Samsung's Goals for 2012: 'Beating Apple is #1 Priority'

[brainkilla]

Yea I am sure Apple are saints.

Of course they're not, but the real problem with Samsung - from my standpoint - is that they have no product culture. And it's not only the memo that testifies to their single desire of toppling Apple, but their whole media presence... instead of trying to make the greatest product, they want to beat Apple at all costs, even if their product is inferior. Pathetic.

 

[samcraig]

they want to beat Apple at all costs, even if their product is inferior. Pathetic.

Why wouldn't a company want to promote their product as the very best? Inferior is also subjective.

 

[kdarling]

Because in those countries people buy cheap phones. They aren't buying galaxyS4 or Nokia 1020's either.

Of course, people are also buying "cheap phones" in subsidized countries, where the perceived price is from free to a couple hundred bucks. That's the key to selling an expensive phone: make it appear to be cheaper.

That's why Apple has recently been expanding loan and trade-in programs around the world.

An historical subsidy example is the iPhone in Japan. For the first year or so, it barely sold. Then it began to be offered for "free" (or almost free) with contract, and "sales" took off. Now, it's a favorite:



(No doubt the same goes for any expensive phone; in this case, we have the data broken out by country so it's possible to make a chart.)

 

[brendu]

Of course, people are also buying "cheap phones" in subsidized countries, where the perceived price is from free to a couple hundred bucks. That's the key to selling an expensive phone: make it appear to be cheaper.

That's why Apple has recently been expanding loan and trade-in programs around the world.

An historical subsidy example is the iPhone in Japan. For the first year or so, it barely sold. Then it began to be offered for "free" (or almost free) with contract, and "sales" took off. Now, it's a favorite:

View attachment 467771

(No doubt the same goes for any expensive phone; in this case, we have the data broken out by country so it's possible to make a chart.)

I love reading your posts. Always well thought out and clear. It's a breath of fresh air on these forums.

 

[bbeagle]

Yea I am sure Apple are saints.

Nobody thinks Apple is. Why are you saying that?

 

[Nabooly]

Seems like these Samsung threads are for the sole purpose of generating traffic.

 

[Taz Mangus]

See this is why everyone here recognizes you for what you are. You're trying to count the profits Samsung's entire conglomerate makes when we were discussing the profits Apple makes in smartphones compared to Samsung. Apple makes the majority of smartphone profits in the industry. I know it hurts you to hear that but its the truth. And counting what Samsung makes in shipbuilding, TVs, and the many different other industries it is involved in is not going to change that fact.

Again, Apple was a computer company with no phone experience and came into Samsung's industry and basically stole all the money out of it. Android is basically made up of all the failed companies Apple decimated. Samsung let Apple come in and walk away with the majority of the profit, the largest ecosystem, and a huge developer following with the best apps in the industry.

How could they let Apple do that to them when they had decades worth of a head start? This is just terrible for Samsung and the rest of the Android manufacturers. Hell, most of them are actually losing money. It must pain them to look at Apple and see what they could have been if they had innovated. Now they have to just sit and wait for Daddy Google to give them an OS so they can throw a skin on top of it and call it "innovation". Pathetic.

So you're including TVs and other electronics. You're making yourself look bad. Why not just stop instead of continuing to dig? Samsung let Apple come into their industry and take their cookies. And they had DECADES of a head start. It is beyond me that they could let a company come in and do this to them the way Apple has. Now Apple is sitting as king of the industry with only a few years of experience making phones. How did Samsung and all the other Android manufactures with their decades of experience making phones allow this to happen?

Don't expect any answers back from Lilo777. Pretty much count on Lilio777 to pop in any thread, on this website, that has a story related to Samsung. If you have read the posts, that this poster has made, over the years it always has the same tone. In 2010, this very same poster stated that Apple would become irrelevant in a few years.

 

[kdarling]

Seems like these Samsung threads are for the sole purpose of generating traffic.

Yep. It's all about generating clicks.

Despite the humorous paranoia of some, outsiders do not generally come into iPhone forums and start Samsung threads. It's almost always the forums themselves doing it.

Again, Apple was a computer company with no phone experience and came into Samsung's industry and basically stole all the money out of it.

Apple didn't take money away from Samsung's sales when they came into smartphones.

If anything, they helped Samsung sell hundreds of millions more units, by ignoring the price and feature sets that Samsung was willing to hit.

How could they let Apple do that to them when they had decades worth of a head start?

The biggest problem that phone makers had the time, was that they were stuck supporting legacy devices... some going back to B&W key driven tiny screens.

Apple had no such legacy devices to worry about. At least, not in 2007. Now they do, and it shows in how long it's taking them to add more screen sizes.

 

[Jibbajabba]

Of course they're not, but the real problem with Samsung - from my standpoint - is that they have no product culture. And it's not only the memo that testifies to their single desire of toppling Apple, but their whole media presence... instead of trying to make the greatest product, they want to beat Apple at all costs, even if their product is inferior. Pathetic.

