run for your life

Jg75

macrumors member
Original poster
Oct 24, 2016
76
84
.. and buy the "old" 2015 MBP. It will be worth it. I got mine today, the last available from a reseller in Norway. I didn't know, but from my 2014 they upgraded the trackpad to force touch, and it seems they upgraded the keyboard to be more like the air (a little bit less travel). I got the perfect computer now for the next 10 years. Hopefully by then, Apple has sorted out the keyboard. IF NOT, its like the greek tragedy, where the Giant Achilles got destroyed because of his heel. That's too bad, when everything else is perfect, including the ecosystem. Go Apple, you can do it, I have an Acer Chromebook 14" with better keyboard than all the current offerings. And Apple fans, run for your life with your credit card!
 

AppleHaterLover

macrumors 68000
Jun 15, 2018
1,891
1,889
Look, I usually refrain from dissing on people's acquisitions after the fact, but you seem to be so smug about your "superior"purchase, which makes it OK in this case.

You've just bought a laptop that's bulky, has a jurassic processor that's 4 generations old, worse speakers, worse screen, worse everything and WORSE KEYBOARD with mushy keys. """""Upgrading""""" from a 2014 MBP to a 2015 MBP didn't make any sense even in 2015 (think about how the entire world was different back in 2015), never mind almost 4 years later.

Honestly, if Apple users were so concerned about how this keyboard is really the apocalipse there wouldn't be so many people drooling over the MBA launch and furiously debating new MacBook Pros when they're launched here on these forums.

Plus, you're in Norway for Christ's sake. If your Mac breaks, you just throw it away and get a new one with pocket change.
 

Jg75

macrumors member
Original poster
Oct 24, 2016
76
84
1.
Believe me, I tested the 2018 MBP with Touch Bar thoroughly in the shop. It was way quieter (the keyboard) than the 2nd gen 13" inch that I also tried out, but still not as comfortable as I know Apple can make them (had an air since 2010), and most importantly, I cannot trust it in the next 2-3-4-5-6 years until it is properly tested by you guys.
2.
Ppl in Norway is like everywhere else, some rich, some caring more about the money.
 

AppleHaterLover

macrumors 68000
Jun 15, 2018
1,891
1,889
1.
Believe me, I tested the 2018 MBP with Touch Bar thoroughly in the shop. It was way quieter (the keyboard) than the 2nd gen 13" inch that I also tried out, but still not as comfortable as I know Apple can make them (had an air since 2010), and most importantly, I cannot trust it in the next 2-3-4-5-6 years until it is properly tested by you guys.
2.
Ppl in Norway is like everywhere else, some rich, some caring more about the money.
We have been "testing" them for a few years now. Mine has no issues and I love it. Apple knows some of them have issues, and now all of them have a 4-year warranty that means it's an entire top case replacement (new keyboard + battery) in case the keyboard fails.
 
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maxgts

macrumors regular
Jul 16, 2013
118
95
Sunnyvale, CA
Amen to the OP. I picked up a 2015 rMBP 13", 8GB ram, 256GB SSD about a month ago, in pristine condition, for $680. Only 226 battery cycles. Soon after I upgraded the SSD with an Intel 760p NVMe 1TB. The keyboard is just a joy to type on. The force touch trackpad is the perfect size compared to the absurdly large one on the current model. When not portable and at home I have it connected to a 4K monitor, Magic keyboard and Magic Trackpad 2. It's an awesome laptop for the money. Best of all, I don't have to worry about a bread crumb ruining my keyboard.
 

Howard2k

macrumors 68030
Mar 10, 2016
2,556
1,821
Amen to the OP. I picked up a 2015 rMBP 13", 8GB ram, 256GB SSD about a month ago, in pristine condition, for $680. Only 226 battery cycles. Soon after I upgraded the SSD with an Intel 760p NVMe 1TB. The keyboard is just a joy to type on. The force touch trackpad is the perfect size compared to the absurdly large one on the current model. When not portable and at home I have it connected to a 4K monitor, Magic keyboard and Magic Trackpad 2. It's an awesome laptop for the money. Best of all, I don't have to worry about a bread crumb ruining my keyboard.
I have the same laptop. Love it. As much as I’d love the performance of a quad core, I don’t really need it. And the ports are still handy.

I am about to pick up a new external drive though, and considering a combo USB-A / USB-C model. It’ll have to happen at some point.
 

afir93

macrumors 6502a
Jan 5, 2018
724
888
Look, I usually refrain from dissing on people's acquisitions after the fact, but you seem to be so smug about your "superior"purchase, which makes it OK in this case.

