Rivian CEO Doubles Down on Decision to Not Offer Apple CarPlay

[MRrainer]

How does offering CarPlay or Android Auto remove the option of using the manufacturer’s software … all my cars give me (the owner) the choice of using either … the manufacturer’s software, Android Auto or CarPlay !

What’s wrong about giving the owner the choice of what software to use in the car ? This actually attracts more customers !

The problem is that most likely even the developers of the software and the employees of the car-manufacturer use CarPlay. So bugs in their own software don't get fixed because, who gives a **** - CarPlay/Android Auto works, right?

Most executives don't have the will-power and the conviction in their own product (and they don't have to use it themselves, as they are driven around) to double down and fix their software.

 

[Windoes]

A valid reason to not consider this brand in the next round

 

[BP9906]

It’s unfortunate that car companies are attempting to subscribe their buyers. I believe car companies are attempting to maintain control over everything, but at the expense of buyer preferences. Cars are tangible assets that buyers tend to keep for a longer period. The fewer options and integrations available, the more challenging it becomes to sell them, unless maybe the buyer is a short-term lease customer. Perhaps Rivian is banking on short term leases and disposable income buyers.

 

[Dirk Pieters]

We love Carplay and had it installed afterwards in our Mazda, having had it in previous cars.

But … I wouldn’t want it in our Tesla. I don’t see how Apple Maps can offer the same value for routing and charging the way Tesla does. Knowledge of superchargers, speeds, how busy they are, which stalls are broken … I’ll take that over Carplay, thank you very much.

I’ll take the fact that Apple Music isn’t that great in the Tesla as a consequence.

 

[wanha]

Apple execs should not be surprised by this. They are also very cagey when it comes to deep integration of third-party code into their operating systems and hardware. Everyone wants to control the user experience. Why should car manufacturers be an exception?

uhhh for the simple reason that consumers want their phones to seamlessly integrate with their car?

 

[Evangelion]

So, I would be using one set of apps and services in my car, and different set of apps and services when I'm not in my car? That's not very "seamless" if you ask me. Just give me CarPlay, so I can use the same apps and services everywhere. That would be "seamless". I really don't care how seamless the experience is when I'm in the car, I care how well it all fits with rest of my life, which mostly happens outside the car.

 

[MilaM]

uhhh for the simple reason that consumers want their phones to seamlessly integrate with their car?

I'm not saying that it's not desirable to have CarPlay or Android Auto in your car. My point is that Apple also has very strict rules about how apps and hardware can integrate with iPhones and iPads. Sometimes, this practice is to the detriment of a subset of their customers.

 

[ProVideo]

Apple should spend some of it's resources on doing surveys and studies to show how many people will not buy a car that doesn't have CarPlay support and release those for the shareholders and board members of these car companies to see how many sales they missing out.

 

[wonderings]

Um, have you heard of Lucid Motors? They sell two vehicles that are more high tech and run circles around the Rivian, the Sapphire is one of the fastest cars in the world for around $250,000, and they have Car Play. High tech and Car Play can work together. It should be about freedom of choice. That simple.

From the video I saw it looks like a small portion of the display is CarPlay only, so from what I see they are not actually letting CarPlay replace their UI, just in a small portion of the multiple displays they have. And looking at CarPlay compared to the rest of Lucids UI again Apple looks childish and in my eyes out of place. This is all subjective of course, if you like it no sweat off my back.

 

[ARK]

If Rivian wants me to consider purchasing a car from them, they need to get rid of the toilet seat headlights and add CarPlay.

 

[wanha]

I'm not saying that it's not desirable to have CarPlay or Android Auto in your car. My point is that Apple also has very strict rules about how apps and hardware can integrate with iPhones and iPads. Sometimes, this practice is to the detriment of a subset of their customers.

I get that, and I am answering your question of what makes cars different from other technologies is that people love their phones and demand they integrate with their cars.

Car manufacturers may resist this, but this is what consumers overwhelmingly want.

They don't have choice. Well, I guess they do if you consider conceding customers a choice.

 

[BrendanChase]

I have been a CarPlay guy for many years now. 1st Gen Apple guy on most products. I am a new Rivian R1S owners this year and can absolutely say I do not miss CarPlay in the least. The Rivian UX is superior. CarPlay has simply not evolved enough. I think the major EV companies are right sticking to their software. When I get in my wife’s Mazda and my CarPlay comes up, it looks antiquated.

 

[SnowCrocodile]

There will be a lot of people who will not buy the car specifically because it doesn't have CarPlay. I sure wouldn't, as I like the experience of my phone. So so hate trying to use different company GPS's software, they never work well, are harder to use and don't have the best experience. So what will happen is the people who buy this car will either buy an ugly external CarPlay screen or a holder for their phone so that they can still use their better phone GPS. Kind of defeats the experience of having one of these cars.

I won’t buy any car without CarPlay, period.

But I also wouldn’t consider Rivian as they don’t seem to be doing well.

 

[I7guy]

From the video I saw it looks like a small portion of the display is CarPlay only, so from what I see they are not actually letting CarPlay replace their UI, just in a small portion of the multiple displays they have. And looking at CarPlay compared to the rest of Lucids UI again Apple looks childish and in my eyes out of place. This is all subjective of course, if you like it no sweat off my back.

If Tesla offered car play, which there are aftermarket options, I dont know if I would use it. On one hand a familiar interface that just works your way and works better than probably 98% of all native infotainment systems - as childish as it looks - it just works.

