Retina MacBook Pro Thermal Paste Swap - Video

[Queen6]

do link me to those please, the ones saying that paste replacement is a useless thing. its not.

You just need to search, it`s that easy. I am not suggesting replacing the standard paste is useless, merely that it wont be earth shattering, offering a few degrees centigrade at best or nothing at worst.

If you want I can link you to high performance systems that there is a good measure of how effective a repaste is. Including mbps.

Thx, i know how to search forums. As i said people rarely take into account the impact of cleaning the cooling system, in general it`s older systems most will try repasting first. My own Early 2008 15" 2.4 Penryn MBP, was genuinely suffering from cooling issues due to failing fans & clogged heat-sync`s after over 30K hours uptime, two deserts and a couple of years in the Tropics. once cleaned up, new fans fitted the operating temperature is well within limits. The overtemp was due to dust nothing more, nothing less, and for the thermal paste it`s original as the system runs fine never having once shutdown due to overtemp - you don't need to fix what isn't broken...

You also might not be aware that there is a complaint about the cpu and the gpu when stressed dont always use their thermal quota to the maximum, due to the high temps, and yes that is in the rmbp.

I am not seeing any ill effects myself, so like many things on MacRumors, i`ll take it with a "pinch of salt" every system is different, as each individual machine has a unique software footprint, what effects one system may have no consequence to another at the end of the day who knows what background process`s are running, when people are attempting to replicate issue.

This is also good for overclockers.

No doubt, as are larger heat-sync`s, more vents, bigger fans

you are not aware that those few degrees matters. For example in the 600m kepler ones (not all are kepler), there is a hard limit to what the chip can endure in terms of temps, its around 80c, thats when graphics start to fluctuate.

Same as above it`s only an issue if it`s an issue to the specific user. i have yet to see any graphical anomalies on my rMBP and i doubt Apple did anything special to it.

Also repasting in this model aint hard (quite the contrary, its extremely easy), repasting on the cmbp is another matter. I did it when the tech swapped the mobo, I hadnt the guts to do it before.

No one suggested it`s was a difficult task, nor is it strictly necessary, maybe your system had issue the majority likely don't, insinuating that this is a must to ensure good performance is nonsense at best. Repasting thermal compound may or may not make a difference, if it does it will be marginal at best.

People posting on forums by nature tend to document resounding success, yet tests in controlled conditions generally don't meet the same lofty expectations

 

[Exana]

Placing so much thermal paste will never improve thermal dissipation. So this thermal paste swap is useless. Check MacBook Pro 2011 thermal paste swap to see real *how to*.

 

[Mabyboi]

Placing so much thermal paste will never improve thermal dissipation. So this thermal paste swap is useless. Check MacBook Pro 2011 thermal paste swap to see real *how to*.

I went back and reduced the amount on there. Note that this is for the RETINA MACBOOK PRO not the 2011 macbook pro.......

And yet again I say, this video was made to show people HOW TO SWAP THE THERMAL PASTE, not exact measurements. This isnt a glorified video thats going to skyrocket me to superstar status. This is a video made for the people who ASKED ME TO MAKE IT.

If you feel like you can do better, feel free to make your own video and post it here.

 

[unwinded]

Just an FYI for anybody who is curious or considering a thermal paste swap...

Besides the usual void-the-warranty thing, I advise against doing this. It will make you all sorts of unhappy even if you do it right. No laptop is easy to take apart and this one is no exception. The various fragile components can be easily damaged. It isn't like taking a part a PC even if you have a lot of experience with it.

I did this to a previous laptop and the whole thing took several hours. My temps appeared to improve but during intense gaming they were right where they normally would be. I just wish I never attempted it. I'm lucky there weren't any screws left over. I don't think this is worth it unless taking stuff apart and putting it back together is second nature. Like you are an expert. And I don't recommend doing it just to replace the stock thermal unless you are an aspie. There is no talking an aspie (aspergers) out of it when their mind is made up. They will even ask their friends if they can do it to theirs. Nevermind. My two cents and all opinion. Just in case anybody cares.

