Jinzen

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Oct 16, 2012
347
36
Short answer of it is that the only benefit I'm seeing from the iPad Air is faster browser load times and WiFi speeds. It's lighter, but doesn't change anything. It's still heavy to not change my usage pattern.

Drawbacks are there - memory management really. Yes, if they upped to 2GB of RAM, I wouldn't feel like I was spending $800 on a step back.

So, I'll be getting a Retina Mini instead, at least then I get the real benefits of portability instead of feeling like I got a downgrade in some ways as well.
 

ZBoater

macrumors G3
Jul 2, 2007
8,479
1,268
Sunny Florida
So, I'll be getting a Retina Mini instead, at least then I get the real benefits of portability instead of feeling like I got a downgrade in some ways as well.

So give me ONE example where the Air is a downgrade from the iPad 4.

Just one.
 

urkel

macrumors 68030
Nov 3, 2008
2,784
882
So give me ONE example where the Air is a downgrade from the iPad 4.

Just one.
Price?

The guy owns an iPad 4 that he has to sell at half the cost that he paid last year. But if he returns the iPad Air then he gets all his money back.

BOTH products are great but if they both also offer pretty similar experiences then it's perfectly reasonable to keep the product you own and saving your money for the more dramatic upgrade (Next years model will likely have TouchID, more RAM, 32GB Base Storage and a more mature 64bit library of apps).
 

Jinzen

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Oct 16, 2012
347
36
So give me ONE example where the Air is a downgrade from the iPad 4.

Just one.

RAM and cost is the only real one. I'm finding my apps are getting kicked out of memory much more often and tabs are reloading much more often.

Kind of makes me want to get a Surface Pro and have everything loaded in memory and never need to constrained by 1GB of memory.

I could keep my iPad 4 and get a Surface Pro w/ 64gb and 4GB of Ram for $800 (10% off student discount), or a decked out 256gb/8GB RAM one for $1179.

Almost as much as the iPad Air cost (64gb + smart case). The Surface doesn't even need a Smart Case cause it's got a kickstand built in.
 

ZBoater

macrumors G3
Jul 2, 2007
8,479
1,268
Sunny Florida
Price?

The guy owns an iPad 4 that he has to sell at half the cost that he paid last year. But if he returns the iPad Air then he gets all his money back.

BOTH products are great but if they both also offer pretty similar experiences then it's perfectly reasonable to keep the product you own and waiting for a more dramatic upgrade (Next years model will likely have TouchID, more RAM, 32GB Base Storage and a more mature 64bit library of apps).

I'm not trying to split hairs, but price is not a downgrade.

Double the CPU and GPU and the reductions in size and weight ARE dramatic. But let's not get hung up on details.

ONE downgrade. In FEATURES.

----------

RAM and cost is the only real one. I'm finding my apps are getting kicked out of memory much more often and tabs are reloading much more often.

RAM is the same? How is it a "downgrade"? Because of the 64 bit nonsense? :confused:

Wow. Ok.
 

Poochi

macrumors 6502a
Jul 30, 2010
875
236
Toronto
Price?

The guy owns an iPad 4 that he has to sell at half the cost that he paid last year. But if he returns the iPad Air then he gets all his money back.

BOTH products are great but if they both also offer pretty similar experiences then it's perfectly reasonable to keep the product you own and waiting for a more dramatic upgrade.

Excitement Meter: (1 to 10)
iPad 1: upon purchase - OMGOMGOMG (10), after a while knowing internet's slow (6)
iPad 2: upon purchase - OMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMG (10), huge performance gain over iPad 1, after a while (8)
iPad 3: upon purchase - OMGOMGOMGOM LOVE THAT DISPLAY (10), heating issue/sluggish (5)
iPad 4: upon purchase - WTF ITS ONLY BEEN 7 months!!! (5), good performance/doesn't heat up/faster (7)

iPad 5 (Air): SO THIN and LIGHT (not really after getting use to it again)!!! JUST WHAT I WANTED, but it's the 5th iPad already and kind torn between Air vs. Retina Mini (7), after purchase... sure it's fast but doesn't change the experience much from the 4 I sold.... (4). Not much excitement after the 5th iteration, but I still like the iPad.

At this time I don't think I'd be upgrading to another 9.7" iPad next year, I may just keep it for my "big screen needs" like reading PDF, and move on to annual Mini upgrades.
 

BC-2

macrumors member
Aug 12, 2012
91
13
The "one" thing for me between my Air a 4 is the structural integrity. I'm slightly concerned about accidentally bending or breaking my Air because everything is so much thinner on it. Examining the demo unit at best buy, I could easily flex it in a twisting motion. Durability is definitely a downgrade. I'm fully aware that it's a byproduct of the significant reduction in weight. Just like the iPhone 4/4s to the 5/5s (people have been accidentally bending their 5/5s). Having said that, I'm happy with my air except for a BSOD that happened once. Gonna keep an eye on that.
 

xNYMetsx

macrumors 6502
Jul 17, 2013
251
0
So give me ONE example where the Air is a downgrade from the iPad 4.