You've just bought a laptop that's bulky, has a jurassic processor that's 4 generations old, worse speakers, worse screen, worse everything and WORSE KEYBOARD with mushy keys. """""Upgrading""""" from a 2014 MBP to a 2015 MBP didn't make any sense even in 2015 (think about how the entire world was different back in 2015), never mind almost 4 years later.

Honestly, if Apple users were so concerned about how this keyboard is really the apocalipse there wouldn't be so many people drooling over the MBA launch and furiously debating new MacBook Pros when they're launched here on these forums.
I absolutely agree with you.

I'm happy that you're content with your choice @OP, but I feel that advise you give people to buy the 2015 model over the current ones very much needs some context, or else it's not very responsible advise. At which price point "will it be worth it"? Because if we are talking about getting a really good deal on the 2015 MacBook Pros (less than half or maybe a third of their original price) – then yeah, I'd agree with you OP, you're getting a fairly capable machine for that price. But if we are talking about only a few hundred Euros of difference between the 2015 and the equivalent 2018 model, something that's more akin to the price difference from back when Apple still sold the 2015 MacBook Pro (which was only until a few months ago), then I wouldn't in good conscience advise anyone to choose the 2015 models over the 2018 ones.

You are advising people to buy almost 4-year-old hardware over the current ones, and these four years make a huge technological difference on pretty much every level that you look at. If we are talking about maybe a price difference of 2600€ for the 2015 and 3000€ for the comparable 2018 model then it's the superior choice in almost every way to chug that additional 400€ for a laptop upfront for a laptop you're very likely going to be using for many year and want to be as content with as possible, instead of choosing hardware that is in some areas leagues behind what you're getting with a 2018 model.

It's not even a very responsible advise from a financial perspective since these 400€ savings might come back to bite you some years down the road since you might feel inclined to upgrade much sooner again than with a 2018 model.
 

_Kiki_

macrumors 6502a
Aug 13, 2017
841
253
it's a very good laptop for a reasonable price, SSD is replaceable, so no problem with storage space in future
 

iPhonagain

macrumors member
Dec 28, 2009
86
9
Indy
I love my 13" 2015, got it used but it's like new. But if I had the money, I would get a 2018 for sure. I even like the new keyboard better, call me a freak if you must....
 

Queen6

macrumors 604
Eh, I don't know, everybody has they own preferences I guess. I certainly wouldn't pay money for an outdated bulkier laptop with wobbly keys...
I wouldn't pay money for a notebook that can barely hold base frequency under full load, has a keyboard with known design flaws and a port solution that makes zero sense in many professional settings.

Every single person I know who used to use the Mac professionally in a portable role has dumped Apple due to poor design of the MBP, few doubts the trend will continue...

I'll rejoin my primary engineering project very soon. Of all the hundreds of contractors I will deal with from independent's, small national to major multinationals I fully expect to see zero Mac's, even consultant's like myself where pricing is not an issue, I wonder why...o_O

Q-6
[doublepost=1542085454][/doublepost]
.. and buy the "old" 2015 MBP. It will be worth it. I got mine today, the last available from a reseller in Norway. I didn't know, but from my 2014 they upgraded the trackpad to force touch, and it seems they upgraded the keyboard to be more like the air (a little bit less travel). I got the perfect computer now for the next 10 years. Hopefully by then, Apple has sorted out the keyboard. IF NOT, its like the greek tragedy, where the Giant Achilles got destroyed because of his heel. That's too bad, when everything else is perfect, including the ecosystem. Go Apple, you can do it, I have an Acer Chromebook 14" with better keyboard than all the current offerings. And Apple fans, run for your life with your credit card!
Enjoy your new Mac :) You know your own requirements and need not be concerned with others feeling they have to justify thier own choices.

Q-6
 
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mcpix

macrumors 6502
May 13, 2005
272
59
I bought a 2015 MBP when you could still get them on the Apple refurbished store. I love it, but I still keep checking prices on a new 2018 6 core machine.
 

Queen6

macrumors 604
Isn't OP justifying his/her own choice by their post, just like the others you mention?
True, equally the OP isn't putting a negative slant on other's choices or appearing to attempt to be superior.

Unfortunately this is often why the PC community tends to ridicule Mac fans. Apple does produce nice computers arguably less professionally focused now, however the MBP keyboard is subjective and remains to offer questionable reliability...