 

[Mabyboi]

Just an FYI for anybody who is curious or considering a thermal paste swap...

Besides the usual void-the-warranty thing, I advise against doing this. It will make you all sorts of unhappy even if you do it right. No laptop is easy to take apart and this one is no exception. The various fragile components can be easily damaged. It isn't like taking a part a PC even if you have a lot of experience with it.

I did this to a previous laptop and the whole thing took several hours. My temps appeared to improve but during intense gaming they were right where they normally would be. I just wish I never attempted it. I'm lucky there weren't any screws left over. I don't think this is worth it unless taking stuff apart and putting it back together is second nature. Like you are an expert. And I don't recommend doing it just to replace the stock thermal unless you are an aspie. There is no talking an aspie (aspergers) out of it when their mind is made up. They will even ask their friends if they can do it to theirs. Nevermind. My two cents and all opinion. Just in case anybody cares.

This is true, and in no way to I take responsibility for any damages done inside the computer as I said in the video. Keeping in mind that Apple did "lock out" the computer by using pentalobe screws, you need to know what you're doing before even contemplating attempting this. I've done this many many times (I used too much paste in the video though ) but you NEED to be an expert to do this. I made the video for those who asked, and if they're experts then great, if not it's their problem...

 

[terraphantm]

I'll probably do this a few years down the line when the stock thermal paste starts to dry out. As it stands, my temperatures are perfectly acceptable. My GPU gets to about 70º overclocked while playing games. That's fairly cool as far as GPUs go, so I'm not going to bother touching it. The CPU I'm not concerned about since mobile chips are generally more resilient anyway.

 

[gbit]

i've done it yesterday based on this:
http://www.ifixit.com/Guide/Reapplying-Thermal-Paste-to-the-CPU-and-GPU/9587/1
and used as thermal paste this one:
http://www.arctic.ac/de/p/cooling/waermeleitpaste/30/arctic-mx-4-4g-und-20g.html
(cost around 5$ in europe)
temperatures have improved about 7K at idle and 11K at max load

 

[dusk007]

Great video. I would do this if it was my laptop too.

HOWEVER:

You're still applying WAY too much thermal paste, and I can't believe nobody else has noticed this yet.

Most of that will ooze out the sides, just like the excessive Apple thermal paste does. Spreading a very thin amount over the dies with a thin piece of plastic will ensure adequate coverage. Those blobs are just way, way too much.

I agree it looks to me just the same. The funny video actually shows a good trick with the glass. Perfect amount is anything that is not too little. You want so little that it just doesn't leave any dry spots.
You use the thing for a few years, it should be worth spending the time to try once or twice too little before putting it back together. When one presses the cooling block on and remove it again, one can see if it is too little.
Just blotching enough on it and pressing the heatpipes back on, screwing everything back in, isn't worth the effort.
This on the video was may too much and the only thing that would improve temps or noise there would be the higher quality paste.

 

[Pentad]

This is a terrible video.

1. The tear down of the MBPr is good and well voiced. I found myself thinking "Focus! Focus!" too much but it was a good effort.


2. I'm not trying to be a jerk here but honestly he is using too much TP and applying it incorrectly. When I saw him raise the HS and then say he thought he applied too much last time I gasped. Everything about this is wrong.

TP should be about the size of a BB and smoothed across the surface of the chip to form a thermal layer that transfers heat well but does not act a thermal blanket.

I would suggest looking at much better videos from folks like MPC or by some of the users on the overclock sites.

When he dumped a glob of TP on the CPU and GPU I had to turn it off. Ack!


3. Lastly, I don't think people really understand what TP is or how it really works. TP is not magic and it won't reduce your heat by some amazing percent (20% to 30% is crazy on a MBPr). It is designed to by a soft-seal thermal conductor that fits between the heat source (CPU, GPU, etc...) and HS to facilitate an even thermal transfer. If too much is applied it becomes a 'blanket' and can retard the thermal transfer.

