Remove the CDROM Apple!

[kappaknight]

I'm sorry. I didn't phrase my question correctly. I realize that people still buy DVDs and CDs. So, in that regard, there is use for a disk drive. What I meant to ask was: why can't media be placed on USB flash drives? Instead of renting a DVD you rent a USB stick with the movie on it. My TV set-top box, stereo, and DVD player all have USB ports. Can't we move past disks just like we moved past floppy disks and VHS tapes?

Honestly, the same argument can be made against flash drives. Why not just download everything from the cloud? Why carry any physical media period? One can download stuff, store it on the NAS and use XBMC to play the media on a number of different devices at home if one wants to be on the cutting edge.

There are obviously enough people still using CD/DVD's to warrant its inclusion. (Think globally in all of Apple's markets, not just what's going on in your house.) So it stays.

 

[Tomorrow]

That's his point. You don't' often use it. One could even argue that you could just use the burner at home, rip the dvd to your computer, then just watch on the laptop as a file, saving you both battery power AND having to bring the physical dvd and the case with you.

His point is that I don't often use it on the road. Even so, why insist on an external drive when I can have an internal? I DO use the external drive when I'm not at my desk, but if I have the option of bringing a movie with me or some extra hardware, I'd rather bring the movie.

There's still no substitute for burning a disc and giving it to someone when I want to. I don't keep a cache of thumb drives around to just up and give to people and let them keep. Optical media are cheap, and perfect for just such a thing.

Despite what some people may tell you, battery life is pretty good either playing a disc or watching a ripped video. Yes, spinning a disc uses power, but so does processing and rendering video. It's not that big a deal.

 

[bier-meister]

USB flash drives are more expensive for the storage they give. Also, you don't need a dvd to be rewritable if it's a form of media. You don't want your new CD or DVD to be able to hold something else, why would you? Of course there would be reasons but ultimately it wouldn't make sense.

You can get a 100 spool of dvds for under 30 bucks. You can get a flash drive that stores... I don't know, *checks* a 32gb drive under 50. See the cost difference? It costs drastically more to produce a million flash drives than to produce a million dvds. A lot more.

But it costs drastically more to produce a million dvds than to host the files on a server and let users download it and then store it whatever way they want (local drive, NAS, flash drive, cloud drive, external drive, DVD-R, etc).

 

[Roman2K~]

Honestly, the same argument can be made against flash drives. Why not just download everything from the cloud? Why carry any physical media period? One can download stuff, store it on the NAS and use XBMC to play the media on a number of different devices at home if one wants to be on the cutting edge.

There are obviously enough people still using CD/DVD's to warrant its inclusion. (Think globally in all of Apple's markets, not just what's going on in your house.) So it stays.

The point is not about whether physical media (whether CDs, DVDs, flash drives...) are useful or not. Of course they are.

It's about whether their use warrants precious space inside a portable computer, where every bit of space counts. Laptops are about compromise.

What would you rather have: 50% longer battery life or an embedded drive -- given that you could carry an external one for the only cases when you need optical discs?

 

[bigjobby]

What would you rather have: 50% longer battery life or an embedded drive -- given that you could carry an external one for the only cases when you need optical discs?

And would you be satisfied with a price hike in the MBP?

The base 13" in the UK is already £999 which isn't funny money and more battery instead of the SuperDrive would surely raise the MBP's price and effect Apple's target market significantly.

 

[ladytonya]

How many times when you aren't at home do you use the optical drive? Do you ever stick a music CD or any CD in your drive? If you had an airport extreme or similar wireless router with a usb port you could put the music on the external drive and plug it into the wireless router. I have a 1TB hooked to my Airport Extreme and when I need it I just select it as one of my network devices.

I have a simple wireless router that my laptop, printer, Wii, and PS3 connect to. Hubby's desktop is wired in to the router by ethernet connection. Honestly, I don't even know if it has a USB port or not. I have ~60GB of music on my hard drive and I use a 500GB external to run Time Machine. I don't want to mess with running iTunes off an external drive because then I couldn't access my iTunes library when I'm not at home.

