Safari 3.1 to Bring Performance Boosts ("Snappier")

[deputy_doofy]

Last night was the first time I ever downloaded the "gold" Safari - the webkit nightly build. I must say, this sucker is FAST. I'm a user of Firefox, but if Safari actually runs at this speed, I might consider switching.

Even more impressive, I LOVE the CSS3 animations. Is this a Safari only thing or will FF be getting that as well? I don't want the web-transforms thing to be similar to IE, where it has its own version of stuff that the rest of the browsers cannot see.

It's all exciting stuff.

 

[vanc]

Webkit nightly uses far too much memory than Firefox and Camino. Simply load the same web pages and you will see.

 

[WalrusCP]

Webkit nightly uses far too much memory than Firefox and Camino. Simply load the same web pages and you will see.

Safari has that problem in general, but the webkits are even worse. I really hope 3.1 fixes the massive memory leaks.

 

[cyberjunky]

how do you like that "report bug" button?

What about it? I have no bugs to report.

huh, mac is supposed to be "just work"

now it sounds like "it may not be just work, but you can do it this way to get around, maybe this way will double your hassle, but its still doable."

For the most part it does just work, the inability to use a simple application and/or OS just because your used to half a million toolbuttons taking half the screen away at your finger tips does not have anything to do with it not working, but rather reflects on your inability to try and learn new and better ways of doing things.

then why accusing windows having too much viruses? when all windows users need to do is only to install a free AVG?

Its double standard, thats what it is.

Yes we do, as far as im aware theres 1 known virus for mac and its not self activating and not self propogating so only a moron would
1) let it on their machine
and
2) run the file (specially after the warnings)

So yes windows does have many viruses, just because computers are getting more and more powerful does not mean we should frivolously piss it down the drain running half a dozen security apps to help defend an already battered joke of an OS

If you dont like it and feel windows is somehow superior with its viruses, malware, adware, worms, poorly designed eye bleeding and screen filling UI, DLL Hell, registry problems along with all the other crap then why not switch back to PC..

Safari has that problem in general, but the webkits are even worse. I really hope 3.1 fixes the massive memory leaks.

Weird i never noticed any memory leak problems with Safari except when running Flash stuff like youtube for example, however this could be attributed to macromedias mac implementation.

 

[clevin]

For the most part it does just work, the inability to use a simple application and/or OS just because your used to half a million toolbuttons taking half the screen away at your finger tips

does dishonest exaggeration a common thing I should expect from apple fans? and do you actually read and understand what we were talking about?

 

[cyberjunky]

does dishonest exaggeration a common thing I should expect from apple fans? and do you actually read and understand what we were talking about?

Dishonest? please justify how i have been dishonest?

Also I understand perfectly, they want a button to open new tabs, theres always someone bitching and whining about something.

Perhaps it is you who does not understand what im talking about?

Toolbar anyone? thats about 1/9th of the screen gone.

Perhaps its not enough, maybe we need MORE, yes MORE buttons...

If we are not careful we may end up with safari looking like this, one button at a time we get closer to imperfection, keep it simple keep it clean.

 

[clevin]

Dishonest? please justify how i have been dishonest?

Also I understand perfectly, they want a button to open new tabs, theres always someone bitching and whining about something.

the proposal is to replace that customizable "report a bug" button with "new tab" button. disable by default, but can be added from customization of safari/webkit toolbar.

There is no increase in number of buttons in total, so there is no argument about adding more buttons.

 

[motulist]

Dishonest? please justify how i have been dishonest?

Also I understand perfectly, they want a button to open new tabs, theres always someone bitching and whining about something.

Perhaps it is you who does not understand what im talking about?
Toolbar anyone? thats about 1/9th of the screen gone.

Perhaps its not enough, maybe we need MORE, yes MORE buttons...


If we are not careful we may end up with safari looking like this, one button at a time we get closer to imperfection, keep it simple keep it clean.

Perfect explanation, I couldn't have done it better myself. There are lots of people out there that would want buttons, dials and controls for whatever specific particular purpose they want. But if you give everyone the button, dial or control that they want then the end result is a huge mess that makes no one happy because the interface is now much more of a pain to use because there are so many doo hickies all over the place that you cant find what you want.

That's the exact reason why I hate MS software. Theoretically their software has a doo hicky for every feature you want, but the ones you want are so obscured by the ones you don't care about that the entire interface usability is destroyed in the process. And yes you can customize the interface, but only up to a point. And even just being able to customize the interface the way you want is a nightmare because you still have to wade through all the possible interface choices which by necessity due to their sheer number wind up with hard to understand icons and long button names.

Personally I'd rather have 1 button missing that I'd really like to be there, in order to have the rest of the interface be super easy and convenient to use.

Again, I'm not saying having a new tab button in the customizable options in necessarily a bad thing, but Apple's software designers had to draw the line somewhere to prevent the number of confusing options from getting out of control. And considering that I've only heard 2 or 3 people ever mention their desire for a new tab button within this long discussion about the issue, it makes me think that Apple drew the line in an appropriate place.

 

[kuwisdelu]

Dishonest? please justify how i have been dishonest?

Also I understand perfectly, they want a button to open new tabs, theres always someone bitching and whining about something.

Perhaps it is you who does not understand what im talking about?
Toolbar anyone? thats about 1/9th of the screen gone.

OH GOD! Looks more like a whole third of it gone to me. Thank you for reminding me once again why I upgraded to iWork.

Much more pleasing to my eye. So much less clutter. Not even a "save" button! No need when I just Cmd + S anyway...

 

[cyberjunky]

the proposal is to replace that customizable "report a bug" button with "new tab" button. disable by default, but can be added from customization of safari/webkit toolbar.

