Report Examines GM's Controversial Move to Abandon Apple CarPlay

[applezulu]

Up until a couple of months ago, Apple was ostensibly working on its own car. It seems likely that issue factored into the decision of GM and others to develop future EV models with in-house dashboard entertainment and satnav systems. From their perspective, the idea of a rival car company having real-estate inside your vehicles may have seemed a bit too much. It’s be like Ford including prominent features made by Toyota. So, they may have thought, better to get something else in the pipeline.

With the Apple Car now apparently parked for good, that calculus will probably change. Including CarPlay as an option is now once again more akin to including Bose speakers as a feature. The problem at this point is that GM has already committed substantial resources and headed down a path to develop a system intended to compete directly with Apple, including dreams of revenue from subscription-based services. So now the question is whether they acknowledge that’s a bad idea before or after they bring their almost guaranteed-to-be-inferior in-house system to market.

 

[Murdock12]

GM and the other legacy manufacturers who abandon CarPlay better put some serious processing power into their in-house systems. That’s the biggest issue with the proprietary systems - they’re so, so underpowered and lack responsiveness.

Tesla and Rivian both have extremely responsive and (relatively speaking) powerful in-house systems…yet it’s still a major issue for some. Most people can at least tolerate not having CarPlay if the in-house systems are really good, but I highly doubt GM will do it. Probably gonna be super slow, laggy, and cumbersome to use.

 

[Beautyspin]

Incorrect, Mercedes won't allow the *full* CarPlay takeover (entire UI including speedometer) but didn't say they would ditch CarPlay completely.

As stated in my response.

 

[Quicksilver867]

GM will reverse course on this in 2-3 years for sure.

 

[I7guy]

I won’t buy another car without CarPlay, no offense to those who would.

Sorry GM EVs and Tesla.

Tesla has CarPlay aftermarket options that actually look good.

 

[I7guy]

I got to use carplay in a Ford Edge a couple weeks ago, it's trash. Maybe they should fix that first?
I'm truly amazed at how many people say it's a good thing? That carplay randomly disconnected about a million times.
iphone 14 pro max up to date on software. I'm much happier with my everyday bluetooth link that works flawlessly.

It’s the ford edge. I had multiple cars with CarPlay and one with wireless CarPlay. There were never any issues.

 

[zoozx]

Don't show you are a stupid monkey not long out of the woods, ( we all are ) with blanket statements.
I'd never buy a Gm, Ford, Tesla.
Analyze the Current data and make a wise decision.

 

[Victor Mortimer]

Even if it's the best thing in the world for you, imagine choosing a car because of carplay?

What would you suggest choosing a car because of?

I know a lot of people think exterior looks matter, but stop and think for a minute. Where do you spend time with your car, outside of it looking at it, or inside driving it? And once you're inside it, what systems do you interact with most? Sure, there's the steering wheel (so no Turdlas) and the other controls like the turn signal stalk (so no Turdlas), the pedals (one pedal driving is stupid, so no Turdlas), the gear shift (no Turdlas), the screen (NO TURDLAS), and the gauge cluster (I ALREADY SAID NO TURDLAS).

Every car has reasonable acceleration now. Every car gets you from point A to point B. Every car has air conditioning. So you've got to pick based on something. In order of importance, that's comfortable seats, no analog gauges, and CarPlay.

 

[sflagel]

This decision has externals consultants written all over it: good idea on paper, terrible idea to implement. Even Tesla's own OS is terrible: the SatNav has no proper turn by turn; the music services cut out in tunnels, the integration with Messages is non-existent, etc.

Having said this, I am not keen on having the Apple aesthetic clash with the car interior, so if the app providers, including Apple apps, provide good APIs so that the apps integrate well on the GM OS, then this could be a way forward.

In the meantime, I love how Apple Maps fetches an address for an appointment from Calendar, sing my Contact list, and my Messages are all in one thread on my phone. (I share a car with my wife, so CarPlay also allows us to keep our Contact Lists, Messages, Music Playlists, etc separate)

 

[Beautyspin]

The amount of integration is Purely optional. CarPlay is completely free to the manufacturers to install. The only costs are meeting the hardware standards.. but apple gets nothing. It's an experience sales tool for apple... as many have said... I woundn't buy a car with out airplay for the most part... Because of Apple Music, podcasts and Audible... I do have a Tesla though, and that has podcasts and Apple Music now and Audible is coming in next update.

