Quality of Moderation on MacRumors Forums

[MBAir2010]

seems to me the better the  product like the M1 chip with Monterey,
has to be a relief to the moderators compared to High Sierra with a MBP Butterly keyboard,
as the late 2010's were brutal here with many jumping ships everyday.

imagine deciphering all those daily negative posts from both  and 🪟 users?

 

[bousozoku]

seems to me the better the  product like the M1 chip with Monterey,
has to be a relief to the moderators compared to High Sierra with a MBP Butterly keyboard,
as the late 2010's were brutal here with many jumping ships everyday.

imagine deciphering all those daily negative posts from both  and 🪟 users?

I stopped moderating about the time of the first iPhone, after the price dropped and people were ranting about not yet getting their refund. Every few seconds, there seemed to be 20 new, angry posts.

 

[splifingate]

While I've made some somewhat-specious (e.g., "LOL" ('yeah; I could have ruminated upon my thoughts a few seconds longer') comments over the years (some of which have been deleted by teh Mods)), my mind comes to the question:

I have been seeing a lot of "Suspended" accounts from frequent (and, sometimes, rather-nice-like) Posters.

Maybe I've been recently paying more attention, but I have observed more "Suspended" accounts as-of-late (even more than I observed during the last USofA Presidential Cycle).

It's sorta tough to enter-into a discussion with a (partial) fear that a hammer might bonk me over my head.

No-matter my heartfelt intent, every day--I might go by-the-way-of-the-Dodo.

I'm just here to learn, share and provide perspective (when I can).

urhm. . . I guess that's all I've got to say about that.

 

[Weaselboy]

I don't think we are doing any more suspensions than in the past.

Honestly, if you just don't act like an ass and treat others with some measure of courtesy, you aren't going to end up suspended. Even if you do unintentionally run afoul of a rule, say something like a technical posting requirement in the marketplace section, or a LOL post as you mentioned, you would not get suspended for it. All you would get is a reminder (heads up) about the rules. Only if you ignored the reminder and repeatedly violated the same rule, would you risk being suspended.

Hope you have a nice Thanksgiving.

 

[Clix Pix]

The thing is, too, no matter how helpful, friendly, charming, delightful and wonderful any member seems to be, the issue is not about that at all, but rather specifically around whatever forum rule(s) he or she may be violating at any particular time. And, yes, in the case of some members those violations do add up after a while, certain posting patterns inevitably emerge and if there is a persistence in those regardless of reminders/cautions/warnings/temporary suspensions, etc., yes, further decisions have to be made.

At some point an administrative/moderating team on a web-based discussion forum is going to have to address the issue of how any member's posting patterns and behavior have an impact on the many, many other members of their site and eventually make a decision which is considered to be for the overall good of the community. They can't do anything about whatever may be causing this type of behavior in the first place, that is way outside their realm, they simply need to assess the situation in front of them and work from there. It's not an easy decision, nor often a popular one for various reasons, but it certainly is a difficult one for any admins/mods team to have to make and implement.

 

[splifingate]

I don't think we are doing any more suspensions than in the past.

Ah, well, one could only hope otherwise 😉 It's my microscope, of course.

it certainly is a difficult one

I can only imagine!

Happy 🦃-day People . . . may your kitchen/house smell as divine as mine 🙂

 

[I7guy]

I don't think we are doing any more suspensions than in the past.

I believe (wet finger in the air) suspensions are less since PRSI was shut down.

Honestly, if you just don't act like an ass and treat others with some measure of courtesy, you aren't going to end up suspended.

This is sage advice. If one follows the above without reading one single rule (even through one agrees to them when creating an account) there would be much more civility. Having said that some people just can’t help themselves….

Even if you do unintentionally run afoul of a rule, say something like a technical posting requirement in the marketplace section, or a LOL post as you mentioned, you would not get suspended for it. All you would get is a reminder (heads up) about the rules. Only if you ignored the reminder and repeatedly violated the same rule, would you risk being suspended.

Hope you have a nice Thanksgiving.

Don’t know who is more stuffed. Me or the turkey.

 

[jav6454]

I don't think we are doing any more suspensions than in the past.

