rmbp 15" heat issue with autocad LT 2015

Discussion in 'MacBook Pro' started by vasco78, Sep 10, 2015.

  1. vasco78 macrumors newbie

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    #1
    I´ve recently bought a new macbook pro retina 15" mid 2015 2,5ghz i7 quad core with 16GB RAM and 512GB drive with the AMD GPU. Autocad for mac LT 2015 revs up the fans constantly, and in iStat Menus autocad shows up usage of 100% + of the CPU with average temperatures of the computer reaching 85ºC constantly and sometimes hitting 97ºC. Autocad LT 2015 is a desktop subscription.

    My mid 2014 15" rmbp with 2,8ghz i7 with 750m GPU NVIDIA runs cooler without the fans spinning up so much at an average temperature of 70ºC, and runs a perpetual license of autocad for mac 2015 LT perpetual license.

    Both macbooks are connected to external Samsung 27" display 1980x1080 via hdmi port.
    Any idea why the recent macbook pro with AMD heats up so much and shows 100%+ CPU usage? Both laptops work on the same project with the same files


    on the 750m GPU 2,8ghz i7 rmbp and iMac AMD 295x GPU 4,0ghz 5K that we have in the office, autocad LT 2015 perpetual licences uses less than 10% CPU...what is wrong in this cenario? is it the subscription version of 2015 LT? is the AMD GPU? i need help...





    Thank you
     
  2. snaky69 macrumors 603

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    #2
    My guess is that AutoCAD leverages on the nVidia GPU in your older machine, taking the strain off the CPU.
     
  3. Bending Pixels macrumors 65816

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    #3
    The Autodesk site doesn't provide detailed info, but it appears that Autocad for Mac does rely heavily on the GPU. Ergo, this is what's generating the additional heat. i.e. it's normal.
     
  4. vasco78 thread starter macrumors newbie

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    #4
    Does this mean that Autodesk needs to update Autocad 2015 LT to work with the AMD GPU in the mid 2015 rmbp?
     
  5. vasco78 thread starter macrumors newbie

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    #5
    On the 2014 macbook pro i have with the 750m 2GB there's no heat issues with Autocad 2015 LT, only with the macbook pro that has AMD R9 M370X Gpu.
     
  6. snaky69 macrumors 603

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    #6
    I'm guessing AutoCAD uses CUDA, which is proprietary to nVidia hardware. ATI uses OpenCL.

    There is no "updating" needed per se. Software companies that want to use GPU enabled code usually choose to develop for CUDA or OpenCL (as in, either or, not both) and stick to that.

    Edit: there you go, your graphics card isn't supported.

    http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servle...t_group=28&release=2015&os=16&manuf=all&opt=1
     
  7. vasco78 thread starter macrumors newbie

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    #7
    Although the AMD R9 370M doesn´t show up in the list, there is other AMD Gpus in there that are recommended. The AMD Firepro 300 and 500 that power the nmp 6,1 use Open CL and not CUDA.

    To this point i found only one other post about fan/heat issues on the current 2015 15" rmbp with AMD Gpu and according to it the fault was plugging external monitor via Hdmi. But in my case i´m seeing 100% Cpu usage by auto cad when on similar situations on other macs i just see 10%...Maybe Autocad LT for mac has an issue with the AMD R9 370M.

    I'm going to see today what happens in the System.log on Console.app and try to connect the external monitor via mini display port to vga adapter.
     
  8. snaky69 macrumors 603

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    #8
    Unless Autodesk updates their app to support your card, no amount of looking at the console will help you.

    And I honestly don't think they'll update it this far into the year. You may get to see it in 2016.
     
  9. vasco78 thread starter macrumors newbie

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    #9
    If they won´t resolve this i will be sending a fried mid 15" rmbp with AMD 370m Gpu to apple...under Apple Care...in an 8hour working day the Cpu shows all 4 cores at 100% and system temps in iStat reach 97ºC until i shutdown autocad for mac. This happens in 3 hours out of the 8 of the working day...
     
  10. snaky69 macrumors 603

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    #10
    You're not damaging anything, it can handle those temps fine.

    Case in point a friend of mine would run BOINC on his laptop for months on end ever since he got it 5+ years ago. it would stay at or around 100C pretty much 100% of the time. It still works like new today.

    Let your computer take care of itself, worry about your work instead.
     