Apple has a history of interjecting itself where it is not required and then slowly owning it. Car manufacturers see how Apple Pay, Appstore, and other stuff has gone and are being careful at the outset. They do not want to cede control to third parties. Yes, they can be one of the addons, not the one controlling the main functions.

 

[darngooddesign]

I got to use carplay in a Ford Edge a couple weeks ago, it's trash. Maybe they should fix that first?
I'm truly amazed at how many people say it's a good thing? That carplay randomly disconnected about a million times.
iphone 14 pro max up to date on software. I'm much happier with my everyday bluetooth link that works flawlessly.

Yet even with my old iPhoneXR CarPlay is solid in the Mazda CX-50 I bought last year. Wouldn't have purchased it without CarPlay support.

 

[Beautyspin]

Same here. GM should simply declare Ultifi a failed experiment and move on.

Apple took 10 years to declare its Autonomous car project a failure and we do not know how many years it will take Apple to do the same with AVP. Give GM time. Maybe they will improve.

 

[bluespark]

Well, considering that Mercedes-Benz is also not going to let CarPlay in, due to reasons specified by CEO Ola Källenius in the following interview, I doubt others would let CarPlay in too. Their reasons will apply to all the others too.

Mercedes-Benz won’t let Apple CarPlay take over all its screens

No Apple screen takeover in Mercedes-Benz.

www.theverge.com

Apple wanted to control core functions of the vehicle like HVAC, as well as the speedometer and odometer.

"But Mercedes doesn’t appear to be in any rush to follow its luxury vehicle peers in letting Apple dominate the in-car experience for its customers. Instead, Källenius said that the company is working closely with Apple’s main rival, Google, in designing a new navigation feature that will be built on Google Maps. The key difference there is that Mercedes’ own engineering team will be heavily involved in the process."

This seems quite different because Mercedes supports CarPlay in all of their vehicles. The question here was whether they would allow all of the features of the new extended CarPlay, which include direct control over car features such as HVAC and allowing CarPlay to take over displays other than the car's central screen. I suspect a larger number of users wouldn't buy a system without CarPlay but also are relatively ambivalent about whether CarPlay should get that added control.

Personally, I think BMW gets the right balance here: Information from CarPlay is available to the BMW system (so, for example, the heads-up display shows driving information and turns coming from CarPlay, the driver's screen can show a deck of turns for a route fed from CarPlay, turning the steering wheel selection knob will show next tracks, etc., from Apple Music), but the native BMW system is simultaneously working and providing all of the information I want from the driver's screen, etc. Best of both worlds, IMO.

 

[Mr_Ed]

I’m sure I’m in the minority here, but I prefer the built-in vehicle UI for most things. I actually wish there was a way to have CarPlay NOT take over the screen when I summon Siri. If I’m driving and ask Siri for something, like sending a text to my wife, or play a specific song, I’m using voice. I don’t need my home infotainment screen changed.

I acknowledge that vehicle UIs vary in terms of utility and ease of use, and that is certainly a perfectly valid consideration when shopping for a vehicle, but I’m shopping for a motor-vehicle, not a phone. If it is not comfortable enough, or performant enough, or uses too much fuel (ICE), or has poor handling/driving dynamics, or lacks sufficient utility for my needs, whether or not it supports CarPlay won’t make a bit of difference to me.

I’ve said before that the one significant positive I see for CarPlay (or Android auto for that matter) is for the user to continue to have access to certain advanced internet-connected functionality in the future when the auto manufacturer sunsets support for the vehicle’s connected functionality. We are at a point where we’ve integrated mobile device tech as the core infotainment UI in vehicles but unlike a phone, I expect a car to stick around for 10, 15, 20 years or more even if the underlying connected tech is no longer supported.

EDIT: correcting Apple’s “magical” auto-correct.

 

[Beautyspin]

The real question is, who would purchase a GM vehicle in the first place?

Once all the manufacturers go the same route, as appears to be happening, I think GM will find takers again.

 

[reden]

I won’t buy another car without CarPlay, no offense to those who would.

Sorry GM EVs and Tesla.

Why are you apologizing?

 

[darngooddesign]

Once all the manufacturers go the same route, as appears to be happening, I think GM will find takers again.

While they might not adopt the full CarPlay2 integration do you have evidence that most manufacturers are discontinuing CarPlay1 support on the second screen?

 

[Beautyspin]

This seems quite different because Mercedes supports CarPlay in all of their vehicles. The question here was whether they would allow all of the features of the new extended CarPlay, which include direct control over car features such as HVAC and allowing CarPlay to take over displays other than the car's central screen. I suspect a larger number of users wouldn't buy a system without CarPlay but also are relatively ambivalent about whether CarPlay should get that added control.