I'd say less ever since PRSI was cancelled. Lots of users joined (in a sense) to MR just to go about tirades there.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

I'd say less ever since PRSI was cancelled. Lots of users joined (in a sense) to MR just to go about tirades there.

Unfortunately, the cancellation of PRSI hasn't led to an end to tirades.

Just pay a visit to many of the iPhone threads around launch time to see a veritable tsunami of intemperate tirades.

 

[jav6454]

Yes, that is a truth. However, as a counter, I'd say the tsunami of tirades will lessen now that changes were put in place recently. Perhaps not as much, but egregious fighting should subside to an extent.

 

[Chuckeee]

Unfortunately, the cancellation of PRSI hasn't led to an end to tirades.

Just pay a visit to many of the iPhone threads around launch time to see a veritable tsunami of intemperate tirades.

Agreed, any mention of either X/twitter or China is like waving raw meat to a pack of hungry dogs.

 

[VulchR]

I, for one, miss PSRI, but I do understand why MR pulled the plug. Still, as a MR user sometimes it is hard to determine the boundary between technology and politics. For instance the current debates about AI, which is bound to affect not just Apple products, but nearly every domain of our lives. In such cases the mods will have to make judgement calls, and I hope that most people can recognise that their words are not so precious that a debate needs to be had with the mods every time a post is taken down.

Also, I'd have to say that I have been suspended a few times. Of the initial reaction is 'why me?', but then when I have considered the post in question, I can see where the mods come from. I do think there are some biases, particularly regarding critical comments of certain countries and Apple-related trade, and the cynic in me wonders about MR's efforts to promote itself in those countries, but for the most part I think the mods do a thankless job very well. I hope they realise that when I have overstepped the mark that I didn't mean to. The only thing thing missing from the moderation process is a mechanism for expressing apologies and gratitude to the mods.

 

[Madhatter32]

I, for one, miss PSRI, but I do understand why MR pulled the plug. Still, as a MR user sometimes it is hard to determine the boundary between technology and politics. For instance the current debates about AI, which is bound to affect not just Apple products, but nearly every domain of our lives. In such cases the mods will have to make judgement calls, and I hope that most people can recognise that their words are not so precious that a debate needs to be had with the mods every time a post is taken down.

Also, I'd have to say that I have been suspended a few times. Of the initial reaction is 'why me?', but then when I have considered the post in question, I can see where the mods come from. I do think there are some biases, particularly regarding critical comments of certain countries and Apple-related trade, and the cynic in me wonders about MR's efforts to promote itself in those countries, but for the most part I think the mods do a thankless job very well. I hope they realise that when I have overstepped the mark that I didn't mean to. The only thing thing missing from the moderation process is a mechanism for expressing apologies and gratitude to the mods.

PSRI was littered with racist, anti-Semitic, misogynistic and other forms of hate speech couched as political discourse. Conspiracy theories, false narratives and other forms of political propaganda also polluted that forum. Rants about iPhone releases pale in comparison to what was going on there. It was a disgrace to the community and I cannot imagine anyone missing that cesspool -- but to each their own. I, for one, applaud MR for throwing the whole sorry mess into the trash can.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

I, for one, miss PSRI, but I do understand why MR pulled the plug.

Agreed.

Still, as a MR user sometimes it is hard to determine the boundary between technology and politics.

This is a key point, and one I used to make when arguing for the retention of PRSI.

I am not sure that it is possible to separate discussion of technology - which has had an utterly transformational effect on our lives - and that of politics as - increasingly - in myriad ways - they are fused

Or, rather, I am not so sure that it is possible to consider politics entirely divorced from discussion of the socio-economic influence of tech, not least, the influence of technology on politics and on society.

For instance the current debates about AI, which is bound to affect not just Apple products, but nearly every domain of our lives. In such cases the mods will have to make judgement calls, and I hope that most people can recognise that their words are not so precious that a debate needs to be had with the mods every time a post is taken down.

This is pretty much my opinion, as well.

Also, I'd have to say that I have been suspended a few times. Of the initial reaction is 'why me?', but then when I have considered the post in question, I can see where the mods come from. I do think there are some biases, particularly regarding critical comments of certain countries and Apple-related trade, and the cynic in me wonders about MR's efforts to promote itself in those countries, but for the most part I think the mods do a thankless job very well.