Your first question, though, is what I have been thinking about. How many times when you aren't at home do you use the optical drive? Well, just thinking about the last 24 hours I can count 4 times.
1. Needed to burn 3 discs of music from our last community band concert to distribute for publicity. Only way this could be distributed was via CD because of the requirements of the places where we were distributing them to.
2. Received a CD of photos to add to a Facebook page that I manage for church. The files were too big to email and the person who sent them to me wouldn't know a thumb drive from a hole in the ground.
3. My husband bought a new CD at Best Buy and I wanted to load it into my iTunes right away so I could listen to it while I worked on a paper at the library. Yes, I realize I could have downloaded the CD but it was on sale thus actually cheaper to buy it at Best Buy. Plus, even if he had downloaded it he would have probably burned it to CD so I could rip it to my computer as it would be dumb for us to pay for the same CD twice.
4. Bought a magazine at Barnes & Noble that included a disc with various tutorials and some interesting free ware. Spent about 3 hours at B&N perusing the contents of that CD. Maybe the content was available online, who knows, but the CD came with the magazine and I got a lot of useful information off of it.
I know that you could go through and tell me the multitude of ways that I could have done these things without the OD, but really, it was easier to do them this way. Actually, since I've been typing this message a client just dropped off a disc of documents and photographs for me to take a look at, so there's number 5 in the past 24 hours. If you don't need an OD, buy a MBA, there are still plenty of us out there that need it!

 

[Roman2K~]

And would you be satisfied with a price hike in the MBP?

The base 13" in the UK is already £999 which isn't funny money and more battery instead of the SuperDrive would surely raise the MBP's price and effect Apple's target market significantly.

Good point.

We would have to see what Apple would do with the extra room and how that affects prices. Personnally, I wouldn't mind paying more for more battery, if I deem the price increase fair for the gain (unlike the additional 200€ for an extra 4 GB of RAM).

And I feel you about the $ => € | £ conversion. I'm in the same boat .

 

[Young Spade]

And would you be satisfied with a price hike in the MBP?

The base 13" in the UK is already £999 which isn't funny money and more battery instead of the SuperDrive would surely raise the MBP's price and effect Apple's target market significantly.

Not necessarily. There is a chance this would happen but Apple COULD just not make THAT much on their machines. They have 54 billion in cash and they make 3 times on a Macbook than HP does on a 600 dollar notebook.

I'm sure that even if they cut out the superdrive and added more battery, they would still make money. They could do that and keep the price the same.

But they won't. Because, as you can see from the tech specs of machines being released, they know people will pay whatever price without question.

 

[Tomorrow]

What would you rather have: 50% longer battery life or an embedded drive -- given that you could carry an external one for the only cases when you need optical discs?

An embedded drive. I'd rather carry a power cord than an external drive.

 

[Young Spade]

An embedded drive. I'd rather carry a power cord than an external drive.

Why? Seeing as the power cord weighs more and takes up more space? Not to mention brings hassle with keeping it spooled; plugs aren't always around either.

Of course you're entitled to your opinion and preference, I'm just wondering why you feel this way.

 

[Tomorrow]

Why? Seeing as the power cord weighs more and takes up more space?

There's hardly any appreciable difference in either size or weight between the two, but, just the same, let's explore that statement a bit.

The Apple Store online lists a MacBook Air Superdrive's weight at 0.74 lb.

I wasn't able to find the weight of a MacBook power adapter on the Apple Store online, so I found it at another online store: 0.20 lb.

I think your statement might be wrong.

Not to mention brings hassle with keeping it spooled

Huh? How in the world is this a hassle?