When applied correctly it does a wonderful job but you are not going to see wildly amazing temperature differences. When I read these: "my temps went down 30 degrees!" I wonder if it is the placebo effect or if people are dumb.

Also, for me, I consider this ratio: performance vs risk. Granted the MBPr is much easier to get at but there is risk involved here: damaged to the computer, poor application like here which you make it worse, voiding warrant, etc...

I do not see a compelling reason to do this at the current time. If the MBPr was a few years old and the TP had become dry and ineffective than I could argue that as a reason. However, for me, I just replace my machines too often to consider this a viable option.

I have nothing but respect for those who do it -and do it correctly- but for 5 or 8 degress, "meh"...


-P

 

[Mabyboi]

This is a terrible video.

1. The tear down of the MBPr is good and well voiced. I found myself thinking "Focus! Focus!" too much but it was a good effort.


2. I'm not trying to be a jerk here but honestly he is using too much TP and applying it incorrectly. When I saw him raise the HS and then say he thought he applied too much last time I gasped. Everything about this is wrong.

TP should be about the size of a BB and smoothed across the surface of the chip to form a thermal layer that transfers heat well but does not act a thermal blanket.

I would suggest looking at much better videos from folks like MPC or by some of the users on the overclock sites.

When he dumped a glob of TP on the CPU and GPU I had to turn it off. Ack!


3. Lastly, I don't think people really understand what TP is or how it really works. TP is not magic and it won't reduce your heat by some amazing percent (20% to 30% is crazy on a MBPr). It is designed to by a soft-seal thermal conductor that fits between the heat source (CPU, GPU, etc...) and HS to facilitate an even thermal transfer. If too much is applied it becomes a 'blanket' and can retard the thermal transfer.

When applied correctly it does a wonderful job but you are not going to see wildly amazing temperature differences. When I read these: "my temps went down 30 degrees!" I wonder if it is the placebo effect or if people are dumb.

Also, for me, I consider this ratio: performance vs risk. Granted the MBPr is much easier to get at but there is risk involved here: damaged to the computer, poor application like here which you make it worse, voiding warrant, etc...

I do not see a compelling reason to do this at the current time. If the MBPr was a few years old and the TP had become dry and ineffective than I could argue that as a reason. However, for me, I just replace my machines too often to consider this a viable option.

I have nothing but respect for those who do it -and do it correctly- but for 5 or 8 degress, "meh"...


-P

Read through this thread and you will see that multiple times now Ie Sao that I went back and reduced the amount of TP on there. It was a brand new tube that spewed out way too much. Honest mistake. The point of the video is not to show how much paste to use but instead to show how to get In there.

 

[gbit]

 

[terraphantm]

This is a terrible video.

1. The tear down of the MBPr is good and well voiced. I found myself thinking "Focus! Focus!" too much but it was a good effort.


2. I'm not trying to be a jerk here but honestly he is using too much TP and applying it incorrectly. When I saw him raise the HS and then say he thought he applied too much last time I gasped. Everything about this is wrong.

TP should be about the size of a BB and smoothed across the surface of the chip to form a thermal layer that transfers heat well but does not act a thermal blanket.

I would suggest looking at much better videos from folks like MPC or by some of the users on the overclock sites.

When he dumped a glob of TP on the CPU and GPU I had to turn it off. Ack!


3. Lastly, I don't think people really understand what TP is or how it really works. TP is not magic and it won't reduce your heat by some amazing percent (20% to 30% is crazy on a MBPr). It is designed to by a soft-seal thermal conductor that fits between the heat source (CPU, GPU, etc...) and HS to facilitate an even thermal transfer. If too much is applied it becomes a 'blanket' and can retard the thermal transfer.

When applied correctly it does a wonderful job but you are not going to see wildly amazing temperature differences. When I read these: "my temps went down 30 degrees!" I wonder if it is the placebo effect or if people are dumb.