Again, to a pretty large extent, I find myself in agreement with you.

I hope they realise that when I have overstepped the mark that I didn't mean to. The only thing thing missing from the moderation process is a mechanism for expressing apologies and gratitude to the mods.

Well said.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

PSRI was littered with racist, anti-Semitic, misogynistic and other forms of hate speech couched as political discourse.

Unfortunately, this is (was?) true.

However, there were thoughtful and informed and interesting contributions made there, as well.

Conspiracy theories, false narratives and other forms of political propaganda also polluted that forum.

Alas, yes.

Rants about iPhone releases pale in comparison to what was going on there. It was a disgrace to the community and I cannot imagine anyone missing that cesspool -- but to each their own. I, for one, applaud MR for throwing the whole sorry mess into the trash can.

Unfortunately, one cannot pretend that tech concerns and political matters are not linked, and that they do not play an enormous (and increasingly important) role in our lives and worlds.

The pity of it is that it no longer seems possible to be able to conduct a civil discourse in an online platform (or, a real life one, for that matter), where such subjects can be discussed calmly and with composure, combining respect for differing perspectives while disagreeing on actual (political and socio-economic) positions.

 

[rm5]

PSRI was littered with racist, anti-Semitic, misogynistic and other forms of hate speech couched as political discourse. Conspiracy theories, false narratives and other forms of political propaganda also polluted that forum. Rants about iPhone releases pale in comparison to what was going on there. It was a disgrace to the community and I cannot imagine anyone missing that cesspool -- but to each their own. I, for one, applaud MR for throwing the whole sorry mess into the trash can.

I wasn't a member when the PRSI forum was a thing, so I have no personal experience with it. Although from what you're saying, I completely understand why it was bagged.

The pity of it is that it no longer seems possible to be able to conduct a civil discourse in an online platform (or, a real life one, for that matter), where such subjects can be discussed calmly and with composure, combining respect for differing perspectives while disagreeing on actual (political and socio-economic) positions.

I think that's true in most places, but there are some where that can happen (a school, for instance - or a well-managed Discord server). You're right about most online platforms though, and I agree there.

 

[Madhatter32]

The pity of it is that it no longer seems possible to be able to conduct a civil discourse in an online platform (or, a real life one, for that matter), where such subjects can be discussed calmly and with composure, combining respect for differing perspectives while disagreeing on actual (political and socio-economic) positions.

I agree that it is a pity. Moderation is a good thing for an online forum like this one. But no matter how good (or bad) it is, I think moderating a forum on politics, religion and social issues is near impossible these days given a world of limited resources and the open nature of the forum. Many members of that forum were not interested in civil discourse in any way.

 

[MajorFubar]

What the heck was PRSI? Sounds like some work-related physical injury that the lawyers on the TV ads want me to make a claim for.

 

[rm5]

What the heck was PRSI? Sounds like some work-related physical injury that the lawyers on the TV ads want me to make a claim for.

From my limited knowledge (because I wasn't a member back then), it was a Politics, Religion, and Social Issues subforum. Problem was, apparently, things got very out of hand and it was too hard to moderate effectively, so they had to permanently close it.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

I opted out of PRSI in the end as I think it highlighted and brought out the very worst in posters characters. There are posters now who I have found a lot of common ground with and appreciate their input, but once upon a time I would have thought their views were abhorrent when discussing politics and religion. I think it was the best thing this site ever did when they closed it down even if I think some of the threads here mildly touch on political points by nature and the rules are too strict. For example when talking about sports where politics are ingrained to some degree. It can be hard to discuss current decisions and issues without touching these topics.

 

[laptech]

Removing PRSI was a mistake in my opinion because the vast majority of what goes on in the world is either the result of political motivation, religious motivation or social motivation. Executive pay rises, bonusses, new manufacturing plants being built, manufacturing plants being closed, prices rises and the list goes on. A lot of what goes on with regards to Apple and China is either politically related or social related but no one can talk about it because the rules state your not allowed to discuss maters of a political, religious or social matter.

As soon as dissent started happening in PRSI the mod's should have been on it hard but they were not and allowed the section to get out of hand to the point where they complained they could not handle the work load in dealing with that section of the forum.