Why wouldn't a company want to promote their product as the very best? Inferior is also subjective.

Even if their product is inferior ? As samcraig said - it is subjective and at the end of the day, the proof is in the pudding .. If you are company A and you think company B's products are inferior, why do you care ? You got nothing to worry about. If you think it is wrong for them to try to destroy Apple on the market - then clearly you don't know what competition is. Let's face it, the best way to react - if you are afraid on losing out on the market because of their products or advertising - step it up .. Don't just sit still. Either provide what people wants or stick to your guns and stop moaning.

And of course they would, I am sure Apple is trying this too - now it is just less obvious then it was in the eighties or nineties .. Bear in mind, just because there aren't any internal documents from Apple saying the same thing, it doesn't mean they don't exist .. I mean for crying out loud, a lot of Apple employees don't even know what they are working on because it is all a big secret. Maybe Apple was just clever enough not to put the "We are going to destroy Apple" memo in writing.

But I don't blame you. And I don't care. I wouldn't expect anything less but defensive Apple fans on an Apple / Mac related forum

 

[MrX8503]

Samsung's Goals for 2012: 'Beating Apple is #1 Priority'

Apple had no such legacy devices to worry about. At least, not in 2007. Now they do, and it shows in how long it's taking them to add more screen sizes.

Apple chooses to not release a larger screen iPhone. iPhones have the longest legacy support compared to any smartphone. iPhone 4 users can update to iOS7. Can you get kitkat on Galaxy S phone?

Even if their product is inferior ? As samcraig said - it is subjective and at the end of the day, the proof is in the pudding .. If you are company A and you think company B's products are inferior, why do you care ? You got nothing to worry about. If you think it is wrong for them to try to destroy Apple on the market - then clearly you don't know what competition is. Let's face it, the best way to react - if you are afraid on losing out on the market because of their products or advertising - step it up .. Don't just sit still. Either provide what people wants or stick to your guns and stop moaning.

And of course they would, I am sure Apple is trying this too - now it is just less obvious then it was in the eighties or nineties .. Bear in mind, just because there aren't any internal documents from Apple saying the same thing, it doesn't mean they don't exist .. I mean for crying out loud, a lot of Apple employees don't even know what they are working on because it is all a big secret. Maybe Apple was just clever enough not to put the "We are going to destroy Apple" memo in writing.

But I don't blame you. And I don't care. I wouldn't expect anything less but defensive Apple fans on an Apple / Mac related forum

Maybe Apple does have such documents maybe they don't. The point is that no such documents have been revealed like it has for Samsung.

 

[samcraig]

Apple chooses to not release a larger screen iPhone. iPhones have the longest legacy support compared to any smartphone. iPhone 4 users can update to iOS7. Can you get kitkat on Galaxy S phone?

The problem with your assertion that I have is that 1) I buy tech based on what it can do when I buy it - not for what I might be able to do with it in the future. 2) Google Play Services and core apps are updated all the time. It's a different model than Apple uses (well used) for updates. So while the Galaxy S phone might not be able to run KitKat - it certainly has received many updates.

On the flip side - I would be curious to know what turnover is for iPhones and Android phones anyway. Do people keep phones much longer than 2 years anyway? If not - talking about what an older device (2+ years) is pretty insignificant anyway.

 

[MrX8503]

Samsung's Goals for 2012: 'Beating Apple is #1 Priority'

The problem with your assertion that I have is that 1) I buy tech based on what it can do when I buy it - not for what I might be able to do with it in the future. 2) Google Play Services and core apps are updated all the time. It's a different model than Apple uses (well used) for updates. So while the Galaxy S phone might not be able to run KitKat - it certainly has received many updates.



On the flip side - I would be curious to know what turnover is for iPhones and Android phones anyway. Do people keep phones much longer than 2 years anyway? If not - talking about what an older device (2+ years) is pretty insignificant anyway.

The comment in question is about legacy support and I replied as such. It has nothing to do with your personal buying preferences. I simply said that Apple's legacy support is way better than Google's.

I believe there are many iPhone 4/4S's out there. Carriers still sold these devices for awhile.

 

[samcraig]

The comment in question is about legacy support and I replied as such. It has nothing to do with your personal buying preferences. I simply said that Apple's legacy support is way better than Google's.

I believe there are many iPhone 4/4S's out there. Carriers still sold these devices for awhile.

Apple's legacy support is different than Google's is more accurate. "Way Better" is subjective.

 

[LordVic]

The comment in question is about legacy support and I replied as such. It has nothing to do with your personal buying preferences. I simply said that Apple's legacy support is way better than Google's.

I believe there are many iPhone 4/4S's out there. Carriers still sold these devices for awhile.

very different types of support. one isn't inherrintely "better" than the other.

For example, legacy support for Apps in Android isn't as platform dependant as on iOS.