 

[Nekronos]

I applaud him for his conviction. I'll never buy his car because of it - but at least he recognizes it.

As a very related note: in 2018 the Honda Odyssey supported CarPlay, while Toyota's Sienna didn't. It was such a HUGE swing in sales that Toyota issued the next year model (and a back-end update for existing 2018's) to ONLY do CarPlay. They had so many people come in and say - ok, these two are pretty similar, so if no carplay, i don't want it.

And that's TOYOTA. I'm glad he's confident in his product.

The average toyota customer is quite different than the average rivian customer.

RJ's points are legit and is along the same veins as what apple is doing.

A robust first party solution in a vehicle is preferrable from a safety standpoint and a smoother user experience when simultaneously accessing vehicular functions versus something you might use carplay for.

 

[MozMan68]

I didn't see it mentioned as I perused the responses...but there was an article about GM getting rid of it...maybe in the WSJ or NYT that summed it up pretty clearly.

Until they come up with a Rivian phone that works well, they will never properly replace CarPlay or Android Auto. People are tied to one of two systems typically, iOS or Android, which they use ALL DAY! They do NOT want to switch to another system no mater how integrated the company makes it. I want a seamless interaction between the phone/operating system i look at and interact with all day...even when I'm driving.

Sorry Rivian (and Tesla and GM and everyone else)...you're wrong...you already lost the software wars. It all starts with the personal device. You need to integrate with that, not force your buyers to do the exact opposite.

As far as Tesla integration to get to charges via their own mapping system, it is so easy to integrate that into CarPlay or Android Auto, so that is not a deterrent. And as CarPlay Ultra has shown, they can integrate as much or as little as their own systems, UX, etc. into the system and not lose their brand identity...this was made SO clear in the Astin Martin example.

 

[jimmy_john]

Shocker, another car manufacturer that thinks where EVERYONE else has failed, they will succeed. No car company has ever made a good UI, and they’ve had about 100 years to work on it. But you know what? I think Rivian cracked it LOL! The hubris you have to have, to think that. If i’m making cars, letting Apple have the dash is a no brainer. It makes lots of people happy, and assuming there are Android equivalents, it doesn’t make very many people unhappy. Rivian needs to worry less about building its own AI and more about making their vehicles affordable. Companies like Hyundai and Kia are choosing to offer CarPlay Ultra, while bigger players like Toyota are not. This is going to be a pivot point for these lower priced auto makers. If you are in the market for a Toyota or Hyundai type vehicle, its going to be much more affordable to go Hyundai, and you are getting CP Ultra thrown in!

You should try a Rivian some time.

 

[jimmy_john]

The problem is the software being outdated very soon. And the brand gone. Maybe.

It gets updated more often than CarPlay does.

 

[jimmy_john]

Then you'll have to wait for the Apple Car. Maybe it will materialize at some point.

Can you imagine?

Get into Apple Car (which only comes in gray), start it up, have to click through 27 prompts about various garbage Siri features, finally drive a little bit. At a stoplight you get hassled to sign up for AppleTV+ because the 27th season of The Morning Show is about to air, etc

 

[turbineseaplane]

This sounds rather unfortunate for Amazon delivery van drivers.
But does anyone else actually drive Rivians?

Lots of them are used as aspirational “outdoorsy” grocery getters in Seattle to pick up the kids and visit REI to play pretend “we love getting out in nature”.

 

[Marshall73]

They don’t want you to use CarPlay because they lose access to your information, maps, contacts, calls etc. Then they can’t sell that info on.

 

[D3xbot]

For example, he said Rivian is planning a native AI-powered voice-to-text feature for messaging.

Aw man, I was really excited for the R3 but this has completely destroyed any hype I had for the vehicle.

Rivian prefers to provide an à-la-carte selection of built-in apps, such as Apple Music, Google Maps, Spotify, and YouTube

And no CarPlay so I can't use Overcast on the car screen? Or Libro.fm? Or Plexamp? Or Finamp (if I switch my media server)? Kinda wild that my 2018 Honda has a more user-friendly software stack so I don't have to violate my state's hands-free law to change the podcast I'm listening to.

 

[D3xbot]

All the downvotes are coming from people who have no clue what vertical integration vs outsourcing looks like in the auto business. Literally group think. How's that new iPhone treating ya? The one you get every single year to show it off to your friends?

I mean, a car can have the slickest software on the market with awesome maps and vehicle charging network integration but, unless I can pick an album via Plexamp or change what podcast or audiobook I'm listening to WITHOUT touching my phone, it's useless to me. Regardless of if I'm on iPhone or Android or a dumbphone and an iPod plugged into the USB.

 

[turbineseaplane]

They don’t want you to use CarPlay because they lose access to your information, maps, contacts, calls etc. Then they can’t sell that info on.

I feel like this needs to be pinned on every page.

All of this is about controlling and monetizing your data, as well as getting you stuck on a subscription for things your phone already provides.

Forget what you think of these cars (or any cars) .. that's all these manufacturers are doing here.

 

[jimmy_john]

I feel like this needs to be pinned on every page.

All of this is about controlling and monetizing your data, as well as getting you stuck on a subscription for things your phone already provides.

Forget what you think of these cars (or any cars) .. that's all these manufacturers are doing here.

If you’ve got evidence of Rivian monetizing users’ data I’d love to see it.

It’d be a shame if we ended up with hundreds of posts from users projecting absolute unequivocal certainty about things they have no knowledge of, experience with, nor evidence of.

But i suppose that is what forums are all about.