Also, for me, I consider this ratio: performance vs risk. Granted the MBPr is much easier to get at but there is risk involved here: damaged to the computer, poor application like here which you make it worse, voiding warrant, etc...

I do not see a compelling reason to do this at the current time. If the MBPr was a few years old and the TP had become dry and ineffective than I could argue that as a reason. However, for me, I just replace my machines too often to consider this a viable option.

I have nothing but respect for those who do it -and do it correctly- but for 5 or 8 degress, "meh"...


-P

Thermal past won't drop temperatures 20-30%... but dropping 10ºC from 50º is not a 20% reduction. It's actually only a 3% decrease in temperature (remember one must use an absolute scale such as Kelvin to discuss % changes in temperature). That 3% makes a huge difference though because the operating temperatures of a CPU are fairly narrow on the whole scale.

The paste itself likely won't even make that large of a difference, but the application can. Most factory applications I've seen are crappy enough that 10ºC or greater differences at idle (and more at load) are definitely possible

 

[Queen6]

Thermal past won't drop temperatures 20-30%... but dropping 10ºC from 50º is not a 20% reduction. It's actually only a 3% decrease in temperature (remember one must use an absolute scale such as Kelvin to discuss % changes in temperature). That 3% makes a huge difference though because the operating temperatures of a CPU are fairly narrow on the whole scale.

The paste itself likely won't even make that large of a difference, but the application can. Most factory applications I've seen are crappy enough that 10ºC or greater differences at idle (and more at load) are definitely possible

The primary reason I don't see the need is my Retina idles at 34C with ambient at 26C, fans at default. Ripping it apart to change the thermal paste is simply unnecessary in my machines case. Under full load the is really very you can do; even with a Mac specific cooler, elevation and increased fan rpm`s CPU/GPU temp will eventually rise to very elevated levels, it`s the thermal envelope of these systems (Retina & Unibody)

 

[ZipZap]

Read through this thread and you will see that multiple times now Ie Sao that I went back and reduced the amount of TP on there. It was a brand new tube that spewed out way too much. Honest mistake. The point of the video is not to show how much paste to use but instead to show how to get In there.

I would say the point is both tear down and application.

 

[ibebyi]

I haven't read many of the posts in this thread, but I have done the operation as well and would like to provide some feedback.

As stated, changing thermal paste will not lower max temps under load over longer periods of time, as the CPU will simply saturate the heatsink and all surrounding components with heat. There is nothing you can do about that short of limiting the speed of the CPU.

What you do see with a thermal paste swap is faster cooling at the same fan RPM levels (for example 90C/load drops to 45C/idle MUCH faster-- no more insulating thermal paste), but of course you'd have to manually override the fans in the first place to see any real world benefit.

I've also begun thinking... couldn't a TIM swap INCREASE temps on the GPU, as the CPU would have more direct (& less insulated) surface area contact with the heatsink? Only reason I'm thinking this is that the heatsink is shared between the CPU/GPU.. I hope the next Apple laptop redesign places the two components on different sides of the laptop or at least farther apart....

 

[Mechinyun]

The point of the video is not to show how much paste to use but instead to show how to get In there.

I swapped out my thermal paste on my brand new 15 Retina macbook last night.

Easy to do, I used prolima pk-1 paste on both the GPU and CPU - the stock installation was just like all the pictures - WAY to much - there was actual "chunks" of it.

Cleaned that off - put down a small dot on the GPU and a "grain of rice" on the CPU. Put her back together and I have confirmed a temp drop of 10 degrees. Temps also dont get as high now under load either - havent cracked 65C yet on full load of HD videos and a host of other programs running.

I am betting as a few thermal cycles happen the paste will spread move evenly and ill see even a bit better temps.

 

[johnnnw]

Shame the video was removed, I was interested to watch that.

