Should I get the 5k iMac or the maxed out non-5k?

[Bobarom]

Retina or Non-Retina

-that is the question. I was looking on Apple's website (I'm in the UK). Whilst I can understand that the newer Retina Imac is more expensive - what I cannot understand is why ssd (512gb) storage is a lot more expensive on the NON Retina (ie £400.00) and yet it would appear to me that it is only £240.00 on the Retina - then again, I might have misread everything - just wondering if anyone else has noticed.
Happy New Year to one and all.

 

[AR86]

-that is the question. I was looking on Apple's website (I'm in the UK). Whilst I can understand that the newer Retina Imac is more expensive - what I cannot understand is why ssd (512gb) storage is a lot more expensive on the NON Retina (ie £400.00) and yet it would appear to me that it is only £240.00 on the Retina - then again, I might have misread everything - just wondering if anyone else has noticed.
Happy New Year to one and all.

The rImac comes standard with a fusion drive which you can change out free of charge for 256gb of SSD, then the next upgrade in terms of SSD is the 512gb one which will cost an extra £240 BUT with the normal 27 model you get a standard 7200rpm 1tb hard drive and to it costs an extra £160 either way for the upgrade to fusion drive or 256gb of SSD then as with rImac it costs an extra £240 for 512gb of SSD the only difference being the rImac skips out the money you have to pay to make the first upgrade step as you're given a fusion drive or 256gb ssd as standard.

 

[hjalte]

-that is the question. I was looking on Apple's website (I'm in the UK). Whilst I can understand that the newer Retina Imac is more expensive - what I cannot understand is why ssd (512gb) storage is a lot more expensive on the NON Retina (ie £400.00) and yet it would appear to me that it is only £240.00 on the Retina - then again, I might have misread everything - just wondering if anyone else has noticed.
Happy New Year to one and all.

I guess it's because of the update from HDD to SSD is higher than from FD to SSD.

 

[ixxx69]

In my experience, the long-term benefits of Retina vs. non-Retina has little to do with good visions vs. bad vision. Some people just don't seem to be very sensitive to it.

I've switched several long-term, but typical non-techie computer users (ages 30's to 60's) to rMBP in the last couple years, and to my slight disappointment, none of them sat down at their new rMBP and immediately said "wow, this screen is incredible!" - but within a few days, all commented how nice the screen was. They don't know what "retina display" means, or how the resolution doubling works - they just can see it looks nice.

Personally, my eyesight is relatively bad (nearsighted, in the -5 to -6 range in both eyes). I'm also approaching "middle age", and my ability to focus is starting to degrade noticeably. I may have a more difficult time distinguishing individual pixels compared to someone with excellent vision, but I still can tell when something is sharper vs. blurrier!

I have to agree that anyone who says they literally can't tell the difference side by side is either being delusional or is suffering from severe vision issues. Now whether you care enough about the difference to spend extra money on a retina display is entirely an individual opinion.

But as someone who's spent literally spent tens of thousands of hours in front of computers over the last 30+ years, I'll offer some advice to anyone who uses a computer several hours a day: be preemptive when you're young about ergonomic issues (including the computer display's size and resolution), because the toll it takes is cumulative and mostly irreversible - you may not notice minor eye strain or tired wrists when you're young, but you'll pay for it down the line. I can only wish now that I had bought a really good ergonomic chair and started using wrist-supports as soon as I entered the workplace.

 

[SmallDane]

What did you end up doing mate? You sent your retina back right?

Yes, they picked it up today. Then Apple has to receive it, and then it takes 5-7 days before I get my money back. After that I'm not sure what I'll do. For now I think I'll probably just live with my "old" 2011 iMac.

 

[hjalte]

Yes, they picked it up today. Then Apple has to receive it, and then it takes 5-7 days before I get my money back. After that I'm not sure what I'll do. For now I think I'll probably just live with my "old" 2011 iMac.