Most Apps will be compatible with an overall versioning. For example, Either 2.x or 4.x,. and generally not so much on the individual release number. This means, that despite a large amount of disparity amongst Android OS versions in the wild. The older devices not running the absolute latest version tend to still fully support most apps on the app store.

plus, It's not googles fault. Google wants all it's users on the latest and greatest. UNfortunately, the device makers don't care, Skin their devices with their custom firmware, and then follow the carrier model for updates, which means ultimately, your carrier is responsible for getting you the update. And we all know how terrible carriers are when it comes to doing anything for it's users.

On the other hand. iOS apps tend to be version specific. At least a minimum version specific, that tends to be supported for only 1 or 2 revisions. if you're not on a current OS revision (or the one immediately prior) you're SOL for software and updates. Most Apps don't go back and support anything much further. That means, once your device no longer capable fo the most recent 2 versions, you will be unable to get a lot of Apps. This is why in the Apple camp, not being the most up to date for iOS can be a very limitting factor on what you can do with your device.

Heck, My iPod touch can only run up to iOS4. Not only can I not install most apps because they now require 6 or 7, but many of the Apps I HAD installed were completely llost to me on a wipe and were not able to be reinstalled at all! So my perfectly working older gen iPod touch became nothing more than a basic media player.

 

[subsonix]

plus, It's not googles fault. Google wants all it's users on the latest and greatest. UNfortunately, the device makers don't care.

Then of course it's Google's fault, it's a problem that is inherent in the platform they created. Device makers that doesn't care are just symptoms of that model.

 

[MrX8503]

Heck, My iPod touch can only run up to iOS4. Not only can I not install most apps because they now require 6 or 7, but many of the Apps I HAD installed were completely llost to me on a wipe and were not able to be reinstalled at all! So my perfectly working older gen iPod touch became nothing more than a basic media player.

Your iPod touch is way older than a Galaxy S phone.

 

[SlCKB0Y]

I remember when Apple adopted the "We must beat Microsoft" attitude. Almost landed them out of business.

Except at that point 95% of computers sold were Windows vs. less than 5% Mac.

The situation is now much less skewed towards the dominant company in this situation given that Samsung now outsells Apple and in some quarters a single Samsung phone can outsell iPhone towards the end of the iPhone product cycle.

Completely different situations.

Just do your own thing and make great products. If all you're interested in is beating the competition, then you lose that edge.

Just do your own thing and make great products. If all you're interested in is suing the competition, then you lose that edge.

----------

Then of course it's Google's fault, it's a problem that is inherent in the platform they created. Device makers that doesn't care are just symptoms of that model.

A problem which has been massively reduced by Google Play Services and the ability to update most core apps independently of the OS.

 

[subsonix]

A problem which has been massively reduced by Google Play Services and the ability to update most core apps independently of the OS.

I have no doubts that they are trying to reduce the problem, but that takes away nothing from my point.

 

[SlCKB0Y]

An historical subsidy example is the iPhone in Japan. For the first year or so, it barely sold. Then it began to be offered for "free" (or almost free) with contract, and "sales" took off. Now, it's a favorite:

View attachment 467771

(No doubt the same goes for any expensive phone; in this case, we have the data broken out by country so it's possible to make a chart.)

Just a clarification - iPhone can be acquired on all the major carriers in Australia for $0 upfront on contract (usually 12-24 months).

The warranty length is also 2 years.

 

[MrX8503]

Except at that point 95% of computers sold were Windows vs. less than 5% Mac.

The situation is now much less skewed towards the dominant company in this situation given that Samsung now outsells Apple and in some quarters a single Samsung phone can outsell iPhone towards the end of the iPhone product cycle.

Samsung sells more devices, but Apple makes most of the profit. How did that work out for Windows PC OEMs?

 

[samcraig]

I have no doubts that they are trying to reduce the problem, but that takes away nothing from my point.

Of course it does.

 

[Dave.UK]

Apple chooses to not release a larger screen iPhone. iPhones have the longest legacy support compared to any smartphone. iPhone 4 users can update to iOS7. Can you get kitkat on Galaxy S phone?

Just because the iPhone 4 runs ios7 - It dosent receive all the features of ios7. People seem to ignore the fact that fragmentation is very much alive when it comes to ios.

 

[subsonix]

Of course it does.

Can you explain how?

 

[subsonix]

Just because the iPhone 4 runs ios7 - It dosent receive all the features of ios7. People seem to ignore the fact that fragmentation is very much alive when it comes to ios.

Fragmentation is relevant to portability of software, i.e does all software run across the entire platform or not. Features that doesn't affect this doesn't hinder software to run on any particular model.

 

[samcraig]

Fragmentation is relevant to portability of software, i.e does all software run across the entire platform or not. Features that doesn't affect this doesn't hinder software to run on any particular model.

Ok. Then What Android software doesn't run on various devices vs what does or does not run on iOS.

How is Android "more" fragmented or a bigger issue?