Closing PRSI and stipulating in the rules that you cannot discuss PSRI matters elsewhere in the forum has allowed the owner of the forum to make sure certain Apple related topics cannot be discussed. A good case in point is Apple's presence in China. This is a big concern to many Apple fans and supporters but yet cannot be discussed because there is no place to discuss it which would not incur the wrath of the mods.

Members need to understand that they are being conditioned, controlled in how to respond to posts. You make a post, you notice it get's removed. Day's later you make another post and you get a 'friendly' reminder that you have broken the rules. This then get's you thinking 'what am i doing wrong? why are my posts being removed, why and I getting 'friendly' reminders about the rules. This then changes your thought process on how you behave and thus you change how you word your posts to prevent having posts removed and to prevent getting the 'friendly' rule reminders.

 

[VulchR]

I wasn't a member when the PRSI forum was a thing, so I have no personal experience with it. Although from what you're saying, I completely understand why it was bagged.
...

That is just one person's view, but it is true that PSRI was becoming impossible at a practical level to moderate. However, I think the mods now face similar challenges in the news forums, with many grey areas, and I would hope that people would give them a break. It seems like every so often people vent at them, and I think most of the time the criticism is unfair. Even in instances in which the mods were overzealous, I don't think we should begrudge a few minor biases or mistakes. They get it right most of the time, and that's the most we can expect of human beings. Frankly, I marvel that anybody volunteers to be a mod.

 

[rm5]

Members need to understand that they are being conditioned, controlled in how to respond to posts. You make a post, you notice it get's removed. Day's later you make another post and you get a 'friendly' reminder that you have broken the rules. This then get's you thinking 'what am i doing wrong? why are my posts being removed, why and I getting 'friendly' reminders about the rules. This then changes your thought process on how you behave and thus you change how you word your posts to prevent having posts removed and to prevent getting the 'friendly' rule reminders.

If there were no rules or no enforcement of the rules, it'd just be like 4Chan or whatever, and who wants that? Of course you have to choose your words carefully—I think that goes with most sensible online communities.

As soon as dissent started happening in PRSI the mod's should have been on it hard but they were not and allowed the section to get out of hand to the point where they complained they could not handle the work load in dealing with that section of the forum.

Don't you think that most people knew exactly what they were getting into when they posted in PRSI? Users and moderators alike. I understand, it is hard to control, but you can't blame the mods entirely.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

If there were no rules or no enforcement of the rules, it'd just be like 4Chan or whatever, and who wants that? Of course you have to choose your words carefully—I think that goes with most sensible online communities.

Agreed.

Don't you think that most people knew exactly what they were getting into when they posted in PRSI? Users and moderators alike. I understand, it is hard to control, but you can't blame the mods entirely.

I've been a member of the forum since 2008, and I can honestly say that PRSI (tone and content, both) changed considerably - and for the worse - during my time on the forum.

It wasn't as venomous, and nor was it quite as toxic and trollish in those earlier years, - you tended to have more by way of debate, - sometimes, very interesting debates - and less by way of targeted insult designed and intended to cause offence.

In fact, there was a time when it was actually possible to have a genuine debate with individuals who held different opinions - informed by different perspectives - to one's own.

 

[laptech]

If there were no rules or no enforcement of the rules, it'd just be like 4Chan or whatever, and who wants that? Of course you have to choose your words carefully—I think that goes with most sensible online communities.

Don't you think that most people knew exactly what they were getting into when they posted in PRSI? Users and moderators alike. I understand, it is hard to control, but you can't blame the mods entirely.

It is not a case of about no rules or enforcement but a case about manipulating the rules and enforcement to force the situation that the owner of the forum wants to have total control over the narrative of what topics get discussed and how they are discussed.

For example and a very good one is the news reports that MR put out about the UK's online safety bill and Europe's stance on sideloading. Both topics are mired heavily with alleged political bias and influence but that avenue of discussion cannot be explored because it fall's under the no politics allowed. The UK's online safety bill is mired heavily with social issues as the root cause for it's introduction but again that avenue of discussion cannot be explored because again it would breach the rules on no social issue discussion allowed.