  11. Queen6 macrumors 603

    Queen6

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    #11
    Being an owner & user of the 15" MacBook Pro forever; Over the years the 15" has frequently struggled with it`s thermals, especially when an external display is connected as the dGPU switches on as default, internal temperatures soar;
    • Elevate the rear, aluminium passive coolers generally work best (I use RainDesign`s mStand & iLap)
    • Increase base fan RPM to 3K or as much as you are comfortable with (MacsFanControl or SMC Fan Control)
    • Limit the dGPU`s usage with gfxCardStatus
    • Swap out Chrome for Chrome Canary as it`s way more optimised for OS X and will extend battery run time, reduce thermals
    • Swap out VLC for Movist as again it`s a reduced load on CPU/GPU
    • Uninstall or block Flash
    • Install an ad blocker Ublock extension works well
    • Powered coolers are very much a "mixed bag" when it comes to Mac portables, you need one that has a high capacity (100 CFM minimum) and preferably a large single fan, this can help to keep the 15" internal fans below 4K which for many is good enough as often it`s this point and beyond where the fans become intrusive. Don't expect a powered cooler impact internal temperatures, beyond a couple of degrees
    • Older machines can benefit from cleaning the cooling system
    • Replacing the thermal paste has been hit & miss, some with very positive results, some with no improvement over stock. Personally I would only do this on a Mac Portable that was either very old, or one that I can confirm was definitely running hotter than stock.
    • If your MBP has a discrete GPU, it will fire up when an external display is connected as default, temperatures will rise rapidly.
    The key to a quiet life with a 15" MacBook Pro is several incremental changes that do add up to reduce thermals. From my experience over the years if your going to push a 15" hard the fans are going to max out fast, with associated noise. If your using it with a moderate load life can be made quieter :) For the most part your MBP runs hot as that`s how Apple designed it, the trade of for form over, function, thin & light...

    The old adage still applies; it`s easier to keep a system cool, than cool-down an already hot machine. This being said it`s not strictly necessary, equally it`s nice to know that there are options for reducing temperature out there.


    Q-6
     
  12. vasco78 thread starter macrumors newbie

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    #12
    maybe i haven´t stressed this enough:i have 2 other macbook pro´s ( 2012 retina 2,3ghz GT 650M 1GB and 2014 retina 2,8ghz 2GB GT750M) and neither show this behaviour. They stay cooler by 15ºC to 20ºC and autocad 2015 LT for mac doesn't reach 100%+ Cpu usage on all 4 cores...hey autocad 2D is not supposed to use more than 1/2 cores...i´m saying in all 4 cores because in iStat the temps on all cores are the same 75/82ºC

    I use all my Laptops with Twelve South stands HiRise for laptops or occasionally a ParcSlope, and never in clamshell mode.

    I only see 100% Cpu usage with rendering programs like Artlantis.

    When i close the app (autocad) the cpu usage comes down and i only see this kind of behaviour after 2hours of continuos work.

    So far Autocad for mac on the Nvidia rmbps use about 2% to 15% of the Cpu.

    Maybe the app can not use properly the AMD GPU because of autodesk not supporting it.

    Maybe AMD GPU heats up because of external monitors ( used the mini display port to vga and this behaviour showed up again)

    Next step will be to use only the laptop display ( but this defeats the purposes of a dGPU that could run a 5k monitor) and see if this persists. After this last resource will be to re install autocad LT 2015 for mac or join the ongoing beta test of the next version and see if they support the AMD 370M dGPU).
     
  13. Queen6 macrumors 603

    Queen6

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    #13
    This I believe is your answer, if the SW is not able to lever the usage of the dGPU, the CPU will pickup the load, external monitors have and continue to drive up temperatures on MBP`s with dGPU, and as a rule faster silicon runs hotter unless there has been a "die shrink".

    If was you I would be consulting Autodesk`s support, and looking at ways to keep the rMBP cooler, assuming there is no hardware issue, equally if the later was the case I would expect more issue with other applications.

    If you want validation, create a bootable external drive image with SuperDuper etc. and then run the external image on one of your other MBP`s like as not there will be no issue.

    Q-6
     
  14. vasco78 thread starter macrumors newbie

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    #14

    Thank you all for the time to reply on this thread.

    Again Today...i´m starting to hate AMD GPU´s or Autodesk ...

    CPU USAGE CONTINUOSLY AGAIN AT 100% AFTER 2 HOURS OF WORKING IN AUTOCAD FOR MAC, EVEN IF AM DOING NOTHING BUT STARING AT THE SCREEN.

    Here goes some iStat and Console.App All messages



    Temps reached 97ºC on the iStat sensors.

    Fans are loud...

    The other mackbooks that i have won´t break a sweat with the same files on Autocad.

    Screen Shot 2015-09-12 at 18.15.17.png
     
  15. vasco78 thread starter macrumors newbie

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  16. vasco78 thread starter macrumors newbie

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  17. vasco78 thread starter macrumors newbie

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    #17
    I think this answer is right...i´ve started a thread on the autocad mac forums and have been contacted by autodesk...
     
  18. Kissmyne macrumors 6502

    Kissmyne

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    #18
    First off, I noticed in your original post that it was implied that you are running a different version of AutoCAD (Subscription vs Perpetual?), so I get the impression that your comparison of your machines is not an "Apples to Apples"(no pun intended) comparison.

    Autodesk doesn't indicate support for your GPU, however it does list other AMD GPU's that are supported so the CUDA vs OpenCL is nonsense here.

    After reading all of the posts I have the following recommendations in order..

    1.Restart your Mac in Safe Boot, then immediately restart back into normal mode after logging into your account via Safe Boot.

    2. Reset SMC and PRAM/NVRAM.

    3. Disable all login items(Honestly looks like a memory leak, runaway process, or app conflict issue)

    4. Reinstall the Software.

    5. Reinstall OS X( you could create a disk image of the Macintosh HD from the Mac experiencing this issue, write it to a USB drive and boot from that image on one of your known good machines to determine if it is the OS X install, if you prefer to do so prior to actually doing a reinstall.)