Just one.

There are no downgrades, just lack of upgrades from the 4...

----------

I'm not trying to split hairs, but price is not a downgrade.

Double the CPU and GPU and the reductions in size and weight ARE dramatic. But let's not get hung up on details.

ONE downgrade. In FEATURES.

----------



RAM is the same? How is it a "downgrade"? Because of the 64 bit nonsense? :confused:

Wow. Ok.

The foot print is 30% larger. Nonsense? I don't think so.
 

Jinzen

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Oct 16, 2012
347
36
I'm not trying to split hairs, but price is not a downgrade.

Double the CPU and GPU and the reductions in size and weight ARE dramatic. But let's not get hung up on details.

ONE downgrade. In FEATURES.

Double the CPU - no actual user experience improvement - I don't do any serious number crunching, iMovie, iPhoto or anything like that. Only Safari loading is faster but not dramatically.

Double GPU - I think there's only a 40% improvement in GPU actually. And there is 0 user experience improvement here. Games won't really take advantage of it forever and iOS 7 is still laggy.

Weight and size are not a huge reduction with a case on it. It still weighs enough and it's still too big. The bezels should be more in line with the Mini.
 

ZBoater

macrumors G3
Jul 2, 2007
8,479
1,268
Sunny Florida
I'm sorry iPad 4 owners, I don't mean to sound mean. If your device fits your needs, then that's fantastic. But to describe the Air as a "downgrade" is incredulous. You can tell youself what you want, but for the reader trying to decide whether to buy your used iPad 4 or spring the extra coin for a new iPad Air, let's recap.

28% lighter
20% thinner
24% less volume
2X wifi speed
64 bit vs 32 bit
2X CPU
2X GPU

These may be worth it for most to upgrade. If these are not enough reasons for you to upgrade, don't. I'm sure the "new" iPad Air next year will have even more reasons. But please, don't call the Air a "downgrade" from the iPad 4. Even here that just sounds silly, not to mention inaccurate and misleading.
 

Primejimbo

macrumors 68040
Aug 10, 2008
3,295
131
Around
Every time I read something like this I feel the poster is trying to convince him/herself what is better.

Trying to compare the iPad to a surface is like comparing a truck to a car. They are not really the same. The Surface to me is between a iPad and a computer. It's not a full blown computer (unless you get the pro) and it's not a tablet either.

Personally I do like the Surface, but I don't need a "almost computer", and if I wanted a Surface I might as well get a MacBook Air. The kickstand as a selling point? Really? I got a $30 case for mine and it also does the same as the kickstand and my iPad is protected in a case also.

I'm sorry iPad 4 owners, I don't mean to sound mean. If your device fits your needs, then that's fantastic. But to describe the Air as a "downgrade" is incredulous. You can tell youself what you want, but for the reader trying to decide whether to buy your used iPad 4 or spring the extra coin for a new iPad Air, let's recap.

28% lighter
20% thinner
24% less volume
2X wifi speed
64 bit vs 32 bit
2X CPU
2X GPU

These may be worth it for most to upgrade. If these are not enough reasons for you to upgrade, don't. I'm sure the "new" iPad Air next year will have even more reasons. But please, don't call the Air a "downgrade" from the iPad 4. Even here that just sounds silly, not to mention inaccurate and misleading.

If I had a iPad 4 I wouldn't get an iPad Air. I don't see the point in getting a new iPad every year also, but also I don't like seeing iPad 4 owners trying to justify not getting the Air. If you're happy with an iPad 4, awesome! It's still supported and it works great.
 

Steviejobz

macrumors 68020
Jun 19, 2010
2,107
343
SoCal
people feel strong need to defend Air purchase. Not everyone sees the value in spending $600+tax to get marginal improvement vs iPad 3/4. In some cases the new architecture is causing more problems and new screen has cheaper feel. Plenty of reasons to not upgrade despite the on-paper spec upgrade.
 

ldburroughs

macrumors 6502
Feb 25, 2005
258
0
Virginia Beach, VA
Price?

The guy owns an iPad 4 that he has to sell at half the cost that he paid last year. But if he returns the iPad Air then he gets all his money back.

BOTH products are great but if they both also offer pretty similar experiences then it's perfectly reasonable to keep the product you own and saving your money for the more dramatic upgrade (Next years model will likely have TouchID, more RAM, 32GB Base Storage and a more mature 64bit library of apps).

Price is not a downgrade. Any upgrade costs money. It costs the same as the previous generations with all around upgraded specs. Also, he can sell or trade in the 4 and pay even less for a brand new iPad Air.
 

ZBoater

macrumors G3
Jul 2, 2007
8,479
1,268
Sunny Florida
The foot print is 30% larger. Nonsense? I don't think so.

Ahhh, the "footprint". Are you referring to the Anandtech review?

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7460/apple-ipad-air-review/9

"In general you’re looking at a 20 - 30% increase in memory footprint when dealing with an all 64-bit environment."