Personally, I think BMW gets the right balance here: Information from CarPlay is available to the BMW system (so, for example, the heads-up display shows driving information and turns coming from CarPlay, the driver's screen can show a deck of turns for a route fed from CarPlay, turning the steering wheel selection knob will show next tracks, etc., from Apple Music), but the native BMW system is simultaneously working and providing all of the information I want from the driver's screen, etc. Best of both worlds, IMO.

Yes. And it is going with Google for native Maps/directions so it will be superior in most countries compared to the Apple maps on carplay (not everywhere, but in most countries other than the US). So, the only thing left is entertainment.

 

[gank41]

I've been actively looking for a new car for the last couple months, and was initially wanting to look at the Chevy EV Blazer, but have been looking at just about everything else because of this. Chevy's got a lot of competition. It's not looking like this will turn out to be a good decision for them in the long run.

Here's another thread chock full of more outrage-

GM Says It's Nixing CarPlay to Make Drivers Safer

Earlier this year, General Motors (GM) announced plans to phase out Apple's CarPlay and Android Auto in its future electric vehicles, with the company instead relying on an infotainment system co-developed with Google. This has not been a popular decision with iPhone users, and today, GM...

forums.macrumors.com

 

[bluespark]

I got to use carplay in a Ford Edge a couple weeks ago, it's trash. Maybe they should fix that first?
I'm truly amazed at how many people say it's a good thing? That carplay randomly disconnected about a million times.
iphone 14 pro max up to date on software. I'm much happier with my everyday bluetooth link that works flawlessly.

Issues like what you are describing are almost entirely dependent on how the manufacturer implements CarPlay. Some implementations are incredibly reliable, others not so much. I've had my car (BMW) for four years and have *never* experienced a CarPlay connection issue. It's wireless, available instantly, and rock-solid. However, I've also had rental cars that struggled to stay connected. Incidentally, the one that I recall was a Ford.

 

[johnediii]

I won’t buy another car without CarPlay, no offense to those who would.

Sorry GM EVs and Tesla.

Same. And this is the thing. I have a GM vehicle now with CarPlay in it and the GM software is terrible. It has CarPlay via bluetooth. This is a disaster if you have 2 people who use the same car and both have iPhones. So we switched to using wired and that is also a bad experience. About 50% of the time it doesn't pick up the iPhone. Sometimes it will pick it up after several minutes. GM SUCKS at software. My 2018 GM car worked way better. I traded it in this year for a 2024 and the 2024 is not good.

 

[sflagel]

Well, considering that Mercedes-Benz is also not going to let CarPlay in, due to reasons specified by CEO Ola Källenius in the following interview, I doubt others would let CarPlay in too. Their reasons will apply to all the others too.

Mercedes-Benz won’t let Apple CarPlay take over all its screens

No Apple screen takeover in Mercedes-Benz.

www.theverge.com

Apple wanted to control core functions of the vehicle like HVAC, as well as the speedometer and odometer.

"But Mercedes doesn’t appear to be in any rush to follow its luxury vehicle peers in letting Apple dominate the in-car experience for its customers. Instead, Källenius said that the company is working closely with Apple’s main rival, Google, in designing a new navigation feature that will be built on Google Maps. The key difference there is that Mercedes’ own engineering team will be heavily involved in the process."

This is for CarPlay 2.0. As a consumer, we also wish to see first what added benefits we get by being able to control the A/C with Apple CarOS, or setting the Cruise Control with it. For now I'd prefer that the Merc controls the essential hardware and Apple plays me the songs I want to hear.

 

[Beautyspin]

While they might not adopt the full CarPlay2 integration do you have evidence that most manufacturers are discontinuing CarPlay 1 support?

I do not have any evidence. However, if you read the article in theverge, you can see the underlying reason why BMW is not supporting the extended Carplay. For any manufacturer, the same reasons should apply and I do not see any reason why not. Hence, I am assuming that extended carplay (or for that matter even Android Auto), may not get any traction as companies will not cede control of essential functions to 3rd parties.

 

[mike090910]

I can see ads popping up when ever you pass paying customer, or charging to listen to the radio

 

[blaureiter]

One point is the degree to which Apple and Android have developed good tools and you can apply your knowlege across platforms rather than learning a new GM interface.
The second point is the degree to which GM already violates privacy by sharing driving data with insurance companies. Of course they will then share our music, podcast, and other preferences with whoever will pay them.

Without privacy, GM is just another Facebook where the consumers are the product.