It really sucks. But I am very glad you shared your experience here on the forum

 

[robgendreau]

Viewing distance of the iMac makes it nearly impossible to see individual pixels on the non-retna machine. Yes, the retna display will be more crisp but isn't really going to make as much of a difference as it made on the iPhone, iPad and the portable macs. With everything you said above, I belive you would be better off with the maxed out non-retna.

Huh? I have a non retina iMac screen sitting right next to my riMac, and I'm viewing at 30" and I see all kinds of pixellation on the regular iMac screen. Retina distance on the 2560x1440 for a person with 20/20 is 32", which is further than most people sit. There are plenty of reasons to buy non-retina, but this isn't one.

In addition, if you work with images it's hugely different. Twice as much, in fact. I can see most of a 4600x3800 RAW in my photo editing software on my riMac at 1:1; with a non-retina you only see a quarter of that. And 4k video can be seen at 1:1 as well; again, impossible on the regular iMac without scrolling. Again, if you don't do photos or video or large format documents, no big deal. But for many of us that's huge.

And I have encountered fewer problems with the riMac than any other Mac I've purchased, and that's been about 20 since 1986. If one worries about such, then you should really buy at the low end, preferably with an older system. After all, you could end up with the yellow screen or dodgy video. Hope not....

 

[Illimitable]

Was in similar predicament recently, and opted for the Retina. I have to say that I am very impressed thus far and the screen is immaculate. I have no complaints so far.

 

[Cape Dave]

I got to see them side by side at Best Buy yesterday.

A real no brainer for me. So glad I got the Retina. Have had it for a month. No buyer's remorse at all.

Rock it and do not look back. Enjoy.

----------

In my experience, the long-term benefits of Retina vs. non-Retina has little to do with good visions vs. bad vision. Some people just don't seem to be very sensitive to it.

I've switched several long-term, but typical non-techie computer users (ages 30's to 60's) to rMBP in the last couple years, and to my slight disappointment, none of them sat down at their new rMBP and immediately said "wow, this screen is incredible!" - but within a few days, all commented how nice the screen was. They don't know what "retina display" means, or how the resolution doubling works - they just can see it looks nice.

Personally, my eyesight is relatively bad (nearsighted, in the -5 to -6 range in both eyes). I'm also approaching "middle age", and my ability to focus is starting to degrade noticeably. I may have a more difficult time distinguishing individual pixels compared to someone with excellent vision, but I still can tell when something is sharper vs. blurrier!

I have to agree that anyone who says they literally can't tell the difference side by side is either being delusional or is suffering from severe vision issues. Now whether you care enough about the difference to spend extra money on a retina display is entirely an individual opinion.

But as someone who's spent literally spent tens of thousands of hours in front of computers over the last 30+ years, I'll offer some advice to anyone who uses a computer several hours a day: be preemptive when you're young about ergonomic issues (including the computer display's size and resolution), because the toll it takes is cumulative and mostly irreversible - you may not notice minor eye strain or tired wrists when you're young, but you'll pay for it down the line. I can only wish now that I had bought a really good ergonomic chair and started using wrist-supports as soon as I entered the workplace.

If it would fit, I would put that on my gravestone May have to settle for just:

Be preemptive.

My friends think I am nuts to have switched to a mostly veggie diet. Along with a walk and a nap every day. And yet, I am 62 and take no prescription drugs, save for dental pain when appropriate.

I like to think I am being preemptive

 

[cmm]

The "risks" i am talking about is Heat and Fan-noise + the machine possibly being underpowered.

I realize that on a forum like this,people with problems are much more likely to post, but in the end, the non-retina seemed like the right choice (all things considered)

Now I just have to wait 14 days

What parallel tasks are you doing that you need an i7 in the first place, which is available on the retina and non retina models? Let's start there. Unless you already passed the 14 day return period.

 

[Crunch]

I have ordered the maxed out non-retina with 512 SSD.

And just for the record; there IS a difference between retina and non-retina. Sure the retina display is much nicer, but for me, it isn't worth the risk.
Many people have reported problems with their new retina model (heat, speed, lag, noise) and I don't want to take that chance.

I can also understand that there have been some problems with the AMD cards in the past.

