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iPod Silly feature of the iPOD Shuffle

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vinieux said:
I DO not and DID not get any error messages while installing iTunes. And just to explain, You do not HAVE to let iTunes decide how you store your music. You can have a collection that is years old in many familiar directories, and make iTunes ONLY act as library without reordering or reshuffling your music drives. In this case, it saves the library file that it creates (called library.xml or some such in Windows) somewhere and shows you all your music as one seamless library even though your storage may be in multiple drives all over yr system.

In essence, I DID NOT move all my music into the iTUNES folder and rearrange all my familiar paths to my music. When you have 50 GB of music collected over 10 years you will realise it is not the best thing to do.

One fine day, the secret drive where it stored this file got full (I presume) because it started showing me this message every 10 seconds.

"The iTunes Music Library File cannot be saved. The disk you are attempting to use is full." And then very stupidly it continues "Removing files and emptying the recycle bin will free up additional space." And then a check box saying "Don't warn me again."

I am telling you the exact phrasing, word for word in the dialog I got.

Firstly, when it is as critical as saving the library file, it should give me an option to point to another drive with free space immediately. It simply does not. And there are no options in settings to change this manually either. I tried changing it to the empty iTunes folder that it creates by default, presuming you would want it to resort and rearrange your music - this is possible in Settings, under Advanced - Itunes Music Folder location. No such luck. Every time I put on my iTunes, this message would pop every 10 seconds or so. i uninstalled and resinstalled iTunes, and NO change.

Assuming such a problem is possible, and the solution not built into the settings, a simple plug n charge option would have saved me no end of heartache...
Click to expand...

So what you want is a tonne of cure because you won't call Apple for an ounce of prevention?

You want them to build an option into iTunes on the odd chance that a problem occurs that a user won't seek help for - riiight...

Wouldn't you rather the big problem fixed?
 
OK, so it wasn't an error message during installation, but why don't you free up some space on the drive that's full?

Here's something that shows how the Autofill can be configured from Apples support pages link:
To prevent Autofill from replacing any of your manual changes to the iPod shuffle playlist, make sure the "Replace all songs when Autofilling" checkbox at the bottom of the iTunes window is not checked. When this checkbox is not checked, clicking Autofill adds new songs that meet the criteria set at the bottom of the window without replacing any songs you've added to the list by dragging.
Click to expand...
You can also turn off autofill entirely according to this other Apple page link:
Transfer Your Music Automatically

Once you connect iPod shuffle to your Mac or PC, iTunes automatically updates its contents. iTunes becomes aware that you’ve connected iPod shuffle and displays it in the Source column. You can see your music and playlists at a glance. For the ultimate exercise in uncertainty, let iTunes randomly Autofill your iPod shuffle. iTunes creates a playlist that fits your style — and your iPod shuffle’s capacity. For finer control over your portable music collection, set Autofill to add specific playlists or add higher-rated songs first. Or turn Autofill off and manually select the songs you want to tote on your iPod shuffle.
Click to expand...
 
I am a power user (well as much power as Windows allows me), and I use all kinds of software from stuff like google Earth all the way up to Photoshop and Dreamweaver for my work, with no problems, no crashes. I use Win XP with SP2 and all other service updates installed - a fairly new P4 machine with 512 MB RAM. My problem started with iTunes 5. Continued with iTunes 6. I uninstalled and reinstalled 6, and the problem stayed.

Now I got the solution, which is clear up the registry before reinstalling because the uninstall is NOT clean - but I am so pissed off that I will wait for the next release before trying it. I like the Winamp plug in - the whole process is in my control from the moment I see the iPOD appearing in the menu to when I finish updating or refreshing or whatever.

Sure, iTunes has taken that headache off your chest and does it automatically, but is it too much to ask to at least let me decide which way i want to do it??
 
vinieux said:
AND, you can change the setting and tell iTunes not to update the iPOD. But even if you have made no changes at all, it first DOES do the playlist check or refresh or what you called checking the playcount or whatever, BEFORE it starts charging

All I am saying is give me the option to decide whether it should start doing anything at all when i plug my iPOD in. thats what I like about the Winamp plug in. It presumes I am intelligent enough to decide what I should do with my music and simply opens up the iPOD and shows me the songs in it currently. Any updating or ANYTHING else I want to do, is only when I decide to tell it to do so.

Sure, make it a default option to autoupdate or refresh playcounts if you want, but also give me the option to disable it if I choose, because more often than not I will be simply charging the iPOD, not updatingit and refreshing the playcount just then is of no consequence to me.
Click to expand...
:eek: Now I'm really confused :confused:
You say that you have been able to disable Autofill all along and that your only complaint is that iTunes updates the playcounts and stuff of your songs. If that's the case I think it's fair to say that you're just trolling.

Secondly, if Winamp works the way you like, why don't you just stick to Winamp. :confused:
 
Gekko, if there is one thing that was turned off from the day i got my iPOD it was autofill. Deciding what I want to listen to, when and for how long is MY CHOICE as far as I am concerned, not that of any software even from God.

