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Safari 1.3 Seeded

mainstreetmark said:
What would you even use Undo for. "Oops, I opened a Tab"? "Oops, I went to Yahoo instead of Google"?

I don't think I get it. :)
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Undo is needed for text boxes, incase you are typing a huge post and somehow delete it.

I'd also like to see Safari remember its scrollbar position in text boxes. Numerous times I've clicked to a different tab to check something, then returning to it, it's scrolled up to the top again. Not a big deal, but annoying.
 
Speed issue in Safari: rendering EXTREMELY long pages in Safari (say 100-150 screen lengths at 1280x1024) makes my dual 2GHz G5 spin up the fans to 100%, and the beach ball comes a spinnin for a good 30-45 seconds. I hardly think system specs are an issue, it's solely in Safari's rendering algorithms because...

Camino and Firefox on the other hand render those same pages in about 2 (okay, maybe 3) seconds with nary a peep from the fans.

And once the page is done rendering on Safari, subsequent scrolling is near impossible to use. Again not an issue in Camino or Firefox.

Another annoying thing is the poor Javascript support. It just doesn't seem up to par with Mozilla just yet.

Altogether, it's annoying enough for some work that I stopped using Safari for those things. The only thing that keeps me coming back to Safari is the bookmark sync which keeps my bookmarks synced between work and home.
 
Sauron1440 said:
I really think that Apple needs to backport their rendering improvements to older OS versions - Speed improvements are nice and all, but for a web designer, it's VERY difficult to make a web page that displays consistently across all the various versions of Safari in use - and it has an OS-enforced upgrade cap if you're still on Jaguar. Users are far more likely to upgrade to a Software Update-provided Safari upgrade than a Firefox download (which, thankfully, is exempt from Apple's marketing manipulations). Oh, well. Apple is as apple does.
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Its all open source, so, anyone can do it, even if apple neglects too.
And, don't forget, Omniweb (which uses Safari Engine) wont be abandoning anyone below Jaguar...
 
cmoney said:
Speed issue in Safari: rendering EXTREMELY long pages in Safari (say 100-150 screen lengths at 1280x1024) makes my dual 2GHz G5 spin up the fans to 100%, and the beach ball comes a spinnin for a good 30-45 seconds. I hardly think system specs are an issue, it's solely in Safari's rendering algorithms because...

Camino and Firefox on the other hand render those same pages in about 2 (okay, maybe 3) seconds with nary a peep from the fans.

And once the page is done rendering on Safari, subsequent scrolling is near impossible to use. Again not an issue in Camino or Firefox.

Another annoying thing is the poor Javascript support. It just doesn't seem up to par with Mozilla just yet.

Altogether, it's annoying enough for some work that I stopped using Safari for those things. The only thing that keeps me coming back to Safari is the bookmark sync which keeps my bookmarks synced between work and home.
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Safari 1.3 loads the [adult swim] message boards (which show 100 messages per page by default) in about 5 seconds. Before, I got the dreaded beachball.
 
I don't know what they did, but this thing seems to load even faster than the webpage can come into the broadband connection! Blink and it's there. HUGE speedup on my dual 1GHz. Unbelievable.
 
Wow - did the whole BenchJS testing thing and my scores improved from 60 seconds to less than 10 this is on a shiny new 1.5Ghz powerbook. Too bad about the macrumors menus, I'd better check on some of my own sites.
 
Fukui said:
Its all open source, so, anyone can do it, even if apple neglects too.
And, don't forget, Omniweb (which uses Safari Engine) wont be abandoning anyone below Jaguar...
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You have no idea what you're talking about.

I love all the people that think it would be trivial to backport Safari 1.2 from Panther to Jaguar.

Safari is not simply WebKit. It's not just webkit that was improved in Panther. There's a ton of technologies used by Safari that would also have to be backported. Think CFNetwork, certificate/keychain stuff, parsing, javascript, quartz rendering (where do you think css shadow support comes from :)), and much more than most people could imagine.

Mac OS X is a very well designed OS. That means layers. That means that something you do that seems innocent on Panther and could be easily ported back to Jaguar may not be when the various underlying layers are taken into account. After all, imagine some bit in some layer uses kqueues. These don't exist in the Jaguar kernel. To backport an app that relied on kqueues (directly or indirectly) would simply not be possible for Apple. Apple just does not have the resources to backport (develop and certify) anything that has significant dependencies on the various layers of the OS. Or, maybe they do, but at cost... a cost of fewer/slower improvements going forward. Who wants that?
 