 

[JronMasteR]

Replaced the thermal paste too on my rMBP. Took me about 20min to clean up the mess Apple made. You could even see the excess of the existing thermal paste without removing the heatsink. There was so much thermal paste, enough for 4 rMBP.
However, replaced it with AC Silver 5. Temps have improved by 5-10°C. Under full load there is not much of a difference in temps, but it takes now significantly longer for the fans to ramp up. Also, it cools down much faster.
Idle temps and small load temps are 10-15° lower than before. Very happy with the result and it feels good to have cleaned up the mess.

 

[johnnnw]

Replaced the thermal paste too on my rMBP. Took me about 20min to clean up the mess Apple made. You could even see the excess of the existing thermal paste without removing the heatsink. There was so much thermal paste, enough for 4 rMBP.
However, replaced it with AC Silver 5. Temps have improved by 5-10°C. Under full load there is not much of a difference in temps, but it takes now significantly longer for the fans to ramp up. Also, it cools down much faster.
Idle temps and small load temps are 10-15° lower than before. Very happy with the result and it feels good to have cleaned up the mess.

Is your warranty voided now? If you had any.

 

[JronMasteR]

Is your warranty voided now? If you had any.

Well, theoretically yes. But Apple is not gonna notice anything. There are no marks what so ever. As long as you don't break anything in the process you're fine.

 

[Mechinyun]

Replaced the thermal paste too on my rMBP. Took me about 20min to clean up the mess Apple made. You could even see the excess of the existing thermal paste without removing the heatsink. There was so much thermal paste, enough for 4 rMBP.
However, replaced it with AC Silver 5. Temps have improved by 5-10°C. Under full load there is not much of a difference in temps, but it takes now significantly longer for the fans to ramp up. Also, it cools down much faster.
Idle temps and small load temps are 10-15° lower than before. Very happy with the result and it feels good to have cleaned up the mess.

I just ran the "4k youtube demo" thats floating around here on the forum, got my temps up to 92 with it - after the video temps flew back down to near idle fast just as you said. (btw I have my rMBP hooked to a 27 Thunderbolt display - seems to add a few degrees to the mix in general)

 

[JronMasteR]

I just ran the "4k youtube demo" thats floating around here on the forum, got my temps up to 92 with it - after the video temps flew back down to near idle fast just as you said. (btw I have my rMBP hooked to a 27 Thunderbolt display - seems to add a few degrees to the mix in general)

Yeah I also have a 27" Thunderbolt Display hooked up to it. It adds a few degrees. I usually put the fans to 3k rpm while using it on my desk. Which CPU do you have? I have the 2.7Ghz.

 

[thekev]

Yes, while I did not test it I had read many users having warm keyboards and warm temperatures overall.

I've had macbook airs and pros in the past with overheating issues and have done this to both to correct it. I figured I would do it right away just to make sure. I know what I'm doing, I didnt break any seals, I didnt strip any screws and there was no marks of me being in there.

I did this video for those who requested it, theres a large group of people out there who have wanted a video like this, so I did one seeing as how I had already done it.

----------

Heres a better way to apply thermal paste if you guys were wondering

I realize it's an old post, but that video is priceless.

"Watch out for the orange. The orange is lava."

"You guys are nerds. You've never been to the beach."


I'm not sure how you initially found it, but the guy that made it has an awesome sense of humor.

 

[Mechinyun]

2.4 ghz is where I am at.

I have my TB display hooked up to my machine about 99 percent of the time, it's really a desktop replacement - with travel capabilities for work.

It's still early since I just did it last night to know full benefits.. but so far this is what I am seeing.

23.8C as my ambient temp.

Nvidia Discrete engaged to power TB display - which is always on and adds heat to the equation.

I do have the laptop open - but macbook display is OFF using the magnet technique.

Im finding under "average" load - Few tabs open in chrome, few finder windows open, VLC idle, skype running idle, activity monitor open, CPU is averaging about 3-5% usage.

Im getting a steady 43-47C CPU measured at the CPU Die using istat pro. This is down from about 53-58C before the paste switch. Fans are at 2k'ish.

GPU at this same load is steady at 39C measured at the die also.

 

[Exana]

This looks nice.