There is no increase in number of buttons in total, so there is no argument about adding more buttons.

Even IF the button is added by default it still increases the button count, sure we can hide it away in the customisation menu but your only dusting the problem under the rug, AGAIN half a dozen buttons later then the customisation menu itself becomes cluttered.

Then there is the matter that when you consider after adding tonnes and tonnes of buttons for features most people wont use you actually end up with a heavier app, the more features the more potential bugs and so fourth.

Keep it simple, keep it clean, keep it WORKING!

Also, whats the point in adding a button for new users to open tabs when as you suggested it would be hidden or "disabled by default", wouldnt someone who is new to the OS probably not even know that the customisation menu exists in order to add the button, thusly defeating the point of its existance.

 

[justflie]

lol, I can't believe you guys are still debating this issue. Have fun.

 

[Daveoc64]

IE7 is a terrible example to use for your argument.

I can make IE7 suit my needs.

Don't need tabs? Get rid of the feature entirely.

Don't want a particular icon? Turn it off.

It's called choice which is something Apple rarely does.

Your argument is also flawed when there's a toolbar button to file a bug report.

 

[Fukui]

Even more impressive, I LOVE the CSS3 animations. Is this a Safari only thing or will FF be getting that as well? I don't want the web-transforms thing to be similar to IE, where it has its own version of stuff that the rest of the browsers cannot see.

It's all exciting stuff.

They are being submitted to the W3C for inclusion in CSS 3. Hopefully Firefox 3.x will support it..... and maybe IE 9 or 10 or so.....

 

[DiamondMac]

It's called choice which is something Apple rarely does.

Explain

 

[clevin]

Also, whats the point in adding a button for new users to open tabs when as you suggested it would be hidden or "disabled by default", wouldnt someone who is new to the OS probably not even know that the customisation menu exists in order to add the button, thusly defeating the point of its existance.

don't be unreasonable, every other browsers have that button hidden by default. and nobody complain about it.

and how exactly does "remove 1+add 1" increase the button count?

 

[cloudness]

A new button (default or not) for new tabs could be a nice option. It would make things easier for mac newbies coming from Windows/IE6 who never got used to tabbed browsing. Upon buying a new machine, I would zap it out though, as I do with half the buttons turned on by default (I used to remove all buttons in the Safari bar, but got annoyed with people using my laptop and asking me how to do without the Back button). To the risk of repeating what has been said, it is quicker to:

1. Press option while clicking on a link/history link/bookmark.
2. Press option-l, enter url, then press option-enter.

Also possible:

3. Press option-t
3. Double-click on the tab bar (if already visible or always turned on)

Now to the exciting part: nightly build 30468 is fresh out and blazingly fast! It also scores 87/100 on Acid3, which puts it (again) as the best contender in completing the test first.

 

[uv23]

Now they just have to fix all of their back-related ajax bugs.

 

[cyberjunky]

don't be unreasonable, every other browsers have that button hidden by default. and nobody complain about it.

and how exactly does "remove 1+add 1" increase the button count?

Im not being unreasonable at all, if the purpose of the button is to help noobs yet it is hidden by default, then noobs wouldnt find it before they get used to doing it the proper way, thus rendering it useless. If its useless then why have it added in the first place?

People might not complain but a lot of people dont use it either, people want speed, reliability and so fourth, they can have that if they keep the solution simple, and thats what apple is doing.

 

[benzslrpee]

it's a damn button...get over it already. even women argue less about whether to use lip gloss or lipstick.

 

[Frozonecold]

Safari 3.1 doesn't need to get snappier, it is already far snappier than Firefox. Apple keep up the good work and reduce Safari's ram usage while you are at it.

 

[vanc]

Safari 3.1 doesn't need to get snappier, it is already far snappier than Firefox. Apple keep up the good work and reduce Safari's ram usage while you are at it.

Have you tried FireFox 3 beta 3? The page redering is even snappier than the latest webkit nightly builds. The memory usage of FF 3 is way better than Safari.

 

[clevin]

Safari 3.1 doesn't need to get snappier, it is already far snappier than Firefox. Apple keep up the good work and reduce Safari's ram usage while you are at it.

just a reminder, safari is based on webkit, an open source project, not apple's property. and webkit is originated from KHTML, not apple's property neither.

 

[iPoodOverZune]

double click only open new tab in firefox, sure it would be a big improvement for safari if apple eventually add this function.

actually, right click first to see a new tab ballon and left click to select it, opens a new tab (~= double click).

I am using a SafariStand add-on that adds a lot of functionality that you might like to have a look at it.

 

[iPoodOverZune]

After installing SafariStand, it is in the regular View->Customize toolbar menu

Thanks. I figured that actually.

For those here looking for a new Tab button (and may be more functionality), have a look at SafariStand. You might like it.

For the new tab haters here, its not that I can't live without it, its just that its a nice button to have sometime when you are lying lazy reading some stuff and you dont want to stretch to get to the keyboard. I actually like IE7 implementation of new tab (this feature and its expose type functionality to view the tabs). SafariStand provides viewing tab functionality but that too smallish window is too small view!!

 

[clevin]

actually, right click first to see a new tab ballon and left click to select it, opens a new tab (~= double click).

i can't agree with that, double click takes much less time, much less energy, much less focus. No need to move mice, and no need to change mice button
that "~=" just doesn't make sense here

I am using a SafariStand add-on that adds a lot of functionality that you might like to have a look at it.

I don't think we want to get into discussion of extensions, safari has really no chance if we go through extensions for firefox. Im willing to stick to out of box functions of both browsers.