Q-6
 
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stratokaster

macrumors member
Jul 30, 2011
73
54
Dublin, IE
Eh, I don't know, everybody has they own preferences I guess. I certainly wouldn't pay money for an outdated bulkier laptop with wobbly keys...
Wobbly keys? I wonder if this ever was a problem before Apple started pushing the butterfly switches (and to be honest, superior keycaps stability is its only advantage)
 
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Jg75

macrumors member
Original poster
Oct 24, 2016
76
84
Wobbly keys? I wonder if this ever was a problem before Apple started pushing the butterfly switches (and to be honest, superior keycaps stability is its only advantage)
Regardless of the switches, I'm not so sure it is a good idea with the larger keycaps and reduced spacing. I feel the spacing on the old keyboard makes it easier to type on.
 

leman

macrumors G3
Oct 14, 2008
9,963
4,550
Every single person I know who used to use the Mac professionally in a portable role has dumped Apple due to poor design of the MBP, few doubts the trend will continue...
That what I mean, eery body ha their preferences. I know only one person who dislikes the butterfly-style keyboard, others either don't notice any difference or prefer the new one. But anecdotal evidence is anecdotal.
[doublepost=1542098724][/doublepost]
Wobbly keys? I wonder if this ever was a problem before Apple started pushing the butterfly switches (and to be honest, superior keycaps stability is its only advantage)
No, it wasn't, but everything is learned though comparison. I liked the old keyboard, but once the new was released I can't see myself moving to the pre-2016 keys. The new keyboards is so much more comfortable to me now.
 
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c0ppo

macrumors 65816
Feb 11, 2013
1,392
2,587
I'm happy that you're content with your choice @OP, but I feel that advise you give people to buy the 2015 model over the current ones very much needs some context, or else it's not very responsible advise.
If anyone asks me should he/she get a new MBP, my advice is: no, no and NO.
Out of first 16 MBPs in my company, 9 had keyboard failures in the first 5 months. 2017 version wasn't any better, so MBP got banned from being purchased at all.

2009-2015, not even one keyboard failure. There is some context to you :)

I certainly wouldn't pay money for an outdated bulkier laptop with wobbly keys...
Bulky? Wobbly?
Sorry, but I really doubt we have the same idea of bulky and wobbly. Even though I like to type more on butterfly keyboards then on previous ones, they are a complete failure because they fail often. Old ones don't.

As far as bulky goes, new MBP throttle a lot. So if someone needs performance, avoid new MBP completely, even though they are slim and sexy, no denying that.

That what I mean, eery body ha their preferences. I know only one person who dislikes the butterfly-style keyboard, others either don't notice any difference or prefer the new one. But anecdotal evidence is anecdotal.
Your own experience counts, but everyone else's experience is anecdotal? ;)
 

afir93

macrumors 6502a
Jan 5, 2018
724
888
If anyone asks me should he/she get a new MBP, my advice is: no, no and NO.
Out of first 16 MBPs in my company, 9 had keyboard failures in the first 5 months. 2017 version wasn't any better, so MBP got banned from being purchased at all.

2009-2015, not even one keyboard failure. There is some context to you :)
Appreciated. You should be aware however that the 2018 models seem to have for the most part fixed the keyboard issues in the v3 iteration of the butterfly keyboard, thanks to the new membrane below the keys, so if you're stacking the 2015 models vs the 2018 ones, I don't think it's very relevant anymore.

Aside from that, the 2015 model is inferior in almost every way compared to the 2018 one, and far inferior in a number of ways. The 2018 models have a significantly better display (larger color space, higher brightness, TrueTone, ...), their speakers are leagues ahead the 2015 models, performance saw a huge spike especially with the 2018 models, much faster SSD and RAM speeds, a huge increase in portability and decrease in size/weight, Touch ID, trackpad is far larger, a port selection that can objectively do more (even though it's slightly less convenient at times), can be charged from both sides with a universal charging standard, many more smaller but still handy advantages like "Hey Siri", Bluetooth 5.0, the T2 chip for a variety of minor but meaningful improvements like more security, faster SSD access and much faster HEVC encoding... and so on and on.

The only wild cards really are the keyboard (some love it, some hate it, for many people it doesn't matter, but the reliability issues are mostly a thing of the past) and the Touch Bar (same thing: some love it, some hate it and many people don't mind either way, but it's way more versatile in the long run); everything else is almost universally considered an improvement (give or take the port selection). If we're talking about a, say, 400€ price difference between the 2015 models or the equivalent 2018 ones then it's absolutely a no-brainer for me to advise people to buy the new models that will be a better experience for them in almost every way and very likely last them far longer down the road.
[doublepost=1542105122][/doublepost]
As far as bulky goes, new MBP throttle a lot. So if someone needs performance, avoid new MBP completely, even though they are slim and sexy, no denying that.
The 2018 models still show huge performance gains over the 2017 (and even more so 2015) models, so advising people to stay away from the newer models for this very reason but not from the old ones seems a bit like cherry-picking when they are still a far better choice from a performance point-of-view than the 2015 MBPs.
 
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