I don't want an external drive, I prefer to have it internal. I don't want to drop it. I don't want it bouncing around inside my briefcase. I don't want to figure out where to lay it when I'm watching a movie in bed at night. I don't want to burn a file for a client and realize that I left the external drive at home. None of those are an issue with an internal drive.

The only potential gain I could see to removing an internal optical drive is to add another battery. With Apple portables already getting 7-8 hours of life out of a charge, I fail to see why a second (or bigger) battery is more of an issue than an internal drive.

 

[blueroom]

I'm sure there were folks pining for Floppy disks when they stopped producing them. Heck pretty much every PC case still has em.

Bandwidth caps will increase, Flash memory will disappear when Phase Change memory matures and DVD drives will be a thing of the past (my guess 2015)

 

[Young Spade]

I don't want an external drive, I prefer to have it internal. I don't want to drop it. I don't want it bouncing around inside my briefcase. I don't want to figure out where to lay it when I'm watching a movie in bed at night. I don't want to burn a file for a client and realize that I left the external drive at home. None of those are an issue with an internal drive.

The only potential gain I could see to removing an internal optical drive is to add another battery. With Apple portables already getting 7-8 hours of life out of a charge, I fail to see why a second (or bigger) battery is more of an issue than an internal drive.

1) That's why I suggested they have TWO models. I fail to see why everyone always assumes either/or. I suggested (along with whoever started this whole debate) that they have a SEPARATE model with no optical and more battery ALONG WITH the standard notebook.

Everyone's happy and we don't need to have these arguments.

2) You make some good points; I could argue that having your laptop on > having an internal dvd/cd drive. If I'm doing a LOT of work during the day, personally I'd rather have my laptop last the entire day of working. The entire day.

I'm not saying you're wrong or your opinion is worse than mine, I'm stating, as a whole, that it doesn't really matter between us individuals because it comes down to personal preference. Someone suggesting they develop a laptop with no optical drive requires no cause for an argument nor debate.

Both sides can state the pros and cons but at the end of the day, none of that ultimately matters because, for one, the laptop isn't out, and two, they can just get whatever floats their boat and at this point, the entire debate would be meaningless.

But yes, the whole point of removing the drive is to add more battery power. That's what this whole thread is about: Battery power + weight OR an optical drive. You can ALWAYS bring an external drive but you can't always bring an extra battery nor can you always find an outlet. People going pro optical nit pick and state there are always plugs out there when there obviously aren't.

Both sides have pros and cons with them. If you don't use DVD daily and you cannot, for any reason, give up one usb port (or thunderbolt port, OR firewire port, it could use that) for the dvd drive then stick with the old model.

For everyone else who can carry 1 extra pound on occasion or leave it home when most dvds are used anyway, having a longer battery life would be the better option.

Not to be a party pooper but what else needs to be said?

 

[kappaknight]

The point is not about whether physical media (whether CDs, DVDs, flash drives...) are useful or not. Of course they are.

It's about whether their use warrants precious space inside a portable computer, where every bit of space counts. Laptops are about compromise.

What would you rather have: 50% longer battery life or an embedded drive -- given that you could carry an external one for the only cases when you need optical discs?

I think the point/argument is exactly about whether technology X is useful or not. It's included in a mobile package because it is useful for most people out there that purchase the laptop.

Run flat tires exist now, so why do people still carry spares when everyone can just buy run flat tires?

Also, just because the CD drive is taken out, it doesn't necessarily mean Apple will fill that void with a second battery, increase its weight dramatically and hope it magically produce 50% more battery life. Advancing battery technologies will be able to extend the life of the battery without increasing it in size, just like every other component in the MBP that is aimed at increasing speeds, reducing needs and increasing the mobile life of the device.

The reason most people choose to own a laptop today instead of a desktop is because we can just fold it up and take it with us. There is no benefit to owning a laptop if taking it means taking 15 USB attached accessories with it. You may think that's ridiculous, but that's what people a few years ago did. External wifi/3G connections, separate web cams, external mouse, external storage, GPS, and who knows what else.