Ok. How about

"...the device’s total memory usage never exceeded 60% of what ships with the platform"

"Applications being evicted from memory don’t tend to be a huge problem since the A7 can reload them quickly."

The "footprint" of 64 bit apps is a non issue, especially when the A7 wipes the floor with the A6X. Sorry, try again.
 

superduperdom

macrumors member
Sep 1, 2010
60
1
Bought an iPad air for someone else. It is of course nicer to hold than my iPad 3 and more nippy in many instances, especially loading web pages, but not that much that it warrants an upgrade yet. I wait for a base model of 32gb, 2gb of ram, ac wifi, and of course touch id.
 

Lucille Carter

Suspended
Jul 3, 2013
1,266
4
The "one" thing for me between my Air a 4 is the structural integrity. I'm slightly concerned about accidentally bending or breaking my Air because everything is so much thinner on it. Examining the demo unit at best buy, I could easily flex it in a twisting motion. Durability is definitely a downgrade. I'm fully aware that it's a byproduct of the significant reduction in weight. Just like the iPhone 4/4s to the 5/5s (people have been accidentally bending their 5/5s). Having said that, I'm happy with my air except for a BSOD that happened once. Gonna keep an eye on that.

Ok am with you and predict that we will be hearing about our first bent Air soon.
 

urkel

macrumors 68030
Nov 3, 2008
2,784
882
I'm not trying to split hairs, but price is not a downgrade.

Double the CPU and GPU and the reductions in size and weight ARE dramatic. But let's not get hung up on details.

ONE downgrade. In FEATURES.
ONE upgrade. In FEATURES.

The OP's point was that the size reduction (regardless of how magical) still requires you carry a purse so if you're going to try to prove superiority then what exactly can the iPad Air do that the iPad 3/4 can not?

And of course Price is a huge factor. IF given a choice between an iPad 4 or iPad Air then 100% of people would choose the Air. But the OP's opinion is slanted because he already OWNS the 4 which is why his reasoning is sound and these "details" you are choosing to follow are only to suit your own strange crusade to prove that the Air is not a "downgrade". (Everyone knows that the Air is Apple's best 9.7" yet so just relax. The iPad Air's feelings aren't hurt by his careless use of words so neither should yours)
 

BC-2

macrumors member
Aug 12, 2012
91
13
When I first began using my Air, I was underwhelmed and considered returning it. Mainly because I couldn't notice much of any real world performance difference. The feel of the device also was a concern (structural integrity). However, as I used it more, I began noticing the improvements. The wifi is faster, safari is also faster and smoother (scrolling up and down is no longer wavy). This and the main reason I bought the Air in the first place (light weight and smaller foot print) was great. So I can understand that these improvements aren't significant enough for everyone. I've decided to keep mine. :)
 

Jinzen

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Oct 16, 2012
347
36
I'm sorry iPad 4 owners, I don't mean to sound mean. If your device fits your needs, then that's fantastic. But to describe the Air as a "downgrade" is incredulous. You can tell youself what you want, but for the reader trying to decide whether to buy your used iPad 4 or spring the extra coin for a new iPad Air, let's recap.

28% lighter
20% thinner
24% less volume
2X wifi speed
64 bit vs 32 bit
2X CPU
2X GPU

These may be worth it for most to upgrade. If these are not enough reasons for you to upgrade, don't. I'm sure the "new" iPad Air next year will have even more reasons. But please, don't call the Air a "downgrade" from the iPad 4. Even here that just sounds silly, not to mention inaccurate and misleading.

The lighter, thinner, smaller - is good and all, but doesn't change anything about the iPad usage. It still gets heavy and still too big to shove into jackets or pants.

Speed improvements are only noticeable on Safari, then you take a step back in memory pressure and footprint.

The 64Bit aspect of A7 is completely a non-factor.

I would say the only real upgrade to this generation is WiFi and CPU speeds, but the fact that iOS 7 still lags, and you can't keep as much apps in memory... is almost a wash. The smaller and thinner is nice but not enough.

Yes, if you need a new iPad today, I would buy an iPad Air. But as an iPad 4 owner, I'm buying an iPad Mini Retina, as that would actually change my usage pattern by being able to take it with me everywhere and is a significant upgrade to the existing mini.
 

ZBoater

macrumors G3
Jul 2, 2007
8,479
1,268
Sunny Florida
...and these "details" you are choosing to follow are only to suit your own strange crusade to prove that the Air is not a "downgrade". (Everyone knows that the Air is Apple's best 9.7" yet so just relax. The iPad Air's feelings aren't hurt by his careless use of words so neither should yours)

Oh, so calling out a "careless use of words" is a "strange crusade"?

Ummmm, ok.

OP, if you are happy with not having to spend money on the Air and it's "several downgrades", good for you. :confused:
 

lshirase

macrumors regular
Jan 7, 2008
235
3
Did you really have to make a thread about this? It seems like you're just trying to justify the return. Get a grip, bro.
 
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