many thanks, my friend, but now I mourn with you for a Lion version of Q3A.

 

[Irishman]

Haha yeah, that would be pretty neat!

Some time ago, there was a conversation on one of the podcasts I listen to (I think it was TUAW, but it could just as easily have been Macbreak Weekly).

They were talking about possible extension of Thunderbolt in new Mac Pros, assuming of course that Apple refreshes it at all, and the thinking was a new Mac Pro might look like the Cube form factor mentioned above. But, apart from the motherboard/CPU, power supply, SSD, and RAM all the extensible and replacable stuff would plug into the Mac's 4-6 Thunderbolt ports, including graphics support and pretty much anything that currently needs to sit in a PCI slot.

The idea would seem to stick to Apple's design mantra of simplification, reducing the form factor and taking advantage of Thunderbolt for i/o.

----------

I'm not wanting to buy the game; I bought it on Xbox 360 already back in 2005. Charging $20 for a game that old is absurd.

No, it's not absurd. I will gladly pay it.

----------

I think you are underestimating the amount of 'build your own pc'ers' that could be swayed by a reasonably priced (not mac pro grade) 'open' mac tower.

Apple hasn't made a proper midtower since Steve returned in 1997. I think that (even though I would snap one up in a heartbeat), I stopped holding my breath for Apple to offer one again many years ago. It would have to be a very compelling business case for operations-centric Tim Cook and design-centric Jon Ives to sign off on such a functional but inelegant solution.

 

[gotluck]

*It would have to be a very compelling business case for operations-centric Tim Cook and design-centric Jon Ives to sign off on such a functional but inelegant solution.

Haha that's one hell of a quote. I guess I'm not apples target customer, I'd take functionality over elegance any day especially for a desktop style machine.

 

[jouster]

So you were about to wonder? -or- You did wonder?

I hope s/he responds soon. It's important that we get this cleared up.

Yeah, I'll thoroughly enjoy watching grandma and grandpa use their tablet toy while I use my computer to get real work done and then some.

I used my tablet yesterday to finalize a seven figure deal. My employers consider that to be real work.

idk, from all the professionals that used Apple DESKTOPS for working on developing your devices and iOS? No, couldn't be...

I can't with this one...

You certainly seem not to know if you believe that the desktops are responsible for Apple's cash pile. In fact, they are the smallest grossing segment of the company's hardware, behind notebooks and waaaaay behind iOS devices.

 

[3282868]

You certainly seem not to know if you believe that the desktops are responsible for Apple's cash pile. In fact, they are the smallest grossing segment of the company's hardware, behind notebooks and waaaaay behind iOS devices.

Where did I state that desktops are Apple's cash pile? Never did. Simply stated they're not losing money on desktop sales as one person claims desktops aren't money making at all for Apple. Simply stated that wasn't true.

 

[InuNacho]

How is Quake 4 anyways? I used to play Q3A and UT on the Dreamcast all the time and when UT2004 came out never checked in again on Quake. Probably has something to do with not having a Mac version.
Do they still have the announcer that yells "Humiliation" and all that fun stuff?

I agree with several others in this thread, we need a headless upgradable iMac OR a low end Pro in the $1,200 range. They used to make low end Powermacs in the G4 days, I don't see why they can't do that again.

 

[Richdmoore]

How is Quake 4 anyways? I used to play Q3A and UT on the Dreamcast all the time and when UT2004 came out never checked in again on Quake. Probably has something to do with not having a Mac version.
Do they still have the announcer that yells "Humiliation" and all that fun stuff?

I agree with several others in this thread, we need a headless upgradable iMac OR a low end Pro in the $1,200 range. They used to make low end Powermacs in the G4 days, I don't see why they can't do that again.

I don't remember if there is an announcer, I never played the multiplayer component more than a game or two.

Quake 4 is a sequel to Quake 2, rather than Quake 3 Arena. Basically it is much more of a traditional single player story driven FPS, with the multiplayer part being standard deathmatch, capture the flag, etc....

I do really like the single player part of the game, I played it on the PC and Xbox 360.