Obviously it was not turned off by Itunes despite my changes because of the library save problem.

Now you've brought out another point. As a result of this, any new playlist that i created would not stay in the iPOD. The moment I plugged it in, the autorefresh would start and it would replace it with whatever was in the iPOD before the save library problem started, and delete all the stuff I put into it manually alter on.

Presuming that this is a logical thing to do, then why didn't it get stuck looking for this original playlist when I plugged it into my friends drive.

Like i keep saying, all I want is an option to change this autorefresh thing. If an iPod isbeing plugged in for charging as well as for refreshing or updating or replacing I think I should make the choice of what it should do first - not iTunes
 
Yeah, it's weird, and the thing is, as soon as you plug the shuffle in it charges, the playcount check occurs while the shuffle is charging but as soon as iTunes opens.
 
Gekko, my complaint is NOT that iTunes updates playcounts - it should do it. My complaint is that I should make the choice to let it do so, ESPECIALLY because plugging it into a USB port has 2 fucntions - charging AND updating.

"Do you want to update your iPOD? Yes/NO. Remember this setting till I change it"

Assume I am listening to radio on iTunes and it is by chance on Autofill. I have made some changes in the songs I have on my iPod but I WANT those songs to stay for just a while longer. However, I need to plug it in for charging WITH my iTunes open and my radio on. Now what? Lose the songs I've painstakingly filled manually??
 
All of your problems are being caused by iTunes' little hiccup. I had a problem with iTunes Helper not recognising my iPod on my parent's PC when I installed iTunes 5.

But instead of saying "waaa, why won't iTunes give me an option to change this?" I went to Apple, found the solution to the problem, applied these things (involved trashing some things from the iPod folder on the Hardrive) and all worked well.

Have you even looked at Apple.com's support pages? They have a lot of info there.
 
vinieux said:
Gekko, my complaint is NOT that iTunes updates playcounts - it should do it. My complaint is that I should make the choice to let it do so, ESPECIALLY because plugging it into a USB port has 2 fucntions - charging AND updating
Click to expand...

But you have already made that choice, by listening to the song you have changed the playcount, all that happens then is iTunes updates the number of times that song has been played so that your library and smart playlists are up to date. Surely this isn't a bad thing?
 
Sure it can update the playcounts and SURE it is a good thing, but when I WANT to do it, not when iTunes wants to do it. All I am saying is if I am simply charging the iPod, then it should make no changes until I ask it to.

Also because then, any other problem like the library saving one will simply not have any effect on the Shuffle till i rectify the issue with iTunes.

I repeat:
Assume I am listening to radio on iTunes and it is by chance (or choice) on Autofill. I have made some changes in the songs I have on my Shuffle but I WANT those songs to stay for just a while longer. However, I need to plug it in for charging WITH my iTunes open and my radio on. Now what? Lose the songs I've painstakingly filled manually??
 
It does. It changes the playcounts as you yourself said. All i am saying is when I plug in the iPOD, iTunes should do nothing until I tell it to - or at least give me an option to enable such an action (or non action if you prefer).

This way no iTunes problem or Windows problem can screw up my iPod. If for example, I did have a setting like this, then library problem or no library problem my Shuffle wouldn't go through hell and high water trying to preserve the music that i filled manually.
 
vinieux said:
Gekko, if there is one thing that was turned off from the day i got my iPOD it was autofill. Deciding what I want to listen to, when and for how long is MY CHOICE as far as I am concerned, not that of any software even from God.

Obviously it was not turned off by Itunes despite my changes because of the library save problem.

Like i keep saying, all I want is an option to change this autorefresh thing. If an iPod isbeing plugged in for charging as well as for refreshing or updating or replacing I think I should make the choice of what it should do first - not iTunes
Click to expand...

vinieux, no offense, you appear to be they type of "power user" that I have encountered many times in my travels through windows land.

One guy I know insisted on setting up his Win2K systems with a 512MB C:\ partition, and a dedicated swap partition, a programs partition and a data partition, because that's the way he did all his NT 3.5.1 boxes, and that's the way HE wanted it. unfortunately many windows programs make assumptions about where they MUST be installed (on C: of course), so he quickly ran into trouble filling up C:\ and corrupting his registry.

Or the "power user" who overclocked his machine to the minimum requirements for an app and then wonders how they coulr release such an underperforming/unstable app. Actually, that was the same guy. :rolleyes:

You insist on control, change everyting in the software and don't give it essential resources (free space) and then you turn around and blame the hardware. :confused:

B
 
I am a power user by virtue of what i do. My machine is not overclocked, nor do I have fancy partitions.

However, if I use Photoshop, I use it for both print and web graphics, making me utilise it much more. Similarly, i have 50GB of music, and I sometimes broadcast music on Shoutcast, and when I use music related software I use it to the full as an advanced user.