Finally, it's also a question about if the retina is worth the extra $600. I don't think it is (considering the 'risk').

Congratulations on your new purchase. I have the non-Retina model, the higher-end one, but not totally maxed out. I did get the straight 256GB SSD, though, and I've been SUPER happy with it for over a year. Constant usage, every single day several hours and ZERO problems, along with nonexistent fan "noise".

As for the risk, well, you could've always returned it, as I did, and gotten a different model, but yea, I realize that it might be a pain for you to do so. (I'm guessing)

As for the price difference, the Retina iMac represents incredible value, and if you consider the fact that it even comes with a 1TB Fusion Drive, the same cost as my upgrade of $200 for the 256GB SSD on the non-Retina model, that difference shrinks quickly. (it can shrink by as much as half, or $300)

It does blow that the base config had so many lag issues, though. I remain shocked at the fact that Apple would put something like this out. Doesn't matter, though. I'm about to undergo that risk for a 2nd time with a discounted 295X upgrade. I'm excited. Anticipation is half the fun!

Crunch wrote above:
[[ I cannot believe this is even an issue. To those people who claim to see "little or no difference" are either liars or can't see for shhhhhhh. How's your eyesight? Mine's 20/20. (knock on wood) ]]

How old are you?

Just wait another thirty or forty years, then get back to us.

I'm middle-aged. Don't you know it's rude to ask someone that?

Anyway, so you mean it will be an even greater benefit in a decade or two to have the razor sharpness of a Retina display? I couldn't agree more.

 

[Crunch]

What parallel tasks are you doing that you need an i7 in the first place, which is available on the retina and non retina models? Let's start there. Unless you already passed the 14 day return period.

hey, I am back and forth on the i7 upgrade. I wonder if the Retina display as a whole is run by mostly the GPU or the CPU. I remember my returned Retina iMac not really taxing the 290X much at all. The i5, the process "Window Server" was running quite a bit. I wonder if the issue I had was unrelated to either the GPU or CPU. Any thoughts?

 

[cmm]

hey, I am back and forth on the i7 upgrade. I wonder if the Retina display as a whole is run by mostly the GPU or the CPU. I remember my returned Retina iMac not really taxing the 290X much at all. The i5, the process "Window Server" was running quite a bit. I wonder if the issue I had was unrelated to either the GPU or CPU. Any thoughts?

CPU is irrelevant for this issue. I've had issues with low end graphics and powering many displays (not even necessarily 4ks) and it's why I'm leaning towards buying a Mac Pro (to power two 4ks), rather than a 5k iMac and another 4k monitor hooked up to it. However, I've tested the upgraded GPU in the 5k iMac with my business rep at the 5th Ave Apple Store, while having a 4k monitor plugged in, and there were no issues. I pushed it.

 

[diipii]

The 5K is something you want but don't need. Apple bases its whole philosophy on this.

 

[Crunch]

CPU is irrelevant for this issue. I've had issues with low end graphics and powering many displays (not even necessarily 4ks) and it's why I'm leaning towards buying a Mac Pro (to power two 4ks), rather than a 5k iMac and another 4k monitor hooked up to it. However, I've tested the upgraded GPU in the 5k iMac with my business rep at the 5th Ave Apple Store, while having a 4k monitor plugged in, and there were no issues. I pushed it.

So just to make sure I'm discerning correctly, you're saying not to worry about the i7 and that the upgraded graphics will take care of any lag issues? Are you also saying you know the 290X to be underpowered?

Thanks!

The 5K is something you want but don't need. Apple bases its whole philosophy on this.

I agree completely. I realize that I don't even "need" the computer I already have, which remains a current-gen. product. I make this decision consciously. Perhaps that makes me a worse man than an ignorant one, as I am fully aware that I'm causing unnecessary fossil fuels burned, supporting what amounts to slave labor in China, contributing to this whole sick system, which is set to collapse literally at any moment.

...but it's a Retina-freaking-iMac...

 

[cincygolfgrrl]

How's your eyesight? Mine's 20/20.

My, aren't you lucky.