    I would test for resolution after doing steps 1 and 2, then if no go again after step 3, then again step 4, and step 5. Basically test for resolution after each step.. except do the first two in tandem before testing.

    FYI AMD GPUs typically are a bit warmer than their Nvidia counterparts, that is not an issue, but you will notice more fan activity as a result. This is totally normal.

    Also where is your indication that CPU usage is 100% across all 4 cores.. OS X reports CPU usage relative to 'effective' CPU core utilization, hence why you can get values over 100% in OS X. 100% CPU usage(as reported per process) basically means that the process is using the equivalent of 1 core running at maximum load, not that it is using all 4(This is further reinforced via your iStat screenshot, notice the CPU graph, User, System, and Idle monitors. Also you can look at all the examples online of people having "200%" CPU usage)

    Like others have stated Console.app most likely won't help you here, with the exception being, that the logs will show what GPU profile is being loaded.. I had an issue where my Intel GPU profile loaded with my Nvidia GPU being the active GPU(what a mess) and caused quite the headache with several apps I use.

    As a side question, is this issue able to be replicated with the external monitor disconnected? And to supplement, when external monitor isn't attached, does the issue occur with the Iris Pro being the active GPU?
     
  19. vasco78 thread starter macrumors newbie

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    #19
    Did step 1 an 2 and the problem persists.

    Going to step 3 and 4

    This problem persists with the external monitor disconnected and dGpu AMD driving the retina laptop display.

    GFX card status lets me use the INTEL iris pro with autocad disabling the AMD 370M also going to see if this helps.
     
  20. Dead0k macrumors regular

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    #20
    As i understand, your software uses the graphic chip integrated in CPU - Intel Iris pro. This chip is weak and the task is heavy, thus your fans are running hard. Try to run software in Windows via bootcamp, and if it is possible there to switch the iGPU to dGPU.
     
  21. Queen6 macrumors 603

    Queen6

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    #21
    This can be done in OS X with gfxCardStatus, the dGPU and the OP`s related software is the issue

    Q-6
     
  22. vasco78 thread starter macrumors newbie

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    #22
    Intel Iris pro drives quite well the rmbp 15" display with autocad ,and i bet if OS X would allow it , it could also drive the external display 1980x1080 resolution. The entry model only has an integrated Intel Iris pro.
     
  23. snaky69 macrumors 603

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    #23
    No it couldn't.

    On models with 2 graphics card, only the discrete card is connected to the external ports, the Iris isn't. It has nothing to do with OS X and 100% with hardware.
     
  24. zuerione macrumors newbie

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    #24
    Hi!

    I am having very similar issues. Mine is a mid 2015 2.8 GHz 15 MBP and I have been fighting with heat, fan and overstress issues from day one. On mine the fans start whining on high RPM even though TG Pro doesn't show any abnormal temperatures. My setup consists of a Samsung 4K and a LG Ultrawide QHD display. What really seems abnormal to me is that the Fans already wind up to 3000+ RPM when I'm doing simple stuff like updating stuff from the app store or making simple vector illustrations in Adobe Illustrator. In my case, it actually doesn't really matter what I do- the fans kick in at full. After a little while the computer gets REALLY hot despite the high RPM Fans and consequently starts lagging. Sometimes the displays cut out. Once mine gets to that abnormal state, it does not return to normal in a long time, even after force quitting all applications. Fans continue at high RPM even though activity monitor shows approx 90% CPU Idle... When I select to restart, everything goes blank and the computer remains stuck in that high fan state until I force shut down using the power button. Upon restarting, I am randomly taken to a screen in OS X recovery insisting that I have forgotten my password and need to reset it.

    Now, the interesting part is: I also own a late 2013 13" MBP with only about half the total power of the newer machine. The setup on both machines is IDENTICAL, since I used migration assistant to transfer everything. I got this MBP hoping it would outperform the old one, but it does not in any way! The old MBP operates way smoother in every aspect, and even at long term heavy load, the fan can barely be heard. In fact, in all these two years, I have never noticed the fans on the 13" model. Actually, the 15" model performed worse than my 2012 MBA due to the constant lagging in a practical performance comparison carried out.

    Therefore I began to believe something must be wrong with the new 15" unit. I tried everything from SMC Reset, OSX 10.11 GM, deleting startup programmes etc. To rule out ghosting background apps or whatever issues which might be result of the migration process I completely formatted the computer and reinstalled everything manually. Unfortunately, that did not solve the problem.

    I have lost my patience with this nonsense and arranged for an appointment at the genius bar tomorrow to have the unit inspected. Having owned almost a dozen Intel Macs I am very sure that this is not normal. :(
     
  25. hhammouda macrumors newbie

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    Sep 20, 2014
    #25

    I am having exactly the same issues you have but with the lightroom cc after 3 or 4 minutes of usage i experience the same symptoms you have.
    also my old MBP 13'' and older 15'' haven't experienced any of these wired stuff.!!!!!!

    have you reached to any thing with Apple team
     

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