I certainly don't blame the hardware either. I think iPods rock and rule. iTunes is the problem - and iTunes for Windows if that makes any of you happier.

The control I am asking for seems to me to be logical. If a USB port has two completely divergent purposes for the iPOD, i think simply plugging it in should NOT necessarily mean it has to update anything - playcounts or otherwise. I think I should make that choice.
 
vinieux said:
I am a power user by virtue of what i do. My machine is not overclocked, nor do I have fancy partitions.

However, if I use Photoshop, I use it for both print and web graphics, making me utilise it much more. Similarly, i have 50GB of music, and I sometimes broadcast music on Shoutcast, and when I use music related software I use it to the full as an advanced user.

I certainly don't blame the hardware either. I think iPods rock and rule. iTunes is the problem - and iTunes for Windows if that makes any of you happier.

The control I am asking for seems to me to be logical. If a USB port has two completely divergent purposes for the iPOD, i think simply plugging it in should NOT necessarily mean it has to update anything - playcounts or otherwise. I think I should make that choice.
Click to expand...

So, have you set it to not open iTunes when attached yet or what?
 
vinieux,

I have to ask since it has been talked about over and over again..

Why won't you contact apple? And don't give me the line that support in India sucks since you obviously have internet access and can interact with them over email.
 
For future reference, and not necessarily aimed at vinieux:

The tutorial on controlling your shuffle's sync behavior is quite good IMHO.

http://www.apple.com/support/ipod/tutorial/ip_gettingstarted_t7.html
http://www.apple.com/support/ipod/tutorial/ip_gettingstarted_t3.html

As Chundles pointed out make sure the "start iTunes when this iPod is connected" (or whatever the phrasing is)enable disk mode and manually manage songs and playlists, keep the iPod in the sources list and you bascially have a USB memory stick that you can add/remove tracks frominiTunes and still use as a flash drive. You will have to manually eject it just like any other memory stick.

B
 
snowmoon said:
And don't give me the line that support in India sucks since you obviously have internet access and can interact with them over email.
Click to expand...
Wait a second! You mean that US support isn't in India? :p ;) :rolleyes:

B
 
I didn't mean US support isn't in India, just that I presumed since no forum has helped me yet, or any of the reading I have done, it would involve a person coming home, not just online help - and that wouldn't be any good here for sure. I did have a Mac user come home and he could do nothing with any of the settings. In fact I demonstrated the problem to him right in front of his eyes.

And why must I keep repeatng myself? My settings are all ok, they were getting buggered up by the fact that iTunes had nowhere to save those settings once the library problem started.

Which is why i keep saying, if I had that one little option, none of the other problems would have mattered. iTunes inability to save my Shuffle setting onto the iPod or onto itself is what made it go into a loop. The option to auto update my playcounts whenever i plugged it in is what caused the problem to begin with.

Because each time I manually transferred songs onto the Shuffle, and iTunes couldn't save those settings wherever it wanted to, every time I stuck my iPod in it would start the playcount update, assume on its own that changes had been made (NOT realising that those changes were not changes actually but the playlist it could not save the last time) and then presume my iPod needed updating and replace the songs anyways.

And if this same problem could be responsible for my friends laptop assuming that it was his own iPod when he doesn't even own one, and replacing my songs with his, all the more reason i think I should have the ability to prevent any autoupdate of songs or playcounts - at least in the advanced settings if not up front.
 
The other problem is that if the iPod isnt in the USB port, one can't see the iPod settings at all or make any changes to them.

So assuming my settings were all wrong, by the time I plugged in the iPOD and went as fast as I could to the iPod settings, it would have already started the update and begun updating my songs. There was no way I could have won that battle without having a clear option NOT to start anything till I specifically told iTunes to.
 
You're having these problems because you won't get the library problem fixed. You are complaining that Apple don't provide an option to workaround a problem the end-user refuses to fix.

Go get the big problem fixed instead of hanging around here whinging. The next time you post something bemoaning the shuffle due to your unwillingness to repair the cause of the problem I will be reporting you to the mods.
 
And Chundels, the first thing i did when i got my ipod even before the problem started with the library saving was to disengage auto filling and NOT to start iTunes when the shuffle was plugged in.

Now however, I have given up on experiments, I tried enough of them - I now use the Winamp Plugin.

I will try reinstalling iTunes only after the next release, and then if you wish I can let you know how it works out if and when I try to recreate the problem. I can tell u for sure that even if there is NO problem whatsoever, I would still prefer iTunes not update ANYTHING from playcounts to playlists without my express permission.

Till then I'm out of here...
 
And I did try to fix the library problem by reinstalling. It didn't work cos the uninstall is not clean, which was when I decided to forget the whole thing and go for the winamp plugin, rather than uninstall yet again, clean out the registry, an then reinstall all over again.

This is my last post folks. And thanks. At least i understood the problem better.
 
Contact APPLE SUPPORT!

I am beginning to believe you won't contact apple because your shuffle was obtained through less than savory channels.
 
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