 

[cmm]

So just to make sure I'm discerning correctly, you're saying not to worry about the i7 and that the upgraded graphics will take care of any lag issues?

Yes.

 

[hjalte]

Update

Just to give you guys an update (now that you were so helpful )...

I bought the late 2013 imac, maxed out (i7, 4GB GPU, 512 SSD, 24GB Ram).

I just received it yesterday and I couldn't be happier.

The screen is super clear and if you would have told me that this was what retina is, I would have believed you (I come from a 17" asus laptop with HD resolution).

It's super fast. Wow. Again, coming from windows... but WOW! When I open something, it just opens. Like right away. It's so cool.

And it's silent. It doesn't say anything at all. The temp rarely gets over 40 degrees (it is at 37 now, while I am typing this. That's cooler than me, lol).

I did try civilization and wow (the only two games I play) and the temp got to around 45 degrees with no fan-noise at all.

The screen is HUGE. I have to get used to that. I am moving my head from side to side to look at stuff

I still need to get my head around mac. There are some thing I don't quite get and have trouble with (it took me 10 minutes to find the @ sign - I actually had to look it up ).

But I'll get there eventually.

Anyway, just wanted to give you an update and thank you guys for making this forum the best one out there

 

[SmallDane]

I bought the late 2013 imac, maxed out (i7, 4GB GPU, 512 SSD, 24GB Ram).

I just received it yesterday and I couldn't be happier.

That is good to hear. Did you get the 755M or 780M?

Also, the temps you mention, are they the CPU or the GPU?

 

[Butchie-T]

You may want to consider the Logitech Solar Keyboard K750. It is a nice MAC compatible keyboard but it does take one of your USB ports for the unifying receiver.

I have one and I really like it. I'm an Apple MAC noob as well. I'm liking the differences I have seen so far but will never completely make the switch. So I guess I'll remain an OS hybrid user.

 

[hjalte]

That is good to hear. Did you get the 755M or 780M?

Also, the temps you mention, are they the CPU or the GPU?

I got the 780M and the Temp is the overall temp I guess (the one in the menubar)

 

[hjalte]

You may want to consider the Logitech Solar Keyboard K750. It is a nice MAC compatible keyboard but it does take one of your USB ports for the unifying receiver.

I have one and I really like it. I'm an Apple MAC noob as well. I'm liking the differences I have seen so far but will never completely make the switch. So I guess I'll remain an OS hybrid user.

Just before it arrived, I was about to buy that keybord and performance MX mouse.

But I decided I wanted the "Mac experience" first. so far, I like the keyboard and the magic mouse.

I really don't think I will back to the PC. Unless I find something I can't do on the mac that i REALLY need to do (and cannot do in VirtualMachine)

 

[SmallDane]

I got the 780M and the Temp is the overall temp I guess (the one in the menubar)

I think by default iStat shows CPU Proximity in the menu bar. You can customize it in the preferences. The most interesting temps are the 4 CPU cores and the GPU die. And then of course the fan speed.

 

[Butchie-T]

Just before it arrived, I was about to buy that keybord and performance MX mouse.

But I decided I wanted the "Mac experience" first. so far, I like the keyboard and the magic mouse.

I really don't think I will back to the PC. Unless I find something I can't do on the mac that i REALLY need to do (and cannot do in VirtualMachine)

I also bought a Magic Mouse. Initially I did not think I'd like it or get used to it........I was wrong.
Congrats on the new toys and enjoy!

 

[Alesc]

I have ordered the maxed out non-retina with 512 SSD.

And just for the record; there IS a difference between retina and non-retina. Sure the retina display is much nicer, but for me, it isn't worth the risk.
Many people have reported problems with their new retina model (heat, speed, lag, noise) and I don't want to take that chance.

I can also understand that there have been some problems with the AMD cards in the past.

Finally, it's also a question about if the retina is worth the extra $600. I don't think it is (considering the 'risk').

Hi! I've made the same choice (non Retina over Retina) two mounths ago, and I haven't regret it since: this machine is powerfull and flawless! I'm really happy with this machine. I will buy a Retina later, in 1 or 2 gen.