 

[kappaknight]

1) That's why I suggested they have TWO models. I fail to see why everyone always assumes either/or. I suggested (along with whoever started this whole debate) that they have a SEPARATE model with no optical and more battery ALONG WITH the standard notebook.

I fail to see why you fail to acknowledge that the Macbook Air is exactly what you're recommending as that second model.

 

[Tomorrow]

Run flat tires exist now, so why do people still carry spares when everyone can just buy run flat tires?

Some models made today don't have spares, many others have donut spares. The point behind run flat tires is to let you limp into a shop to get it replaced, typically no more than 50 miles. Also, you might not replace them with run flat tires (very expensive) when they wear out.

 

[Gen]

I think the main argument should be whether a laptop needs a superdrive. Sure, a desktop - like the Mini or iMac - can have one. But why a laptop? When you burn/rip something you're usually stationary. How often does a person burn a CD while moving, in class, or away from home. A USB superdrive is perfect. The benefits of not having it heavily out-weigh of having one built internally.

 

[jlc1978]

I think the main argument should be whether a laptop needs a superdrive. Sure, a desktop - like the Mini or iMac - can have one. But why a laptop? When you burn/rip something you're usually stationary. How often does a person burn a CD while moving, in class, or away from home.

Quite a bit - in fact more often that when I am at my main place of work. I also often get large files on a CD as it is a quick and easy way to transfer large amounts of data.

A USB superdrive is perfect.

Not really - it's one more thing to lug around / break lose. I had a laptop with one a while back - first chain I got I swapped it for one with an internal drive.

The benefits of not having it heavily out-weigh of having one built internally.

For some people; not for others. That's why Apple offers the Air as well as the MB/MBP. Don't want a drive? Buy an Air; as was pointed out earlier.

YMMV HAND

 

[Young Spade]

I fail to see why you fail to acknowledge that the Macbook Air is exactly what you're recommending as that second model.

I fail to see why you fail to acknowledge that the MBA is just as expensive, has a lower clock speed, lower overall performance, is upgradable, has less ports, and has a lower battery life.

Are you thinking before you're posting? These are the major negatives that come with getting a MBA; the main reasons why people who have no or minimal use for the superdrive still get the MBP.

Personally I would love to get the Air and if my budget works out right and they offer great baseline specs, I'll get the 13 inch with an accompanying superdrive. If not, I'll get the MBP.

 

[Elven]

I would love this idea, especially having an i7 in a 13" chassis.

Although I think the option to have the CDROM fitted should be available keeping the current chassis in circulation. As I believe some users will want an all in one solution.

 

[blueroom]

I fail to see why you fail to acknowledge that the MBA is just as expensive, has a lower clock speed, lower overall performance, is upgradable, has less ports, and has a lower battery life.

Are you thinking before you're posting? These are the major negatives that come with getting a MBA; the main reasons why people who have no or minimal use for the superdrive still get the MBP.

Personally I would love to get the Air and if my budget works out right and they offer great baseline specs, I'll get the 13 inch with an accompanying superdrive. If not, I'll get the MBP.

I bought my mid 2010 13" MBP for it's battery life, if an identically spec'ed MBA was available (lighter, external DVD, same price) I would have bought that as I simply have never needed the drive on the road.

 

[blueroom]

This is what they could use the ODD space for.
Heatsink as Fan

 

[Young Spade]

This is what they could use the ODD space for.
Heatsink as Fan

I saw that article the other day; pretty cool if you ask me. If they can drastically reduce heat and lower the energy required to run the thing, I'd be all for it.

 

[Tech198]

..... so you can actually use it on your lap - a true laptop.

I already use may MBP this way, when I need it, as I don't have room for a desk.

 

[Tech198]

Dont think the mainstream Apple buyer is ready for this

Nope. All laptops have them. But then again,

This could be the notion of "Think different"

It will be different if the drive isn't there.