You people act like safari is some great killer app that would make all the PC users switch and then bow to Steve.......

Its just a web browser..... for freaking out loud


Jeeze
 
bryanzak said:
You have no idea what you're talking about.

I love all the people that think it would be trivial to backport Safari 1.2 from Panther to Jaguar.

Safari is not simply WebKit. It's not just webkit that was improved in Panther. There's a ton of technologies used by Safari that would also have to be backported. Think CFNetwork, certificate/keychain stuff, parsing, javascript, quartz rendering (where do you think css shadow support comes from :)), and much more than most people could imagine.
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While I am largely iggernant of the specifics of the WebKit internals (I'm familiar with some of it, but only conceptually) I would really like Apple to backport some of the rendering methods - things like CSS improvements, and some of the tag extensions. I can do without having hardware-rendered CSS shadows in jaguar (pretty cool, though) but I really want things like the CSS float property fixes to be available to all the Safari users out there, regardless of OS revision - things like that would best be described as "bug fixes", as opposed to features. Unfortunately, that definition only goes so far, because very few modern browsers can really be considered bug-free, using my definition of the word.
 
My Check Free

if anyone's bank or credit card uses the "my check free" service for paying bills, does the current version of Safari work with that ?

I'm pretty sure it didn't and 1.3 does. But maybe it always has worked :p
 
I really hope that there will also be improvements to the HTML/CSS rendering engine. Even though it's already quite good, there are still some annoying bugs like the clear:none bug...
 
XDream said:
I really hope that there will also be improvements to the HTML/CSS rendering engine. Even though it's already quite good, there are still some annoying bugs like the clear:none bug...
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screenshot in 1.3:
 

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I find that when visiting certain secure sites such as the .Mac login page that Safari slows down a lot and the fans spin up on my G5. Other browsers it's just like a normal page. In that sense Safari actually puts me off using .Mac!

Also Safari still feels slower than FireFox overall. It may be something to do with the length of delay before displaying the first rendering as discussed in the authors blog, or maybe it really is just simply slower.
http://weblogs.mozillazine.org/hyatt/
 
I wasn't aware that people were having problems with Safari. For me, it has been one of the most stable pieces of software that I have ever used. I can have 20 tabs open at once and I don't notice any slowdown at all. I mean, tabbed browsing is so reliable for me, I never imagined it would cause problems for some people. I can't remember the last time Safari crashed (I'm not even sure if it has in the last year or so). I've tried Firefox, Omniweb, iCab, and Opera. So far I've found Safari to be substantially faster, and more reliable, than all of them.
 
må¥å said:
RRS is actually a neat feature as mentioned at WWDC Keynote. It can find information of interest much faster than Google and it is more current (upto date) than the information on google.
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It's more up to date than Google web search. But will it be better/faster than Google news search? I guess being able to save those searches into clippings would be useful tho
 
I'm glad to see these relatively quick Safari updates coming...I'm running into fewer and fewer sites with problems.

Bring it! :D
 
jeffgarden said:
if anyone's bank or credit card uses the "my check free" service for paying bills, does the current version of Safari work with that ?

I'm pretty sure it didn't and 1.3 does. But maybe it always has worked :p
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that's what i'm looking for. i do online banking and safari doesn't do it properly. i've run into a few other secure online payments from some regular computer cable warehouse type places that also did not work correctly with safari. i had to fire up IE and that worked fine. i'd rather not run any of that microsoft stuff on this computer. when safari does online banking and other sales transaction properly it will be the only browser i use.
 
Gotta be nuts to use IE with the security risks. Love Safari, and I just finally downloaded FireFox for my old peecee and it's been fine.

My banking works fine with Safari. The only bill pay sites that don't work for me with Safari are State Farm and Verizon Wireless.
 
LOL.

I had some CSS rendering issues with 1.2, and installed 1.3 hoping to resolve these (i.e. make sure it was Safari and not just my error). It completely messed up the whole layout. Back to 1.2!

AppleMatt
 
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