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Other Screen flicker on OLED (PWM)

left shark fan

left shark fan

macrumors member
Original poster
Apr 23, 2015
30
4
Hi guys!

Last time when I used an OLED display I had some issues with headaches and eye strain, I chose the XR over the XS for this reason. My LTE is broken on my XR so it's time for an update and I think the new iPhones look great, however there is no model with an LCD. I was wondering if maybe you guys know if these OLED still have the PWM (flicker) or if there has been technological improvements compared to previous OLED displays. If not, is there any way to fix this issue?

Would love to hear what you guys know and thanks in advance! ?
 
The Jericho Initiative

The Jericho Initiative

macrumors newbie
Sep 13, 2016
28
53
We know the 12 series has PWM, there are early camera tests - but we don't know the effective frequency yet. If it's 290Hz or above, things may be okay. It depends on the characteristics of the waveform.
 
V

vladi

macrumors 6502a
Jan 30, 2010
968
583
All OLEDs have it and it's really hard to avoid if display has some insanely high constant brightness. X and XS were bad but not nearly as bad compared to what was offered in Android OLED world at the time. iPhone 11 got better at it but it's no guarantee that 12 will be any better, it could be worse.
 
D

dotme

macrumors 65816
Oct 18, 2011
1,198
257
Iowa
I'm in the same boat. Two years ago, chose XR over XS because the XS screen, especially when scrolling text, left trails and made me feel a little dizzy/light headed, and that was just playing with display models in the store.

My XR is now out of AppleCare+ Warranty. It's been a great phone. But the higher cost of the 12, along with the OLED display - even with much better PPI, led me to order an 11 yesterday instead. It arrives today. I'm hopeful in 2 years when I upgrade again that the OLED refresh rates will be faster, maybe leading to less visual issues for me and I can make the move then. Meanwhile, I get an upgraded camera with night mode, the U1 chip which I'm hoping will be useful soon, and another 2 years under AppleCare+

The wife, incidentally, was with me when I tested the XS 2 years ago. She didn't have any issues with the screen at all - didn't see what I saw. So OLED does seem to affect some people more than others.
 
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jm31828

macrumors 65816
Sep 28, 2015
1,394
895
Bothell, Washington
dotme said:
I'm in the same boat. Two years ago, chose XR over XS because the XS screen, especially when scrolling text, left trails and made me feel a little dizzy/light headed, and that was just playing with display models in the store.

My XR is now out of AppleCare+ Warranty. It's been a great phone. But the higher cost of the 12, along with the OLED display - even with much better PPI, led me to order an 11 yesterday instead. It arrives today. I'm hopeful in 2 years when I upgrade again that the OLED refresh rates will be faster, maybe leading to less visual issues for me and I can make the move then. Meanwhile, I get an upgraded camera with night mode, the U1 chip which I'm hoping will be useful soon, and another 2 years under AppleCare+

The wife, incidentally, was with me when I tested the XS 2 years ago. She didn't have any issues with the screen at all - didn't see what I saw. So OLED does seem to affect some people more than others.
Click to expand...

Same here! Two years ago wife and I both got new phones- I got the XS, she got the XS Max. The XS really messed with my eyes, with eye pain, headaches, a bit of a motion sickness type of feeling, so I unfortunately had to return mine. But my wife still has her XS Max, has no trouble at all with it.
 
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Samut

macrumors regular
Oct 1, 2017
180
174
dotme said:
I'm in the same boat. Two years ago, chose XR over XS because the XS screen, especially when scrolling text, left trails and made me feel a little dizzy/light headed, and that was just playing with display models in the store.
Click to expand...

I had exactly the same problem with scrolling text on iPhone Xs and that was the reason I was looking forward for 120hz screen.

It is separate issue from PWM and I believe it has something to do with extremely fast refresh times on oled and it causes motion to look jerky.
 
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vladi

macrumors 6502a
Jan 30, 2010
968
583
On a side PPI on pentile OLED and LCD is not remotely the same thing.
 
The Jericho Initiative

The Jericho Initiative

macrumors newbie
Sep 13, 2016
28
53
vladi said:
All OLEDs have it and it's really hard to avoid if display has some insanely high constant brightness. X and XS were bad but not nearly as bad compared to what was offered in Android OLED world at the time. iPhone 11 got better at it but it's no guarantee that 12 will be any better, it could be worse.
Click to expand...

Not all OLED panels use PWM. Most do simply because it's cheaper for the manufacturer.
 
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ctjack

ctjack

macrumors 65816
Mar 8, 2020
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jm31828 said:
Interesting you could only see flicker on the phone on the right- the standard 12 from what I can tell.
Click to expand...
I have watched even further and noticed the same thing(has another example of PWM later on in the video). So the trick is that PWM is "catchable" under certain degree and surely its' severeness veries upon brightness level. So the phone on the left had higher brightness at the moment of shot and different angle.
mailman199 said:
What phone is that on? Is that a 12 or previous gen?
Click to expand...
That is both 12 and 12 Pro.
 
Moonjumper

Moonjumper

macrumors 68030
Jun 20, 2009
2,741
2,909
Lincoln, UK
vladi said:
On a side PPI on pentile OLED and LCD is not remotely the same thing.
Click to expand...
Yes, Pentile can also cause issues. I believe at least some (maybe all) Apple mobile screens have Pentile and PWM. Not a great combination.

All screen technologies can have PWM, but is currently an issue mostly on mobile OLED, although still not eradicated on LCD (I had a major problem with an LCD monitor). All screen technologies can have Pentile, but only Samsung use this as far as I know, and (currently) only on OLED.

I wish Apple had stayed with LCD until this had been resolved. I love my OLED TV, but I don't miss the advantages on my LCD iPhone (1st gen SE).
 
S

shadyman

macrumors regular
Jun 9, 2015
231
214
Not sure if that’s exactly your problem, but I found this source:

blog.elcomsoft.com

iPhone X Eye Strain: How to Stop OLED Flickering in Just Three Clicks

The iPhone X uses a new (for Apple) display technology. For the first time ever, Apple went with an OLED display instead of the IPS panels used in all other iPhones. While OLED displays have numerous benefits such as the true blacks and wide color gamut, the majority of OLED displays (particularly t
blog.elcomsoft.com blog.elcomsoft.com
 
4

418608

Cancelled
Mar 24, 2010
157
47
I definitely noticed this on my iPhone 12, compared to the XR.
I was very excited to move to a OLED screen, but apart from the great blacks, I have mostly been hit by issues (yellowish screen and, even worse for me, the issue with the blurred text / text trail/ ghosting when scrolling).

I have added a post on this just today.

forums.macrumors.com

Blurred text when scrolling on my iPhone 12

When scrolling on my iPhone 12, text is particularly blurred And it disturbs me a bit. Does it look like this is one of the annoying downsides of any OLED display, or is it just that the one of my iPhone 12 is particularly bad? I shot a video showing both the new iPhone 12 (on the left) and...
forums.macrumors.com forums.macrumors.com
 
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